Rumor: ALL PURPOSE JT MILLER THREAD - New Update - (Post #1123)

[Canucks LB]

This thread is for ALL JT MILLER POSTS/NEW THREADS for the current time period.

PLEASE POST ALL RUMORS, VALUES, TRADES, EVERYTHING JT MILLER in this thread.

Click to read more...

 

[Fatass]

Miller's name has been in the rumor mill for too long to just be smoke and mirrors. What exactly is a fair deal in your eyes? He's going to get a 7 x 9-10.5 mil or a 8 x 8-9.5 mil with whatever team he signs with.

Everything you said is pretty run of the mill - players saying they want to say, being part of marketing efforts, etc. If Vancouver's main priority was to get him re-signed, they'd simply say Miller wasn't available to the media. It doesn't stop them from working out the right deal, but it does stop the media from making all these speculations.

The only time GMs allow a name to be thrown back into the rumor mill over and over again is to let every team know that he's more or less going to be traded to the highest bidder.

Miller's wife posts photos of JT with their daughters playing in the parks downtown Vancouver. It's a city where he is raising his family, and the wife and children have connections. Maybe he actually wants to stay? If so, then I could see a total dollar contract between 55 and 60. The term would depend on how Allvin wants to allocate his cap. Maybe 7 x 8.5 or 8 x 7.75 if it's upper end.

 

[TryamkinPleaseReturn]

The thing that no one talks about, is the single handed impact JT has on his team. Look at the top 10 scorers in the NHL this year. Every single one has at least one other teammate in the top 25 in scoring.

Stamkos (7) has Hedman (23).
Draisaitl (4) has McDavid (1).
Huberdeau (3) has Barkov (17) and Reinhart (29).
Kaprizov (5) has Fiala (22) and Zuccarello (36).
Tkachuk (8) has Gaudreau (2) and Lindholm (27).
Marner (10) has Mathews (5), Nylander (33), and Tavares (44).

JT Miller didn't have a teammate in the top 50 in scoring. The next highest scoring team-mate was over 30 points below him.

What JT did this year, on such a weak team, is pretty amazing. Whoever ends up with him, even if they lose a really good asset or two, could actually be buying low on JT, considering what he could do with better line mates and a better team.

 

[theguardianII]

Miller's name has been in the rumor mill for too long to just be smoke and mirrors. What exactly is a fair deal in your eyes? He's going to get a 7 x 9-10.5 mil or a 8 x 8-9.5 mil with whatever team he signs with.

It always amazed me that fans in Vancouver think he wanted to be there.

Again I post;
He has a house in Tampa.
His family in Florida
No income tax in Florida
He took a home town discount to stay in Tampa
He neve demanded a trade.

He gets dealt to a team as far away as possible from his family
He gets to spend an extra million a year in taxes and cost of living
He is on a team that has not had a winning season.

What makes fans think he wants to stay? Twice he has expressed unhappiness about the team.
If he stays for money then he should be traded, you want a player that stays because the team is winning and Vancouver will not be doing that until the cap and some bad contracts expire.

 

[Warh1ppy]

The teams most likely to pay for JT Miller are

Contending next year and can shed some assets without affecting their roster​

​

Have drafted highly, are young and need a veteran they can lean on for a year​

​

Are young and need that next step taken and have the cap space to justify it​

​

There's maybe 5 or 6 teams from the first bolded that can justify Miller for one season. They have the assets and can not only sweeten things with a pick and asset can also facilitate a larger trade. Miller with retention is far more viable and opens that list up more.

There's 5-7 teams in the last two columns that can pay for JTs services for a single year and retain him. Never discount what having that insulating presence can do for a teams growth.

Bottom line is Miller IS coming off a 99 point season, has been a PPG player for over 3 years, has been a 50+ point 3rd line centre coming from NY/Tampa to Van. Is a face off monster. Generates most of his points off of the even strength marks. Plays the PK and can play C/LW/RW. With retention the guy is able to be had for as low as $2.65 million which is absolutely insane.

That being said. I think numerous fans of other teams think that somehow magically he is not worth as much as his resume indicates. While ignoring the returns that Copp, Giroux, Toffoli, Chiarot and even Lindholm net just this year alone. he is worth vastly more than what the "Josh Anderson is worth a top 10 pick" crowd are suggesting.

But, Canucks fans are also a shade over the moon with their expectations as well. Miller is the most intriguing one year rental in the last 10-20 years based on what he brings and his potential cap hit. But leaning on the endless "RHD+++++" is not gonna happen nor is it feasible. A blue chip prospect; a 1st round pick, a solid young roster player, a potential cap dump; multiple later picks. Pick any 3 of those and THAT is reasonable and probably in keeping with what the return will be.

IE: Columbus trades pick 6 or 12 (pick) Jack Roslovic (roster player) Kent Johnson (blue chip)

While that trade is not what I am suggesting, that IS in fact what is a reasonable expectation for the Canucks and if players/assets are returned in that fashion it certainly is not something that the team can sniff at as it opens other opportunities for drafying what they need or trading now redundant pieces for them.

Needless to say, from an armchair GMs point of view, it's going to be interesting to see what happens with JT Miller

 

[gsharpe]

The teams most likely to pay for JT Miller are

Contending next year and can shed some assets without affecting their roster​

​

Have drafted highly, are young and need a veteran they can lean on for a year​

​

Are young and need that next step taken and have the cap space to justify it​

​

There's maybe 5 or 6 teams from the first bolded that can justify Miller for one season. They have the assets and can not only sweeten things with a pick and asset can also facilitate a larger trade. Miller with retention is far more viable and opens that list up more.

There's 5-7 teams in the last two columns that can pay for JTs services for a single year and retain him. Never discount what having that insulating presence can do for a teams growth.

Bottom line is Miller IS coming off a 99 point season, has been a PPG player for over 3 years, has been a 50+ point 3rd line centre coming from NY/Tampa to Van. Is a face off monster. Generates most of his points off of the even strength marks. Plays the PK and can play C/LW/RW. With retention the guy is able to be had for as low as $2.65 million which is absolutely insane.

That being said. I think numerous fans of other teams think that somehow magically he is not worth as much as his resume indicates. While ignoring the returns that Copp, Giroux, Toffoli, Chiarot and even Lindholm net just this year alone. he is worth vastly more than what the "Josh Anderson is worth a top 10 pick" crowd are suggesting.

But, Canucks fans are also a shade over the moon with their expectations as well. Miller is the most intriguing one year rental in the last 10-20 years based on what he brings and his potential cap hit. But leaning on the endless "RHD+++++" is not gonna happen nor is it feasible. A blue chip prospect; a 1st round pick, a solid young roster player, a potential cap dump; multiple later picks. Pick any 3 of those and THAT is reasonable and probably in keeping with what the return will be.

IE: Columbus trades pick 6 or 12 (pick) Jack Roslovic (roster player) Kent Johnson (blue chip)

While that trade is not what I am suggesting, that IS in fact what is a reasonable expectation for the Canucks and if players/assets are returned in that fashion it certainly is not something that the team can sniff at as it opens other opportunities for drafying what they need or trading now redundant pieces for them.

Needless to say, from an armchair GMs point of view, it's going to be interesting to see what happens with JT Miller

If we can get pick #6, roslovic and Kent Johnson I would be ecstatic. Pick one of the RHD from this year's draft. Trade roslovic at the deadline for a late first.

 

[kanucks25]

If we can get pick #6, roslovic and Kent Johnson I would be ecstatic. Pick one of the RHD from this year's draft. Trade roslovic at the deadline for a late first.

Johnson was taken 5th overall last year... highly doubt we would get that and the 6th this year. They also just re-signed Roslovic 2 weeks ago.

 

[kanucks25]

The thing that no one talks about, is the single handed impact JT has on his team. Look at the top 10 scorers in the NHL this year. Every single one has at least one other teammate in the top 25 in scoring.

Stamkos (7) has Hedman (23).
Draisaitl (4) has McDavid (1).
Huberdeau (3) has Barkov (17) and Reinhart (29).
Kaprizov (5) has Fiala (22) and Zuccarello (36).
Tkachuk (8) has Gaudreau (2) and Lindholm (27).
Marner (10) has Mathews (5), Nylander (33), and Tavares (44).

JT Miller didn't have a teammate in the top 50 in scoring. The next highest scoring team-mate was over 30 points below him.

What JT did this year, on such a weak team, is pretty amazing. Whoever ends up with him, even if they lose a really good asset or two, could actually be buying low on JT, considering what he could do with better line mates and a better team.

I will preface this by saying I wouldn't blame anyone for being cautious considering it was a career year and he is soon entering the back half of his career.

However he did get 99p despite dragging around plugs and/or struggling players all season. If he had another top-line player on his wing all season that was actually performing at a top-line level, 115p isn't out of the question.

He was fantastic (offensively at least).

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Young top 4 RD/top 6 forward (blue chip prospect or roster player) + the value equivalent of a mid/late 1st round pick is what Miller should be traded for.

 

[BCNate]

I believe he ends up in Columbus. He's a perfect fit for that team.

I agree he is a really nice fit in Columbus. They have some good young C's in Roslovic, Johnson and Sillinger, Miller could be brought in to help shelter them as they develop. They also have the cap space to look at a long term extension.


Lots of really interesting pieces to put together a solid package ( I get some are not on the table...)
-Johnson
-Sillinger
-6OA
-12OA
-Laine (depending on RFA negotiations)
-Jenner
-Boqvist
-Bean
-Peeke
-Ceulemans

In fairness, I'm not super familiar with CBJ fans needs/wants, but I'd certainly want to explore a deal around Peeke +12 for Miller @50% as a base.

 

[Empoleon8771]

There's a debate about this on the Penguins board, so I want to see what Canucks fans think. On the scale of 1-5, with 1 being very bad, 3 being okay and 5 being very good, how would you rank a package of Marino, Kapanen's RFA rights, Poulin and a 1st for Miller?

 

[Djp]

Young top 4 RD/top 6 forward (blue chip prospect or roster player) + the value equivalent of a mid/late 1st round pick is what Miller should be traded for.

And what he will actually get..

playoff team 1st, a roster player+ decent but not recent top 20 drafted prospect.

 

[BruinsBtn]

I agree he is a really nice fit in Columbus. They have some good young C's in Roslovic, Johnson and Sillinger, Miller could be brought in to help shelter them as they develop. They also have the cap space to look at a long term extension.


Lots of really interesting pieces to put together a solid package ( I get some are not on the table...)
-Johnson
-Sillinger
-6OA
-12OA
-Laine (depending on RFA negotiations)
-Jenner
-Boqvist
-Bean
-Peeke
-Ceulemans

In fairness, I'm not super familiar with CBJ fans needs/wants, but I'd certainly want to explore a deal around Peeke +12 for Miller @50% as a base.

Texier would be the guy I'd target.

In any case, if you add JT Miller to the Jackets, that's a really good team.

 

[Warh1ppy]

There's a debate about this on the Penguins board, so I want to see what Canucks fans think. On the scale of 1-5, with 1 being very bad, 3 being okay and 5 being very good, how would you rank a package of Marino, Kapanen's RFA rights, Poulin and a 1st for Miller?

To be brutally honest, that's actually probably close to fair value around the TDL no matter what fans hoping for the moon want to think.

If we can get pick #6, roslovic and Kent Johnson I would be ecstatic. Pick one of the RHD from this year's draft. Trade roslovic at the deadline for a late first.

I don't see that as being realistic but I believe that KIND of return is more than fair value in terms of quality of assets.

 

[OV Rocks]

I am sure VAN fans will be level headed and not over react to what the eventual return actually gets them.

They will be lucky if the return is around what Giroux brought back to Philly.

 

[BCNate]

There's a debate about this on the Penguins board, so I want to see what Canucks fans think. On the scale of 1-5, with 1 being very bad, 3 being okay and 5 being very good, how would you rank a package of Marino, Kapanen's RFA rights, Poulin and a 1st for Miller?

From a Canucks POV this is a 4 out of 5 offer. We are getting the 21 pick, recent 1st winger with size and upside, top 4 RD on a good long deal, and a pretty good 3rd liner.

This checks a whole lot of boxes for sure, if this were the best offer on the table, I'd take it for sure.

 

[Toby Flenderson]

There's a debate about this on the Penguins board, so I want to see what Canucks fans think. On the scale of 1-5, with 1 being very bad, 3 being okay and 5 being very good, how would you rank a package of Marino, Kapanen's RFA rights, Poulin and a 1st for Miller?

Dude what… that’s certainly too much.

That’s a 1 on the scale for Pittsburgh

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

And what he will actually get..

playoff team 1st, a roster player+ decent but not recent top 20 drafted prospect.

I mean, maybe if you abandon all precedent.

Look at what Lehkonen just received. Barron (late 1st that was tracking well in the AHL) + a 2nd. For a 3rd line forward with 1/3 the point production of Miller while being an RFA requiring a new contract, and carrying the same cap hit as Miller at 50% retention.

Allvin isn’t going to trade Miller for pennies on the dollar.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think the best comparable we have for a Miller trade right now was when Marty St. Louis was traded for Ryan Callahan and 2 1sts back in 2014. St. Louis was older, but he was also the Art Ross winner in 2013. Callahan at the time was a 28 year old 2nd liner on an expiring contract, but he did sign a long term deal to stay with Tampa Bay after that season.

There's also the Mark Stone trade, but that was a case of a prospect being crazily hyped and having a ton of value, so I think it's tough to gauge that trade

 

[CanucksSayEh]

If the Pens or Caps were willing to give JT a contract and not the Nucks I'd be pissed. OV/Sid with JT would be awesome though, it would just make the Nucks look like such a loser franchise. Maybe next decade rite?

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Some posters here must be blinded by their hatred for the Canucks if they think a 99 point gritty, all situations (and capable of playing all forward positions) forward, in the middle of his prime, carrying a $2.6 mill cap hit (50% retained), will return spare parts. Some of the stupidest shit I’ve seen on here.

 

[Toby Flenderson]

Some posters here must be blinded by their hatred for the Canucks if they think a 99 point gritty, all situations (and capable of playing all forward positions) forward, in the middle of his prime, carrying a $2.6 mill cap hit (50% retained), will return spare parts. Some of the stupidest shit I’ve seen on here.

I’m not sure what offer you are referring to but let’s also keep in mind this is the only season he’s even topped 75 points and is a rental.

Can’t think of the last time a rental was traded for elite pieces.

It’s been said a ton on here recently but I’ll say it again. There’s only a handful of teams that would be interested in JT as a rental and realistically none of them have the top assets Canucks fans are asking for. Year after year rentals get dealt for packages involving late firsts because no team with early firsts or elite prospects are in the market.

If Canucks management has the same attitude as you they are on the fast track to losing him in free agency for a big ole goose egg in return

 

[TBF1972]

I think the best comparable we have for a Miller trade right now was when Marty St. Louis was traded for Ryan Callahan and 2 1sts back in 2014. St. Louis was older, but he was also the Art Ross winner in 2013. Callahan at the time was a 28 year old 2nd liner on an expiring contract, but he did sign a long term deal to stay with Tampa Bay after that season.

There's also the Mark Stone trade, but that was a case of a prospect being crazily hyped and having a ton of value, so I think it's tough to gauge that trade

kovalchuk?

 

[Andy Dufresne]

this is the only season he’s even topped 75 points

He had 90 pts 2 years ago.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

I’m not sure what offer you are referring to but let’s also keep in mind this is the only season he’s even topped 75 points and is a rental.

Can’t think of the last time a rental was traded for elite pieces.

It’s been said a ton on here recently but I’ll say it again. There’s only a handful of teams that would be interested in JT as a rental and realistically none of them have the top assets Canucks fans are asking for. Year after year rentals get dealt for packages involving late firsts because no team with early firsts or elite prospects are in the market.

If Canucks management has the same attitude as you they are on the fast track to losing him in free agency for a big ole goose egg in return

Miller was on pace for 86 points in the 2020 Covid shortened season, his first season as a Canuck with no sign of slowing down. He is a rental, but at least a full season rental (not TDL) and can negotiate an extension (a team like Columbus could be interested in an extended Miller).

I’ve seen posts in this thread saying late 1st + B prospect + roster player (likely not a difference maker). Those are spare parts in terms of moving the needle for roster improvement.

 

[Taluss]

Some posters here must be blinded by their hatred for the Canucks if they think a 99 point gritty, all situations (and capable of playing all forward positions) forward, in the middle of his prime, carrying a $2.6 mill cap hit (50% retained), will return spare parts. Some of the stupidest shit I’ve seen on here.

-He’s probably nearing the end of his prime
- I’m not seeing offers with half retained, maybe I’m blind
- Not seeing a lot of “spare parts” offered tbh. Majority seem to be quite reasonable. 1st, B+ or A prospect and a young roster player with another small add.
- Your not considering his age or his massive extension probably coming. Both those factors will make fanbases tune down their offer cuz of risk or being unable to resign him after this year.