Around the NHL - Part XLV (Playoffs edition)

[NickyFotiu]

I hate burns … but wtf

He was a nice guy at local pick up game a few years ago.

 

[noncents]

Yeah, the Rangers really did everything right around the leadup to the 2014 team. They had some banger trades, so obviously luck is involved, but still...

They rehabilitated high picks with skill as role players (that's where Florida got Bennett from, let's not forget, not paying $69 million for somebody's third liner). They rebuilt their defense around passing ability (McDonagh, Stralman, Klein). They got everyone to play a system that was based on straight hockey with speed.

By 2015-16, they were an East-West team that was already slowing down, had an immobile defense, and lost their speedy forecheckers only to replace them with useless grinders like Stoll and Glass. It took them two years.

They looked at the loss to LA, blamed it on everything they did well, and doubled down on everything about the team that was a negative.

Florida got lucky with some acquisitions like all winning teams do, but recognizing what makes you good is an ability, and it's one we don't seem to have.

A decade after 2015-16, we still have one of the least skilled defense corps in the NHL and we just keep shoving our chips to the middle of the table on it.

the stupid thing about your tone here is that you act like we didn't go to 2 ecf in 3 years with dogshit coaching to boot. they won a PT. the rangers have had good success. reading this you'd think they had been the worst team in the league for 5 years running.

shesterkin + dominant PP is a recipe that can be tweaked.

 

[NYRnine94]

Dom whatever-the-f***-his-name is a moron and I think his takes are laughable but this one I can’t clown him on that much.

Paul Maurice was an all time career loser before this run the Panthers have gone on

I hate that he’s won a cup because he truly is a loser and now he’s even more smug

Everybody is a loser until they win a cup. Why do so many people hate Maurice?

 

[Boris Zubov]

Everybody is a loser until they win a cup. Why do so many people hate Maurice?

It's like all of sudden he learned how to coach when he got to a team full of good players. Fairly reminiscent to Joe Torre.

 

[NYRnine94]

the stupid thing about your tone here is that you act like we didn't go to 2 ecf in 3 years with dogshit coaching to boot. they won a PT. the rangers have had good success. reading this you'd think they had been the worst team in the league for 5 years running.

shesterkin + dominant PP is a recipe that can be tweaked.

With certain posts, you have to consider the source.

Anyway, Shesterkin and a dominant PP can't be our recipe for success since the whistles go silent in the playoffs. Our 5 on 5 game needs to improve while still having a decent powerplay.

 

[Machinehead]

the stupid thing about your tone here is that you act like we didn't go to 2 ecf in 3 years with dogshit coaching to boot. they won a PT. the rangers have had good success. reading this you'd think they had been the worst team in the league for 5 years running.

shesterkin + dominant PP is a recipe that can be tweaked.

Listen, I'm not in the mood for your tone policing today.

Nobody who's ever won has built around being bad at even strength. They either don't realize they're not a good 5v5 team or don't care because they think they know better than everyone else.

You mentioned the last 5 years. Over those 5 years, the Rangers have a 51.8% goal share at 5v5, placing them 15th in the league. It's not the worst, but it's just not that good!! It's barely over the playoff line of 16 teams.

The Stanley Cup is totally monopolized by teams that outscore their opponents 5v5 by a sizeable margin. There aren't even any exceptions.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Most of you have lost the plot with the Panthers.

Maurice over a guy who had just guided the Panthers to a PT finish (well, most of the way at least) was a gigantic risk. Thats the kind of move that if it doesn't work, basically guarantees that you never get a GM job again. @Mike in Houston picked out 2 people who spoke up against it, but it was more or less universally met with people who didn't like it or acknowledged that it was a realllly risky play.

Paul Maurice had maybe 1 team capable of winning a cup or at least being in the conversation in all of his years coaching before taking the Panther job (Winnipeg 2018, which to this day is IMO the best team not to win one, that team was f***ing electric before they got voodoo'd in the WCF.) If he was being branded as a career loser, it was done by people who weren't paying attention to the quality of teams that he had to deal with.

I think the biggest mark in Zito's favor is that he basically stopped making bad moves after they won the PT and got swept by Tampa - His worst moves as GM came at the deadline that year (needlessly adding Giroux to a team that could already score when ever they wanted and giving up a boat load for Ben Chiarot who is f***ing awful.) He took it a step further by not being afraid to make bold moves by shipping out popular players for better players and reshaping his roster to fit what he and his new HC hire en visioned.

Risky and bold, but they worked. Their cup final run in 2023 was fools gold (that team was good, but they were dragged to the finals by goaltending and when Bob stopped being unbeatable, they got smoked) but Zito didn't just sit back and run it back with the same group because they came close.

He went out and replaced the shittiest parts of their roster with better players. Out went the Staal Brothers, in came Rodrigues and Mikkola.

Contrast that to what we've seen here which has been the same old boring, safe, lazy moves. If you're trying to hang your hat on the Rangers turning things around with Sullivan (who was the laziest hire of all time and doesn't signal at all a change in style) I'll tell you straight up that it won't happen unless the GM starts to do some bold stuff with the roster.

We have people who want to run it back with the same group next year and/or are f***ing terrified of trading Panarin. If you want different results you need to do different things. It may not work, but neither will continuing to do things that already haven't worked.

Yeah, the Rangers really did everything right around the leadup to the 2014 team. They had some banger trades, so obviously luck is involved, but still...

They rehabilitated high picks with skill as role players (that's where Florida got Bennett from, let's not forget, not paying $69 million for somebody's third liner). They rebuilt their defense around passing ability (McDonagh, Stralman, Klein). They got everyone to play a system that was based on straight hockey with speed.

By 2015-16, they were an East-West team that was already slowing down, had an immobile defense, and lost their speedy forecheckers only to replace them with useless grinders like Stoll and Glass. It took them two years.

They looked at the loss to LA, blamed it on everything they did well, and doubled down on everything about the team that was a negative.

Florida got lucky with some acquisitions like all winning teams do, but recognizing what makes you good is an ability, and it's one we don't seem to have.

A decade after 2015-16, we still have one of the least skilled defense corps in the NHL and we just keep shoving our chips to the middle of the table on it.

I don't think the bolded is true.

They handcuffed themselves by choosing the wrong players. I can't get behind the idea that they ignored what made them good because they added Boyle and Yandle within the same time frame.

Staal and Girardi's contracts were responsible for them trading away Hagelin (they could have afforded him with the extra 10+ million they would have had. This was low key a terrible move by Gorton too, that return was butt) and the rest of the roster either got old or really wasn't good enough to lead the way but those 2 were the main culprits because they were on the decline when they were signed and continued to get way more ice time than they deserved.

I don't think they would have won the entire thing in 2017 but they had no business losing to the Senators that year. That series had Staal and Girardi's prints all over it along with the genius to continued to throw them out there and lose better players on the bench.

 

[Gordon Bombay]

Most of you have lost the plot with the Panthers.

Maurice over a guy who had just guided the Panthers to a PT finish (well, most of the way at least) was a gigantic risk. Thats the kind of move that if it doesn't work, basically guarantees that you never get a GM job again. @Mike in Houston picked out 2 people who spoke up against it, but it was more or less universally met with people who didn't like it or acknowledged that it was a realllly risky play.

Paul Maurice had maybe 1 team capable of winning a cup or at least being in the conversation in all of his years coaching before taking the Panther job (Winnipeg 2018, which to this day is IMO the best team not to win one, that team was f***ing electric before they got voodoo'd in the WCF.) If he was being branded as a career loser, it was done by people who weren't paying attention to the quality of teams that he had to deal with.

I think the biggest mark in Zito's favor is that he basically stopped making bad moves after they won the PT and got swept by Tampa - His worst moves as GM came at the deadline that year (needlessly adding Giroux to a team that could already score when ever they wanted and giving up a boat load for Ben Chiarot who is f***ing awful.) He took it a step further by not being afraid to make bold moves by shipping out popular players for better players and reshaping his roster to fit what he and his new HC hire en visioned.

Risky and bold, but they worked. Their cup final run in 2023 was fools gold (that team was good, but they were dragged to the finals by goaltending and when Bob stopped being unbeatable, they got smoked) but Zito didn't just sit back and run it back with the same group because they came close.

He went out and replaced the shittiest parts of their roster with better players. Out went the Staal Brothers, in came Rodrigues and Mikkola.

Contrast that to what we've seen here which has been the same old boring, safe, lazy moves. If you're trying to hang your hat on the Rangers turning things around with Sullivan (who was the laziest hire of all time and doesn't signal at all a change in style) I'll tell you straight up that it won't happen unless the GM starts to do some bold stuff with the roster.

We have people who want to run it back with the same group next year and/or are f***ing terrified of trading Panarin. If you want different results you need to do different things. It may not work, but neither will continuing to do things that already haven't worked.



I don't think the bolded is true.

They handcuffed themselves by choosing the wrong players. I can't get behind the idea that they ignored what made them good because they added Boyle and Yandle within the same time frame.

Staal and Girardi's contracts were responsible for them trading away Hagelin (they could have afforded him with the extra 10+ million they would have had. This was low key a terrible move by Gorton too, that return was butt) and the rest of the roster either got old or really wasn't good enough to lead the way but those 2 were the main culprits because they were on the decline when they were signed and continued to get way more ice time than they deserved.

I don't think they would have won the entire thing in 2017 but they had no business losing to the Senators that year. That series had Staal and Girardi's prints all over it along with the genius to continued to throw them out there and lose better players on the bench.

Please refresh my memory on who AV lost on the bench and who Staal’s d partner was?

That was criminal coaching and 100% lost the series

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Please refresh my memory on who AV lost on the bench and who Staal’s d partner was?

That was criminal coaching and 100% lost the series

I believe it was Brendan Smith and Brady Skjei?

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

One of the things about florida that gives me a glimmer of hope for the rangers is that the Bob contract was considered a humongous albatross, especially after he had an awful first year, and they’ve been just fine

 

[duhmetreE]

Most of you have lost the plot with the Panthers.

Maurice over a guy who had just guided the Panthers to a PT finish (well, most of the way at least) was a gigantic risk. Thats the kind of move that if it doesn't work, basically guarantees that you never get a GM job again. @Mike in Houston picked out 2 people who spoke up against it, but it was more or less universally met with people who didn't like it or acknowledged that it was a realllly risky play.

Paul Maurice had maybe 1 team capable of winning a cup or at least being in the conversation in all of his years coaching before taking the Panther job (Winnipeg 2018, which to this day is IMO the best team not to win one, that team was f***ing electric before they got voodoo'd in the WCF.) If he was being branded as a career loser, it was done by people who weren't paying attention to the quality of teams that he had to deal with.

I think the biggest mark in Zito's favor is that he basically stopped making bad moves after they won the PT and got swept by Tampa - His worst moves as GM came at the deadline that year (needlessly adding Giroux to a team that could already score when ever they wanted and giving up a boat load for Ben Chiarot who is f***ing awful.) He took it a step further by not being afraid to make bold moves by shipping out popular players for better players and reshaping his roster to fit what he and his new HC hire en visioned.

Risky and bold, but they worked. Their cup final run in 2023 was fools gold (that team was good, but they were dragged to the finals by goaltending and when Bob stopped being unbeatable, they got smoked) but Zito didn't just sit back and run it back with the same group because they came close.

He went out and replaced the shittiest parts of their roster with better players. Out went the Staal Brothers, in came Rodrigues and Mikkola.

Contrast that to what we've seen here which has been the same old boring, safe, lazy moves. If you're trying to hang your hat on the Rangers turning things around with Sullivan (who was the laziest hire of all time and doesn't signal at all a change in style) I'll tell you straight up that it won't happen unless the GM starts to do some bold stuff with the roster.

We have people who want to run it back with the same group next year and/or are f***ing terrified of trading Panarin. If you want different results you need to do different things. It may not work, but neither will continuing to do things that already haven't worked.



I don't think the bolded is true.

They handcuffed themselves by choosing the wrong players. I can't get behind the idea that they ignored what made them good because they added Boyle and Yandle within the same time frame.

Staal and Girardi's contracts were responsible for them trading away Hagelin (they could have afforded him with the extra 10+ million they would have had. This was low key a terrible move by Gorton too, that return was butt) and the rest of the roster either got old or really wasn't good enough to lead the way but those 2 were the main culprits because they were on the decline when they were signed and continued to get way more ice time than they deserved.

I don't think they would have won the entire thing in 2017 but they had no business losing to the Senators that year. That series had Staal and Girardi's prints all over it along with the genius to continued to throw them out there and lose better players on the bench.

I don’t think it starts with Panarin.

It starts with Kreider and Zibs imo. That emo clique is not good for a locker room. It is what it is.

Would Drury move all 3? That’s bold but the NMCs have us by the balls. I’m fully ok with moving all 3.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Please refresh my memory on who AV lost on the bench and who Staal’s d partner was?

That was criminal coaching and 100% lost the series

Skjei and Smith.

Staal played with Nick Holden.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I don’t think it starts with Panarin.

It starts with Kreider and Zibs imo. That emo clique is not good for a locker room. It is what it is.

Would Drury move all 3? That’s bold but the NMCs have us by the balls. I’m fully ok with moving all 3.

I think it depends on what your goals are.

If you really want to reshape your team and play differently, nothing is going to force that more than getting rid of the guy they’ve unsuccessfully tried to build around for the last 6 years and isn’t suited to play the style of game that you’re trying to instill in this group.

I think it’s time to move on from Kreider regardless of what they decide to do fwiw.

 

[CasusBelli]

He was a nice guy at local pick up game a few years ago.

I just don’t trust people with snakes as pets.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

I don’t think it starts with Panarin.

It starts with Kreider and Zibs imo. That emo clique is not good for a locker room. It is what it is.

Would Drury move all 3? That’s bold but the NMCs have us by the balls. I’m fully ok with moving all 3.

Agreed. They need to be gone it’s the only way the healing can begin. And I don’t care that ZiB began producing at a non-embarrassing level after Miller came. He’s the biggest issue on the team.

 

[Boris Zubov]

Agreed. They need to be gone it’s the only way the healing can begin. And I don’t care that ZiB began producing at a non-embarrassing level after Miller came. He’s the biggest issue on the team.

Half of those points came in the last 10 games of the year when the season was basically lost.

 

[NickyFotiu]

I just don’t trust people with snakes as pets.

I do not know him so I can not say anything except he was really nice around 4 summers ago. I do not think it matters now but he played in a local (TX) drop in game when he probably was not supposed to be doing that contract wise. I have a picture of him with my buddy. Huge smile albeit missing a lot of teeth

 

[NYR94]

Oops

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Oops

I bet that there is actually truth to this and they wanted to keep it under wraps for a little while longer. Taking attention away from the playoffs is a no-no and it's weird timing regardless.

With 1 year left on his deal and him turning 40 at the beginning of the year it makes sense.

 

[Cmox]

Anson Carter making an ass of himself...again.

I agree with him. Why should they start now?

 

[Filip Chytil]

 

[bleedblue94]

This is an interesting point because it seems to make the assumption that after the 45 hour game where everything is called, the players won't start adjusting how they play the game to match the changed criteria of officiating.
For every other sport I'd say that's weird. For hockey, where we still see a tonne of 'puck over glass' penalties 20 years after the the rule was introduced, it does make sense...

At the start of the playoffs and every round the officials call more and call it tighter. Do you think that as the playoffs move along or a series moves along the players get nicer to each other and do less shit or that the league just owns the fact that no one wants to watch 49 minutes of 3 on 3 playoff hockey.

In the NBA and NHL it's constantly talked about that certain teams just keep taking penalties/fouls bc they know the officials "can't" call them all, and they are right. No one would watch and sponsor money goes away. Fans complain but they still watch.

It's not changing...

 

[bleedblue94]

They're not as good as they think they are.

Weird, their coach literally just said he didn't think they would make the playoffs at the start of the season. Seems they overachieved compared to what they thought they were. Even weirder for an nyr fan to critique it ha

 

[Filip Chytil]

What I’m hearing about Penguins coaching search’s final stages

The Penguins are getting close to Kyle Dubas' June 1 deadline of naming a new coach.

www.nytimes.com

Marco Rossi’s name has been floating around in trade rumors, and the Penguins are a potential suitor.
The Penguins like him. He fits the profile they want. It’s not often that young, talented players such as Rossi are available on the trade market. He’s No. 2 on Chris Johnston’s offseason trade board for a reason.
By accumulating so many draft picks, the Penguins have the ammunition to go after players like Rossi. Dubas doesn’t seem all that interested in bringing in players in their 30s. He’s trying to build for the long haul.
Rossi doesn’t turn 24 until September. He’s a name to keep in mind.

Teams continue to call the Penguins about a potential trade for Bryan Rust.
Rust’s no-trade clause expires on July 1, after which the Penguins won’t need to ask his permission to trade him.
Now, I’d be surprised if they do trade him. He should be wearing an “A” on his sweater. He’s Crosby’s favorite winger and a terrific player on a very good contract. His reputation for being wonderful with young players fits the long-term plan.
In other words, he’s the kind of guy you want to keep around. I think the Penguins will do just that — unless, of course, a team makes Dubas an outrageous offer.

 

[Boris Zubov]

I agree with him. Why should they start now?

Are you sure we're talking about the same thing?