Speculation: Armchair GM Thread

[Bringer of Jollity]

I look at the Dubois trade where he was given for virtually free after a subpar season or 40 points and Cozens now almost 1.5 seasons deep into a mid 40 point pace and ask why should we have to pay much more then that? I understand there are differences in age and Cozen's caphit is better but that contract is also longer and Cozen's doesnt have the track record of being a 60+ point performer. Dubois 3 seasons of 60+ points and 28ish goals vs Cozens 1 season of 60+ points and 31 goals.

Couple in Kakko getting traded for next to nothing. Draft pedigree be damned. Dollar for dollar Kakkos contract is much better even though he hasnt hit the high that Cozen's has hit. He also doesnt have the commitment so you can just walk away no harm no foul. Cozen's doesnt rebound and it is a buyout

I am subscribing to your blog. Killing it today.

 

[Flgatorguy87]

Wasn't Dubois kind of pegged as a malcontent though similar to Kakko who seemed to have issues with management?

 

[Top 6 Spaling]

I look at the Dubois trade where he was given for virtually free after a subpar season or 40 points and Cozens now almost 1.5 seasons deep into a mid 40 point pace and ask why should we have to pay much more then that? I understand there are differences in age and Cozen's caphit is better but that contract is also longer and Cozen's doesnt have the track record of being a 60+ point performer. Dubois 3 seasons of 60+ points and 28ish goals vs Cozens 1 season of 60+ points and 31 goals.

Couple in Kakko getting traded for next to nothing. Draft pedigree be damned. Dollar for dollar Kakkos contract is much better even though he hasnt hit the high that Cozen's has hit. He also doesnt have the commitment so you can just walk away no harm no foul. Cozen's doesnt rebound and it is a buyout

1. Big
2. Center, vs Kakko at W
3. "Attitude Issues"

For the record, I agree with your logic 100%, but I think that drives the perceived differences in value. I think Dubois is a good comparable and shows why I think a 1st for Cozens isn't a smart move.

 

[herzausstein]

Wasn't Dubois kind of pegged as a malcontent though similar to Kakko who seemed to have issues with management?

Dubois and Kakko didnt like the way they were being used. I also doubt that Cozens is enjoying the way he is being used. Probably wouldnt like the way he would be used here as well.

 

[herzausstein]

1. Big
2. Center, vs Kakko at W
3. "Attitude Issues"

For the record, I agree with your logic 100%, but I think that drives the perceived differences in value. I think Dubois is a good comparable and shows why I think a 1st for Cozens isn't a smart move.

Centers do tend to get more value but Kakko was also performing at a rate worthy of his paycheck. Cozens didnt last season and is doing worse this season. His performance in relation to his paycheck should kill that value gain though for being a Center atleast in my opinion.

 

[Flgatorguy87]

Dubois and Kakko didnt like the way they were being used. I also doubt that Cozens is enjoying the way he is being used. Probably wouldnt like the way he would be used here as well.

I think there are some parallels, but also some differences between the situations.

Not to be repetitive, but like any acquisition, house, car, hockey player...it all comes back to how much you paid. If Trotz can make this deal realistic in cost then I am happy to roll the dice.

 

[herzausstein]

I think there are some parallels, but also some differences between the situations.

Not to be repetitive, but like any acquisition, house, car, hockey player...it all comes back to how much you paid. If Trotz can make this deal realistic in cost then I am happy to roll the dice.

Yeh as long as we dont give up something stupid .. im game to give it a shot.

Even if we give up something stupid, if it works out in the long run then awesome. Ill be pissed until it pans out though. If it doesnt pan out, ill be calling for trotz to be fired.

 

[Top 6 Spaling]

Centers do tend to get more value but Kakko was also performing at a rate worthy of his paycheck. Cozens didnt last season and is doing worse this season. His performance in relation to his paycheck should kill that value gain though for being a Center atleast in my opinion.

Agreed 100%. I would do Novak+Lauzon+mid pick and not much more

 

[Flgatorguy87]

Yeh as long as we dont give up something stupid .. im game to give it a shot.

Even if we give up something stupid, if it works out in the long run then awesome. Ill be pissed until it pans out though. If it doesnt pan out, ill be calling for trotz to be fired.

Well honestly, we should probably already be calling for Trotz to be fired. He's either lying or so completely lost in his plan that he can't keep up with the direction he wants to go

 

[Soundgarden]

With everybody apparently disappointed in Wood, would you be ok with some combination of Wood, Novak and Parssinen along with picks for Cozens?

 

[herzausstein]

Agreed 100%. I would do Novak+Lauzon+mid pick and not much more

I value Lauzon at a late 1st, Novak im fairly neutral on and a mid pick is a mid pick so this seems fairly decent value wise imo.

If those pieces dont entice them then something along that same value using other players/prospects is also acceptable to me. Maybe they turn around and take the assets for Larkin

 

[Flgatorguy87]

With everybody apparently disappointed in Wood, would you be ok with some combination of Wood, Novak and Parssinen along with picks for Cozens?

Uhhhh absolutely 10x over. Not a wood fan, not a Novak fan, and Pars is going to get waived...I honestly would bet money on it at this point.

 

[herzausstein]

With everybody apparently disappointed in Wood, would you be ok with some combination of Wood, Novak and Parssinen along with picks for Cozens?

I like wood so id be unhappy but also if we arent going to fire trotz/bruno i also see no future for him here so it is probably a wash

To clarify: our team "identity" and "playstyle" make Wood the most expendable 1st round prospect we have

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

With everybody apparently disappointed in Wood, would you be ok with some combination of Wood, Novak and Parssinen along with picks for Cozens?

I just don't know why we'd give up even that much. Novak and Parsnip probably could both be 40-50 point guys if used in some kind of consistent manner. I'm fine trading wither, but both PLUS arecemt 1st rounder PLUS picks?

 

[herzausstein]

I just don't know why we'd give up even that much. Novak and Parsnip probably could both be 40-50 point guys if used in some kind of consistent manner. I'm fine trading wither, but both PLUS arecemt 1st rounder PLUS picks?

Pärssinen has no value at this point. He sits in the pressbox and is probably only avoiding waivers because Trotz already looks like a dumbass for Fabbro and Tomasino. Novak is lucky to get 12 mins a night under Bruno and hed probably rather have sissons as 3C tbh. Those two are treated as spare parts to be dealt with.

Wood is a bigger guy that isnt overly physical and not fleet of foot.

None of these guys really fit the team identity. Doesnt mean we should have to pay this much but also players that dont really fit the teams direction.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

Pärssinen has no value at this point. He sits in the pressbox and is probably only avoiding waivers because Trotz already looks like a dumbass for Fabbro and Tomasino. Novak is lucky to get 12 mins a night under Bruno and hed probably rather have sissons as 3C tbh. Those two are treated as spare parts to be dealt with.

Wood is a bigger guy that isnt overly physical and not fleet of foot.

None of these guys really fit the team identity. Doesnt mean we should have to pay this much but also players that dont really fit the teams direction.

I suppose. I know there's a difference between the value a player should have and their practical value (includes how much team wants them and fit, etc..), but it sucks to see us take a bath on the former because of the quirks of the latter.

 

[herzausstein]

DelG clears waivers

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

With everybody apparently disappointed in Wood, would you be ok with some combination of Wood, Novak and Parssinen along with picks for Cozens?

It would seem like such a huge waste. I feel like we could get #2C-level production out of Novak OR Parssinen, just fine. Just as much as we could out of Cozens. But noooo, we already tanked those players and aren't going to do that. So. Yes, trading either or both of them for the $7M equivalent seems to make loads of sense.

Where I would draw the line is just how much we should throw on top of them. I'm not liking what I'm seeing with Wood atm, and I think we could get a Cozens-level dart throw out of a late 1st pick... I don't want to pile all that up for a player I'm not getting any kind of warm-fuzzy about.

Trotz could make this deal, and who knows, maybe in a few years we'd look back and say it was a good one. But I just don't see it in today's world. If I was making a prediction, it'd be that we get toasted on this kind of move.

 

[hido]

It’s now a “reset.” Everyone got that? RESET:

“It’s not a rebuild,” Preds general manager Barry Trotz told The Athletic on Thursday. “I’m not in the business of not winning. I’m in the business of trying to win. We’re not selling off. We are resetting. We know where we are. It’s not where we thought we would be.

“But we want to move forward.”

 

[101st_fan]

It’s now a “reset.” Everyone got that? RESET:

“It’s not a rebuild,” Preds general manager Barry Trotz told The Athletic on Thursday. “I’m not in the business of not winning. I’m in the business of trying to win. We’re not selling off. We are resetting. We know where we are. It’s not where we thought we would be.

“But we want to move forward.”

Resetting from his own recent signings. Wedgewood, Carrier, Fabbro, Tomasino ...

 

[Scoresberg]

You should NEVER be desperate as an NHL GM. If Trotz is there... why???? The team is already mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. (Ok, "effectively", not "mathematically"). There is really nothing that you should be "desperate" about. That shipped sailed more than a month ago when you didn't fire the coach. If you make a trade out of "desperation" right now, you are just doubling down on being a bad GM.

Bingo. There are times when you might have to be a bit desperate as a GM. This is not one of those times.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Resetting from his own recent signings. Wedgewood, Carrier, Fabbro, Tomasino ...

Tbh, I never really pictured Trotz as a kind of verbal-diarrhea kind of GM who would just say whatever whenever. I feel like we kind of got taken for a ride. It was a breath of fresh air when he waltzed in here and started talking to us, after decades of mum's-the-word. But now that we've seen where it all goes... uh... can we have the cone of silence back, please?

 

[BigFatCat999]

Well honestly, we should probably already be calling for Trotz to be fired. He's either lying or so completely lost in his plan that he can't keep up with the direction he wants to go

You do realize that every GM lies through their teeth. It’s a job requirement.

 

[glenngineer]

I’d give up one of the two late firsts and Novak for Cozens. The draft is weak so the pick has little to no value.

If we bring in Cozens now, we can at least see what he looks like.

I still don’t like this particular idea but if it’s out there and moving forward, beyond what I suggested is way more than we should have to give up.

 

[herzausstein]

Resetting from his own recent signings. Wedgewood, Carrier, Fabbro, Tomasino ...

Well to be fair... wedgewood and Carrier did play like buns and Annunen is a nice goalie option going forward since we traded Askarov. So those are nice resets.

Not playing Tomasino or Fabbro though was dumb.

Im hoping we continue to reset our way away from Nyquist, Lauzon, and Bruno