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Salary Cap: 24-'25 Salary Thread: Crosbicles Volume MMXXVII: Retool over! Time to go for a cup in 2026!

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Big Friggin Dummy said:
I don't think you can count on finding a Draisaitl tbh. He's a 1st overall in every draft that doesn't have a bona fide generational talent like Sid, Ovechkin, or McDavid. He's a genuinely exceptional player, a franchise cornerstone type guy. They got really, really lucky with him panning out the way he did.

-edit- Just saw your edit. Yeah, we basically agree.
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Yeah I wasn't referring to Draisaitl specifically, just more that Draisaitl tier. Most drafts usually have 1 or 2 guys that end up on that level. The COVID draft years didn't, but you had Hughes (2019), Hughes (2018), Makar (2017), Matthews (2016), Eichel (2015) and McDavid (2015) in the 5 drafts before it. That also excludes guys like Heiskanen, Dahlin, Marner and Rantanen, who I'd argue are pretty damn close to that tier too.

I'd probably argue that the expectation for their high 1sts for the next 5 drafts should be:

-1 guy on the Hughes/Makar/Matthews level
-1 guy on the Heiskanen/Marner/Dahlin level
-1 or 2 guys on the Ehlers/Hanifin/RNH level
-1 or 2 depth guys (think like Rasmussen or Kotkaniemi) or busts

That's worse than what the early 2000s Penguins did when they got Whitney, Fleury, Malkin, Crosby and Staal of course, but I still think it's a reasonable expectation.
 
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DesertPenguin said:
Alright, if at least some of us are in agreement that we need a top 6 F, C preferred, and a lop line LD, who are you targeting? There's wings going to UFA (Marner, Ehlers, Boeser, in that order) but not much at C. Maybe you try to pry Zegras from ANA? Or maybe you cross your fingers that we get to about 4th in the draft lottery, it falls for us and we get one there.

On D, go fish. Nothing in UFA unless you think Chychrun or Proverov are it, and I'm not sure I do. Byram is probably available from BUF but we don't have the assets that would interest BUF. Need to target a deep defensive team with a young kid blocked from rising, and either get the blocked player or the one who's blocking him.
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I'm targeting a top 3 pick and hoping to win the lottery next year for McKenna. Chasing FAs that'll cost an obscene amount and likely be at the tail end of their prime by the time this team's ready to be relevant again is just a vain attempt to pull this team out of its nosedive and a fool's errand imo. If you're trading (not you, just in general), you need guys who are like 23-24 and genuinely damn good. Zegras is ass, he just scored a Michigan one time. :laugh:

I really don't think this team should be adding. They need to build up a few elite prospects via the draft, then hope the guys they have in the system now (McG, Koivunen, Broz, Brunicke) turn into impact players in supporting cast roles. Then they can go about throwing a Brinks truck at a top player in FA and trying to trade for guys to push them into the category of deep playoff runs.
 
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It's Pagnotta so it's probably bullshit but Marner's apparent ask of the Leafs is $13M AAV x 8yrs. So I imagine he's gonna want $13-14M AAV x 7yrs in FA.

I really like the player, but man, he's a finishing touch kinda guy, not a foundational piece imo. I know the cap's going up like $26M in the next three years but, yeesh.
 
Big Friggin Dummy said:
It's Pagnotta so it's probably bullshit but Marner's apparent ask of the Leafs is $13M AAV x 8yrs. So I imagine he's gonna want $13-14M AAV x 7yrs in FA.

I really like the player, but man, he's a finishing touch kinda guy, not a foundational piece imo. I know the cap's going up like $26M in the next three years but, yeesh.
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Yes, he’d be the finishing touch on our roster. Let’s goooooo. 7x15. We can retain 50% in 3 years and get a haul. Ez money
 
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The more research I've done on other rebuilds and the moves they've made, the more I'm hesitant to throw Marner a huge deal. I want this team to be bad enough to that their draft picks will be high enough to get the core pieces they need, but not so bad that the young guys will not have anyone to support and it will stunt their progression. I think Marner right now might screw with their ability to get the high enough draft picks.

I'd rather throw high AAV, short term deals at someone like Marchand rather than a mega deal at Marner. I think it would be about 3-4 years premature for this team to be throwing a mega deal at Marner.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
The more research I've done on other rebuilds and the moves they've made, the more I'm hesitant to throw Marner a huge deal. I want this team to be bad enough to that their draft picks will be high enough to get the core pieces they need, but not so bad that the young guys will not have anyone to support and it will stunt their progression. I think Marner right now might screw with their ability to get the high enough draft picks.

I'd rather throw high AAV, short term deals at someone like Marchand rather than a mega deal at Marner. I think it would be about 3-4 years premature for this team to be throwing a mega deal at Marner.
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We’re winning the cup next year
 
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Big Friggin Dummy said:
It's Pagnotta so it's probably bullshit but Marner's apparent ask of the Leafs is $13M AAV x 8yrs. So I imagine he's gonna want $13-14M AAV x 7yrs in FA.

I really like the player, but man, he's a finishing touch kinda guy, not a foundational piece imo. I know the cap's going up like $26M in the next three years but, yeesh.
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Unless things go well in the playoffs, I dont see him resigning based on what Ive been told. He not happy with how local fans and media have treated him outside of hockey.

Give him 7x15mil if thats what it takes.

Geno - Sid - Marner
Rust - Raks - _____

Solid top 6 next year. When Sid retires we trade Marner wherever he wants to go, or he stays after winning a cup with Sid and mentors McKenna after we draft him with the Rangers pick. :sarcasm:
 
Zirakzigil said:
Unless things go well in the playoffs, I dont see him resigning based on what Ive been told. He not happy with how local fans and media have treated him outside of hockey.

Give him 7x15mil if thats what it takes.

Geno - Sid - Marner
Rust - Raks - _____

Solid top 6 next year. When Sid retires we trade Marner wherever he wants to go, or he stays after winning a cup with Sid and mentors McKenna after we draft him with the Rangers pick. :sarcasm:
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Hasn't he been carjacked twice, too? :laugh:
 
IcedCapp said:
Even if we delay the rebuild 2 years for the core, 7-10 years seems wayyyyy too pessimistic
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Depends when you mark the end - when we’re making the playoffs or when we’re contending. Probs more like 5-7 to be relevant in the playoffs depending on whether Dubas continues to dismantle and we pick high the next 2-3 years or take one more shot for Sid’s sake next year.
 
Making the playoffs shouldn't be the goal, or mark the end of a rebuild imo. Being relevant as far as contending goes should.

Half the goddamn league makes the playoffs. Shit, this miserable f***ing team could be a playoff team if they didn't have the most volatile dipshit goalies in the league and an egomaniac behind the bench, torpedoing things by being spitefully stubborn. But who gives a shit if you're making the 1st round just to plod around for a week before golfing. That's pointless.
 
Zirakzigil said:
Unless things go well in the playoffs, I dont see him resigning based on what Ive been told. He not happy with how local fans and media have treated him outside of hockey.

Give him 7x15mil if thats what it takes.

Geno - Sid - Marner
Rust - Raks - _____

Solid top 6 next year. When Sid retires we trade Marner wherever he wants to go, or he stays after winning a cup with Sid and mentors McKenna after we draft him with the Rangers pick. :sarcasm:
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Unconventional idea: offer Marner 14x3 or 4. Gavrikov style. He gets another chance to get paid even more with the rising cap and to choose his team when Sid retires. We don't get saddled with big money on the books for 7 seasons.
 
DesertPenguin said:
Unconventional idea: offer Marner 14x3 or 4. Gavrikov style. He gets another chance to get paid and to choose his team when Sid retires. We don't get saddled with big money on the books for 7 seasons.
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Not sure he takes a short term contract. Risk in that if he gets injured. Would be nice for the Pens though.
 
DesertPenguin said:
Only with how high and fast the cap is rising does this make sense for him. But in these circumstances it might.
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Its what Matthews has done the last 2 contracts. Some players like the sure thing of 8 years, no wrong answer. Offer him the big contract to get his interest and if he says no less years well then we have already won.
 
Marner has zero incentive to take a short term deal on a bottom 5 team that's circling the drain though. He can get injured and cost himself his colossal deal. He could see his play/production drop precipitously on this team and in Sullivan's system, costing himself a ton of money. He's not gonna be on a team that's doing anything but hovering around a WC spot. Assuming Sid stays healthy and remains effective.

Sure, the Pens could throw $14M at him for 3yrs, but why does he sign here instead of, like, San Jose or Chicago where he can play alongside franchise guys who will grow and improve, but still earn the same salary? Or like, taking $12M AAV from a contender after a decade of wallowing in failure in Toronto?

Does Dubas give him the same assurance he gave Sid that he's gonna build a competitive team? Then surround Marner with guys like Nieto, Acciari, Glass, Hayes, Shea, POJ, Dewar, and other complete trash? :laugh:

I dunno man. Marner's a fantastic player but not a fix for this situation. He's a Kessel-esque addition to a team ready to challenge for a Cup, not a marquee guy imo. I honestly don't think this team can cut corners to try and escape the inevitable misery years, nor should they.
 
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