Loaning him out doesn’t help my “argument”? My argument was that he never played in the Premiership, and he literally did not. That was my argument as I’ve already pointed out. Then you came along, tried to turn it into something else. And no, he did not fail in the Premiership because he literally did not play in the league. Also, yes, you too haven’t failed in the Premiership because you haven’t played there. Arguing that someone wasn’t deemed good enough is fair context, but it doesn’t change the fact that one didn’t fail.
What Premier League matches was he on the bench for? Go ahead and post them all with dates. Of course they’re irrelevant as he didn’t play, but go ahead and post them. As for his time when he was actually at Brighton, he played at U23 level a good amount of matches.
As for the counter, yes, he was loaned out to lower tier sides and didn’t set the world on fire. Hence my reply to SEPH, before this post I’m now quoting, stating as much. However, 8 cup matches spread out over 2 seasons aren’t what I would call “real chances”. I also noted that one might argue they poorly managed the player. I don’t see all those loans and playing for four different teams (five actually) over the course of two and a half seasons great player management. Of course I wouldn’t put that all on Brighton as often times the player and/or their representatives can get involved, but still the kid (and he was a kid) was being bounced around all over the place. I also noted that Brighton didn’t see what they had. I can’t qualify that apart from his record with the U23s or his record before joining Brighton including being joint top scorer at the 2017 European U19 Championship, but if you ask Brighton I’m guessing they’ll tell you he’s now better than they thought he’d be. In fact, I’m sure they’d had told you the same two years ago.
Yeah, and without adding context, that’s already been discussed and has nothing to do with this.
1. He didn’t fail in the Premiership as he didn’t play. Even if one wanted to say he did fail, then you can add young De Bruyne and young Salah to that list. As for 2, again, not relevant as no one has said that and it’s not part of this discussion.
Your argument was very specifically that he did not fail in the Premier League (also, if you're going to be so pedantic, at least get the name right; it hasn't been the Premiership since 2007). I posit if you are on the roster of a Premier League team and you fail to earn a league appearance, you have failed in the Premier League. To argue otherwise is just silly! Put it in other contexts. Imagine Team A signs a player for 100M and that player never plays for Team A because he wasn't good enough. By your logic, you cannot say that 100M player failed at Team A. That's nonsense.
I'm not sure why you're incapable of googling this information yourself, but he was on the bench for Brighton's 2-1 defeat away at Cardiff on Nov. 10, 2018, Brighton's 1-0 victory at home against Everton on Dec. 29, 2018, and Brighton's 2-1 loss away to Man United on Jan. 19, 2019. As mentioned previously, in each case, both Florin Andone and Glenn Murray either started or were subbed in over Gyokeres.
8 cup matches over two seasons is a lot for a team like Brighton and it was also over a season and a half. In fact, Brighton only played 10 cup matches during that time, so it's not like they had an opportunity to play him in more cup matches during that time. As for the loans, I'm not really sure how you found 5 teams, unless you're counting Brighton's senior team as different than its U23 team. Brighton bought him in Jan 2018. He stayed at Brighton for the remainder of that season and all of 2018-19, where he got into 5 (of 7) cup matches and sat on the bench for three PL matches. They then loaned him to St. Pauli for 2019-20, where he had regular playtime. After that, at the start of 2020-21, he started in all of their cup matches but could not earn PL playing time, so they loaned him out to Swansea. At Swansea, he performed so poorly that he was stapled to the bench, so they recalled him and instead loaned him out to Coventry, where he scored three goals in 19 matches. Four teams: Brighton, St. Pauli, Swansea, Coventry. I refuse to believe you actually think its bad player management to recall a player who has earned a full time bench role at his loaned team in order for him to get minutes at a different team that's a couple hours drive away.
1. Sure, you could say Salah and De Bruyne failed in the PL when they were young! To play semantics like you, though, I'm not sure how they're relevant because they both played in the PL, so surely, using your logic, you would agree they failed as well. That said, as you mention in 2, the conversation about whether Gyokeres will be successful is irrelevant, so I don't know what you were trying to solve by referencing Salah or KdB.
Actually that's not true - I know exactly what your point is, whether you'll say it or not. The underlying current of this conversation is trying to answer the unwritten question of if Gyokeres will be successful at a top side. Hence, you brought up Salah and KdB as examples of players who were later successful in the PL after not achieving success at Chelsea when they were younger. Of course, there are I'm sure hundreds of examples of players who were unsuccessful at a young age on a Premier League team and didn't turn out to be Salah or KdB. However, even accepting the comparison, I think it's relevant to note that both were at a Chelsea team contending for titles rather than a lower-in-the-table Brighton side, so presumably it would have been harder for either to establish himself as a first-team mainstay and both, when loaned and ultimately sold, were sold to teams in a different top 5 league. Other than his 8 cup matches you scoff at, Gyokeres hasn't played a game for a team in a top 5 league.
Anyway, this is all a lot more words than I intended to type about Gyokeres, so I'll let you have the last word I know you desperately crave. Take it away - let's see which hair you'll split this time to weasel out of the meaning of your words.
