Salary Cap: 24-25 Salary Thread Crosbicles Volume MXVI: End of season wrap up

[Empoleon8771]

Graves is a tall defenseman. He doesn't bring offense, defense, physicality or anything like that. He's just tall.

Calling him an "offensive" defenseman is a mischaracterization, just like calling him a "defensive defenseman".

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

Graves is a tall defenseman. He doesn't bring offense, defense, physicality or anything like that. He's just tall.

Calling him an "offensive" defenseman is a mischaracterization, just like calling him a "defensive defenseman".

He's a Schrodinger's defenseman.

 

[OtherThingsILike]

Considering that Graves has the offensive IQ of a canned ham and puts up only marginally more points than I do on the Penguins (shocking as it may be I do not play professional hockey for the Pittsburgh Penguins or any other organization)... it is both horribly confusing and sad that I agree wholeheartedly with this.

It's true that Graves is a low-IQ player, but that would be another reason why he might work better under a different coach, because Sullivan's system required a high-IQ to thrive in.

Graves is a tall defenseman. He doesn't bring offense, defense, physicality or anything like that. He's just tall.

Calling him an "offensive" defenseman is a mischaracterization, just like calling him a "defensive defenseman".

Graves didn't accidentally get 26 points with Colorado in 2019-20, 28 points with New Jersey in 2021-22, and 26 points with New Jersey in 2022-23.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Graves didn't accidentally get 26 points with Colorado in 2019-20, 28 points with New Jersey in 2021-22, and 26 points with New Jersey in 2022-23.

That's not exactly a lot of points, though.

He's a Schrodinger's defenseman.

He's Chad Ruhwedel if Chad Ruhwedel was 6'5" instead of 5'11"

 

[OtherThingsILike]

That's not exactly a lot of points, though.

For a defenseman it is, especially when compared to the 4 points he had with us this past season.

 

[Gurglesons]

Graves didn't accidentally get 26 points with Colorado in 2019-20, 28 points with New Jersey in 2021-22, and 26 points with New Jersey in 2022-23.

Wonder how he got those points...

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Not sure where to put this, but it looks like Sid is playing with the kids for Canada.

With Dubas as GM, I have a feeling this is more his decision than the coaching staff as a precursor to the fall.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

He's a Schrodinger's defenseman.

Hahaha this is the right answer

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

I just wanted to sound smart.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Being a bit picky and semantic...

Graves doesn't deserve a chance. He blew his chance. Finding causes for optimism regarding his previous good performances have to note how much his previous partners carried him.

However, since nobody's going to take him for free or even just a modest sweetener, they might as well give him a shot at some point. It's the whole Jack Johnson logic of trying to shine a turd all over again.

But he doesn't deserve it and I really hope they find some other guys to give a go to there first.

Deserve is the wrong word. It is in our best interest to try him in a new system with a new coach to see if he can't turn it around. The upside is significant and the downside is small. Buy him out after this season if it flops.

 

[DesertPenguin]

...having said all that I think EVERYONE deserves another look on this team under a different coach. I think it's pretty safe to say certain guys were not exactly thriving in this system and I mean... that's to be expected considering how little it's changed and how predictable it is.

Like... if we're playing chess and somehow I know every move you're going to make ahead of time... I'd BETTER win right?

Makes me wonder whether Karlsson and Letang might improve as well. I still move EK if the right deal is there though.

 

[Pancakes]

Makes me wonder whether Karlsson and Letang might improve as well. I still move EK if the right deal is there though.

Yeah I'm ok with moving EK if there's a good deal to be had but I'm not moving him just to move him. I'd rather see if he can build up some value with a new coach.

But if someone really wanted him this off season and was willing to pony up some good assets I'd be fine with doing it now. But only if.

 

[DesertPenguin]

That's not exactly a lot of points, though.



He's Chad Ruhwedel if Chad Ruhwedel was 6'5" instead of 5'11"

Chad Ruhwedel he is not. Ruh was a low ceiling, high floor, low event 6/7 d man that doesnt hurt you but doesn't help much either. Graves, evidently, was a value added d man prior to coming to Pittsburgh that could play top pair, but since arriving has done nothing but hurt. It stands to reason that might be system driven, and a new system might at least allow him to regress to the mean.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Yeah I'm ok with moving EK if there's a good deal to be had but I'm not moving him just to move him. I'd rather see if he can build up some value with a new coach.

But if someone really wanted him this off season and was willing to pony up some good assets I'd be fine with doing it now. But only if.

Much as we love Brunicke he's still really young. Not AHL eligible next year. Might be a year away still, or more.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

He's Chad Ruhwedel if Chad Ruhwedel was 6'5" instead of 5'11"

I actually think Ruhwedel would be a better defenseman if he had Graves' size. Ruhwedel's biggest issue was he was a "defensive defenseman" who lost way too many one on one and board battles because he's the size of Tyrion Lannister.

 

[Ulf5]

I just want Dubas to offer sheet someone fun like Cuylie.

Very strategic move, I like. Sully will tell Drury not to match, get me someone like Acciari instead.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Positional defensemen are trash.

 

[The Old Master]

Considering that Graves has the offensive IQ of a canned ham and puts up only marginally more points than I do on the Penguins (shocking as it may be I do not play professional hockey for the Pittsburgh Penguins or any other organization)... it is both horribly confusing and sad that I agree wholeheartedly with this.

you can't blame graves for you holding out for more money.

 

[Mr. T]

I actually think Ruhwedel would be a better defenseman if he had Graves' size. Ruhwedel's biggest issue was he was a "defensive defenseman" who lost way too many one on one and board battles because he's the size of Tyrion Lannister.

The size of Tyrion Lannister and the unruly mane of Lord Varys

 

[chethejet]

See what a new coach who brings fresh eyes can do with this roster. Karlsson can bring back some nice assets, free up a spot and allow for development of the younger RD. Graves third pairing with say ST Ivany can work. Dubas will bring in a solid LD. to help Letang.

 

[Andy99]

What I would do if I were Kyle Dubas in the 2025 draft.

While the Penguins dropped to 11th in the draft, the rest of the lottery was noteworthy because two teams made significant leaps forward in the draft order. The

penslabyrinth.com

I like this idea…suggests moving the 11th OA and Rakell for Utah’s 4OA and a 2026 2nd and some mediocre D prospect…

 

[eXile3]

Per Dan Kingerski,

Pens are front runners for Isaac Howard at this time.

Makes sense given Dubas wants to get younger but not wait seven years to get better

 

[chethejet]

Dubas will trade picks for Howard. He knows Rakell and Rust playing RW with adding McGroarty and Koivunen is the next additions to adding young talent to the top 6. Not against Howard, but with those 2 left wingers, Pens still need younger centers in the system.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Kingerski is almost definitely full of crap, but Howard is the exact kind of move Dubas made with McGroarty and he's the exact kind of player Dubas has been adamant about wanting. My concern is how they would get him, I know they have a bunch of 2nds they can offer but someone else could offer a 1st. Philly really sticks out as a team that could offer a 1st.

I think the best the Penguins could realistically offer is Pickering and a 2026 2nd for Howard. Tampa is extremely thin on LD in the system, Pickering could push to be their 3rd pair LD next year and make their 3rd pair Pickering-Raddysh. Dubas seems not all that high on Pickering, so I can see him swapping him for a prospect he likes more and then focusing on building up the LD in the organization with guys he likes.

They could also view Pickering as their heir for McDonagh, who's pretty old already and is a UFA after next year.

 

[eXile3]

Kingerski is almost definitely full of crap, but Howard is the exact kind of move Dubas made with McGroarty and he's the exact kind of player Dubas has been adamant about wanting. My concern is how they would get him, I know they have a bunch of 2nds they can offer but someone else could offer a 1st. Philly really sticks out as a team that could offer a 1st.

I think the best the Penguins could realistically offer is Pickering and a 2026 2nd for Howard. Tampa is extremely thin on LD in the system, Pickering could push to be their 3rd pair LD next year and make their 3rd pair Pickering-Raddysh. Dubas seems not all that high on Pickering, so I can see him swapping him for a prospect he likes more and then focusing on building up the LD in the organization with guys he likes.

They could also view Pickering as their heir for McDonagh, who's pretty old already and is a UFA after next year.

I’m not familiar with him. Is he unreliable?