GDT: All things training camp

[voyageur]

There is zero chance Lundmark gets claimed barring a team suffering multiple injuries on defense tonight, and even then he's probably the 3rd most attractive defenseman on waivers today. Picking up a longshot to play this season that has to be kept on the roster is a bad look to the players a team is already committed to. Lundmark was at best the 3rd best defenseman on the Moose last year, I'd argue 4th, a solidly quiet training camp doesn't elevate him to being claim worthy.

There's no Heinola or Capobianco on the Moose this season. The best LD is Kuzmin, in fact he's the only one and then guys signed to AHL contracts. I think your premise is right. But I do think he contributes to the Jets team this year, if he gets through.

 

[Flair Hay]

How transferrable are defensive metrics from team to team, system to system?

Vilardi for instance had great defensive metrics with LA but the info I saw had him below average on the Jets

I didn't really see top defensive forward (top relative to what /whom) from Iafallo last year tbh.

Iafallo was really highly ranked in LA and 97th percentile defense in Athletic playing cards. His offense is very mediocre.

But he seemed to do well at helping lines he was on drive more play. Did well with Scheif and Connor, Perfetti and Vlad

Ideally a guy like him is making not much cap on a contender.

 

[Buffdog]

I think it's more like they don't want to pay to get rid of the Appleton like contracts. Also the goal is playoffs and this is mostly the team that got them there so why change it.

Personally I think the team has a real chance at missing this year so maybe they bring some in and move some UFAs out. I doubt they plan to keep everyone who's a UFA in the summer.

Why would they want to get rid of Appleton? He put up 36 points playing against other teams best players. How much exactly is that worth? He makes 2.17M

Who should be in his spot? Chibs? A player with zero NHL experience and lesser success than Appleton in their 1st AHL seasons (apples was a year older)

 

[Shlep]

There's no Heinola or Capobianco on the Moose this season. The best LD is Kuzmin, in fact he's the only one and then guys signed to AHL contracts. I think your premise is right. But I do think he contributes to the Jets team this year, if he gets through.

Oh yeah I was just talking about his track record. He looked serviceable this camp, that's good, at this point of his career he just hasn't shown enough to make a GM think "yeah, he looks good enough to keep on my main roster while pushing down players I've already invested in".

 

[macmaroon]

The Jets organization needs to change the bulb on the Easy Bake Oven....

 

[KingBogo]

You guys are stressing over Lundmark for no reason. I am not even breaking a sweat at him getting put on waivers, even if he gets claimed. He is no Kovacevic, Chisholm or Eyssimont. Very little chance he gets claimed and even if he does good for him and everyone moves on.

But that is just your opinion. 4th line guys like Eyssimont are a dime a dozen around the NHL Kovacevic has proven to be no more than a 6/7 guy. Chisholm still has growth to his game but someone had to go on waivers. IMO Lundmark isn’t a throw away player. He was a second round pick with more tools than given credit for. He is also a RHD with some size. He is a bit of a late bloomer but I think he will be a solid NHLer one day. It would be a shame for the organization to lose him before we truly know what we have.

 

[surixon]

But that is just your opinion. 4th line guys like Eyssimont are a dime a dozen around the NHL Kovacevic has proven to be no more than a 6/7 guy. Chisholm still has growth to his game but someone had to go on waivers. IMO Lundmark isn’t a throw away player. He was a second round pick with more tools than given credit for. He is also a RHD with some size. He is a bit of a late bloomer but I think he will be a solid NHLer one day. It would be a shame for the organization to lose him before we truly know what we have.

Yeah, he's a poor man's DeMelo. He may carve out a role as a steady and safe bottom pairing dmen that can PK.

 

[KingBogo]

Yeah, he's a poor man's DeMelo. He may carve out a role as a steady and safe bottom pairing dmen that can PK.

And there was a time long ago that no one thought DeMelo would be more than that. The safe steady guys that can skate and move the puck well can often compliment a more dynamic offensive player as they gain experience. That’s what I see in Lundmark.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

If we do lose Lundmark, that would be the third NHL capable defenceman lost on waivers so we can continue to keep Logan Stanley. While not franchise altering moves, Chevy’s continued doubling down on Logan is at this point meme worthy and certainly poor asset management.

 

[KingBogo]

If we do lose Lundmark, that would be the third NHL capable defenceman lost on waivers so we can continue to keep Logan Stanley. While not franchise altering moves, Chevy’s continued doubling down on Logan is at this point is meme worthy and certainly poor asset management.

Stanley is only 1 person. Only 1 of the 3 could replace him. The other 2 would still be gone. And at this point Stanley is on IR so he doesn’t impact who goes on waivers.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Stanley is only 1 person. Only 1 of the 3 could replace him. The other 2 would still be gone. And at this point Stanley is on IR so he doesn’t impact who goes on waivers.

Not everyone was waived at the same time, LOL. Kovacevic was waived and claimed in 2022 and Chisholm in 2024. Both were waived to keep Stanley as I believe Ville was still waiver exempt at that time.

 

[Jet]

But this was not the lineup that got us 110 points. This closer to the lineup that went nearly 500 for the back half of the season and then got destroyed in the first round.

This is super confusing to me.

At game 45, we were 30-10-4

Players out:
Dillon, Schmidt (who wasn't really playing), Brossoit (who's impact as a bu with Hellebuyck is minimal)
Fjallby & Toninato

Players in:
Miller, Anderson Dolan, Gustafsson, Kakhonen.

The only significant player who is gone from the roster that was leading the league in GA and challenging for 1OA in the league is Dillon. We replaced him with Miller, while not as good or physical as Dillon is very competent, has more offensive ability and causes less problems for pairings by being a RD.

Additionally, if Heinola could ever get healthy we could have him in the lineup and according so some around here he's the second coming of Bobby Orr.

So, explain how this isn't the same roster that was super successful last year?

Keep in mind, we were without Vilardi and Connor for chunks of that time.

 

[Jet]

I think @Buffdog is correct. The young players getting the opportunity were to be Ville and possibly Kupari/Gus.

It seems this org intends to over bake everyone else.

I don't think anyone is being over baked. It's a product of where the Jets are in their competitive cycle.

Of course, the argument could be made that instead of having a more veteran laden, safe 4th line we could fashion 3 scoring lines and a checking line, allowing us to utilize our young talent a bit more, but that's a separate conversation (I for one am definitely open to it).

The Jets have a lot of tweener depth which further exacerbates the issue.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

If we do lose Lundmark, that would be the third NHL capable defenceman lost on waivers so we can continue to keep Logan Stanley. While not franchise altering moves, Chevy’s continued doubling down on Logan is at this point is meme worthy and certainly poor asset management.

Poor asset management …. ?

Stanley at this time is better than Lundmark. Stanley is under contract for 2 more years and Lundmark is under team control for 4 years .

This is Lundmark 1 st year breaking the top 10 in the Jets depth ranking on Defence ( just barley).

For him to be picked up on waivers…. The other NHL team claiming him would have to have a 30 % less depth on Defence than the Jets to make him their 7-8 th defenseman and keep him on their NHL roster ….

 

[Jet]

I'm surprised Lundmark got cut before Coghlan. Maybe there are details in practice that kept him out of the lineup. If he gets lost to waivers that's a curious decision.

What's the chances Gustafsson or Anderson-Dolan start the season on IR, to be able to free up a roster spot, for one of the rookies? Who might get a start in the home stretch.

Since the kids didn't get demoted you'd think they are all going to play Friday.

The Jets really do seem to like their defense reclamation projects, but they never seem to work out so I don't know why.

 

[John Agar]

For those not in the know...

Chevy is holding onto Logan Stanley for two reasons...

One... he still is growing.... he may be a a touch over 6 ft 7 inches now...

Two... Chevy has identified Logan as his GM replacement one day... year... whatever....

 

[Jet]

I'm surprised Lundmark got cut before Coghlan. Maybe there are details in practice that kept him out of the lineup. If he gets lost to waivers that's a curious decision.

What's the chances Gustafsson or Anderson-Dolan start the season on IR, to be able to free up a roster spot, for one of the rookies? Who might get a start in the home stretch.

Since the kids didn't get demoted you'd think they are all going to play Friday.

Id only say they will if they need healthy bodies. I think Arniel is going to try and play his best roster available.

 

[surixon]

I don't think anyone is being over baked. It's a product of where the Jets are in their competitive cycle.

Of course, the argument could be made that instead of having a more veteran laden, safe 4th line we could fashion 3 scoring lines and a checking line, allowing us to utilize our young talent a bit more, but that's a separate conversation (I for one am definitely open to it).

The Jets have a lot of tweener depth which further exacerbates the issue.

Oh I agree with why most of our kids are being left on the farm longer. But I also think this org does put itself in the corner a bit waiting until waiver ineligibility to make calls on some of these guys.

I think Chisholm is an example of what we could use this year but do to not getting any looks at him other then a few games we lost him for nothing.

 

[Jet]

Oh I agree with why most of our kids are being left on the farm longer. But I also think this org does put itself in the corner a bit waiting until waiver ineligibility to make calls on some of these guys.

I think Chisholm is an example of what we could use this year but do to not getting any looks at him other then a few games we lost him for nothing.

It also might be a product of our draft position and quality. A lot of these guys are depth replacement level players, so it's really hard to shake the 'one in the hand is worth two in the bush' philosopy.

It's not like the Jets are letting go of or wasting really strong talent. We're letting guys go that we can either replace from waivers or for extremely low cost.

 

[Jets 31]

This definitely puts an end to the narrative that "Chevy wants younger players to play but the coach refuses" or that "Chevy and the Coach are at odds with their lineup/deployment decisions".

Arniel- a rookie coach is in no position to go against the wishes of a veteran GM like Chevy so, this lineup is what Chevy feels comfortable with and very likely Chevy was also onboard with various unpopular moves by Bones/Maurice.

Chevy ain't perfect, nobody is, but i think he's one of the best GM's in the League. Dubois trade was a unbelievable trade for the Jets, Mcspoiled brat for Yager i think will be a massive win . Winnipeg has to be the hardest GM job in the League by far.

 

[TS Quint]

But this was not the lineup that got us 110 points. This closer to the lineup that went nearly 500 for the back half of the season and then got destroyed in the first round.

Yeah…..there were a lot of Chicken Little’s last preseason too .

 

[BoneDocUK]

I don't think anyone is being over baked. It's a product of where the Jets are in their competitive cycle.

Of course, the argument could be made that instead of having a more veteran laden, safe 4th line we could fashion 3 scoring lines and a checking line, allowing us to utilize our young talent a bit more, but that's a separate conversation (I for one am definitely open to it).

The Jets have a lot of tweener depth which further exacerbates the issue.

Agree, but I think that's increasingly an important that the Jets -- to date -- have seemed unwilling to engage in.

Maybe Arniel is the one to make to move the adapt to the league rather than plow the 2012-era Jets Hockey furrow, though I expect that the good years, like last season, will probably outweigh the bad ones in terms of where the org thinks its problems might lie.

I'd love to see more young talent integrated into a line that than do more than try to stifle the puck for a few minutes a game, and instead push the play with enough threat and urgency to tilt the ice, for the next line on also I do think that players like Chibby and Lambert have the skill and speed to grow into those roles en route to playing higher up the lineup. But they're going to make mistakes along the way, and be allowed to play through then.

Anyway, my tuppence.

 

[TS Quint]

I think @Buffdog is correct. The young players getting the opportunity were to be Ville and possibly Kupari/Gus.

It seems this org intends to over bake everyone else.

Who have they over baked?

 

[Jets 31]

Yeah…..there were a lot of Chicken Little’s last preseason too .

I look at it this way, the Jets PP and PK was brutal, how many more wins is having a very good PP and PK worth? At the very least it might equal what losing Brossoit will cost. The Jets didn't fluke out 52 wins last season.

 

[TS Quint]

Iafallo was really highly ranked in LA and 97th percentile defense in Athletic playing cards. His offense is very mediocre.

But he seemed to do well at helping lines he was on drive more play. Did well with Scheif and Connor, Perfetti and Vlad

Ideally a guy like him is making not much cap on a contender.

Like the Panthers back up goalie making $4.5m? Or the Oiler paying Nurse $9.25? The Stars paying Seguin $9.85? Benn $9.5m? There is no perfect cap structure in this league.

Iafallo also made I possible to get Vilardi at $3.4.