GDT: #35 | Flyers at Penguins | Monday, December 23, 2024 | 7:00 PM | NBCSP, 93.3 FM

renberg

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Dec 31, 2003
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Once again, it all comes back to coaching. For a guy who claims that his forte is defense, Tortorella has created a grease fire on the back end. The ability of the Flyers' defensemen is not that bad. There are several teams in the league that have less talent; some perform better than these guys. It's the usage of them that matters. The constant juggling of pairs; benchings; and demotions doesn't help to solidify the back end.
 
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Hollywood Cannon

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The Flyers now have a Goal Differential worse than Buffalo, Chicago, Anaheim, and Montreal. :laugh:

Unethical non-competitive team. I heard a rumor Keith Jones was spotted eating a Karl Marx book too. There is no bottom.
I don't pay attention to anything Keith Jones eats. He's only there to sell to STH's.
 

Audible Velvet

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Saw the Pens broadcast. They had some extended time talking to Dubas as play went on. That GM is not in the same playing field as ours. Made it a point to single out and praise Sanheim - bonus points for that.

Once again, it all comes back to coaching. For a guy who claims that his forte is defense, Tortorella has created a grease fire on the back end. The ability of the Flyers' defensemen is not that bad. There are several teams in the league that have less talent; some perform better than these guys. It's the usage of them that matters. The constant juggling of pairs; benchings; and demotions doesn't help to solidify the back end.
The coaching ineptitude was glaring the previous game against Columbus too.
 
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renberg

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Saw the Pens broadcast. They had some extended time talking to Dubas as play went on. That GM is not in the same playing field as ours. Made it a point to single out and praise Sanheim - bonus points for that.


The coaching ineptitude was glaring the previous game against Columbus too.
It shows every night. Today's game is lost on Tortorella. He doesn't understand how to play in it. Constantly juggling lines, benching guys, demotions and so forth are indications of a coach grasping at straws to find a way to compete.
Tortorella doesn't have a grasp on how to compete in the modern game. Give him a gem like Michkov and the best that Tortorella can come up with to improve his play is to cut his PT, or sit him out. That's one heck of a development plan.
The only question left is when will the team turn on him? Tortorella has a clique of veterans who will stand by him and try to hold the line for him but it won't be enough. He's lifted his leg on too many of the younger players as well as some of the established guys like Couturier and Farabee.
 

renberg

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Yay crappy high draft pick traded for even crappier high draft pick. what a win?
Good point. Which wing is Gauthier pushing out of the lineup? Tippett, Farabee, Foerster, MM, TK, Brink? Maybe Laughton but he has the coach's blessing to play. Most likely if the club had Gauthier under contract, he'd by like Lycksell- up and down from LV.
 
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deadhead

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Over the past two years, they've added two free agents, Hathaway and Poehling.
One trade for Johnson after they traded Walker and had two other D-men on IR.
Didn't even pick up a serviceable veteran in the Provorov deal.
Drysdale has struggled but is improving, meanwhile Gauthier has 9 ES points in 33 games.

Everyone else is a draft pick or acquired before Briere (Tippett).

They have the worst goalies in the league, two guys who shouldn't be starting but Hart . . .

After a horrendous start, they are now 15th in xGF and 17th in HDCF.
By the end of the season I won't be surprised if they're in the top 10.

This is EXACTLY what rebuilding looks like.
A young team struggling but showing flashes.
But also making a lot of mistakes.
Draft picks: #12, #18, #27, #39, #43, #44
 

MJL66

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Good point. Which wing is Gauthier pushing out of the lineup? Tippett, Farabee, Foerster, MM, TK, Brink? Maybe Laughton but he has the coach's blessing to play. Most likely if the club had Gauthier under contract, he'd by like Lycksell- up and down from LV.
Yep, the Flyers lineup is just too good. Pretty much every year the Flyers leave little room for younger players to make the lineup. They have to have their veteran security blankets like Seeler and Hathaway
 

deadhead

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It was Jett or Buium, from all reports, Jett wasn't getting past #15 or so.
Drysdale plus high 2nd or Gauthier is looking more like a wash.
In the 8 games since he returned, Drysdale: xGF 60.20%, HDCF 54.32%.
Still a SSS, but looks like Shaw is getting through to him.

The best D-pairs
York - Sanheim
Andrae/Zamula - Risto
Seeler - Drysdale

The best line combos:
Foerster - Cates - Brink, 128 minutes, xGF 64.56%, HDCF 72.10%
Tippett - Frost - Michkov 146 minutes, xGF 54.22%, HDCF 58.39%
Farabee - Couts - TK 156 minutes, xGF 51.93%, HDCF 52.88%
Laughton - Poehling - Hathaway 140 minutes, xGF 58.64%, xGF 57.80%

Tippett - Couts - TK 93 minutes, xGF 50.67%, HDCF 50.33%
TK - Couts - Michkov 65 minutes xGF 53.03, HDCF 45.38%
 

MJL66

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Nov 30, 2008
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Over the past two years, they've added two free agents, Hathaway and Poehling.
One trade for Johnson after they traded Walker and had two other D-men on IR.
Didn't even pick up a serviceable veteran in the Provorov deal.
Drysdale has struggled but is improving, meanwhile Gauthier has 9 ES points in 33 games.

Everyone else is a draft pick or acquired before Briere (Tippett).

They have the worst goalies in the league, two guys who shouldn't be starting but Hart . . .

After a horrendous start, they are now 15th in xGF and 17th in HDCF.
By the end of the season I won't be surprised if they're in the top 10.

This is EXACTLY what rebuilding looks like.
A young team struggling but showing flashes.
But also making a lot of mistakes.
Draft picks: #12, #18, #27, #39, #43, #44
No, that's not what a rebuilding team looks like. Rebuilding teams look like SJ and Chicago. With multiple high end potential elite prospects and the ability to potentially add more high end elite talent in the next draft. Those teams have already surpassed the Flyers in potential in their rebuilds with Anaheim and Columbus to follow. Meanwhile the Flyers will be escalating relatively soon when their cap clears up. Only to continue in the endless circle of failures that they've been stuck in. There is no legitimate path in view for the Flyers to reach legitimate cup contention

It was Jett or Buium, from all reports, Jett wasn't getting past #15 or so.
Drysdale plus high 2nd or Gauthier is looking more like a wash.
In the 8 games since he returned, Drysdale: xGF 60.20%, HDCF 54.32%.
Still a SSS, but looks like Shaw is getting through to him.

The best D-pairs
York - Sanheim
Andrae/Zamula - Risto
Seeler - Drysdale

The best line combos:
Foerster - Cates - Brink, 128 minutes, xGF 64.56%, HDCF 72.10%
Tippett - Frost - Michkov 146 minutes, xGF 54.22%, HDCF 58.39%
Farabee - Couts - TK 156 minutes, xGF 51.93%, HDCF 52.88%
Laughton - Poehling - Hathaway 140 minutes, xGF 58.64%, xGF 57.80%

Tippett - Couts - TK 93 minutes, xGF 50.67%, HDCF 50.33%
TK - Couts - Michkov 65 minutes xGF 53.03, HDCF 45.38%
It is ridiculously premature to state that Gauthier for Drysdale and a 2nd is a wash. The Flyers were never likely going to win that trade. This coaching staff couldn't develop a photo.
 
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Sombastate

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It was Jett or Buium, from all reports, Jett wasn't getting past #15 or so.
I have a friend who is a scout for Edmonton and i asked him if anyone else had Jett in their top 15 and he absolutely said no.

So, my thing is anecdotal and something everyone should take with a grain of Salt. But there's no reason for you to believe he was going top 15 when zero mock drafts had him in the top 15, and a professional scout had him as "absolutely not" in the top 15.

Most everyone had Helenius, Hage, Eiserman, Boisvert, Jiricek, MBN well-well above him. So there's no way you can look at those names and think if we don't take him 13, he for sure goes in the next 2 picks. Just revisionist by anyone's standards
 

deadhead

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I have a friend who is a scout for Edmonton and i asked him if anyone else had Jett in their top 15 and he absolutely said no.

So, my thing is anecdotal and something everyone should take with a grain of Salt. But there's no reason for you to believe he was going top 15 when zero mock drafts had him in the top 15, and a professional scout had him as "absolutely not" in the top 15.

Most everyone had Helenius, Hage, Eiserman, Boisvert, Jiricek, MBN well-well above him. So there's no way you can look at those names and think if we don't take him 13, he for sure goes in the next 2 picks. Just revisionist by anyone's standards

However, TSN’s Director of Scouting and former NHL GM Craig Button had him as the 18th best prospect in his final rankings, and his colleague at TSN Bob McKenzie had him at No. 19.

As per Bob McKenzie via his final rankings list, it sounds like Luchanko’s name has generated a lot of buzz within the last week. Several scouts have told him that they feel he’s picking up momentum and it sounds like he could go higher on Day 1 of the draft than many originally thought.

 
May 22, 2008
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Over the past two years, they've added two free agents, Hathaway and Poehling.
One trade for Johnson after they traded Walker and had two other D-men on IR.
Didn't even pick up a serviceable veteran in the Provorov deal.
Drysdale has struggled but is improving, meanwhile Gauthier has 9 ES points in 33 games.

Everyone else is a draft pick or acquired before Briere (Tippett).

They have the worst goalies in the league, two guys who shouldn't be starting but Hart . . .

After a horrendous start, they are now 15th in xGF and 17th in HDCF.
By the end of the season I won't be surprised if they're in the top 10.

This is EXACTLY what rebuilding looks like.
A young team struggling but showing flashes.
But also making a lot of mistakes.
Draft picks: #12, #18, #27, #39, #43, #44

Four free agents. Johnson and Seeler count.
 

Sombastate

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However, TSN’s Director of Scouting and former NHL GM Craig Button had him as the 18th best prospect in his final rankings, and his colleague at TSN Bob McKenzie had him at No. 19.

As per Bob McKenzie via his final rankings list, it sounds like Luchanko’s name has generated a lot of buzz within the last week. Several scouts have told him that they feel he’s picking up momentum and it sounds like he could go higher on Day 1 of the draft than many originally thought.

Even your list made my point. Thank you.

Nowhere near 13, 4 generous spots below 15 - And if we're putting that much stock in what they said, how come we passed on the consensus 7 and 9?

I know your singular Christmas (and year long) wish is to have it both ways, but you cannot. If you're going to site them, then site the fact that it made my point for me. Thank ya.
 
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Audible Velvet

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It shows every night. Today's game is lost on Tortorella. He doesn't understand how to play in it. Constantly juggling lines, benching guys, demotions and so forth are indications of a coach grasping at straws to find a way to compete.
Tortorella doesn't have a grasp on how to compete in the modern game. Give him a gem like Michkov and the best that Tortorella can come up with to improve his play is to cut his PT, or sit him out. That's one heck of a development plan.
The only question left is when will the team turn on him? Tortorella has a clique of veterans who will stand by him and try to hold the line for him but it won't be enough. He's lifted his leg on too many of the younger players as well as some of the established guys like Couturier and Farabee.
I’m just assuming that Torts is deliberately trying to sabotage his point totals. Can’t have that kid winning an award or anything, might get cocky. Or worse yet, steal the narrative. It’s not about protecting the youth, it’s about protecting a dead legacy.
 
May 22, 2008
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Double counting Johnson, and Seeler was their own player who they developed.

Both had contracts that would have expired. They made the choice to extend both. Hell, Konecny should count too.

If this was another situation, you would point out that trading for Johnson and re-signing him were separate decisions. And you would be entirely correct.
 

MJL66

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Nov 30, 2008
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Even your list made my point. Thank you.

Nowhere near 13, 4 generous spots below 15 - And if we're putting that much stock in what they said, how come we passed on the consensus 7 and 9?

I know your singular Christmas (and year long) wish is to have it both ways, but you cannot. If you're going to site them, then site the fact that it made my point for me. Thank ya.
It's all projection at this point and every team and every scout sees it different. What stands out to me is his potential of a 2C. Why draft that player when a player with 1D potential is there? The Flyers need a future 1C and 1D. Maybe Luchanko exceeds an becomes a 1C but how likely is that?
 

Sombastate

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Jun 19, 2011
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It's all projection at this point and every team and every scout sees it different. What stands out to me is his potential of a 2C. Why draft that player when a player with 1D potential is there? The Flyers need a future 1C and 1D. Maybe Luchanko exceeds an becomes a 1C but how likely is that?
He isn't a 1C. This was always them being the smartest people in the room. I don't doubt for a second that Jett is going to be a serviceable to good NHL player. I'm sure he's going to be a better Laughton. But that's about where it ends. A better Laughton is still a very good hockey player.

Buium or Helenius who is an 18 year old in the AHL averaging half a point and playing great two way hockey was ALWAYS the right decision.

I had Hage higher than most, as well as Boisvert. But i won't malign them for not taking them. Buium and Helenius were always the right decisions.
 

ellja3

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May 19, 2014
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But sure, Torts is defensive specialist

1735066771584.png
 

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