Around the NHL — Episode XLXVII

[bicboi64]

It would be incredibly funny if Ottawa signed Marner or Tavares (Toronto born and loving guys) and then had playoff success lol

 

[DylanSensFan]

Yeah he has his warts but I’d easily take him here. Brady probably goes back to 80+ point form and Stu puts up 100+ points.

They haven’t had that type of winger sonce Giroux could still play 2 years ago.

Yeah, it's all good until we get into the playoffs. Stü can be a 100-point player without Giroux or Marner. Part of the reason offense has declined is because this team has had to learn to play defense. We saw that stingy play in the playoffs, where we actually competed with Toronto. Even shooting more would get Stü at least five more goals per season, maybe more than that.

There is no way I would pay Mitch Marner $13-million or more to disappear in the playoffs. He isn't built for them and neither is anyone on that Toronto roster outside of maybe Knies, Domi and part of their defensive core. But as a GM, what do they do with this flaccid TML team? The difference between TML and us, is that even though we don't match them offensively our team has some dog in them. The same goes for Florida. TML is more offensively talented than Florida throughout their roster. But, Florida is dogged and they go after the puck, and actually care about winning Stanley Cups. Toronto, Marner and their attitude is mediocre... PLAY LIKE OFFENSIVE GODS in the regular season and then fall completely apart in playoffs.

 

[DylanSensFan]

Nylander is fine.

I would sort of agree, but not totally. Nylander has also disappeared. If Berube cannot get through to this team then there is no hope for them to change their ways long term.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Watching the Panthers destroy the Leafs spirit was really kind of nice to see
It did make me wonder what would have happened if the Sens could have taken Game 2 in OT ... we were close

 

[Bileur]

It did for Marner in Round 1. But did it really, people and mostly the refs saw the soft plays and now they are in a fight with the meanest team in hockey he’s not getting any calls because the refs don’t want to be shown up and know Marner dives on everybting.

The refs hate marner, have always hated playoff Marners and he won’t get any more calls this series

Tavares drew a few for sure.

Tavares taught him everything he knows. But the Leaf team fans go on and on, even before the series started about Stu.... I didn't realize how divy the Leafs were until watching them in round 1.

Exactly, you read my mind.

 

[aragorn]

Yeah, it's all good until we get into the playoffs. Stü can be a 100-point player without Giroux or Marner. Part of the reason offense has declined is because this team has had to learn to play defense. We saw that stingy play in the playoffs, where we actually competed with Toronto. Even shooting more would get Stü at least five more goals per season, maybe more than that.

There is no way I would pay Mitch Marner $13-million or more to disappear in the playoffs. He isn't built for them and neither is anyone on that Toronto roster outside of maybe Knies, Domi and part of their defensive core. But as a GM, what do they do with this flaccid TML team? The difference between TML and us, is that even though we don't match them offensively our team has some dog in them. The same goes for Florida. TML is more offensively talented than Florida throughout their roster. But, Florida is dogged and they go after the puck, and actually care about winning Stanley Cups. Toronto, Marner and their attitude is mediocre... PLAY LIKE OFFENSIVE GODS in the regular season and then fall completely apart in playoffs.

This is the problem with some skilled players they don't like the rough stuff when it comes to the playoffs, I continue to say that the Leafs are good regular season players, but too soft especially their star players for the playoffs. More skill does not necessarily translate into playoff success when the going gets so much tougher with every round. You need guys including skilled guys who can handle the tough stuff & give it back. Tkachuk is built for the playoffs, Stutzle is learning to handle the tough stuff, Greig & Pinto are learning to play tougher, Perron & Giroux can handle the rough stuff, Sanderson seems to be able to handle it, Kleven is learning to handle it & I'm quite sure that Yakemchuk is built for the playoffs as well.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

As much as we love to shit on the leafs .. I think the Panthers deserve a lot of credit for getting their game together ... being relentless on the forecheck and shutting down the neutral zone. Bob also made the saves he had to make at the right time.

Leafs goaltending has been ok but not as good as what Stolarz was as well.

Panthers broke their spirit. They served them heaping spoons full of doubt. Series isn't over but if the Panthers can play their game again .. it should be over in 6.

 

[DueDiligence]

Nylander is fine.

Nylander is fine when he's in the offensive zone. Good aggressive forecheck and fights for pucks. In his own zone and playing defense in general, he has a tendency to slack off.

 

[DueDiligence]

It would be incredibly funny if Ottawa signed Marner or Tavares (Toronto born and loving guys) and then had playoff success lol

Marner needs to play with a guy like Brady. Brady does all the heavy lifting and Marner gets to work his magic.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

This is the problem with some skilled players they don't like the rough stuff when it comes to the playoffs, I continue to say that the Leafs are good regular season players, but too soft especially their star players for the playoffs. More skill does not necessarily translate into playoff success when the going gets so much tougher with every round. You need guys including skilled guys who can handle the tough stuff & give it back. Tkachuk is built for the playoffs, Stutzle is learning to handle the tough stuff, Greig & Pinto are learning to play tougher, Perron & Giroux can handle the rough stuff, Sanderson seems to be able to handle it, Kleven is learning to handle it & I'm quite sure that Yakemchuk is built for the playoffs as well.

As much as I'd love Peterka, Peterka by all accounts looks to be a slower Ehlers, who has not done well in the playoffs. Peterka should have been our pick in 2020, but I'm hesitant in trading for him and signing him to a big deal.

 

[flyingfingers]

Matthews is a stud, if he wants to change his reputation he has 120 minutes of hockey to do it. Score and win 2 games and be a stud or fade away and be a local hero.

I disagree that Matthews is a stud.

All this talk of being "a 200 foot player" is insane to me. The guy is good defensively, sure, but he's not so good that he's impacting the game and helping his team win that way. He's paid to score, and he simply can't do it. 0 goals in 10 second round games so far in his career.

And let's look at his metrics this playoffs, at 5v5:

48.14 xGF%, 43.41 CF%, 42.95 SCF%, 50.79 HDCF%

Now compare that to the "stud" centers:

Draisaitl: 64.33 xGF%, 62.59 CF%, 65.00 SCF%, 67.11 HDCF%
Barkov: 60.43xGF%, 61.48 CF%, 64.34 SCF%, 60.32 HDCF%

I left out McDavid because he's just on a separate level.

But Matthews is simply a tier below the studs, and there's no denying it at this point.

I'm not saying he sucks, but he's in the tier with guys like Aho and Hintz. He's not a Draisaitl or MacKinnon or Barkov.

 

[Tuna99]

I disagree that Matthews is a stud.

All this talk of being "a 200 foot player" is insane to me. The guy is good defensively, sure, but he's not so good that he's impacting the game and helping his team win that way. He's paid to score, and he simply can't do it. 0 goals in 10 second round games so far in his career.

And let's look at his metrics this playoffs, at 5v5:

48.14 xGF%, 43.41 CF%, 42.95 SCF%, 50.79 HDCF%

Now compare that to the "stud" centers:

Draisaitl: 64.33 xGF%, 62.59 CF%, 65.00 SCF%, 67.11 HDCF%
Barkov: 60.43xGF%, 61.48 CF%, 64.34 SCF%, 60.32 HDCF%

I left out McDavid because he's just on a separate level.

But Matthews is simply a tier below the studs, and there's no denying it at this point.

Matthews is only in round 4 of his 12 round career.

It’s not going to happen with the Leafs, it’ll be in another market. but it will happen for him when he has wingers who play as hard as he does and fans that have his back

 

[aragorn]

As much as I'd love Peterka, Peterka by all accounts looks to be a slower Ehlers, who has not done well in the playoffs. Peterka should have been our pick in 2020, but I'm hesitant in trading for him and signing him to a big deal.

Small skilled players are targeted in the playoffs just like EK used to be targeted, we see Marner targeted by MTkachuk & it makes a difference. You can have some small skilled players, but too many & you end up with too soft a team who won't go near the net & take the abuse by much larger defencemen which most teams seem to be acquiring. Having some big forwards who go to the net like BTkachuk opens up space for Stutzle to find good passing & shooting lanes.

Peterka is a great regular season player, but when the going gets tough & he becomes a target unless he has big players to protect him will disappear. This may be old school thinking, but every playoffs we see the same thing happening yr after yr & people get angry with the refs, but they can't call everything all the time, it would completely stop play & fans & players won't accept that.

 

[flyingfingers]

Matthews is only in round 4 of his 12 round career.

It’s not going to happen with the Leafs, it’ll be in another market. but it will happen for him when he has wingers who play as hard as he does and dans that have his back

He'll be 28 next season and the injuries are already stacking up. He's not an elite skater and isn't all that willing to use his size. What he has is a shot and hands. But considering the injuries are his wrist and (rumored) back... that doesn't bode all that well for the future.

Matthew Knies is the exact prototype of the winger you'd want with Matthews, and is playing his ass off every night. It hasn't helped Auston. It's actually made him look worse, since Knies goes balls to the wall and Matthews glides around waiting for an opening that just doesn't come in the playoffs.

If I'm the Leafs, I cash out of the Matthews experiment while you can still get an insane package and build around Nylander and Knies.

 

[Loach]

Watching the Panthers destroy the Leafs spirit was really kind of nice to see
It did make me wonder what would have happened if the Sens could have taken Game 2 in OT ... we were close

This. They got ripped off so bad by the refs in game 1 it carried over to game 2. They came out hesitant and down by 2 before it clicked that the reffing would be somewhat normal. Rest of the series was there. Same thing happened in the first game of this series, TO gets PPs and Florida gets kicked out of the faceoffs. Difference was that Florida has the playoff xp to deal with it.

 

[maclean]

As much as we love to shit on the leafs .. I think the Panthers deserve a lot of credit for getting their game together ... being relentless on the forecheck and shutting down the neutral zone. Bob also made the saves he had to make at the right time.

Leafs goaltending has been ok but not as good as what Stolarz was as well.

Panthers broke their spirit. They served them heaping spoons full of doubt. Series isn't over but if the Panthers can play their game again .. it should be over in 6.

One of the huge things this game in particular was the Panthers immediately breaking up any Toronto breakout in the neutral zone. Saw it over and over, and that's gotta become so frustrating, plus the unrelenting pressure that results, really a masterclass from Florida

 

[BigRig4]

One of the huge things this game in particular was the Panthers immediately breaking up any Toronto breakout in the neutral zone. Saw it over and over, and that's gotta become so frustrating, plus the unrelenting pressure that results, really a masterclass from Florida

They’ve got dawgs

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

One of the huge things this game in particular was the Panthers immediately breaking up any Toronto breakout in the neutral zone. Saw it over and over, and that's gotta become so frustrating, plus the unrelenting pressure that results, really a masterclass from Florida

Just out from Pierre Lebrun

 

[Masked]

If I'm the Leafs, I cash out of the Matthews experiment while you can still get an insane package and build around Nylander and Knies.

There's no cashing out with him now. He's locked in a NMC so if you try, he's going to be able to pick his spot absolutely destroying your trade leverage.

 

[flyingfingers]

There's no cashing out with him now. He's locked in a NMC so if you try, he's going to be able to pick his spot absolutely destroying your trade leverage.

You'd still be able to get a haul. I'm sure he wouldn't mind going to LA, and they have lots of pieces that Ken Holland would probably trade to make that sort of splash.

Say... Mathews for Byfield, Clarke, Danault and a 1st.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

They would still get a good return for Matthews, just not full value.

Rantanen just got two 1sts, two 3rds, and Stankoven. He didn't have a traditional NMC, but because Carolina was only getting that return if he signed with the team it acted similar to a NMC.

Let's say they move Matthews to Vegas/Florida/Tampa for two 1sts, two 3rds, and a good young player on his ELC/RFA years. Part of the return that is factored in would be whatever they do with the 13 million dollars. So if they keep Marner, or sign other free agents, whoever they use that money on is part of the return.

 

[bicboi64]

In the spirit of more hockey and chaos, it would be funny to see Marner and AM34 suddenly go super saiyan and score like 10 points as the Leafs make a comeback in the next two games, only for them to go back to disappearing in the ECF and convince Treliving to run it back with them. They have the talent for it

 

[Senscore]

In the spirit of more hockey and chaos, it would be funny to see Marner and AM34 suddenly go super saiyan and score like 10 points as the Leafs make a comeback in the next two games, only for them to go back to disappearing in the ECF and convince Treliving to run it back with them. They have the talent for it

At this point we know who they are though. They aren't going to suddenly be different.


Even in the Sens series Matthews goals were hardly impressive. Both were screw ups on Ullmarks part.

 

[BigRig4]

They would still get a good return for Matthews, just not full value.

Rantanen just got two 1sts, two 3rds, and Stankoven. He didn't have a traditional NMC, but because Carolina was only getting that return if he signed with the team it acted similar to a NMC.

Let's say they move Matthews to Vegas/Florida/Tampa for two 1sts, two 3rds, and a good young player on his ELC/RFA years. Part of the return that is factored in would be whatever they do with the 13 million dollars. So if they keep Marner, or sign other free agents, whoever they use that money on is part of the return.

Byfield as the centrepiece of a return would make a lot of sense imo.

 

[Hale The Villain]

They're going to find a way to sign Marner or overpay for Boeser.

I could see them moving Karlsson's 5.9M cap hit given their center depth + Hague or Whitecloud and then using the resulting cap space to sign Marner.

They need high-end skill badly. It's a problem now and Stone and Herl aren't getting any younger.