Around the League Thread | Anything Non-Rumours and Trades Goes Here

[VanJack]

They all want to play for Vegas or Florida.

What always baffles me a little is the difference between baseball and hockey when it comes to playing in Canada.

MLB players love playing for the Jays. They find it cool that an entire country is rooting for them. And since their salaries are far in excess of NHL salaries, you'd think they'd be the first to complain about the tax structure and the disparity with places like Florida or Vegas.

But for them, it doesn't seem to matter. Yet for a handful of U.S. born hockey players, for some reason it's entirely different. I think a big part of it is the passion and scrutiny that goes with playing in a Canadian market. South of the border, nobody really cares once you get 15 feet from the arena entrance.

I still think that the few high profile defections of U.S. players is clouding the picture of the number of players who where born in the U.S. but love playing in Canada. Guys like Kyle Connor and Brock Boeser come to mind.

 

[northwestrncomfort]

Nobody wanted Boeser. The Canucks gave him more money than others would.

 

[Jyrki21]

They can’t seem to string multiple good moves together. Ott, Van, Buf, Det, cbj that have moved or likely will have to move their top guy, you can list multiple bad moves over the time between when that player arrived til when they left.

In Vancouver's case and to an extent Detroit's, it's purely incompetence. For the others (and the rest of Detroit), they are swimming with a 50-lb. weight around their ankle that the glitzy markets don't have. A lot of the so-called poor decision-making stems directly from spoiled player behavior, becoming instantly disgruntled in certain markets but having endless patience in others.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Carels saw how Brady Martin was glazed and had his stock shoot up for being a farmer (despite him being nothing special) and he followed in his footsteps. That pick for the Predators is not looking good so far

He never should have been a top 5 pick. Martin was in the next tier of players with Bear, Cootes, etc. if he was picked 12th or something he still wouldn’t be doing great compared to his peers. It really doesn’t help that the Parker Martone was picked after, and is looking like the next big power forward.

 

[Jyrki21]

So I hadn't appreciated the Rucks actually led the WHL in scoring... isn't that a big deal? Why was everyone so cool on them? (I know their skating is supposedly subpar, but shouldn't that have impeded them more in junior too? It seems they worked around it OK).

The other question -- they had roughly the same number of points. Why was Liam ranked so much higher than Markus? Because of the goal totals? You'd think that's just the product of one guy being a setup man and the other a trigger-man, though... I assume they were largely in on the same scoring plays.

 

[CanuckleBerry]

So I hadn't appreciated the Rucks actually led the WHL in scoring... isn't that a big deal? Why was everyone so cool on them? (I know their skating is supposedly subpar, but shouldn't that have impeded them more in junior too? It seems they worked around it OK).

The other question -- they had roughly the same number of points. Why was Liam ranked so much higher than Markus? Because of the goal totals? You'd think that's just the product of one guy being a setup man and the other a trigger-man, though... I assume they were largely in on the same scoring plays.

This came up a few times. The main impressions I kept hearing is that their board play, and puck control was at a questionable level to translate to the NHL and larger stronger opponents. So while they seem like they have some comparables to the Sedins, playmaker vs shooter, high skill, slow foot speed, they didn't have those two aspects that allowed the Sedins to translate. They will likely put on some weight too, but they're even a little more slight than the Sedins. I feel like they could still buck all those concerns and eventually figure it all out at the NHL level. But they also would likely need a linemate who is an absolute bulldog in puck retrieval, and shit disturbing.

 

[bandwagonesque]

I don't see that anyone's mentioned it here yet but Stecher goes back to Toronto for 2X1.35M. He hasn't had many chances to win so I'm not surprised he's not signing here.

 

[StreetHawk]

What always baffles me a little is the difference between baseball and hockey when it comes to playing in Canada.

Hard to say.

NBA also not an easy sell. Guys complain about simple things. Like customs, but say stupid things like 41 times. Like no dude, it's closer to around 15 times as you go on 3-5 game road trips so a total maybe 13-15.
But, I feel like it declined over time since the Grizzlies as more Euros are in the league and the game isn't as "Street" if you will where it's under the rim. More 3's.

MLB, who knows. What is the demographics of the game nowadays? I know some reports are that it's growing in Latin America and they get a few more Asian imports. Among "African Americans" the % of players has fallen since the 90's.

Hockey, rising costs is going to change the demographics.

 

[bandwagonesque]

What always baffles me a little is the difference between baseball and hockey when it comes to playing in Canada.

MLB players love playing for the Jays. They find it cool that an entire country is rooting for them. And since their salaries are far in excess of NHL salaries, you'd think they'd be the first to complain about the tax structure and the disparity with places like Florida or Vegas.

But for them, it doesn't seem to matter. Yet for a handful of U.S. born hockey players, for some reason it's entirely different. I think a big part of it is the passion and scrutiny that goes with playing in a Canadian market. South of the border, nobody really cares once you get 15 feet from the arena entrance.

I still think that the few high profile defections of U.S. players is clouding the picture of the number of players who where born in the U.S. but love playing in Canada. Guys like Kyle Connor and Brock Boeser come to mind.

Baseball is in one extremely cosmopolitan city, it's during the spring and summer, and most NBA players are conspicuously tall black men from American cities where black American culture is a major influence on pretty much everything.

 

[StreetHawk]

I don't see that anyone's mentioned it here yet but Stecher goes back to Toronto for 2X1.35M. He hasn't had many chances to win so I'm not surprised he's not signing here.

Good for Troy. He's made $13.9 mill so far in his career. This deal would put him at $16.5 mill in career earnings. Thought when he left, he'd for sure hit $20 mill, but after Det, he ended up with lower contract offers.

He's done well for an undersized undrafted kid from UND. But, he's a #6/7 Dman who managed to make a living in the NHL for a decade now.

 

[Vector]

I don't see that anyone's mentioned it here yet but Stecher goes back to Toronto for 2X1.35M. He hasn't had many chances to win so I'm not surprised he's not signing here.

Because we talked about it in the other thread.

 

[valkynax]

Stecher extended by TOR for 2 years.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Leafs signing Raddsyh for 60+ Millions just weeks before the best possible Defenseman option becomes officially on the market is a cruel twist of fate.

They still need to get Werenski if possible, it's their only shot for real cup aspirations while they still have Matthews, and maybe keep him.

 

[Snatcher Demko]

Happy for Stecher. Tidy sum for the guy career wise. All heart.

 

[StreetHawk]

Leafs signing Raddsyh for 60+ Millions just weeks before the best possible Defenseman option becomes officially on the market is a cruel twist of fate.

They still need to get Werenski if possible, it's their only shot for real cup aspirations while they still have Matthews, and maybe keep him.

What assets does Toronto have to make that trade?

CBJ always seems to be just rebooting. Based on their trades over the past couple of years, have not used a 2nd round pick for a 4 year period. None in 25, 26 drafts. And nothing in 27 or 28.

After Werenski, in round 1:
they had PLD bail on them.
Moved 1sts in 17 and 19.
Foudy in 18 draft.
Chinkhov in 20 that they moved.
Johnson, Sillinger, Ceulemans in '21. Want more out of the first 2 and waiting on Ceulsmans
Jiricek, Meteychuk in '22. Moved off Jiricek. Meteychuk has been fine in his rookie year.
Fantilli in '23. Just missed out (position wise with Chi as they lost their final game keeping them at #2, while #3 worst Chi wins the lottery).
Lindstrom in '24. Took a bigger guy who had injuries. Then just 10 points in 31 games in NCAA last season.
Smith and the G in '25
Hemming this year.

That's a hole lot of misses since Werenski.

If they move Werenski for futures, they've got 4 more RFA years for Fantilli.

 

[VanillaCoke]

What assets does Toronto have to make that trade?

CBJ always seems to be just rebooting. Based on their trades over the past couple of years, have not used a 2nd round pick for a 4 year period. None in 25, 26 drafts. And nothing in 27 or 28.

After Werenski, in round 1:
they had PLD bail on them.
Moved 1sts in 17 and 19.
Foudy in 18 draft.
Chinkhov in 20 that they moved.
Johnson, Sillinger, Ceulemans in '21. Want more out of the first 2 and waiting on Ceulsmans
Jiricek, Meteychuk in '22. Moved off Jiricek. Meteychuk has been fine in his rookie year.
Fantilli in '23. Just missed out (position wise with Chi as they lost their final game keeping them at #2, while #3 worst Chi wins the lottery).
Lindstrom in '24. Took a bigger guy who had injuries. Then just 10 points in 31 games in NCAA last season.
Smith and the G in '25
Hemming this year.

That's a hole lot of misses since Werenski.

If they move Werenski for futures, they've got 4 more RFA years for Fantilli.

Sounds like Toronto's offer centers around Knies, and Dallas' around Harley, can't imagine they go with torontos but most nhl gms are stupid.

When you list it all like that I kinda understand Werenski's perspective, although I do feel for Jackets fans bigtime, canucks have awful luck but somehow Columbus has been worse.

 

[StreetHawk]

Sounds like Toronto's offer centers around Knies, and Dallas' around Harley, can't imagine they go with torontos but most nhl gms are stupid.

When you list it all like that I kinda understand Werenski's perspective, although I do feel for Jackets fans bigtime, canucks have awful luck but somehow Columbus has been worse.

Yeah, it's tough for the fans, but the 17 and 19 picks were moved, one was for Matt Duchene when they upset TB in 2019. 17 was to dump Clarkson.

But, that's a whole bunch of misses in their drafting.

And most of them are not guys where you said, what?

PLD they felt was going to be a C in the NHL, so they took him. But, attitude.
Johnson, Sillinger just expect more out of especially Johnson since he's got the talent.
Jiricek, thought he would be a top 4 RHD at a minimum. Ended up flipping him to draft a Goalie.

Have to be concerned with Lidstrom's injury. Passed on Demidov, Iginla, and a bunch of D options for him.

They need Fantilli to hit. Just don't have enough guys who are likely to be high impact guys after him currently in their organization.

 

[Cancuks]

Columbus is like Seattle, no direction. The Garland trade was baffling when they already have a bunch of wingers. Now talk of moving Marchenko and maybe Voronkov out, both who aren't happy there. Also Johnson who has talent and would definitely be a bounce back candidate on another team. Maybe EP40 would be a fit in Columbus.

 

[StreetHawk]

Columbus is like Seattle, no direction. The Garland trade was baffling when they already have a bunch of wingers. Now talk of moving Marchenko and maybe Voronkov out, both who aren't happy there. Also Johnson who has talent and would definitely be a bounce back candidate on another team. Maybe EP40 would be a fit in Columbus.

Plus they moved picks to add Nuke. Like why do that and then end up trading Werenski?

They really have no clear cut direction they want to head.

 

[Kryten]

Somehow the Oilers are going to end up with a washed up Bobrovsky just like Khabibulin back in the day

 

[Hodgy]

If Werenski lands Harley, then JR and Alvin were taken to the cleaners on the Hughes trade.

 

[andora]

Dallas is dumb if they do that

 

[F A N]

To be fair they were on the right path and then Gaudreau passed away and it’s been shit ever since.

Not really. Gaudreau was alive when they tried to hire Babcock. Gaudreau at the time of his death (RIP) was coming off a 12 goal 60 point season, turning 31, and earning $9.75M AAV. Had he lived he would be 33 right now. What would have changed? Columbus would be better sure but unless their 1st round picks other than Fantilli developed into stars I don't see how things would be that drastically different. The only thing is that Columbus would be able to trade Gaudreau since his NMC becomes a limited NTC on July 1st. They still would have drafted Lindstrom (who was damaged goods and looks like a bust).

 

[F A N]

K this farm thing is being overdone and I'm glad we didn't draft him.

Why is he popping champagne and not a bottle of milk?

 

[AquiliniHurtsMySoul]

This came up a few times. The main impressions I kept hearing is that their board play, and puck control was at a questionable level to translate to the NHL and larger stronger opponents. So while they seem like they have some comparables to the Sedins, playmaker vs shooter, high skill, slow foot speed, they didn't have those two aspects that allowed the Sedins to translate. They will likely put on some weight too, but they're even a little more slight than the Sedins. I feel like they could still buck all those concerns and eventually figure it all out at the NHL level. But they also would likely need a linemate who is an absolute bulldog in puck retrieval, and shit disturbing.

I see them as a future 40-50 point 2/3rd line tweeners. Good players but nowhere close to the Sedins.