Speculation: 2025 Off-season Thread

[SAJ]

The most troubling thing for me as an Avs fan is that I probably have to endure more failures in the playoffs for another 5 years or so before a rebuild begins, then another however many years it’s gonna take to finish a rebuild and have a winning team again, and I’m not that young. There is a chance I never see another cup win for the Avs, but at least I’ve seen 3 in my lifetime

Yes, this.
The wait between 2000-2001 and 21-22 was long. But with a bit of luck maybe it's still possible a couple of years...

 

[Balthazar]

It can't be Nelson. It's not just that he sucked (he did, big time), it's that he didn't even compete. That's not a Bednar issue. Nor is it because of systems, linemates, culture shock, etc. He's soft.

I don't know what options there are but I'll take one who isn't a punk.

It's basically Nelson (if he agrees to stay) or Coyle. That's your 2C options.

 

[the_fan]

I really don’t think we would have gone all the way and won the cup if we beat Dallas. On paper it seemed like we had the team to do it, but there was just something off with the team. Nelson , Necas aren’t really playoff performers. We may have able to beat the Jets, but I think we would lose to Oilers or Vegas.

 

[LOFIN]

I really don’t think we would have gone all the way and won the cup if we beat Dallas. On paper it seemed like we had the team to do it, but there was just something off with the team. Nelson , Necas aren’t really playoff performers. We may have able to beat the Jets, but I think we would lose to Oilers or Vegas.

Meh, I don't buy that. Dallas has just been a very poor matchup for us. More games = more time to get those guys going. And maybe eventually Bednar to try out some new things, who knows.

 

[the_fan]

Meh, I don't buy that. Dallas has just been a very poor matchup for us. More games = more time to get those guys going. And maybe eventually Bednar to try out some new things, who knows.

The thing is, I don’t even think Dallas is all that good. Mikko has single handedly carried them from game 3 in the 1st round to 1st game vs the Jets. When he cools off, I don’t think Dallas is gonna go far. Maybe Mikko doesn’t cool off and stays hot all the way to cup win for them but I have my doubts about that

 

[expatriatedtexan]

The crazy thing is that if we re-sign Nelson, the experts will probably all have Colorado as a top 3 Stanley Cup choice going into next season.

Full season of Landy, Blackwood, strong 1-4 C down the middle, etc.

I’m ready to be fooled again.

Man RIAL... I feel there are a bunch of bucketes out there that folks fall into. For me to get onboard with this, I'd kinda like to know what other centers you have in the Brock Nelson category?

I'd rather get worse and make it necessary to upgrade, than to sign a dude who doesn't really bring what we want, but is better than anyone else in the system. That's settling...not improving.

If this season has taught me anything it's that if you are not improving you f***ing suck. 10 years of the same same ole same ole. I think I'd rather start the season:

Drouin-MacKinnon-Nichushkin
Landeskog/Lehkonen-Coyle-Necas
Lehkonen/Landeskog-Drury-O'Connor
Prischepov-Steinburg-Kelly

Girard-Makar
Toews-Malinski
Middelton/PTO-Manson

Seems like a weak lineup... it's about as cheap as we can go to begin the season and then just see what shakes loose and what we can do as we move along. The Avs are in the late stages of their life-cycle. They are going to be starting out weak and looking to upgrade as the season goes along. They are just simply relying on their stars to carry the load once the playoffs begin. Not a bad strategy, if you weren't also counting on them to carry your entire team into a playoff spot because the coach won't work with 3/4 of his lineup. If Nelson was offered any sort of movement protection at all, he could really screw the team over.

 

[the_fan]

The crazy thing is that if we re-sign Nelson, the experts will probably all have Colorado as a top 3 Stanley Cup choice going into next season.

Full season of Landy, Blackwood, strong 1-4 C down the middle, etc.

I’m ready to be fooled again.

It will be fine, until we play Dallas again in the playoffs.

Same coaching staff and same roster, we definitely not beating Dallas in the playoffs again. Probably not just Dallas either. Oilers and Vegas will beat us too.

 

[niwotsblessing]

JFC! Bednar is still the fvcking coach?! Oy!

 

[expatriatedtexan]

IMO I think the Avs shake out like this next season (lines because Bednar is a moron):

Lehkonen (4.5M) - MacKinnon (12.6M) - Necas (6.5M)
Landeskog (7M) - Nelson (6.25M) - Nichushkin (6.125M)
Drouin (2.25M) - Coyle (5.25M) - Colton (4M)
Kelly (825K) - Drury (1.725M) - O'Connor (2.5M)

Toews (7.25M) - Makar (9M)
Girard (5M) - Manson (4.5M)
Middleton (775K) - Malinski (1.25M)

Blackwood (5.25M)
Wedgewood (1.5M)

Scratches: EJ (775K), Wagner (775K)

Cap Space: 25K lol

Miles Wood I'm convinced is going to be punted to some rebuilding team looking for NHL players this offseason. I don't think, with a greatly rising cap, that it'll be difficult to move on from him, either.

Nelson gets 6.25M for the term provided, Malinski gets "bridged".

The Avs will need to trade for a 3LD at the TDL which I don't believe will be difficult given the abundance of those types come deadline.

Essentially, the Avs are running it back with the same roster. I'll bet Drouin takes a cheap contract again because I can't see any teams offering him big money/term after the season he just had.

The only change I would make would be to not extend Drouin.

If he's not in your plans to be on MacKinnon's wing... he should not be on the roster.

I get it... folks will disagree. But ask yourself.... when was he effective... and not on MacKinnon's wing?

 

[dahrougem2]

The only change I would make would be to not extend Drouin.

If he's not in your plans to be on MacKinnon's wing... he should not be on the roster.

I get it... folks will disagree. But ask yourself.... when was he effective... and not on MacKinnon's wing?

My answer is twofold:

1) Last season he proved he could be effective away from MacKinnon and it's actually where he learned to be a very fast, responsible defensive forward who Bednar trusted a lot at 5v5.

2) If - and only if - Drouin comes extremely cheap I would like to bring him back. If he's asking for 3+M then you definitely let him walk. The purpose is to find cheap, capable depth scoring.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

My answer is twofold:

1) Last season he proved he could be effective away from MacKinnon and it's actually where he learned to be a very fast, responsible defensive forward who Bednar trusted a lot at 5v5.

2) If - and only if - Drouin comes extremely cheap I would like to bring him back. If he's asking for 3+M then you definitely let him walk. The purpose is to find cheap, capable depth scoring.

I just have a different recollection.

But the thing I've learned is that my recollection is often very different from reality and I respect your opinion a lot. I just never felt like Drouin looked anything close to comfortable in a bottom six role.

I need to go back and re-watch some games with new eyeballs.

 

[EdAVSfan]

Man RIAL... I feel there are a bunch of bucketes out there that folks fall into. For me to get onboard with this, I'd kinda like to know what other centers you have in the Brock Nelson category?

I'd rather get worse and make it necessary to upgrade, than to sign a dude who doesn't really bring what we want, but is better than anyone else in the system. That's settling...not improving.

If this season has taught me anything it's that if you are not improving you f***ing suck. 10 years of the same same ole same ole. I think I'd rather start the season:

Drouin-MacKinnon-Nichushkin
Landeskog/Lehkonen-Coyle-Necas
Lehkonen/Landeskog-Drury-O'Connor
Prischepov-Steinburg-Kelly

Girard-Makar
Toews-Malinski
Middelton/PTO-Manson

Seems like a weak lineup... it's about as cheap as we can go to begin the season and then just see what shakes loose and what we can do as we move along. The Avs are in the late stages of their life-cycle. They are going to be starting out weak and looking to upgrade as the season goes along. They are just simply relying on their stars to carry the load once the playoffs begin. Not a bad strategy, if you weren't also counting on them to carry your entire team into a playoff spot because the coach won't work with 3/4 of his lineup. If Nelson was offered any sort of movement protection at all, he could really screw the team over.

I don’t see it.

I have no idea where another 2C is coming from with the assets we have left. Unless we’re trading a winger for one… which I don’t think is happening since there probably isn’t a team out there that has excess centers and wants wingers in return.

The AVS had a very good team with Mack-Nelson- Coyle and Drury as the Cs. The roster is good enough to win.

But they need their coach to get his head out of his ass and develop a little bit of alternative strategy and monitor ice time. And the players need to get out of their own heads. Stop worrying about Dallas and DeBoer.

I remember the year before we won the cup, all I read about was how we needed to change our whole roster to be able to beat Vegas. Vegas didn’t even make it to the playoffs in 2022.

With Nelson, they have a good enough team to win.
And as a collective fanbase, we need to simply accept that we will never go into the post season with the best roster in the league. We’ll be among the better ones with that center lineup and current players signed.

We also have to remember that we had significant strains this season. Our goaltending was absolutely horrid and Mitts forgot how to play hockey. It put us into a huge hole early that forced the team to go balls out just to get back into a healthy spot in the standings.
Keeping Nelson gives us a great chance to be strong off the start especially with the goaltending solidified now. Less tension in the season.


Even if they decide to not sign Nelson, what player is out there that’s available and that we can actually acquire? Then, why would we expect that player to fit seamlessly into this lineup? Why would this new center not have the same Bednar challenges as the others?
I think it’s foolish for us to believe that there’s this perfect 2C just waiting for us to pluck him.

Honestly, for anyone who doesn’t want Nelson re-signed, can you please name me the actual centers that realistically would be available and have a sure fire case of being better? I’m genuinely curious.

 

[the_fan]

Honestly, for anyone who doesn’t want Nelson re-signed, can you please name me the actual centers that realistically would be available and have a sure fire case of being better? I’m genuinely curious.

If Bennett or Tavares become available, make them an offer, if not then trade…

Necas + Girard for EP + 2nd

 

[EdAVSfan]

If Bennett or Tavares become available, make them an offer, if not then trade…

Necas + Girard for EP + 2nd

The AVS were a good team with Nelson for the ending of the regular season.

What you’re suggesting here (which I don’t think Vancouver would accept) is an incredibly massive risk. You take on a player who’s been significantly struggling AND we save no cap room and lose a dman.
This brings us right back to the path of being top heavy with no space for depth. And with zero guarantees that the 2C spot is fixed.

 

[Balthazar]

If Bennett or Tavares become available, make them an offer, if not then trade…

Necas + Girard for EP + 2nd

f*** EP

Trade Necas anywhere for futures then flip them to NYI for Horvat. Add everything we have left on top to get it done if need be. Isles have to start rebuilding and Horvat has no business staying there.

Keep Drouin for cheap to replace Necas.

Lehky - Mack - Drouin
Landy - Horvat - Nuke

That's a cup contender top 6.

Bonus: Horvat only makes 8.5M for the next several years, Necas will make more than that on his next contract.

 

[the_fan]

The AVS were a good team with Nelson for the ending of the regular season.

What you’re suggesting here (which I don’t think Vancouver would accept) is an incredibly massive risk. You take on a player who’s been significantly struggling AND we save no cap room and lose a dman.
This brings us right back to the path of being top heavy with no space for depth. And with zero guarantees that the 2C spot is fixed.

This was the only down year for EP with all the mess happening in Vancouver, other than this year he’s been fine. There were proposals of trading Mikko for EP which I was against because I’m not a huge EP fan, but I’d take EP over Nelson and Necas.

We trade Necas and Girard for EP, that’s 11.5 mill out, 11.6 in, so we’re even there.

Make some kind of a package move sending Colton and Wood for cheap bottom 6 winger making 2 or 3 mill but someone who’s better than Wood. We save 3 or 4 mill there.

Re-sign Lindgren to a 4 mill contract
Sign a cheap 3rd pair free agent LD

Re-sign Drouin, offer him 3 mill max, if he doesn’t take it let him walk.

Then at the trade deadline make a deal for a top 6 winger

 

[Balthazar]

This was the only down year for EP with all the mess happening in Vancouver, other than this year he’s been fine.

Don't let hockey db fool you, he's been bad for 2 full seasons including after the Miller trade.

All the red flags are there.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

I don’t see it.

I have no idea where another 2C is coming from with the assets we have left. Unless we’re trading a winger for one… which I don’t think is happening since there probably isn’t a team out there that has excess centers and wants wingers in return.

The AVS had a very good team with Mack-Nelson- Coyle and Drury as the Cs. The roster is good enough to win.

But they need their coach to get his head out of his ass and develop a little bit of alternative strategy and monitor ice time. And the players need to get out of their own heads. Stop worrying about Dallas and DeBoer.

I remember the year before we won the cup, all I read about was how we needed to change our whole roster to be able to beat Vegas. Vegas didn’t even make it to the playoffs in 2022.

With Nelson, they have a good enough team to win.
And as a collective fanbase, we need to simply accept that we will never go into the post season with the best roster in the league. We’ll be among the better ones with that center lineup and current players signed.

We also have to remember that we had significant strains this season. Our goaltending was absolutely horrid and Mitts forgot how to play hockey. It put us into a huge hole early that forced the team to go balls out just to get back into a healthy spot in the standings.
Keeping Nelson gives us a great chance to be strong off the start especially with the goaltending solidified now. Less tension in the season.


Even if they decide to not sign Nelson, what player is out there that’s available and that we can actually acquire? Then, why would we expect that player to fit seamlessly into this lineup? Why would this new center not have the same Bednar challenges as the others?
I think it’s foolish for us to believe that there’s this perfect 2C just waiting for us to pluck him.

Honestly, for anyone who doesn’t want Nelson re-signed, can you please name me the actual centers that realistically would be available and have a sure fire case of being better? I’m genuinely curious.

Oh I completely agree.

You don't have to convince me. It's Jared f***ing Bednar you need to convince to use more than 5 skaters.

 

[the_fan]

Don't let hockey db fool you, he's been bad for 2 full seasons including after the Miller trade.

All the red flags are there.

Last year 34 goals 89 points in 82 games. I mean if that’s a bad season, I’d take it

 

[Balthazar]

Last year 34 goals 89 points in 82 games. I mean if that’s a bad season, I’d take it

That's exactly what I meant by letting hockey db fool you.

 

[the_fan]

That's exactly what I meant by letting hockey db fool you.

How can a 89 point season be bad? I don’t get it

 

[expatriatedtexan]

The AVS were a good team with Nelson for the ending of the regular season.

What you’re suggesting here (which I don’t think Vancouver would accept) is an incredibly massive risk. You take on a player who’s been significantly struggling AND we save no cap room and lose a dman.
This brings us right back to the path of being top heavy with no space for depth. And with zero guarantees that the 2C spot is fixed.

This is where I become extremely frustrated with Bednar.

By all accounts Mitts is a second line center. Not a great one and probably not the one we needed. But Bednar did jack all to help him.

Nelson by all accounts is your definition of second line center. He looked completely out of place.

Something about this team smells like shit. I think it's becoming obvious that Bednar's gameplan is a major issue.

 

[Balthazar]

How can a 89 point season be bad? I don’t get it

His play started deteriorating at the beginning of 2023-24 and got progressively worse. Something is very wrong with him.

I remember Canucks fans starting to worry about his play and his new contract 2 months into 2023-24.

 

[the_fan]

f*** EP

Trade Necas anywhere for futures then flip them to NYI for Horvat. Add everything we have left on top to get it done if need be. Isles have to start rebuilding and Horvat has no business staying there.

Keep Drouin for cheap to replace Necas.

Lehky - Mack - Drouin
Landy - Horvat - Nuke

That's a cup contender top 6.

Bonus: Horvat only makes 8.5M for the next several years, Necas will make more than that on his next contract.

I like Horvat, but he might be another player who possibly struggles in Bednar’s system. That’s more of a risk than EP

 

[Balthazar]

I like Horvat, but he might be another player who possibly struggles in Bednar’s system. That’s more of a risk than EP

Horvat is one of the least risky center out there. His age fits the core, his cap hit is fine, he's signed long term... I'd welcome him with open arms.

If Bednar can't make it work with Horvat even CMac would have to admit that the coach is the issue.