Post-Game Talk: #9 - 10/27/19 | bruins @ RANGERS

[Machinehead]

I'm okay with that. Seems to be a problem with teams playing at the Garden. So, how do you fix it? Mark Messier only comes around once in a generation.

Value ability over character which is the second thing nobody wants to do.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Let's look at this play as an example.



They need to handle and recognize coverages better. This was a 3on3 which turned into an odd man rush and a player wide open right in front of the Ranger goal. Panarin should have passed off Carlo to DeAngelo and went to Pastrnak while Hajek takes MArchand and boxes him out in front. Don't overcomplicate things...this is simple stuff they need to fix. At game speed against good teams it's hard to...

And the offense didn't help. DeAngelo did the blueline spread play and couldn't get the puck through. Strome and Buchnevich with really poor efforts and routes on the puck recovery. It's just bad all around right now. Some of it is effort, some of it is bad decisions and not reading the play, and this team just isn't that talented relative to a team like the Bruins.

 

[Raspewtin]

Like this board wants to let the rookies run wild but also wants to see tight defensive structure every night. It’s absurd.

what complete nonsense

wanting to see some of the best prospects in hockey used properly or put in positions to succeed is compatible with wanting some structure and noticeable improvement in some of the 6000 areas the Rangers were a dumpster fire in last year

 

[Raspewtin]

Again, players make the system.

yeah i just started watching hockey yesterday too

 

[Levitate]

There does seem to be some systemic issues but it's hard to tell what is system, what is players not executing properly, and what is just the fact that this isn't a good hockey team yet.
I feel like there is a lot of execution issues that are coming from players just not being able to process the team game at full speed right now. When they face a team that doesn't pressure them as hard like Buffalo, they have a bit more time to make the right play, be in the right place, etc. When they face a team that is moving faster and more aggressive, guys start panicking, start losing their marks and their places on the ice, get confused, get behind the play, etc.
Is it bad players? System? Execution?
Probably all three but I've seen even bad teams in the NHL put together respectable defenses by just playing a more simple and conservative game. ON the other hand that means then we all get to complain about the offense being too vanilla and not letting skill players do their thing, etc etc.

My biggest complaints have been that teammates aren't supporting each other very well and are forcing each other to have to win outmanned battles along the boards, make difficult and long passes when they do have the puck, etc. When forechecking and trying to start a cycle, you need support in close, not one guy standing in the slot and the other guy behind the net and the D standing outside the blueline. The forechecker gets easily overwhelmed and out numbered and then it's back the other way. The incredible thing is that this also means an easy breakout for the other team and often traps the other forwards deep...they're not even helping forecheck, but they're stuck deep after the other team breaks out, and then the D have to conceed the blueline because they have no help coming.

similar stuff in the defensive zone, often the support isn't there and guys start getting confused as to who to cover and what to do

So, I dunno, I think there are a lot of parts to this that are badright now and the hard part of stripping the team and moving so many players year after year is that it breaks down the overall structure and you're left with a few guys from the days when the team used to function, a ton of kids, and a handful of new vets who aren't familiar with anyone either.

A team like Boston has basically had the same vet structure in place for years and they don't have to relearn everything every season.

So, I dunno, I'd be happy to fire Ruff because I think he's bad at his job no matter what but it probably doesn't immediately make things better either.

 

[offdacrossbar]

Let's look at this play as an example.



They need to handle and recognize coverages better. This was a 3on3 which turned into an odd man rush and a player wide open right in front of the Ranger goal. Panarin should have passed off Carlo to DeAngelo and went to Pastrnak while Hajek takes MArchand and boxes him out in front. Don't overcomplicate things...this is simple stuff they need to fix. At game speed against good teams it's hard to...

And the offense didn't help. DeAngelo did the blueline spread play and couldn't get the puck through. Strome and Buchnevich with really poor efforts and routes on the puck recovery. It's just bad all around right now. Some of it is effort, some of it is bad decisions and not reading the play, and this team just isn't that talented relative to a team like the Bruins.

simple problem right there. hajek got confused on the cross and took the wrong guy leaving marchant all alone. he had all day. no one bodies him no one slid because they were all on the wrong side. simply a rookie Dman made the wrong read. period.

he was confused on the cross and followed the puck leaving marchant alone. 3 defenders all in the same area and no one on the side of the ice where marchant was and pasta makes the pass to a wide open marchant. ADA tried to slide but too late.

bad defense there by a rookie defender against the best line in hockey. it happens.

 

[The S5]

what complete nonsense

wanting to see some of the best prospects in hockey used properly or put in positions to succeed is compatible with wanting some structure and noticeable improvement in some of the 6000 areas the Rangers were a dumpster fire in last year

Didn't they send Chytil and Krav to the A to get more playing time?
I do think they should put Kakko on the third line until he gets more comfortable.
Bottom line is this is a very young team and many of our players have not played together for very long. They will get better as the season moves along.
Did we really think this was going to be a strong team at the beginning of the year?

 

[Anzi]

 

[Levitate]

Let's look at this play as an example.



They need to handle and recognize coverages better. This was a 3on3 which turned into an odd man rush and a player wide open right in front of the Ranger goal. Panarin should have passed off Carlo to DeAngelo and went to Pastrnak while Hajek takes MArchand and boxes him out in front. Don't overcomplicate things...this is simple stuff they need to fix. At game speed against good teams it's hard to...

And the offense didn't help. DeAngelo did the blueline spread play and couldn't get the puck through. Strome and Buchnevich with really poor efforts and routes on the puck recovery. It's just bad all around right now. Some of it is effort, some of it is bad decisions and not reading the play, and this team just isn't that talented relative to a team like the Bruins.

Yeah excellent example of players just not looking like they know what they're doing. Is it individual players? A system they're struggling to understand? I don't know, but a 3 on 3 shouldn't result in a guy standing alone in front of the net like that.

 

[The S5]

yeah i just started watching hockey yesterday too

I'm sure you will pick it up at some point.

 

[Levitate]

Interested to see if Chytil brings some energy but I'm fairly "meh" on Lindgren to be honest. I don't think hke's as good as people make him out to be, his defense and puck moving isn't that great, but maybe a shakeup with some physical play could help

 

[Anzi]

Interested to see if Chytil brings some energy but I'm fairly "meh" on Lindgren to be honest. I don't think hke's as good as people make him out to be, his defense and puck moving isn't that great, but maybe a shakeup with some physical play could help

He's probably an upgrade over Staal at the very least. Though I doubt that Quinn would scratch Staal.

 

[Levitate]

He's probably an upgrade over Staal at the very least. Though I doubt that Quinn would scratch Staal.

Oh he's for sure going in for Hajek

Though if he went in for Skjei maybe I wouldn't complain either.

 

[Machinehead]

Didn't they send Chytil and Krav to the A to get more playing time?
I do think they should put Kakko on the third line until he gets more comfortable.
Bottom line is this is a very young team and many of our players have not played together for very long. They will get better as the season moves along.
Did we really think this was going to be a strong team at the beginning of the year?

Chytil, sure.

They sent Kravtsov to the A to bench him and yell at him.

 

[Raspewtin]

Oh he's for sure going in for Hajek

Though if he went in for Skjei maybe I wouldn't complain either.

it should be for Hajek tbh he looks pretty bad

 

[will1066]

LIndgren is coming up after Staal gave Gorton the ok

But Staal will make a game time decision that he'll stay in and someone else has to come out

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

So if every player is bad then it's Gorton's fault. At some point, we have to hold the New York Rangers accountable which is the thing nobody wants to do.

Not every player is bad, but this roster is riddled with players who either are bad and/or are really too young to be consistently good in this league.

Forgive me if I don’t take you too seriously on the subject since you’ve consistently belittled the coach and the organization from 2015 - current despite the wheels falling off the roster when it came to talent level.

Personally, I am more optimistic now because I can see the chess pieces I’m moving into place as a fan. I’m not sure what planet you’re on if you think it was all going to come together this season, 8 games in no less

 

[Machinehead]

Not every player is bad, but this roster is riddled with players who either are bad and/or are really too young to be consistently good in this league.

Forgive me if I don’t take you too seriously on the subject since you’ve consistently belittled the coach and the organization from 2015 - current despite the wheels falling off the roster when it came to talent level.

Personally, I am more optimistic now because I can see the chess pieces I’m moving into place as a fan. I’m not sure what planet you’re on if you think it was all going to come together this season, 8 games in no less

Yeah, don't take me seriously because I belittle such a winning organization.

 

[ZiGOODejad]

Do you want to teach these guys or not?

Yeah that’s why you don’t fire your coach before you even hit 20 games. Coaches have to develop a chemistry with the team as well

 

[will1066]

This team is so bad that Edge has stopped posting

 

[Doctyl]

Chytil, sure.

They sent Kravtsov to the A to bench him and yell at him.

It’s actually impressive how horribly handled that whole thing was. Like we might have just thrown away one of the best prospects in hockey. That was totally avoidable.

 

[Gresch04]

I just don't understand the constant rush on this board to give all the players (except staal and whoever else the current whipping boy is) the benefit of the doubt in this organization on everything while acting like the organization is always in the wrong. I swear most people on here would want the inmates to just run the asylum. When was it that a coach just stopped coaching mid game yesterday ago and just let the players run their own lines and special teams bc he was making a point to them?

The organization hasn't won a championship in 25 years. They've earned our scorn and doubt. The Rangers, Jets, Knicks and Mets don't get the benefit of the doubt. The Giants have lost the benefit of the doubt with the recent constant losing. Only the Yankees get a pass. Even the mighty Yankees went into the post season with a mediocre rotation that had little chance of winning. So there's some room for second guessing there as well.

 

[Machinehead]

The organization hasn't won a championship in 25 years. They've earned our scorn and doubt. The Rangers, Jets, Knicks and Mets don't get the benefit of the doubt. The Giants have lost the benefit of the doubt with the recent constant losing. Only the Yankees get a pass. Even the mighty Yankees went into the post season with a mediocre rotation that had little chance of winning. So there's some room for second guessing there as well.

Yep. Trust is earned.

I just assume anything the Rangers do is dumb until proven otherwise. That's what they've earned.

 

[Gresch04]

It’s actually impressive how horribly handled that whole thing was. Like we might have just thrown away one of the best prospects in hockey. That was totally avoidable.

Agreed. Kravtsov is a baby, and I don't mean his character. He's still a kid. I have two kids older than him. I remember how they behaved at 19. The rational brain doesn't fully develop until 25. Just because he's man sized doesn't make him a man.

If the kid didn't work hard in preseason then I'm all for sending a message by sending him down. If he travels half way around the PLANET to a new country and culture and shows strong effort and promise then give him a TASTE of the NHL. He might have surprised us and done fine. If he didn't, at least THEN you have a basis for the demotion conversation that's much easier to handle. "Hey you're a big part of our future. You're new to the NA ice size. The NHL game is fast and it will take some time. Go down and learn the NA game in HFD for a bit, we're confident you'll be back". That's all it probably required to keep him engaged.

Players are people. Their brains are no different than ours. They have the same human need to feel a sense of belonging and that they make a difference in the work they do. If they feel threatened and unsafe they don't perform well because fear is not a sustainable motivator. If they feel confident and comfortable they perform at their full potential because confidence and success breeds more confidence.

I have little confidence sports teams, run mainly by ex-athletes, have any clue how to manage the needs of human beings. Many subscribe to the old school tough-guy nonsense that fear is good. Despite the scientific evidence to the contrary. There is actually an ideal level of stress and pressure that leads to peak performance. So I'm not talking about fantasy land where there is no stress or pressure. Bottom line, it's more than fair to be skeptical that a team as poorly run as the Rangers might just suck at developing young players.

 

[Machinehead]

I was Kravtsov's age when I joined HF and nobody thought I would last.