Prospect Info: 60th Overall, Albert Johansson, LD

[MBH]

I'm guessing that Cotton stays with his team as an over-ager, each WHL team is allowed 3.

If we've got contracts available, I wouldn't mind signing him and sticking him in the ECHL if he's not ready for A.

The contract situation is so wide open
23 players under contract?
And 3 of them are goalies with no real chance of being useful to this franchise.

On defense, we have the following
In Detroit:
Dekeyser
Stecher
Cholowski (for the sake of argument)
Seider
Hronek
We could sign 1LD and 1 RD.
That's 7 defensemen under contract.
PLUS the following in AHL/ECHL
Lindstrom
Newpower
McIsaac
Barton
That's 11.
Probably need 1-2 pros (McIlrath.Hicketts, or their replacements)
So that's 6 in GR and 13 overall.

Viro starts in Flnland.
Sebrango heads back to the OHL.

I'm guessing with Johansson in Sweden, it's super easy to find playing time for Cotton's development.

 

[Coach Reggie Dunlop]

I saw rogle develop seider throughout the season more than I saw in the AHL, granted he was a year older but his positioning and offensive instincts looked far better than I thought they were at his age after this past year. With that being said I’m perfectly fine with letting Albert develop over there for that reason alone, why does everyone have to come to Grand Rapids so soon? The level of play is virtually the same the big difference is the ice but I don’t think ice transition is near his biggest development worries.

 

[Killerjas]

Let Albert be a great 1st line Defender for Farjestad, basically do a Nils Lindkvist 2.0 (3 years of SHL) and then move to the AHL/NHL. No need to rush him.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Let Albert be a great 1st line Defender for Farjestad, basically do a Nils Lindkvist 2.0 (3 years of SHL) and then move to the AHL/NHL. No need to rush him.

'21-22 Seider debut
'22-23 AlJo
'23-24 Werenski, ......McIsaac? Wallinder? Newpower?
'24-25 Sebrango? Viro? Tuomisto?


'18-19 Hronek, (Cholo)
'19-20 Lindstrom
'20-21 slightly used & rehabbed DDK! Mullet Man, SuperStaal & Stech Armstrong

 

[Hoog]

I think you might see a bit of McIsaac this coming year and then full time in 22-23 with AJ arrival, IF he finally stays healthy. We forget how good this kid was and still can be. He would be a huge help to the rebuild if he could just stay healthy. I also think people are sleeping on Tuomisto. This kid will have a huge year next season in college and be right back in the conversation, IMO. It's amazing how many defensive prospects we have in the fold. Viro is a guy that could step up big time as well. He could be ready by 22-23 for some NHL games and then full time in 23-24. If we were to add Werenski to the group, in 23-24 we could have Werenski/Seider, Johansson/Hronek, McIssac/Tuomisto, with Viro/Sebrango in the wings with Wallinder and other draft picks. Very nice!

 

[simonedvinsson]

'21-22 Seider debut
'22-23 AlJo
'23-24 Werenski, ......McIsaac? Wallinder? Newpower?
'24-25 Sebrango? Viro? Tuomisto?


'18-19 Hronek, (Cholo)
'19-20 Lindstrom
'20-21 slightly used & rehabbed DDK! Mullet Man, SuperStaal & Stech Armstrong

I'm anticipating one rookie defenseman per season:

21-22 | Moritz Seider
22-23 | Albert Johansson
23-24 | Edvinsson/Hughes/Clarke (+Werenski)
24-25 | Wallinder

 

[MBH]

I saw rogle develop seider throughout the season more than I saw in the AHL, granted he was a year older but his positioning and offensive instincts looked far better than I thought they were at his age after this past year. With that being said I’m perfectly fine with letting Albert develop over there for that reason alone, why does everyone have to come to Grand Rapids so soon? The level of play is virtually the same the big difference is the ice but I don’t think ice transition is near his biggest development worries.

Because he's been in the SHL for two years. It's time to come over and play in a league that more resembles the NHL style.
It's a D+3 year. Time to venture to the next level.

 

[MBH]

Let Albert be a great 1st line Defender for Farjestad, basically do a Nils Lindkvist 2.0 (3 years of SHL) and then move to the AHL/NHL. No need to rush him.

No need to slow him either.
How much did Nils Lindkvist really improve last year?

 

[Killerjas]

No need to slow him either.
How much did Nils Lindkvist really improve last year?

A lot, thats why he was awarded the SHL defenseman of the year award and was arguebly the best defenseman for Sweden.

 

[MBH]

A lot, thats why he was awarded the SHL defenseman of the year award and was arguebly the best defenseman for Sweden.

So tell me how he improved.
Because statistically, if anything, improvement was a mixed bag.

You have ZERO evidence that his development was helped by staying in Sweden and winning an award.

He might have come over to NA and had a good, strong year in the AHL and been ready for an NHL job right now.

 

[Hen Kolland]

A lot, thats why he was awarded the SHL defenseman of the year award and was arguebly the best defenseman for Sweden.

Did he get better outside of natural growth and progression? It's not like his performance was related to his location. He likely has the same improvement if he was playing in the AHL as he did the SHL, and I would argue he would have been even further ahead with that North American experience.

Now the award probably helps his confidence level, and that's nothing to ignore, but statistically he was pretty flat. Maybe his defensive metrics improved, but it's hard to comment on that being in Sweden, but this is the best we have.

Svengelska Hockey

Looking at his metrics, he generated 3 more CF per game and didn't prevent any more CA per game at 5 on 5. His even strength scoring fell notably, and his powerplay production improved notably. So he was given a more involved powerplay role from the looks of it. Again, there's not much to say that being in the SHL did anything for his development other than allow him to stay in his home nation. Which aligns with your arguments in the past that prospects are better served in Europe just because they are.

 

[Frk It]

Seems more likely he would get 20+ min a night in the SHL next year as opposed to the AHL.... so SHL makes more sense to me.

 

[MBH]

Seems more likely he would get 20+ min a night in the SHL next year as opposed to the AHL.... so SHL makes more sense to me.

20 minutes a night playing the same level of hockey (probably worse, really, with more NA guys back in the NHL or AHL).
I don't want the kid to stagnate. I want him to take the next step.
I don't think he's going to be a first pairing NHLer. At least not a true one. So I don't see why we need him to play in that role every night (even though he sometimes does in Sweden).

My biggest knock on his game is that he does things on Swedish ice that aren't going to translate on smaller ice, against faster, stronger and more physical opponents.

I'd rather not see him pile up more stats doing things that will never work in the NHL and I'd rather see him start to learn what it's going to take to be successful here.

 

[Coach Reggie Dunlop]

20 minutes a night playing the same level of hockey (probably worse, really, with more NA guys back in the NHL or AHL).
I don't want the kid to stagnate. I want him to take the next step.
I don't think he's going to be a first pairing NHLer. At least not a true one. So I don't see why we need him to play in that role every night (even though he sometimes does in Sweden).

My biggest knock on his game is that he does things on Swedish ice that aren't going to translate on smaller ice, against faster, stronger and more physical opponents.

I'd rather not see him pile up more stats doing things that will never work in the NHL and I'd rather see him start to learn what it's going to take to be successful here.

you kinda have the worst takes don’t you? You realize going to the SHL was great for seiders development right?

 

[Hen Kolland]

you kinda have the worst takes don’t you? You realize going to the SHL was great for seiders development right?

Because they played like twice as many games as Grand Rapids, but in all likelihood Seider would have played a decent portion of the season in Detroit with how he was playing last year.

It was a phenomenal year for Seider, but he probably would have had a bigger and arguably more appropriate challenge staying in North America

 

[Snuggs]

20 minutes a night playing the same level of hockey (probably worse, really, with more NA guys back in the NHL or AHL).
I don't want the kid to stagnate. I want him to take the next step.
I don't think he's going to be a first pairing NHLer. At least not a true one. So I don't see why we need him to play in that role every night (even though he sometimes does in Sweden).

My biggest knock on his game is that he does things on Swedish ice that aren't going to translate on smaller ice, against faster, stronger and more physical opponents.

I'd rather not see him pile up more stats doing things that will never work in the NHL and I'd rather see him start to learn what it's going to take to be successful here.

What does this actually mean? What things?

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Because they played like twice as many games as Grand Rapids, but in all likelihood Seider would have played a decent portion of the season in Detroit with how he was playing last year.

It was a phenomenal year for Seider, but he probably would have had a bigger and arguably more appropriate challenge staying in North America

But if Seider played well, then in DET he would've worsened our draft position slightly. As it is we had NJ & CB tank (in addition to Buf/Ana who just suck).

 

[Hen Kolland]

But if Seider played well, then in DET he would've worsened our draft position slightly. As it is we had NJ & CB tank (in addition to Buf/Ana who just suck).

Sure, but do we care as much about this draft pick as we do about Seider getting the best challenge for his development? Seider’s ultimate upside is worth picking 2-3 picks later than we are today.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Sure, but do we care as much about this draft pick as we do about Seider getting the best challenge for his development? Seider’s ultimate upside is worth picking 2-3 picks later than we are today.

His awards this yr. means he's doing ok, don't worry. We're already picking 2-3 picks later, every F***ing draft since '17. Our good karma draft fortune will manifest at the right time.

Meanwhile NJ/CB/Pitt won't.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Because they played like twice as many games as Grand Rapids, but in all likelihood Seider would have played a decent portion of the season in Detroit with how he was playing last year.

It was a phenomenal year for Seider, but he probably would have had a bigger and arguably more appropriate challenge staying in North America

Yes and no. More of a challenge considering we are still a bad team and he’d have carried them on defense. But I don’t think we would have seen his offense develop nearly as much in Detroit as it did in Rogle. That alone is a big reason why I’m fine with Seider having gone to the SHL.

 

[Gniwder]

Seems more likely he would get 20+ min a night in the SHL next year as opposed to the AHL.... so SHL makes more sense to me.

Except they play 8 defensemen so he won't get 20, Virtanen was the only player to average over 20 @22:42
Färjestad BK spelarstatistik - Färjestad BK (farjestadbk.se)

The Wings will have more control over his ice time in GR and the NA game is much more physical. He's going to need some time in GR sooner or later because he's not a physical player. I don't think it would matter as much for a forward, but it can throw off a defenseman's game like Cholo or Djoos for example.

 

[Frk It]

Except they play 8 defensemen so he won't get 20, Virtanen was the only player to average over 20 @22:42
Färjestad BK spelarstatistik - Färjestad BK (farjestadbk.se)

The Wings will have more control over his ice time in GR and the NA game is much more physical. He's going to need some time in GR sooner or later because he's not a physical player. I don't think it would matter as much for a forward, but it can throw off a defenseman's game like Cholo or Djoos for example.

He got 23 min a night in the playoffs. Hard for me to see him getting more playing time in the AHL than he would in the SHL.

Who was the last defenseman prospect we put on Grand Rapids and gave big minutes to? I have not liked how we have integrated our defensive prospects onto that team.

 

[Gniwder]

I'm anticipating one rookie defenseman per season:

21-22 | Moritz Seider
22-23 | Albert Johansson
23-24 | Edvinsson/Hughes/Clarke (+Werenski)
24-25 | Wallinder

Sebrango will make the team, aside from Seider he's the next most sure thing. He may be third pair, but he's good enough defensively that he'll find a roster spot.

I think another year in the SHL means AJ won't see the NHL until 23-24.

 

[Gniwder]

He got 23 min a night in the playoffs. Hard for me to see him getting more playing time in the AHL than he would in the SHL.

Who was the last defenseman prospect we put on Grand Rapids and gave big minutes to? I have not liked how we have integrated our defensive prospects onto that team.

It's really not that hard. McIlrath, Lashoff, and Hicketts were under Red Wings contracts. Not re-signing them forces the hand. It also sounds like Sebrango might have to play in the OHL, so they lost 4 starters.

Besides, if AJ can't earn ice time in GR then he won't ever make the Wings nor does he deserve to. Sebrango managed to earn ice time as an 18 yo. Not sure how to look up AHL ice time, but at least he played in 31/32 games, which is way more than I expected.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Sebrango will make the team, aside from Seider he's the next most sure thing. He may be third pair, but he's good enough defensively that he'll find a roster spot.

I think another year in the SHL means AJ won't see the NHL until 23-24.

what year for Sebrango's NHL debut?