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Salary Cap: 24-25 Salary Thread Crosbicles Volume MXVI: End of season wrap up

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There is a distinct possibility the Pens are better next year with Sullivan gone, more size and younger legs and the development that comes with that. Karlsson will bring back nice assets and I have been on the Rust deal as his value will never be higher. I like Detroit for the first and then the Pens add nice pieces to the existing talent in the system. But the chances of the Rangers going south next year give the Pens a chance for a really top player is icing on the cake. Plus Sid will be ending his career here and then adding the final piece of a top center in the draft or FA allows the Pens to get back into the mix earlier.
 
TimmyD said:
I’m not saying it will happen or that Sid would even ask (because I don’t believe he will). But you are absolutely insane if you don’t think Nate MacKinnon, coming off the heels of another early elimination isn’t going to be in Sid’s ear about playing together and chasing a cup. He would be crazy not to try and get his best friend, who is still one of the best players in the world to come play with him on a contender when he sees the situation the Penguins are in.
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And maybe after the World Championships, Nathan will understand that Sidney is probably in better hands under Dubas than he is under the Sakic/MacFarland regime.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
I know these moves aren't consistent with their logic, but I hope they trade Rakell for a 1st+ at the draft and then throw Marner a mega deal to play with Crosby.

Get a young 2C with McGroarty-Crosby-Marner and Koivunen-XXXX-Rust and I think that top-6 can be playoff caliber pretty damn quickly.
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Why not trade Rust for a LD to play with Karlsson instead?

Why Rakell? He is the more prolific scorer. Do we believe the wheels will come off him more quickly than Rust? Do we believe Rakell has more value across the NHL?

Rust is the obvious player to move out if Marner decides to join Dubas. They play the same position, Rakell is way more prolific on the left side, and Rust's reputation around the league is way higher. Just ask the ex-coach.

NYR alone would offer us max prices to get their hands on the coach's pet. What do you think Guerin and Fitzgerald would offer for Rust?

He is the obvious trade chip, imo.
 
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Jag68Sid87 said:
Why not trade Rust for a LD to play with Karlsson instead?

Why Rakell? He is the more prolific scorer. Do we believe the wheels will come off him more quickly than Rust? Do we believe Rakell has more value across the NHL?

Rust is the obvious player to move out if Marner decides to join Dubas. They play the same position, Rakell is way more prolific on the left side, and Rust's reputation around the league is way higher. Just ask the ex-coach.

NYR alone would offer us max prices to get their hands on the coach's pet. What do you think Guerin and Fitzgerald would offer for Rust?

He is the obvious trade chip, imo.
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Because this team is still rebuilding/retooling and adding Marner is more focused on getting better in 3-4 years, not this year.

Selling Rakell for futures and getting Marner for free is terrific from an asset management point of view.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
Because this team is still rebuilding/retooling and adding Marner is more focused on getting better in 3-4 years, not this year.

Selling Rakell for futures and getting Marner for free is terrific from an asset management point of view.
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Fine. I don't agree but trade Rust for futures instead of Rakell, then. Which was my main point, regardless of your mid-term vision of this team.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
I know these moves aren't consistent with their logic, but I hope they trade Rakell for a 1st+ at the draft and then throw Marner a mega deal to play with Crosby.

Get a young 2C with McGroarty-Crosby-Marner and Koivunen-XXXX-Rust and I think that top-6 can be playoff caliber pretty damn quickly.
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I have 0 problems paying big for talent like Marner. I would rather fill cap space up with a player like him then not.

I definitely would like us to to get a legit top 4 D though. That is a major hole we have.
 
Jag68Sid87 said:
Fine. I don't agree but trade Rust for futures instead of Rakell, then. Which was my main point, regardless of your mid-term vision of this team.
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Okay then trade both of them and Karlsson too :laugh:

I think this team needs to be building to try to compete again in like 3-4 years. Marner at 28 now and like 31/32 then fits that, while Rust, Rakell and Karlsson are all too old to be a part of that.
 
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Empoleon8771 said:
Okay then trade both of them and Karlsson too :laugh:

I think this team needs to be building to try to compete again in like 3-4 years. Marner at 28 now and like 31/32 then fits that, while Rust, Rakell and Karlsson are all too old to be a part of that.
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Sure. In the meantime, Marner wants to come here to compete while Crosby, Malkin and Letang are still here. Thus, keeping Karlsson and Rakell makes sense. Trading one (my preference is Rust) for the biggest organizational need (aside from maybe goaltender) in left defense also makes sense.

Look, if Dubas decides to blow the whole thing up now, I will not agree with the move but I will support it. I don't think there is anything he can do now that will piss me off. Maybe hiring Quinn would be that move, but even that may just be a means to an end (tanking).

Organizationally, Dubas can now do whatever he wants. There are no more restrictions. The training wheels are off.
 
The last 2 years were a perfect lesson of the importance of team defending vs the Power Play.

2023-24: GF/G 18th, GA/G 13th, +4 GD, PP 30th... 88 points
2024-25: GF/G 18th, GA/G 30th, -50 GD, PP 6th... 80 points

They were lucky to reach even 80, with this defending. Some late game heroics got them more points.

It turns out Reirden was actually a better coach than Quinn, because he's better at what actually matters.
But because the PP is sexier than defending, fans gave Reirden 10x more heat than Quinn.
 
If you're signing Marner, wouldn't it be better you are showing to be adding depth than switch one out for another? Why would he come here in that scenario?

To what? Sit around for 4 years watching a retool gone wrong trading deck chairs in and out?


To do a retool it makes perfect sense adding and not subtracting talent. Then the next year you do the same. Rinse and repeat.

They have the draft capital to do whatever they want.

But in a perfect world, Mitch Marner isn't signing in Pittsburgh. Anyways.



I could see Gavrikov wanting to get away from the LA kings inevitable wash by the Oilers.<---- Dubas give him 4-5 years at 7.0/7.5
 
Ugene Magic said:
They have the draft capital to do whatever they want.
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Not really. They've only added one 1st to the 3 they are granted by default over the next 3 years.
They could have 7 if they make the smart moves, and trade Rust, Rakell and EK (50%). They won't do that.

Yeah, the six 2nds and eight 3rds help, but you're gonna have to give up a fair bit of that to bring in enough quality to make a difference. And there isn't gonna be much left to have good odds of hitting on picks in those rounds, which are low %.

This direction is just stupid. They need to really commit to the tank. Stop fence sitting.
 
The Penguins have nowhere even close to enough draft capital to "do whatever they want". Their prospect pool is still in the bottom half of the league and they have no future top-6 centers. The point of adding Marner is to have a veteran core piece when they're ready to turn the corner in 3-4 years, not to try to win now. Hence why you'd sign Marner now and trade other guys for futures.

When the Jackets signed Gaudreau back in the 2022 off-season, they still sold in the 2022-2023 season. The point of signing Marner would be the same as the Jackets signing Gaudreau, you're still rebuilding/retooling and adding young talent but you're getting a star player for free that should really help those young guys.
 
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JackFr said:
I fully think they don't want to trade Rust. He'll probably wear an A in 26-27. Don't think Dubas wants to completely burn it down and if they think Rust is a good influence in the room won't surprise me if they keep him.
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maybe keep him for a deadline deal.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
I know these moves aren't consistent with their logic, but I hope they trade Rakell for a 1st+ at the draft and then throw Marner a mega deal to play with Crosby.

Get a young 2C with McGroarty-Crosby-Marner and Koivunen-XXXX-Rust and I think that top-6 can be playoff caliber pretty damn quickly.
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I agree. Marner is 4 years younger than Rakell so I think it fits into their overall objective which is to rebuild as quickly as possible. Acquiring Marner via cap is a significant asset they can get for “free”. Structure the NTC in a favorable way in the later years so Mitch can bail when Crosby retires. Between Marner’s relationship with Dubas and Crosby, I really do think they have a realistic chance of signing him.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
I know these moves aren't consistent with their logic, but I hope they trade Rakell for a 1st+ at the draft and then throw Marner a mega deal to play with Crosby.

Get a young 2C with McGroarty-Crosby-Marner and Koivunen-XXXX-Rust and I think that top-6 can be playoff caliber pretty damn quickly.
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Bennett?
Trade Acciari, Heinen, Rakell

McGroarty Crosby Marner
Malkin Bennett Rust
Hallander Novak Koivunen
Dewar Lizotte Tomasino
Hayes
 
I wish they would trade Rust, but I just don't believe they'll do it. They're too loyal and for better or worse he is seen as a Penguins product and a key guy. I hope they dump all of Rak, Rust and EK for young dudes with top level upside and race for the bottom next season, but I can't see them trading all three, even if the plan is to bottom out.
 
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