Around the League - 2023/24

expatriatedtexan

Habitual Line Stepper
Aug 17, 2005
17,434
13,361
Good. Time to get a real owner there and start from scratch.
Is that possible in Arizona? It's not like we've haven't seen a revolving door of owners in Arizona already. Smart move might be fold the franchise all together, wait a year or two and then just offer two expansion teams up for sale, one in each conference.
 

henchman21

Mr. Meeseeks
Feb 24, 2012
64,664
49,893
Is that possible in Arizona? It's not like we've haven't seen a revolving door of owners in Arizona already. Smart move might be fold the franchise all together, wait a year or two and then just offer two expansion teams up for sale, one in each conference.
I think so, but they’ll need to team up with the Suns I think to really make it work.

IMO with this, we will get Atlanta and Houston next. The Arizona and a 4th team. Which ideally would be Hamilton, but I doubt Buffalo and Toronto go for that. So we will get a different and probably off the beaten path US market.
 

expatriatedtexan

Habitual Line Stepper
Aug 17, 2005
17,434
13,361
I think so, but they’ll need to team up with the Suns I think to really make it work.

IMO with this, we will get Atlanta and Houston next. The Arizona and a 4th team. Which ideally would be Hamilton, but I doubt Buffalo and Toronto go for that. So we will get a different and probably off the beaten path US market.
You mean the Fairbanks Frozen Nuts are still a possibility?
 
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S E P H

Cloud IX
Mar 5, 2010
31,469
16,977
Toruń, PL
I think we can all agree that Muerlo is a giant turd, but isn't it the State of Arizona's fault for cancelling the auction? What is he honestly supposed to do when it is out of his hands?

More like Canadian teams hate to properly rebuild due to the pressure of the fans, so they always stay as purgatory teams. Never great, but never bad.
 

Balthazar

I haven't talked to the trainers yet
Sponsor
Apr 25, 2006
50,598
54,331
More like Canadian teams hate to properly rebuild due to the pressure of the fans, so they always stay as purgatory teams. Never great, but never bad.
Now that's funny as f***. What's properly rebuilding?

The cup champs just won with only 3 players that they drafted + a key player who happened to be an American that didn't want to play in Canada + a goalie that didn't want to play in Columbus + a bunch of guys that signed there for less because no tax and they can play golf all year.

Is that properly rebuilding? What about the previous champs? Did Vegas properly rebuild?

The reason I wanted Edmonton to win was ONLY to prove that even if you're in the shittiest market in the league, if you draft a generational player you can win the cup. Turns out it's not true, the shitty markets are still hopeless.
 

S E P H

Cloud IX
Mar 5, 2010
31,469
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Toruń, PL
Now that's funny as f***. What's properly rebuilding?

The cup champs just won with only 3 players that they drafted + a key player who happened to be an American that didn't want to play in Canada + a goalie that didn't want to play in Columbus + a bunch of guys that signed there for less because no tax and they can play golf all year.

Is that properly rebuilding? What about the previous champs? Did Vegas properly rebuild?

The reason I wanted Edmonton to win was ONLY to prove that even if you're in the shittiest market in the league, if you draft a generational player you can win the cup. Turns out it's not true, the shitty markets are still hopeless.
Just look at the Canadian teams who properly sucked arse for 5 seasons and got talent (Oilers/Leafs) versus the Canadian teams that decided to stay mediocre their entire existence (Flames/Canucks).
 

Balthazar

I haven't talked to the trainers yet
Sponsor
Apr 25, 2006
50,598
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Just look at the Canadian teams who properly sucked arse for 5 seasons and got talent (Oilers/Leafs) versus the Canadian teams that decided to stay mediocre their entire existence (Flames/Canucks)
Oilers, Leafs, Sens and Habs all tanked. Your argument is invalid.

Plus I just showed you that you don't need to tank to win.
 

LOFIN

Registered User
Sep 16, 2011
15,208
21,169
Now that's funny as f***. What's properly rebuilding?

The cup champs just won with only 3 players that they drafted + a key player who happened to be an American that didn't want to play in Canada + a goalie that didn't want to play in Columbus + a bunch of guys that signed there for less because no tax and they can play golf all year.

Is that properly rebuilding? What about the previous champs? Did Vegas properly rebuild?

The reason I wanted Edmonton to win was ONLY to prove that even if you're in the shittiest market in the league, if you draft a generational player you can win the cup. Turns out it's not true, the shitty markets are still hopeless.
Edmonton just lost a G7 by one goal, they have a few boat anchor contracts with the roster, and that's somehow proof that you can't win by drafting?

You know what would've helped Edmonton? Not the taxes, but not giving Nurse that horrible deal, and giving Campbell 5mil and then burying him to the AHL.

We won the cup by being cap compliant and not having the "tax advantage". And did so with probably the most impressive run of the cap era.
 

McMetal

Writer of Wrongs
Sep 29, 2015
14,247
12,401
The reason I wanted Edmonton to win was ONLY to prove that even if you're in the shittiest market in the league, if you draft a generational player you can win the cup. Turns out it's not true, the shitty markets are still hopeless.
Didn't the Avs just prove exactly that two years ago? Denver isn't a shithole, but it's not exactly a destination. The night life is average; unless you're really into skiing, hiking, and fishing it's not a playground for the young and rich. Our taxes aren't sky high, but they're not close to zero, either. Top free agents and rentals with NTCs turn us down over and over again.

But hey, we drafted a generational defenseman, and in his third full NHL season we won a Cup.

Edmonton is failing because they picked the wrong players to build around. And I'm not talking about McDavid and Draisaitl. Nurse as the anchor of their defense. Campbell/Koskinen/Talbot/Smith in net. Keeping RNH around when they already had two elite top 6 centers. They did draft that generational superstar, but they didn't build the right supporting cast around him. Bad luck they had the one GM on the planet who could f*** that up.
 

NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS

Registered User
Oct 23, 2022
1,936
3,990
Now that's funny as f***. What's properly rebuilding?

The cup champs just won with only 3 players that they drafted + a key player who happened to be an American that didn't want to play in Canada + a goalie that didn't want to play in Columbus + a bunch of guys that signed there for less because no tax and they can play golf all year.

Is that properly rebuilding? What about the previous champs? Did Vegas properly rebuild?

The reason I wanted Edmonton to win was ONLY to prove that even if you're in the shittiest market in the league, if you draft a generational player you can win the cup. Turns out it's not true, the shitty markets are still hopeless.
Ekblad was a first overall
Barkov a second overall
The main piece in the Tkachuk fleeing was Huberdeau at third.

They found Forsling on the side of the road.

Montour and Reinhart from Buffalo.

Bennett and Tkachuk from Calgary.

The real secret sauce is to fleece the worst run teams.

Heck Ekman Larson will have a higher cap for the Canucks next year than for Florida (assuming he resigns).
 

henchman21

Mr. Meeseeks
Feb 24, 2012
64,664
49,893
Florida showed there is another path to a Cup winner. I don't see what is wrong with that. Zito did a masterful job taking an above average team to a contender within a few seasons. In the process he was also completely able to change the identity of the team midstream. That is simply not an easy thing to do.

Teams will certainly study what Zito did and try to pry guys from that organization now.
 

henchman21

Mr. Meeseeks
Feb 24, 2012
64,664
49,893
Just another reason for me to say f*** ST. LOUIS...and I'll blame this on Binnington too!
It is honestly one of the reasons Omaha and OKC will have legs on that round and yeah kinda stupid. Same exact thing with Chicago and Milwaukee. Milwaukee really should have a NHL team, but Chicago (and to a lesser extent Minny) prevents that from happening.
 

Chiarelli

Registered User
Jan 27, 2019
4,847
6,761
Florida showed there is another path to a Cup winner (for teams in good locations). I don't see what is wrong with that. Zito did a masterful job taking an above average team to a contender within a few seasons. In the process he was also completely able to change the identity of the team midstream. That is simply not an easy thing to do.

Teams will certainly study what Zito did and try to pry guys from that organization now.
ftfy
 

henchman21

Mr. Meeseeks
Feb 24, 2012
64,664
49,893
You're kidding yourself if you think that is the only reason... Cheese had a few places he'd go including St Louis (which is far from a nice place). Their biggest UFA signing under Zito is either ERod or Gudas. They've built themselves off excellent asset management, bold moves, and excellent pro scouting.
 

LOFIN

Registered User
Sep 16, 2011
15,208
21,169
You're kidding yourself if you think that is the only reason... Cheese had a few places he'd go including St Louis (which is far from a nice place). Their biggest UFA signing under Zito is either ERod or Gudas. They've built themselves off excellent asset management, bold moves, and excellent pro scouting.
I personally think their blueprint was very similar to ours. We didn't trade for a star player like they did, but the Duchene trade gave us Byram who was instrumental in the cup final series. Then some other steals of trades (Kadri, Lehkonen), reclamation project signings (Nichushkin), and some homegrown drafted talent. Just briliant asset management, but Zito was more agressive in changing the style of the team by switching the coach and trading for Tkachuk, where Sakic was a bit more patient and continued to tinker around the core group.
 
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S E P H

Cloud IX
Mar 5, 2010
31,469
16,977
Toruń, PL
Ekblad was a first overall
Barkov a second overall
The main piece in the Tkachuk fleeing was Huberdeau at third.

They found Forsling on the side of the road.

Montour and Reinhart from Buffalo.

Bennett and Tkachuk from Calgary.

The real secret sauce is to fleece the worst run teams.

Heck Ekman Larson will have a higher cap for the Canucks next year than for Florida (assuming he resigns).
They bought low on a lot of players and got some fortune that they turned out to be good; such as Forsling, Reinhart, and Bennett. Remember, Bennett was pretty much considered a big-time bust when he was traded. Avs did the same thing as the bolded quote, got some fortune that players rebounded nicely like Nuke, Burakovsky, Helm, and Kadri (after his suspension list). Panthers list might have been bigger with Forsling, Reinhart, Bobrovsky (anchor contract), Bennett, OEL, Kulikov, and Montour.
 

Chiarelli

Registered User
Jan 27, 2019
4,847
6,761
You're kidding yourself if you think that is the only reason... Cheese had a few places he'd go including St Louis (which is far from a nice place). Their biggest UFA signing under Zito is either ERod or Gudas. They've built themselves off excellent asset management, bold moves, and excellent pro scouting.
probably close to half the teams in the league could never pull this type of style off:

- Bottom out for top picks
- Trades/extensions for big name players
- Cheap free agent signings
- Market Value UFA signings/player chose to go there


Only real savvy thing they did was get Forsling/couple good trades/Verhaeghe find.
Got many many players that simply would not pick many teams in the league when given the choice.
They showed New York, California, Florida, Texas, and Nevada how to build a team.
 

henchman21

Mr. Meeseeks
Feb 24, 2012
64,664
49,893
I personally think their blueprint was very similar to ours. We didn't trade for a star player like they did, but the Duchene trade gave us Byram who was instrumental in the cup final series. Then some other steals of trades (Kadri, Lehkonen), reclamation project signings (Nichushkin), and some homegrown drafted talent. Just briliant asset management, but Zito was more agressive in changing the style of the team by switching the coach and trading for Tkachuk, where Sakic was a bit more patient and continued to tinker around the core group.
Definitely some similarities. I'd say Florida was more aggressive in going after reclamation players (Bennett, Montour) and taking risks on cast offs (Reinhart, Verhaeghe, Forsling). Florida was a lot of boom/bust.

The big difference I see is Florida was very bold in a few moves... the Hubi+Weegar for Cheese move is a clear balls on the table, this is the right move to chance the identity. Letting Brunette go to drastically change the identity of the team knowing it would cause growing pains. Dumping a 30g scorer for pretty much nothing because he didn't fit the identity. Giving up a top goalie prospect and 1st to ensure Barkov has a quality winger and Cheese can run his own line. That's not to say the Avs didn't make some bold moves, but Florida clearly took a lot of chances... and some of them didn't work. They kept taking those chances until it did. Where the Avs really only took chances twice... and once was forced on them. The Duchene trade is one. The second was finally loading up at the 22 deadline. I'd argue the Avs did take chances again this past season... we will see if that continues.

probably close to half the teams in the league could never pull this type of style off:

- Bottom out for top picks
- Trades/extensions for big name players
- Cheap free agent signings
- Market Value UFA signings/player chose to go there


Only real savvy thing they did was get Forsling/couple good trades/Verhaeghe find.
Got many many players that simply would not pick many teams in the league when given the choice.
They showed New York, California, Florida, Texas, and Nevada how to build a team.

Many teams can't pull different types off....

The bolded is selling them incredibly short.
 

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