Salary Cap: 24 25 Salary Thread Crosbicles Volume Mmxxvii Retool over Time to Go for A Cup in 2026

[Ryder71]

So we are going to pivot from pivoting? That is an awful lot of pivoting. Kyle has no plan.

Not trading Rakell for a very good return was a mistake. Let's see if at least one of EK, BR and/or RR are moved this summer. Rakell being here is helping this winning streak. Which is counter intuitive in us getting a key piece for the future.

Now, the value he extracted in the trades he did make seems very good. He should have gone further though. However, if he's catering to Sid, and it appears as though he is, he's doing a disservice for the team as a whole and their future. I wanna see what happens this summer though. I'm hoping some big changes are coming, we'll see.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Meh I still don't believe any of the rush talk, until they make any actions in that direction. Not trading Rakell could be a bad move in that direction but they could also still just trade him and Karlsson in the summer.

Dallas has built their team through draft and trades. Outside of Heiskanen they have no top 10 pick players. I am not saying that is easy to replicate but Dubas has done way better so far in terms of rebuilding a strong and functional farm system.

Again it's fair to be critical of him and the moves but he also has done a good job starting to restock the system so far. So I think he deserve a little bit of credit for that.

It doesn't matter where the next young core pieces came from, so long as you have them.
But the Pens don't have even one of those guys lined up yet.
Murashov or Brunicke may become 1 of those pieces, but who knows.

Are they really in a position to pass on three 1sts for Rakell, Rust and EK?

Even if you're opting to trade instead of draft, those seem like critical trade chips to acquire the next core.

 

[Darren McCord]

Crosby put up similar points with DOC and Rust.

The reason you trade Rakell is his value is at its peak right now. Then you cycle in a different player with Sid and continue.

Sid will be a PPG with Novak and Rust flanking him if he gets the minutes and usage he will on this team.

Said the same thing about letting Jake walk.

I think Rakell's value could go up in the summer still but could also drop. It's a gamble but you will have more suitors potential in the summer. More teams will have cap space to take him on and teams who might think they will be good may trade for him who wouldn't have at the deadline.

 

[Darren McCord]

Are they really in a position to pass on three 1sts for Rakell, Rust and EK?

They weren't getting those for Rust and EK at the deadline. Maybe in the summer but again that's a conversation for if he fails in the summer.

 

[Penguin Suited Up]

Crosby put up similar points with DOC and Rust.

The reason you trade Rakell is his value is at its peak right now. Then you cycle in a different player with Sid and continue.

Sid will be a PPG with Novak and Rust flanking him if he gets the minutes and usage he will on this team.

Said the same thing about letting Jake walk.

Sid’s more likely to perform well and put up more points with Rakell than another player in the lineup that would replace him.

 

[Ryder71]

Fair. But I wouldn’t trade Rakell for the shot at getting guys who are going to be good in 3-5 years if it reduces his chances of breaking more records and accumulating as many points as possible.

So, you're essentially choosing an individual player over a team? If that's the mindset of the brain trust here we can't expect any noticeable improvement until Sid retires. So Sid is kinda holding this team hostage. Sullivan is here as a result. If nothing changes the pattern will repeat itself until they age out.

 

[Penguin Suited Up]

So, you're essentially choosing an individual player over a team? If that's the mindset of the brain trust here we can;t expect any noticeable improvement until Sid retires. So Sid is kinda holding this team hostage. Sullivan is here as a result. If nothing changes the pattern will repeat itself until they age out.

When the player has led this team to accomplishing what it has, yes. I’m ok with that. I recognize that the majority of the board would rather call it stupid or atrocious. But there is validity in enjoying Sid and Geno finish here while pushing their cumulative stats to the top of the charts

 

[Ryder71]

When the player has led this team to accomplishing what it has, yes. I’m ok with that. I recognize that the majority of the board would rather call it stupid or atrocious. But there is validity in enjoying Sid and Geno finish here while pushing their cumulative stats to the top of the charts

Well, attendance is waning, so hopefully the powers that be will wake up and grow a back bone. It's time to turn the page. Many have lost interest. Again, no playoff wins since 2018. How much longer do we owe this core and their coach? Make no mistake, they are the primary reasons we're in this mess.

 

[Penguin Suited Up]

Well, attendance is waning, so hopefully the powers that be will wake up and grow a back bone. It's time to turn the page. Many have lost interest. Again, no playoff wins since 2018. How much longer do we owe this core and their coach? Make no mistake, they are the primary reasons we're in this mess.

When you have a player like Sid who wants to finish his career on your team, you let him. That’s not a backbone issue, it’s just a different perspective than yours.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Part of what I love about sports is the history that’s built around the different leagues and franchises that have grown the sports. And part of being fan is appreciating the successes that your team has had, both among team and individual achievements.

From that perspective, it’s been awesome to be a Pens fan over the past 40 years. We have 5 Cups and 4 of the greatest players of all time. But there have also been a lot of ‘could have, should have’ conversations around our guys in terms of injuries. So watching Sid work his way into the top 5 all time scorers to me is just as enjoyable as anything else, considering the amount of success he and Malkin have brought to this franchise. I will never get tired of watching Sid and Geno work their way up the charts, and considering it is nigh impossible to be competitive every year and make the playoffs every year over multiple decades, I don’t mind them missing the playoffs right now.

We draft players so that we have the opportunity to watch them bring success, and hope that one day they can have the opportunities to reach the heights that Sid both has already achieved and is working toward right now. So using words like stupid and atrocious and attaching such negative connotations to where the team is right now feels a bit short-sighted and narrowly focused to me. So few fan bases have the opportunity to watch a guy like Sid chase the achievements he’s after while wanting to finish where he started. I love that. There will be plenty of time to trade guys like Rakell or go Cup chasing after he’s retired.

I’m sorry if my deeply held opinion offends you? I’ll be sure to take it into consideration the next time I feel something…. Nah, just being a jag. I’m just kidding with ya.

I dunno, I feel that part of what makes Lemieux the all time GOAT Pen is how much he accomplished with no help. It’s fine that people get something out of Sid going into the record books, I don’t really. No more than I get from any other Pens doing something neat.

 

[Ryder71]

When you have a player like Sid who wants to finish his career on your team, you let him. That’s not a backbone issue, it’s just a different perspective than yours.

If you're not making trades to better your team because you wanna cater to a guy like Sid, yeah that's a real problem. This is a team sport, and as a team we haven't derived any meaningful success going on SEVEN years now. With Rakell still remaining and helping this team win four straight, it's potentially costing us a key piece for the future via the draft. Yeah, that's a bit irritating because this formula CLEARLY isn't working.

He can finish his career here, but he shouldn't be catered to. Geno largely isn't, have the same rules apply to both and accrue assets that help turn this team around in a big way.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Plus Lemieux was just such an amazing player to watch— Il

Ok but both farm teams are top in their leagues. We have 2 rookies in the top 12 of scoring for the AHL and a top rookie goalie. Sure we haven't seen them in the NHL but these players are 19 - 21.

A functional farm takes more than 1 year to develop. You have a fair point because players need to pan out but right now a year + in, the system looks much better.

The AHL is littered with guys that tore the league up and never made it in the show though. That’s why I want us to call these kids up and see what we actually have.

 

[Icarium]

Keeping Rakell or other players in a similar situation around just so Sid can pad his stats in meaningless games would definitely be stupid, no two ways about it. Not as stupid as thinking this team can actually be a Cup contender before Sid and Geno retire but stupid nevertheless.

 

[Penguin Suited Up]

I’m sorry if my deeply held opinion offends you? I’ll be sure to take it into consideration the next time I feel something…. Nah, just being a jag. I’m just kidding with ya.

I dunno, I feel that part of what makes Lemieux the all time GOAT Pen is how much he accomplished with no help. It’s fine that people get something out of Sid going into the record books, I don’t really. No more than I get from any other Pens doing something neat.

I’m not offended at all. I am tired of a lot of the negativity and what I feel is a lack of perspective on this board. . . don’t post consistently, but I do read a lot.

Nobody wins all the time, but our franchise has won A LOT. It’s ok to go through some down years. And the nice part is that our down years include watching Sid do his thing.

And agreed on Mario. He was one of a kind and always will be.

 

[Penguin Suited Up]

If you're not making trades to better your team because you wanna cater to a guy like Sid, yeah that's a real problem. This is a team sport, and as a team we haven't derived any meaningful success going on SEVEN years now. With Rakell still remaining and helping this team win four straight, it's potentially costing us a key piece for the future via the draft. Yeah, that's a bit irritating because this formula CLEARLY isn't working.

He can finish his career here, but he shouldn't be catered to. Geno largely isn't, have the same rules apply to both and accrue assets that help turn this team around in a big way.

That’s like, your opinion, man.

 

[Penguin Suited Up]

Keeping Rakell or other players in a similar situation around just so Sid can pad his stats in meaningless games would definitely be stupid, no two ways about it. Not as stupid as thinking this team can actually be a Cup contender before Sid and Geno retire but stupid nevertheless.

It’s not stupid, it’s just valuing something differently than you.

 

[Icarium]

Valuing the good of individual players more than that of the team in a team game is stupid, period. I don't mind fans doing it but GMs should never indulge in stuff like that.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I’m not offended at all. I am tired of a lot of the negativity and what I feel is a lack of perspective on this board. . . don’t post consistently, but I do read a lot.

Nobody wins all the time, but our franchise has won A LOT. It’s ok to go through some down years. And the nice part is that our down years include watching Sid do his thing.

And agreed on Mario. He was one of a kind and always will be.

Man, the most perspective we should all have is that we are talking about a game here. I’m proud of what this team has done, but at the end of the day, I want to watch an entertaining team playing a style of hockey I like. That’s all I ask for. And what we’re doing now is anything but. So I’m at least someone’s getting something about Sid getting to add accomplishments while the rest of the team sucks because lord knows I get nothing out of it.

 

[Ryder71]

That’s like, your opinion, man.

No, it's steeped in fact! They haven't won anything in seven years. And Sid, the core and Sullivan have been constants in that scenario.

 

[sovietsanta87]

Sharks were us for the first few years of what you are describing.

They hung onto players and signed dudes like Hertl.

Then Grier came in and made the moves that needed to be made.

Dubas’ “plan” is going to result in someone having to come in and clean up or Dubas just accepting reality once Malkin and Sid are gone and going scorched earth.

The sharks were way worse than us a few years ago. They went from back to back 100 point seasons to the third worst record in the league. They didn’t have a Crosby or a Malkin or Guentzel or even rust. They were outright ass with no serious impact players. If the penguins had even an ounce of goaltending this year they would be in the playoffs. That’s a large gap between two teams not making the playoffs. Teams aren’t going to completely collapse their roster unless they have zero prospects and minimal impact players.

Grier came in after the 2022 season where the sharks finish sixth in the pacific for the second straight year. Scorch earth was the only way they could go. The penguins are in a different situation

 

[Ryder71]

You’re not going to get a franchise player by trading Rakell and acquiring 30th overall picks. But Rakell’s contract is pretty good given his ability to play up and down the lineup and contribute more to areas than just what’s on the stat sheet.

There would have been more pieces than just a 1st round pick. Although that's a good starting point. If you wanna turn it around you gotta start somewhere though, right?

Keeping Rakell doesn't help this team in any way. It only stifles our ability in getting a higher draft pick.

 

[sovietsanta87]

If you're not making trades to better your team because you wanna cater to a guy like Sid, yeah that's a real problem. This is a team sport, and as a team we haven't derived any meaningful success going on SEVEN years now. With Rakell still remaining and helping this team win four straight, it's potentially costing us a key piece for the future via the draft. Yeah, that's a bit irritating because this formula CLEARLY isn't working.

He can finish his career here, but he shouldn't be catered to. Geno largely isn't, have the same rules apply to both and accrue assets that help turn this team around in a big way.

The problem starts behind the bench. Sid has been consistently good his entire career. And he’s done it at 25-30% discount from a salary perspective. I have a much bigger problem with this team feeling like they owe sullivan the world after two cup wins. This is something we’ll never know for sure but I’m willing to bet this team would have at least one playoff series win over the last seven years had they fired sully after the islanders series.

 

[Ryder71]

The problem starts behind the bench. Sid has been consistently good his entire career. And he’s done it at 25-30% discount from a salary perspective. I have a much bigger problem with this team feeling like they owe sullivan the world after two cup wins. This is something we’ll never know for sure but I’m willing to bet this team would have at least one playoff series win over the last seven years had they fired sully after the islanders series.

Very possible, but if the core wasn't so behind Sullivan he wouldn't be here. They go hand in hand.

 

[Turin]

There’s an impression that Sid is above caring about individual stuff but his games played and all-time points chase means a lot to him. He’s still annoyed by losing so much hardware and games to injury. Remember the story about how he was so livid in 2013 when he didn’t win the Hart that he said he wasn’t going to the award show ever again?

 

[HandshakeLine]

No? I think that’s the first I ever heard that.