4 Nations Revelations & State of the Leafs

[hobarth]

I'm not watching the 4 Nat. tournie but I am reading indirectly about it, Matthews is playing a great defensive game, I'm sure Sean Kuraly could play an awesome defensive game, Matthews isn't being played on the 1st line to defend, he's played on that line to dominate, also, as he should while with the Leafs not just on the scoreboard but in all facets of the game which would reflect why he's so well paid.

Mitch was also played on Canada's first line but as he does annually, when he's expected/needs to dominate, he's just there and the Cdn coach demotes him as he should be when he doesn't dominate for the Leafs. With the Leafs he needs to go, don't care where.

I think both of these players aren't the right players to lead TO to playoff victory, 8 years of the same old same old speaks volumes and this tournie is another testament to the past. It's fair enough that TO gets beat by any better team during the playoffs but that should never be because TO has 4 of the highest paid players in the NHL and when the chips are down so are they.

So what does TO need for these playoffs, we keep seeing the hacks say a better 3rd line center or a true #1 d-man but that's not what we need, we need Killer and Salming. I worry that a losing culture can affect players and I believe that is what TO has, a fine/good enough team during the regular season to make the playoffs. Marner/Matthews remind me of my all time favorite Leaf Mahovlich who Imlach rode mercilessly because Imlach knew Frank had more to give. I thought maybe Berube had a little Imlach in him but I don't think so.

I'm not condemning M & M, they are what they are, they're superior players that don't have that inner engine but I do blame Dubie & Trev for feeling compelled to pay them like they do have the necessary character to be winners beyond the regular season. I also question why it was so necessary to pay the core 4 so much when all they were able to do was help TO make the playoffs, poor results for so much money. I don't know much about Rantannen but could he be a/the missing ingredient.

I also read that Nylander hasn't been all that he could be, that disappoints me, he's my favorite Leaf, I really liked him at 7 mil. and wouldn't mind him at 8.5 mil., now.

I remember the complaints about Kessel, he was being paid $8 mil. but was essentially a support player, it was unrealistic to expect him to singlehandedly deliver TO to the promised land but when moved to a properly manned teams, with proper leaders/character players, he and that team thrived, that's where either of M & M need to go or one of them needs to be replaced with a quality character leader which TO is so much in need of and possibly a better coach.

Marner tells us after every playoff series loss that they gave it their all and he's probably speaking the truth, in his mind. The leader doesn't need to be as good statically as M & M, Toews or Kopitar were never in stats category of M & M but they had the intangible quality that truly lead their teams to multiple Cup wins but of course it would be better to have a Crosby.

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[arso40]

I'm not watching the 4 Nat. tournie but I am reading indirectly about it, Matthews is playing a great defensive game, I'm sure Sean Kuraly could play an awesome defensive game, Matthews isn't being played on the 1st line to defend, he's played on that line to dominate, also, as he should while with the Leafs not just on the scoreboard but in all facets of the game which would reflect why he's so well paid.

Mitch was also played on Canada's first line but as he does annually, when he's expected/needs to dominate, he's just there and the Cdn coach demotes him as he should be when he doesn't dominate for the Leafs. With the Leafs he needs to go, don't care where.

I think both of these players aren't the right players to lead TO to playoff victory, 8 years of the same old same old speaks volumes and this tournie is another testament to the past. It's fair enough that TO gets beat by any better team during the playoffs but that should never be because TO has 4 of the highest paid players in the NHL and when the chips are down so are they.

So what does TO need for these playoffs, we keep seeing the hacks say a better 3rd line center or a true #1 d-man but that's not what we need, we need Killer and Salming. I worry that a losing culture can affect players and I believe that is what TO has, a fine/good enough team during the regular season to make the playoffs. Marner/Matthews remind me of my all time favorite Leaf Mahovlich who Imlach rode mercilessly because Imlach knew Frank had more to give. I thought maybe Berube had a little Imlach in him but I don't think so.

I'm not condemning M & M, they are what they are, they're superior players that don't have that inner engine but I do blame Dubie & Trev for feeling compelled to pay them like they do have the necessary character to be winners beyond the regular season. I also question why it was so necessary to pay the core 4 so much when all they were able to do was help TO make the playoffs, poor results for so much money. I don't know much about Rantannen but could he be a/the missing ingredient.

I also read that Nylander hasn't been all that he could be, that disappoints me, he's my favorite Leaf, I really liked him at 7 mil. and wouldn't mind him at 8.5 mil., now.

I remember the complaints about Kessel, he was being paid $8 mil. but was essentially a support player, it was unrealistic to expect him to singlehandedly deliver TO to the promised land but when moved to a properly manned teams, with proper leaders/character players, he and that team thrived, that's where either of M & M need to go or one of them needs to be replaced with a quality character leader which TO is so much in need of and possibly a better coach.

Marner tells us after every playoff series loss that they gave it their all and he's probably speaking the truth, in his mind. The leader doesn't need to be as good statically as M & M, Toews or Kopitar were never in stats category of M & M but they had the intangible quality that truly lead their teams to multiple Cup wins but of course it would be better to have a Crosby.

Matthew line is actually the second line

 

[hobarth]

Matthew line is actually the second line

He's probably the highest paid player on the USA team and he's on the 2nd line, not good I'd say.

 

[arso40]

He's probably the highest paid player on the USA team and he's on the 2nd line, not good I'd say.

Eichel should be top line center if you ask me Hes the winner

 

[hobarth]

I always loved Eichel's game, even when with Buffalo but he wasn't a one man band there and he was all Buffalo had.

 

[arso40]

I always loved Eichel's game, even when with Buffalo but he wasn't a one man band there and he was all Buffalo had.

Shoulda traded marner for him when we had the chance god are we stupid

 

[Leaf Fans]

He's probably the highest paid player on the USA team and he's on the 2nd line, not good I'd say.

It is the same as Canada with MacK on the second line

 

[hobarth]

Shoulda traded marner for him when we had the chance god are we stupid

There's always the no trade to provisions in contracts, any Canadian team seems to be on most player's contracts that have enough clout to get this clause in their contracts.

It is the same as Canada with MacK on the second line

McDavid or McKinnon, I'd probably put McDavid on my 1st line and I'd expect McDavid's pay will be significantly higher than McKinnon's when he resigns soon.

 

[Leaf Fans]

There's always the no trade to provisions in contracts, any Canadian team seems to be on most player's contracts that have enough clout to get this clause in their contracts.


McDavid or McKinnon, I'd probably put McDavid on my 1st line and I'd expect McDavid's pay will be significantly higher than McKinnon's when he resigns soon.

Probably.

 

[hobarth]

Mitch was more offensively productive during this tournie than Matthews so is it logical to assume he deserves more $s on his next contract?

 

[arso40]

Mitch was more offensively productive during this tournie than Matthews so is it logical to assume he deserves more $s on his next contract?

How was he more productive ? They had the same amount of points and Matthews played one game less or something like that

 

[ACC1224]

Mitch was more offensively productive during this tournie than Matthews so is it logical to assume he deserves more $s on his next contract?

Money has nothing to do with it, it's cap percentage at the time of signing.
His percentage should fall between Matthews and Nylander.

 

[Sypher04]

There’s a lot of inaccuracies in this discussion

Matthews played well both offensively and defensively. The US also didn’t really have clear cut 1st and 2nd lines, not all that dissimilar from Canada.

The Matthews and Eichel lines were quite quite interchangeable from a quality perspective, in fact, at different points throughout the tournament they even swapped lines.

If you weren’t or didn’t watch the tournament then maybe you should keep your analysis and conclusions to yourself because they aren’t worth anything. Certainly not thread worthy.