A difference of perspective: How Europeans value Olympic medals

[CapitalsCupReality]

It seems that the players do, and even in a second rate tournament they were extremely happy to win the bronze and some called it the happiest they have been. By the way, some of these happy bronze medalists were part of the team that lost the bronze medal game last week....

But hey, THIS TIME they did not care about it, even though this bronze is much bigger than the world championships bronze. Makes PERFECT SENSE!

At the end of this video you can see their non caring reactions and utter depression over having to take this burden of a medal.

On the care meter in the USA, it's like 47th/100, rating above the WBNA but below a good college basketball game any weeknight. It really doesn't matter. Be happy for your Olympic bronze, stop trying to make us care more about the World Championships and we can all move on to a new topic.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

How is it possible that if one player says he can't get up for a game it becomes a fact that you are willing to extrapolate across the entire team.. but another guy on the same team says he was happy to win a bronze at a lesser championship that is not taken into consideration?

The confirmation bias in this thread is mind-blowing.

Oh, so you're suggesting Kane is the ONLY USA player who felt that way and the rest of the team was willing to give blood, sweat and tears for the glory of 3rd place? Come on, you know better.

Nobody is saying a player wouldn't be happy to take the bronze over nothing. The World Championship quotes support that a player will always be happier with something over being empty handed. The prize in the Olympics was the gold and there was a clear letdown after that was lost. Not much else to argue about honestly.

 

[cryssarn]

I mean I suspect the USA players would have been celebrating if they won the bronze too.

I don't really care to argue the value of a bronze. Clearly it means something, it's a great accomplishment. I'm simply posting player comments to support the notion that US posters got crapped on for suggesting, that it was a "gold or nothing" mentality and they weren't up for the bronze game at all. Now it comes straight from a USA player's mouth. Bash away.

and from another USA player mouth something else came out.
I'm just saying that Finland made the best out of a bad situation. Finland always try for gold. Now what grinds my gears is people that claim to know how european players and fans think about medals. You simple don't.
Now I don't understand why you would not try to win the last game, even with the attitude "win or bust"....and it seemed to me that USA tried until 3-0....Callahan and Kessel sacrified themselves a lot etc.
Maybe it's just me, but in my book it's an honor that to wear the jersey of your country....and you should to try to win all games in it.

 

[An Argument For]

On the care meter in the USA, it's like 47th/100, rating above the WBNA but below a good college basketball game any weeknight. It really doesn't matter. Be happy for your bronze, stop trying to make us care more about it and we can all move on to a new topic.

Audience =/= Participants.

Another pointless contribution.

Quick didn't think it was hard to show and try hard.

Jonathan Quick wasn’t buying into the notion it was difficult for the U.S. to play today’s bronze medal game after a tough semifinal loss to Canada.

“It shouldn’t be too hard,†he said, per PHT’s Jason Brough. “We do that all year long. We’re professionals. We play back-to-backs all year long.

“There’s no reason we show up and not piss a drop.â€

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/...ican-performance-following-bronze-medal-flop/

"It's very disappointing the way the game shook out. With a medal on the line, you get blown out 5-0. That's unacceptable at this point, at this stage of the tournament," said Parise, who finished the tournament with just one goal. "We're going home empty-handed with some pretty high expectations and high hopes coming into here a couple weeks ago. To leave on this note is pretty ugly."

From his tone.. I think Parise would have wanted to win that Bronze.

"It feels like you played this tournament for nothing," said U.S. and Colorado Avalanche center Paul Stastny. "You win that quarterfinal game; you get excited because you know you're going to play for a medal; and you come away with nothing. Not much to say, just disappointing, sour, I guess. A medal's a medal and it's going to be with you forever and we couldn't come up with one and that's the part that's most frustrating."

A medal is a medal says Stastny. A medal... is.. a medal.

"Yeah, we did collapse," offered U.S and Minnesota Wild defenseman Ryan Suter. "We had a great first period, we were all over them, had a couple of good chances, couldn't get one by him and it ended up costing us."

If you collapse after a great first period... it's pretty hard to say you couldn't get up for the game.. It's rare that you play amazing for 20 mins before you remember you didn't want to win that badly to start.

http://espn.go.com/olympics/winter/...-feeling-pretty-low-bronze-medal-loss-finland


But hey, I'm simply posting player comments to support the notion that non-US posters got crapped on for suggesting...

 

[psycho_dad*]

But hey, I'm simply posting player comments to support the notion that non-US posters got crapped on for suggesting...

Why use the players, the actual athletes comments and their words when you could quote a dozen of bitter fans who knew after the lost game that their team would have won, had they not cared....and that the fans do not care either so basically it's a moral victory for the U.S.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

LIke I said, yeah sure, anyone would take a medal instead of being empty handed.

I've already said they came out with energy early and flamed out after falling behind. Next irrelevant point to discuss?

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Why use the players, the actual athletes comments and their words when you could quote a dozen of bitter fans who knew after the lost game that their team would have won, had they not cared....and that the fans do not care either so basically it's a moral victory for the U.S.

Who's saying that the USA didn't try hard and we would have won if we had? I've missed those posts.

 

[An Argument For]

Oh, so you're suggesting Kane is the ONLY USA player who felt that way and the rest of the team was willing to give blood, sweat and tears for the glory of 3rd place? Come on, you know better.

Nobody is saying a player wouldn't be happy to take the bronze over nothing. The World Championship quotes support that a player will always be happier with something over being empty handed. The prize in the Olympics was the gold and there was a clear letdown after that was lost. Not much else to argue about honestly.

Umm.. everything that you just said is applied to the Finland team. That's problem you guys keep saying things like they only apply to team USA. You think Finland wasn't disappointed after losing a game that they were winning against their biggest hockey rivals? Yet somehow you seem to act like it affected the US performance far more than the Finland team and you haven't been able to substantiate beyond it being something you want to believe.

 

[psycho_dad*]

Who's saying that the USA didn't try hard and we would have won if we had? I've missed those posts.

A lot of people in the "is finland the 3rd best hockey nation" thread and in this one as well. Just read around.

Off the top of my head Cawz, TJ99, Ohashi and several other apologists.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

and from another USA player mouth something else came out.
I'm just saying that Finland made the best out of a bad situation. Finland always try for gold. Now what grinds my gears is people that claim to know how european players and fans think about medals. You simple don't.
Now I don't understand why you would not try to win the last game, even with the attitude "win or bust"....and it seemed to me that USA tried until 3-0....Callahan and Kessel sacrified themselves a lot etc.
Maybe it's just me, but in my book it's an honor that to wear the jersey of your country....and you should to try to win all games in it.

NO it's not just you...

And I have European family, so I have an idea.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

A lot of people in the "is finland the 3rd best hockey nation" thread and in this one as well. Just read around.

Off the top of my head Cawz, TJ99, Ohashi and several other apologists.

Oh well, there are fringe elements saying bad things on both sides.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Umm.. everything that you just said is applied to the Finland team. That's problem you guys keep saying things like they only apply to team USA. You think Finland wasn't disappointed after losing a game that they were winning against their biggest hockey rivals? Yet somehow you seem to act like it affected the US performance far more than the Finland team and you haven't been able to substantiate beyond it being something you want to believe.

OK, great, Finland felt the same way about the Gold. Do you really think they felt they had a legit chance as one of the favorites or the bronze was more likely in their eyes? I think we know Team USA felt like they were favorites right behind Canada.

 

[psycho_dad*]

OK, great, Finland felt the same way about the Gold. Do you really think they felt they had a legit chance as one of the favorites or the bronze was more likely in their eyes? I think we know Team USA felt like they were favorites right behind Canada.

Finland has 5 out of 6 top 3 finishes in the best on best since 1998 when NHL players started participating.

USA has 2 out of 6.

Neither country has won the olympic gold. Finland has won more head to head games against USA, and has won more against top 7 opponents than USA.

Can you explain to me why Finland would have went into Sochi with more doubt about their ability than USA?

They NEVER go into any tournament with a bronze in their eyes. Expectation is always winning.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Finland has 5 out of 6 top 3 finishes in the best on best since 1998 when NHL players started participating.

USA has 2 out of 6.

Neither country has won the olympic gold. Finland has won more head to head games against USA, and has won more against top 7 opponents than USA.

Can you explain to me why Finland would have went into Sochi with more doubt about their ability than USA?

They NEVER go into any tournament with a bronze in their eyes. Expectation is always winning.

USA has made the olympic final twice, once for Finland. Like you said, neither country has won gold which is apparently all everyone in Europe cares about with regards to the olympics anyways

 

[psycho_dad*]

USA has made the olympic final twice, once for Finland. Like you said, neither country has won gold which is apparently all everyone in Europe cares about with regards to the olympics anyways

Finland also has a world cup final from 2004 so they are basically tied with getting into the finals, Finland just has 3 more bronzes and better in every other metric.

And no, gold is not the only thing people care about, it's the north americans who keep saying it's either gold or nothing. I understand well that gold equals 1st, silver equals 2nd and bronze equals 3rd.

 

[An Argument For]

OK, great, Finland felt the same way about the Gold. Do you really think they felt they had a legit chance as one of the favorites or the bronze was more likely in their eyes? I think we know Team USA felt like they were favorites right behind Canada.

Really, the game is to guess what the players mentality was? That's going to bring closure to this thread?

Finland probably thought they had a good chance to win if they played well. They probably thought hey, we're good defensively and we have the best goalie in the world so we can win this. I'd would assume that their confidence was up when they hung in with Canada and forced them to overtime. I assume after they smacked the Russians around they had a chance.. I would think going into the Sweden game they were feeling good about they're gold medal chances, especially after they took the lead in that game. The notion that they fell from smaller mountain is a bit absurd.

I mean let's be honest, do you think players are completely sold on the pre-tournament hype that the fans and media espouse? Do you think team USA thought they were the legit favorites. USA is filled with good, upper mid-level NHL players while team Canada was top to bottom elite, franchise players, first line forwards and first pairing defense. Do you think Shattenkirk didn't have some doubts about going against the two guys who play top minutes on his own team? You think Pacioretty, Stastny, Wheeler, Stepan etc looked at Team Canada's Getzlaf, Perry, Toews, Sharp and thought to themselves we're the best team in this rink? They probably thought they had a chance but Canada had 5 of the top 10 and 11 of the top 25 scorers in the NHL. I highly doubt the American players who play second fiddle to these guys year in and year out felt like it was theirs to lose.

 

[Peabo]

The US was definitely trying but Finland just kept shutting them out early on. And Kane's the only one I see trying to make excuses and saying Finland wants bronze more because...really Kane was the one who ####### up on two penalty shots... what's he gonna say...of course he not gonna admit he just plain sucked and got beat by a hot goalie

 

[Cawz]

How is it possible that if one player says he can't get up for a game it becomes a fact that you are willing to extrapolate across the entire team.. but another guy on the same team says he was happy to win a bronze at a lesser championship that is not taken into consideration?

The confirmation bias in this thread is mind-blowing.

Of course they are happy to win and got up for the game. Thats not what I'm saying.

So the picture from 2013 is fake? Oshie & Co seemed pretty happy for a bronze in a tournament that is not very important.
And you STILL have NO idea how the mentality of Swedish/Finnish players are. As I have said before....no celebrations over here.

There shouldnt be celebrations for winning the loser-final. Its like winning games after you've been eliminated from the playoffs (something I know all to well being an Oilers fan). Its always nice to win, but who really cares. Celebrations are kind of hollow, just like the loser-final match itself

 

[psycho_dad*]

There shouldnt be celebrations for winning the loser-final. Its like winning games after you've been eliminated from the playoffs (something I know all to well being an Oilers fan). Its always nice to win, but who really cares. Celebrations are kind of hollow, just like the loser-final match itself

Here you go again, telling the athletes from the comfort of your couch how they should feel.

Because YOU don't appreciate it, nobody else does either, even the athletes.

What the athletes themselves are saying doesn't stop you at all. You're the authority and know better how they should feel.

World revolves around you. If you don't approve of something, neither should anyone else.

 

[Mr Kanadensisk]

Neither of us know how they think, apart from what they are willing to share in interviews.

To think otherwise would be extremely arrogant. You read minds? I sure as hell don't.

Everyone hurts after losing a semi, everyone also says they still want to win the bronze because it's better than nothing.

To suggest that you have some sort of comparable knowledge about the mindset of each countries players is just ridiculous. They are all professional athletes and there to represent their countries. Feeling down after losing a semi is not a valid excuse to anyone, and if someone did feel like they did not care, then they deserve to lose. It is nothing but an excuse.

Two posts ago you said they all wanted it just as bad and now when faced with evidence you say no one can have any idea how they feel. You are just contradicting yourself now. As I said before, you can speak for Finns but I will speak for Canadians on this matter.

 

[Mr Kanadensisk]

More excuses.

"But...but....THAT TIME they cared, when they lose they didn't care"

So every time americans win, they cared enough. When they lose, they didn't care. There's never a situation where they just lose because they were worse than their opponent.

I'll try your logic for a size:

I know how USA players think, they could have beaten Canada to a pulp in the semis, but they did not care because they know they are superior anyway. It's not about winning the medal, it's about knowing who the real champions are. They did not care in the gold medal game in Vancouver, and they did not care in the semis in Sochi. USA is the REAL gold medalist of both games, but they knew it, we know it....so why care to show off and actually take them when you're already from the greatest country in the world, the only place where people have any sort of freedom.

I'm sorry, but this is just a load for babble not worthy of a serious reply. It is clear the only reason you are carrying on like this is because you want to believe Finland is a better hockey nation than they really are.

 

[Mr Kanadensisk]

Yes we do. The teams just wasn't good enough in the medal rounds. Don't forget that we only had two NHL player in Korpikoski and Granlund (without whom that game wouldn't have gone into Ot in the first place). Our KHL players were useless in the medal rounds and against the US.

Well, all the empty seats at the recent WC's in Finland would suggest otherwise. And please don't blame the ticket prices, relatively speaking they were pretty reasonable.

 

[Mr Kanadensisk]

I'm sure a lot of you think I am anti Finnish but I don't think that is true. For a country with relatively weak rosters in terms of player talent compared to the other big hockey nations they have done well in making it to the final 4 so many times. Beating less motivated opponents in the bronze games doesn't impress me nearly as much as their QF record at the last 5 Olympics where they have beaten Sweden, USA, Czech and Russia and only lost to Canada.

 

[psycho_dad*]

Two posts ago you said they all wanted it just as bad and now when faced with evidence you say no one can have any idea how they feel. You are just contradicting yourself now. As I said before, you can speak for Finns but I will speak for Canadians on this matter.

You can't speak for Canadians, I can't speak for the Finns.

They are individuals, not some ****ing hive mind.

 

[psycho_dad*]

I'm sure a lot of you think I am anti Finnish but I don't think that is true. For a country with relatively weak rosters in terms of player talent compared to the other big hockey nations they have done well in making it to the final 4 so many times. Beating less motivated opponents in the bronze games doesn't impress me nearly as much as their QF record at the last 5 Olympics where they have beaten Sweden, USA, Czech and Russia and only lost to Canada.

They must have been unmotivated as well.

There's never any other reason for a paper tiger to lose, it must always be because they did not care enough. This is what I have learned from listening to hockey geniuses like you.