Management Bill Guerin

[Wabit]

I wouldn't really fault him for it, but I don't think it's his smartest move available. There's a lot of risk for a guy joining a new team, system, coaching staff, etc, to leave the fate of his first UFA contract at the mercy of so many variables.

What I'm increasingly worried about is that it seems Guerin is completely over Fiala, I don't think there's going to be a ton of collaboration between the two parties when it comes to discussing a trade. I'm worried he won't even ask about an extension to get a better deal, he'll just trade him to whichever team provides the best offer as is. I know it's a different situation, but he bought Suter out without even exploring other possibilities or talking to Suter about his future here. He just wanted him gone. I can see the same happening with Fiala.

This matches my preconceived notions about GMBG. I approve of this message.

Guerin’s gonna die on Fiala Hill.

GMBG can't even see Fiala Hill while standing on top of Kaprizov Mountain...

 

[Webster]

My hot take...Fiala will be shipped to the Pens, Guerin already has a deal with his old team

 

[Wabit]

My hot take...Fiala will be shipped to the Pens, Guerin already has a deal with his old team

PIT has a different GM, so not near as likely now.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Besides Zucc, he’s just the only other guy that makes logical sense to move.

Before those signings/extensions, there definitely was a way to keep Fiala and Dumba on this roster for 1 more season, which I thought Guerin might have preferred given the cap hell the following 2 seasons will be.

He must have some insane offer for Fiala that will make moving him a lot more justifiable.

You know what bothers the crap out of me? People saying that Zucc is untouchable or not gonna be traded (in general, not you). If the Wild can only afford one of Dumba or Fiala right now, how the f*** are they gonna afford Boldy next offseason with an additional $2M in dead cap?

 

[Wabit]

You know what bothers the crap out of me? People saying that Zucc is untouchable or not gonna be traded (in general, not you). If the Wild can only afford one of Dumba or Fiala right now, how the f*** are they gonna afford Boldy next offseason with an additional $2M in dead cap?

That's easy. They'll just set Boldy up to fail by giving him junk linemates. MN has been experimenting on how to perfect this with Fiala over the last 3 seasons. Why do you think they traded for Jost?

It's all been setup the Boldy/Freddy G. Jost line for next year. Boldy is stuck the the choice of taking a 2 year bridge or a long-term low pay deal.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

If you're trying to make a budget for your personal life, you'll cut spending more effectively by having a $250 car payment vs a $750 car payment, than you will by swapping out your weekly 5 Guys burger for a McDonalds burger.

It's easier, and better for the team, to swap Dumba for Middleton than it is to have four more Jordie Benn's playing every night.

Isn't this precisely the argument that trading Fiala for someone like Holtz would be better than trading Dumba for a late 1st?

I feel like Middleton is dramatically worse than Dumba. Someone tell me how Middleton is better than Merrill. Toughness?

 

[AKL]

Isn't this precisely the argument that trading Fiala for someone like Holtz would be better than trading Dumba for a late 1st?

If you can actually get Holtz/similar piece for Fiala? Sure. I'm definitely not holding my breath for that one.

I feel like Middleton is dramatically worse than Dumba. Someone tell me how Middleton is better than Merrill. Toughness?

Middleton is dramatically worse than Dumba. Whatever we have internally to replace Fiala is dramatically, dramatically (two dramatically's vs. just one) worse than Fiala.

 

[Wabit]

Isn't this precisely the argument that trading Fiala for someone like Holtz would be better than trading Dumba for a late 1st?

I feel like Middleton is dramatically worse than Dumba. Someone tell me how Middleton is better than Merrill. Toughness?

+12 difference from this year's Playoffs in favor of Middleton over Merrill.

Middleton has better positioning, makes smarter plays, and works better with Spurgeon than Merrill imo. Dumba is far better than both of them.

Not steeping into the Dumba or Fiala pile of poo landmine on this one.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

That's easy. They'll just set Boldy up to fail by giving him junk linemates. MN has been experimenting on how to perfect this with Fiala over the last 3 seasons. Why do you think they traded for Jost?

It's all been setup the Boldy/Freddy G. Jost line for next year. Boldy is stuck the the choice of taking a 2 year bridge or a long-term low pay deal.

My tinfoil hat theory is they will trade Hartman/Gaudreau to maximize their current value. Then stick Jost next to Kap so they can trade him next offseason for a haul. Hopefully by then Rossi will be ready for prime time.

 

[Wabit]

My tinfoil hat theory is they will trade Hartman/Gaudreau to maximize their current value. Then stick Jost next to Kap so they can trade him next offseason for a haul. Hopefully by then Rossi will be ready for prime time.

If I had any confidence in Jost (he's worse than Rask imo)...

 

[DigitalBoldy]

If you can actually get Holtz/similar piece for Fiala? Sure. I'm definitely not holding my breath for that one.


Middleton is dramatically worse than Dumba. Whatever we have internally to replace Fiala is dramatically, dramatically (two dramatically's vs. just one) worse than Fiala.

I have zero doubt that some trade like Holtz+ or 7OA+ or 10OA+ will happen.

Rossi is two dramatically's worse than Fiala?

 

[AKL]

I have zero doubt that some trade like Holtz+ or 7OA+ or 10OA+ will happen.

Rossi is two dramatically's worse than Fiala?

Rossi is not and should not be considered a replacement for Fiala. He is an eventual Hartman replacement. But frankly, in my opinion, at this stage of their careers, the difference between Fiala and Rossi is significantly bigger than the difference between Dumba and Middleton.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

+12 difference from this year's Playoffs in favor of Middleton over Merrill.

Middleton has better positioning, makes smarter plays, and works better with Spurgeon than Merrill imo. Dumba is far better than both of them.

Not steeping into the Dumba or Fiala pile of poo landmine on this one.

Middleton gets to play with Spurgeon. Merrill was playing with Kulikov or Goligoski. Two awful partners.

I don't think Middleton is dramatically better than Merrill. He might be slightly better at best.

If I had any confidence in Jost (he's worse than Rask imo)...

I don't think you will find many that agree with you on that one.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I have zero doubt that some trade like Holtz+ or 7OA+ or 10OA+ will happen.

Rossi is two dramatically's worse than Fiala?

Zero huh? That’s pretty bold.

 

[Wabit]

Middleton gets to play with Spurgeon. Merrill was playing with Kulikov or Goligoski. Two awful partners.

I don't think Middleton is dramatically better than Merrill. He might be slightly better at best.


I don't think you will find many that agree with you on that one.

For $2m a year I take Rask over Jost 10 out of 10 times. He's slower but his hands are so much better.

 

[Webster]

You know what bothers the crap out of me? People saying that Zucc is untouchable or not gonna be traded (in general, not you). If the Wild can only afford one of Dumba or Fiala right now, how the f*** are they gonna afford Boldy next offseason with an additional $2M in dead cap?

I think you know that if they trade Zucc this team and the top line will get worse. They did try Fiala with Kaprizov, but the chemistry wasn't there.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Rossi is not and should not be considered a replacement for Fiala. He is an eventual Hartman replacement. But frankly, in my opinion, at this stage of their careers, the difference between Fiala and Rossi is significantly bigger than the difference between Dumba and Middleton.

Pretty sure it was heavily hinted that Rossi would start next season on the wing if he cracks the NHL lineup. Probably move him to center slowly throughout the year and then 100% the following year once Gaudreau is gone.

I wouldn't agree with the difference being bigger for Rossi/Fiala. But I think that has more to do with my viewing of Middleton than anything else. I just don't see him as anything to write home about. Even with Rossi, he should have some chemistry with Boldy from their time in the AHL together and development camp.

Zero huh? That’s pretty bold.

Well it's probably not zero anymore now that you said something.

 

[Wabit]

I think you know that if they trade Zucc this team and the top line will get worse. They did try Fiala with Kaprizov, but the chemistry wasn't there.

They had 40-50 mins together 5v5 each of the last 2 seasons. Most of that was a random 1 off shift here and there. Not really enough time to make any type of judgement.

Both Kap and Fiala are too good to not make a line together work given time to learn each other's tendencies.

 

[57special]

It’s a great idea to decimate the defense even farther. Will go from 5 top 4 quality D just over a year ago to 2 top 4 quality D next year.

I don’t get why Dumba gets the shit end of the stick on here when players like Kulikov, Merrill, Goligoski, Jost occupy $7.54M in cap space to be 4th line/3rd pairing players. If you replace those with ELC/league minimum you save $4M+.

Preaching to the choir, but BG goes to a different church. All of those players also need replacments which will cost money, so the savings won't be as significant, either.

I don't want to lose any of Zuccarello, Dumba, or Fiala, but one of those has to go unless we are totally misreading what Guerin's direction for the team is. If it's up to me, I (reluctantly) choose to trade Zucc 1st, Dumba 2nd, and Fiala last, for reasons that have been stated on these boards over, and over, and over.

If Fiala is traded, is he getting the "shit end of the stick?" Or is it only Dumba?

 

[AKL]

Pretty sure it was heavily hinted that Rossi would start next season on the wing if he cracks the NHL lineup. Probably move him to center slowly throughout the year and then 100% the following year once Gaudreau is gone.

I wouldn't agree with the difference being bigger for Rossi/Fiala. But I think that has more to do with my viewing of Middleton than anything else. I just don't see him as anything to write home about. Even with Rossi, he should have some chemistry with Boldy from their time in the AHL together and development camp.


Well it's probably not zero anymore now that you said something.

Where was that hinted? I didn't watch media day so if it was there then that explains why I didn't hear that. When Russo had Tim Army on, he seemed to believe that Rossi would start next season in the AHL unless he knocked the socks off at camp. Which makes sense because he really started to struggle around the 40 game mark last year. Injuries probably played a part, but his body just wasn't used to playing that hard for that long. And he still has issues with his strength and balance against bigger players, let alone players that would be bigger AND better in the NHL.

I'm not saying you're wrong about where he starts, I just think it would be a mistake to pencil him in right now.

 

[Wabit]

If Fiala is traded, is he getting the "shit end of the stick?" Or is it only Dumba?

Boldy is the one that gets that end of the stick.

Fiala wins by going somewhere he's wanted.

Dumba wins by getting to stay in MN with his bestie Brodin.

 

[Webster]

They had 40-50 mins together 5v5 each of the last 2 seasons. Most of that was a random 1 off shift here and there. Not really enough time to make any type of judgement.

Both Kap and Fiala are too good to not make a line together work given time to learn each other's tendencies.

Then why didn't they try this more? I just don't think they like them together. It also has to do with the defensive play, Evason loves Zucc's backchecking. And we know who Kaprizov wants to play with.

 

[57special]

How ironic would it be if Dumba demands Fiala money once they get around to negotiating the next deal.

 

[Wabit]

Then why didn't they try this more? I just don't think they like them together. It also has to do with the defensive play, Evason loves Zucc's backchecking. And we know who Kaprizov wants to play with.

Why Evason made any of the lineup decisions (or lack there of) he did is beyond me. He made 1 switch from his opening day lineup (not forced by injury/trade) to what we saw at the end of the season. That was swapping Hartman and JEE at center.

I have no idea why Freddy G was glued to Fiala's hip.

Realistically Fiala and Karpizov can both be effective without Zucc. Zucc wouldn't be effective without Fiala or Kaprizov. Zucc is a playmaker and nobody besides Fiala or Kaprizov can make much use of his skillset. Boldy will be able to make use of Zucc within the next 2 seasons, but this year he needed to be the secondary scoring option on a line.

How ironic would it be if Dumba demands Fiala money once they get around to negotiating the next deal.

He'd have to have one hell of a season next year.

 

[Bazeek]

Where was that hinted? I didn't watch media day so if it was there then that explains why I didn't hear that. When Russo had Tim Army on, he seemed to believe that Rossi would start next season in the AHL unless he knocked the socks off at camp. Which makes sense because he really started to struggle around the 40 game mark last year. Injuries probably played a part, but his body just wasn't used to playing that hard for that long. And he still has issues with his strength and balance against bigger players, let alone players that would be bigger AND better in the NHL.

I'm not saying you're wrong about where he starts, I just think it would be a mistake to pencil him in right now.

Hinted by Russo, which... we've been around the block a few times regarding reliability. But it jives with the idea of "The Plan", which mostly means buying out Parise and Suter and trading off Fiala. By no means does Rossi actually replace Fiala in terms of production and performance, but to fill the LW spot initially? I buy that even if I don't believe in it.

And I'm hoping he proves me wrong, but from what I've seen he ain't Boldy and this won't be a fun transition to the NHL. Still, management has placed their bet.