Player Discussion Auston Matthews (Captain Edition)

[Stephen]

At least with Marner we can be pretty confident with what we are getting for the next 5 years. With Matthews injury history we have absolutely no clue what we will get and odds are his play will decline much more than Marner's with age and injury history. That's a damn near certainty though anything could happen. Both are going to ask you to give them a blank cheque come contract time, and both don't score in the playoffs. As you said, that and the rest is about the same except the position they play.

Based on that, I would keep Marner 100 times out of 100 and force Matthews out of here like the way Tampa forced McDonagh out despite his NTC so that the Leafs can at least grab some assets for him and not lose him in free agency. Because let's be honest, his next contract will be based on what he's done to date, NOT what he will do in the future. It's almost a guaranteed over payment

The best way I can describe it is this.

Matthews is Batman and Marner is Robin.

Marner thinks they’re co Batman’s and wants to be paid like it.

But when the chips are down, they are both in fact two Robin’s.

 

[sunstersun]

At least with Marner we can be pretty confident with what we are getting for the next 5 years. With Matthews injury history we have absolutely no clue what we will get and odds are his play will decline much more than Marner's with age and injury history. That's a damn near certainty though anything could happen. Both are going to ask you to give them a blank cheque come contract time, and both don't score in the playoffs. As you said, that and the rest is about the same except the position they play.

Based on that, I would keep Marner 100 times out of 100 and force Matthews out of here like the way Tampa forced McDonagh out despite his NTC so that the Leafs can at least grab some assets for him and not lose him in free agency. Because let's be honest, his next contract will be based on what he's done to date, NOT what he will do in the future. It's almost a guaranteed over payment

The positional value is too much.

The problem is, Matthews is a centre. And we have awful centre depth.

 

[Apex Predator]

I’m hoping Matthews makes a lot of us look wrong by the end of the week. Feels like this is the perfect time to us look stupid!

 

[ruaware41]

The positional value is too much.

The problem is, Matthews is a centre. And we have awful centre depth.

Our center depth does suck but we can use Matthews to get a new center from a rebuilding team and have more cap space to bolster the position. Maybe as someone suggested we could pry Larkin out of Detroit but I doubt they would do it. Maybe another team will bite for pr purposes to help grow their fanbase bc of his name and being an American

 

[therealkoho]

I don’t think it’s injury related either. He seems distracted! I wonder what his off ice stuff is like

Probably would be a title from a Bieber song that might describe it

I know of a Beatles tune that might do it

 

[TMLAM34]

Our center depth does suck but we can use Matthews to get a new center from a rebuilding team and have more cap space to bolster the position. Maybe as someone suggested we could pry Larkin out of Detroit but I doubt they would do it. Maybe another team will bite for pr purposes to help grow their fanbase bc of his name and being an American

Dallas would be my perfect trading partner in any Matthews deal.

To Toronto: Wyatt Johnston + Thomas Harley
To Dallas: Auston Matthews + Simon Benoit

 

[fahad203]

Your own or someone else's?

Asking for a friend.

Drinking your own urine is a thing in many countries. Apparently it has anti septic benefits

 

[ITM]

Dallas would be my perfect trading partner in any Matthews deal.

To Toronto: Wyatt Johnston + Thomas Harley
To Dallas: Auston Matthews + Simon Benoit

We might as well ask Edmonton and Boston for a three way deal where we get Gretzky and Orr because it’s the same chance as getting a cost-controlled Johnston.

And the best part is, Johnston’s from Toronto, a late first and would have been an easy get had we wheeled and dealed with Dallas then.

Those first round picks aren’t chump change, but they sure do burn holes in our pockets.

 

[thewave]

Drinking your own urine is a thing in many countries. Apparently it has anti septic benefits

Oh yeah very healthy. We should probably all be having a tall boy right now.

 

[Martin Skoula]

If the centre is damaged goods and you never know when he cannot perform, then you keep the guy who, runs the PP/PK puts up 100 points a year and who's connection to the team probably exceeds most fanboys, enough so that he'd more than likely die for the team.

how are those special teams Marner runs doing? Failing for the 8th year in a row?

 

[namttebih]

The best way I can describe it is this.

Matthews is Batman and Marner is Robin.

Marner thinks they’re co Batman’s and wants to be paid like it.

But when the chips are down, they are both in fact two Robin’s.

Mic drop

 

[TonsofPuppies]

If the centre is damaged goods and you never know when he cannot perform, then you keep the guy who, runs the PP/PK puts up 100 points a year and who's connection to the team probably exceeds most fanboys, enough so that he'd more than likely die for the team.

Die for the team? Lmao. Marner loves the attention / perks that come with being a star on this team, particularly getting overpaid, which has been our mantra for the better part of a decade. But this guy won't even take a hit to win a puck battle for this team and you'll claim he'll "die" for them? Laughable.

 

[arso40]

It's a real Sophie's choice.

Mitch Pros:

1. #1 RW
2. Defends at a Selke level
3. Capable of scoring 100+ points a year
4. Plays on the PP and PK
5. Durable

Mitch Cons:

1. Prone to disappearing in the playoffs
2. Soft
3. Has poor mental outlook with fans and media in this large market which may contribute to playoff ineptitude
4. Overinflated sense of market value

Matthews Pros:

1. #1 C
2. Defends at a Selke level
3. Capable of 60+ goals and 100+ points a year
4. Plays on the PP and PK
5. Strong on faceoffs

Matthews Cons:

1. Prone to disappearing in the playoffs
2. Soft-ish. Not a bruiser but plays with a bit more physicality than Marner, still not enough
3. Avoids responsibility for poor play and prone to excuse making, at least in the media
4. Refuses to sign long term deals in favour of extracting as much money and taking up as much cap space as possible
5. Made of glass and constant injury issues call into question if his previous scoring prowess will continue

Conventional wisdom says you keep the #1 C every time. But I do think Matthews' injury issues are worth taking pause over considering how much we're paying him and how he hasn't looked dangerous at all this postseason (and rarely did in the regular season). Would need to see what and if he does anything in the offseason to rectify whatever is ailing him and if he can bounce back to a 50+ goal scorer at least. If he looks as poor as he did this season next year I think the argument leans more towards Marner.

Of course Marner needs a deal now, not next year. So unfortunately timing is against us again and we can't evaluate how Matthews will look after an offseason to maybe recover. They could also each get their heads out of their asses and lead this team to a series victory over Florida and hopefully more, then this conversation would be moot and the franchise could endeavor to sign Marner with no hesitation.

Here’s the problem we don’t have another number 1 center we have another 1rw which makes it that much easier but even if we didn’t have Willy you still go number 1 center all the time

 

[arso40]

The best way I can describe it is this.

Matthews is Batman and Marner is Robin.

Marner thinks they’re co Batman’s and wants to be paid like it.

But when the chips are down, they are both in fact two Robin’s.

I can agree with this if we had rantanen we’d be steam rolling through the east think about that one

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Matthews needs to score for Leafs to meet this challenge

Matthews needs to score for Leafs to meet this challenge

For much of his time with the Toronto Maple Leafs, Auston Matthews has served as something of a Rorschach test for hockey fans.Those who accept that playoff hockey is a fickle beast - that postseason success is often the result of getting just enough of the 50-50 chances to break your way, and...

thescore.com

 

[saffronleaf]

I’m hoping Matthews makes a lot of us look wrong by the end of the week. Feels like this is the perfect time to us look stupid!

We'll all look stupid for thinking he was elite all these years

 

[ruaware41]

Dallas would be my perfect trading partner in any Matthews deal.

To Toronto: Wyatt Johnston + Thomas Harley
To Dallas: Auston Matthews + Simon Benoit

honestly from a value perspective on paper it's probably fair but I don't know if Dallas would not even hesitate a lot doing Johnston for Matthews 1 for 1. Johnston scored 10 goals in 19 playoff games last year

 

[Aashir]

it's really not this hard to score in the second round, even if injured

Max f***ing Domi has a goal against Florida. Mitch Marner has a goal against florida. f***ing Morgan Rielly has MULTIPLE goals against florida.

No excuses to not have scored now. Absolutely none

 

[TMLAM34]

honestly from a value perspective on paper it's probably fair but I don't know if Dallas would not even hesitate a lot doing Johnston for Matthews 1 for 1. Johnston scored 10 goals in 19 playoff games last year

And Matthews scored 69 in the regular season last year.

Dallas or any team would easily move on from Johnston for Matthews, let’s not kid ourselves here. The only reason I’m even proposing this is because this core together will not win and Johnston would be a great center replacement. If we loose to Florida we need to see some major changes.

 

[The Shadow]

If Matthews was scoring he’d be perfect as the leader of this team. He’s getting chances. The problem is his shot has disappeared. For whatever reason. It’s sad for everyone. We are turning on him and he’s ailing in some way

Hopefully we will learn what the issue is and he gets it fixed. It might mean he misses much of next season.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

If Matthews was scoring he’d be perfect as the leader of this team. He’s getting chances. The problem is his shot has disappeared. For whatever reason. It’s sad for everyone. We are turning on him and he’s ailing in some way

Hopefully we will learn what the issue is and he gets it fixed. It might mean he misses much of next season.

When did Matthews suffer his issue exactly? He scored 6 goals in his last 11 games in the regular season. I

I think the issue you're speaking about is mostly a lack of mental fortitude.

 

[TonsofPuppies]

When did Matthews suffer his issue exactly? He scored 6 goals in his last 11 games in the regular season. I

I think the issue you're speaking about is mostly a lack of mental fortitude.

Matthews lacks that elusive "other gear" in big game moments, which is one of the traits that typically separate the truly elite superstars from other star players in the league. Crosby has it. MacKinnon has it. McDavid has it. Draisaitl has it. Rantanen has it. Matthews and Marner do not.

 

[fahad203]

Hellybuck and Matthews in the same team

What can possibly go wrong?

Luckily for US there was only 4 teams, one of them was detrimented with injuries(Finland)

 

[Racer88]

If Matthews was scoring he’d be perfect as the leader of this team. He’s getting chances. The problem is his shot has disappeared. For whatever reason. It’s sad for everyone. We are turning on him and he’s ailing in some way

Hopefully we will learn what the issue is and he gets it fixed. It might mean he misses much of next season.

And he can’t hit the net to save his life

 

[Racer88]

When did Matthews suffer his issue exactly? He scored 6 goals in his last 11 games in the regular season. I

I think the issue you're speaking about is mostly a lack of mental fortitude.

There ya go……bingo