Assuming Kucherov wins third Art Ross, he is above which of these groups of players...

[mel13666]

The take that NHL players themselves seemed to agree with. If points were the only thing that mattered then Kucherov would be a hair better.

Maybe because out of 660 respondents, about 300 people were Canadians and about 200 were Americans?)
Do you seriously think that if the voting had taken place in a neutral market, the result would have been the same? And even so, in the poll for the best, MacKinnon only got 9% and Kucherov about 7%. The only thing that is not discussed is McDavid's first place, his lead is too big to attribute to the loyalty of the locals.

 

[authentic]

Maybe because out of 660 respondents, about 300 people were Canadians and about 200 were Americans?)
Do you seriously think that if the voting had taken place in a neutral market, the result would have been the same? And even so, in the poll for the best, MacKinnon only got 9% and Kucherov about 7%. The only thing that is not discussed is McDavid's first place, his lead is too big to attribute to the loyalty of the locals.

I’m talking about when MacKinnon won the Lindsay, not McDavid.

You guys seriously think when players are this close offensively and the other is the better all around player it’s because he’s not Russian that people consider him better? Do you watch hockey or …?

 

[mel13666]

I’m talking about when MacKinnon won the Lindsay, not McDavid.

I meant the latest player poll. As far as I know, the results of the Ted Lindsay 23/24 vote were not published, or I did not see them.

 

[mel13666]

I’m talking about when MacKinnon won the Lindsay, not McDavid.

You guys seriously think when players are this close offensively and the other is the better all around player it’s because he’s not Russian that people consider him better? Do you watch hockey or …?

No, not just because he's Russian, because he's not from North America. The same goes for Draisaitl (to a lesser extent because he plays in Edmonton with a huge fan base), Pastrnak, Barkov, and pretty much any player off the market. To win the vote, you have to be a cut above the rest of the season.

Plus, Kucherov’s uncommunicative character and undeservedly bad reputation in the media play against him.

Yes, I watch a lot of hockey. How many Tampa games have you seen this season? At least 20 games? And all of Kucherov's statistics are better this season.

 

[killa3312]

That clearly doesn’t apply to this comparison with MacKinnon though. Advanced stats and eye test give him a slight but firm edge over Kucherov.

However, I think at the end of the day his results in the regular season and playoffs are staggering, and outscoring MacKinnon and McDavid two seasons in a row at 30 and 31 as the slower and less physically gifted player by far is impressive as hell. I don’t think Tampa or Colorado fans would trade one for the other.

Fair. I can respect that opinion.

 

[authentic]

I meant the latest player poll. As far as I know, the results of the Ted Lindsay 23/24 vote were not published, or I did not see them.

No, not just because he's Russian, because he's not from North America. The same goes for Draisaitl (to a lesser extent because he plays in Edmonton with a huge fan base), Pastrnak, Barkov, and pretty much any player off the market. To win the vote, you have to be a cut above the rest of the season.

Plus, Kucherov’s uncommunicative character and undeservedly bad reputation in the media play against him.

Yes, I watch a lot of hockey. How many Tampa games have you seen this season? At least 20 games? And all of Kucherov's statistics are better this season.

Well then maybe he’ll be voted better this season

 

[LightningStorm]

"3 Rosses in the McDavid era"
True - but not really as impactful as some people think that statement means. McDavid is 5th in points this year, and was 3rd last year. There was only one time (2019) where Kucherov had to directly beat out McDavid for the Ross.

McDavid had a great season last year. Him and Kucherov became only the 4th and 5th players in NHL history with 100 assists in a season. I'd say Kucherov directly beat him last season, MacKinnon just happened to have a great season and also beat out McDavid.

 

[Sky04]

Let’s put it this way, is anyone putting MacKinnon on this level as well? MacKinnon is a better player than Kucherov.

Production, awards and cups say different. Mackinnon isn't on the same level.

0 scoring titles, 0. Can't be considered a top forward without one sorry, no other player gets that pass.

 

[Sky04]

Hard disagree on this take.

Except the fact that Mackinnon has won significantly less in his career. But he skates fast and never gets out of the 2nd round tho

 

[Regal]

Production, awards and cups say different. Mackinnon isn't on the same level.

0 scoring titles, 0. Can't be considered a top forward without one sorry, no other player gets that pass.

Scoring at roughly the same level for 8 years but dismissing it to trophy count is just bad reasoning, sorry

 

[Sky04]

Scoring at roughly the same level for 8 years but dismissing it to trophy count is just bad reasoning, sorry

Trophy count matters. Again which player gets excused except Mackinnon? Are Malkin or Kane regarded as highly without their trophy case? No. Or how about his lack of playoff success? Not held against him either right?

Not like we're comparing him to Benn here it's apples to apples and one has clearly achieved more. Mackinnon is closer to Auston Matthews and Kucherov to McDavid

 

[Nathaniel]

Trophy count matters. Again which player gets excused except Mackinnon? Are Malkin or Kane regarded as highly without their trophy case? No. Or how about his lack of playoff success? Not held against him either right?

Not like we're comparing him to Benn here it's apples to apples and one has clearly achieved more. Mackinnon is closer to Auston Matthews and Kucherov to McDavid

This^ is exactly why mack should have played out the season. Would have won the art ross. Yeah all that healthy for the playoffs stuff but an art ross is worth the risk.

 

[Video Nasty]

This^ is exactly why mack should have played out the season. Would have won the art ross. Yeah all that healthy for the playoffs stuff but an art ross is worth the risk.

Would have? 6 points in 3 games is a big ask to assume. He was in control and simply lost it before even deciding to sit out, per usual when it comes to late season MacKinnon fades down the stretch—just 9 points in his final 14 games.

 

[Nathaniel]

Would have? 6 points in 3 games is a big ask to assume.

Should have at least gave it a go. All that hard work for 79 gp. Just to let it all go. There was a reason kucherov played the remaining games

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Yeah all that healthy for the playoffs stuff but an art ross is worth the risk.

Clearly MacKinnon disagrees

 

[Nathaniel]

Clearly MacKinnon disagrees

Or his coach. If mcdavid was anywhere near the scoring lead 100% he doesnt sit out what was it 8 gp? He was far behind so yes he rested. Mack should have played.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Or his coach. If mcdavid was anywhere near the scoring lead 100% he doesnt sit out what was it 8 gp? He was far behind so yes he rested. Mack should have played.

To make some trolls on the internet happy? They have other priorities

 

[Nathaniel]

To make some trolls on the internet happy? They have other priorities

I get that. But it is frustrating now you have these people brushing him off as he has no art ross n its true in the future it will hurt him. But he was tied for the lead with 3 damn games to go. But that will be forgotten

 

[FissionFire]

On par with Lafleur

A 3rd Art Ross (including one back-to-back), 2nd Hart, 2nd Lindsay, 5th 100-point season, along with an excellent playoff résumé is starting to look like an all-time great career. Especially in the McDavid era, where he’s been one of the only guys able to keep up with him offensively for so many years.

If he keeps going like this over the next few seasons, it's gonna be a three horse race for best European player ever between him, Jagr, and Ovechkin.

Sooner than later, he’s gonna be knocking on the door of the top 15–10 all-time.

I’d put Lidstrom comfortably ahead of Kucherov and ahead of Jagr. He’s on the same level as Ovechkin for arguably the best Euro in NHL history.

 

[Video Nasty]

Should have at least gave it a go. All that hard work for 79 gp. Just to let it all go. There was a reason kucherov played the remaining games

MacKinnon saw the writing on the wall. He knew he couldn’t make the effort needed to hold off Kucherov, so he gave up under the guise of playoff preparation.

 

[stevo61]

Voted D. He's a rat on the ice when cranky but an underrated superstar

 

[DFC]

MacKinnon was pacing to beat him for the Ross, but he felt compelled to go win a best on best tournament MVP in the middle of his season while Kucherov got to rest, which ended up costing him the Ross.

Was he? There might have been a couple of days where he was pacing to beat Kucherov. For 99% of the time McKinnon was in the lead, Kucherov was pacing to surpass him.

 

[Regal]

Was he? There might have been a couple of days where he was pacing to beat Kucherov. For 99% of the time McKinnon was in the lead, Kucherov was pacing to surpass him.

I think there was a while where he was pacing for it based on how many remaining games both had, because Kucherov missed some, but I wasn’t able to find any real per game lead

 

[DFC]

I think there was a while where he was pacing for it based on how many remaining games both had, because Kucherov missed some, but I wasn’t able to find any real per game lead

I think there might have been a few days where McKinnon was pacing to finish with more, but it was a point or two at best. On top of missing time, Kucherov had 3 or 4 games at hand all year, and was pacing to overtake McKinnon outside of maybe a couple of days.

 

[JJ68]

wanna know who the most underrated player of all time was? Ducky. Dale Hawerchuk. For years with the Jets he had no help. Look at those stats. Kept playing the Oilers in the playoffs. He had to carry the Jets to that point every year.

Smart and effective player who didnt get much awards or trophies simply because of circumstance and who and what he played for and against.

That is underrated.