2025 Hart Trophy Thread

[the_fan]

Avs literally have two other players jn the top 10 scoring. What kind of nonsense is this?

Makar drives play from the blueline but Rantanen hasn’t driven play this season, so overall MacKinnon has been carrying the team with a help from Makar, but as an Avs fan who’s watching every game, I can confidently say that Avs wouldn’t be in a playoff spot right now without MacK, unless Rantanen would drive play and carry the team up front, which he’s capable of but not doing it this year.

 

[BKarchitect]

To me it’s a balance of the “team X would be here without this player” and “said player is truly having a remarkable season”.

I’m an Avs fan. I’d take MacK over Drai everything considered but if your asking me who is more deserving of being top 1 or 2 in the Hart convo thus far (with over half the season remaining so things can change), it’s Drai, full stop. Same convo with McDavid. Drai’s been better so far this year. That’s not sacrilege to say. It’s simply the truth.

And if we truly want to ask which of the 5 or so guys playing at insane pace whose team would be left absolutely in shambles up front without them, it’s Kaprizov. They are pacing for the 4th best record in the NHL. Kaprizov IS their offense. Boldy has been snake bitten. He has nothing close to McDavid or Rantanen and Makar or Point, Hagel, Guentzel, etc.

Thats why it’s those two for me, so far.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

The empty net crying is truly reaching new levels of embarrassing in this thread

 

[thefutures]

Drai for sure

 

[JoeSakic13]

Last year 2 of the voters didn’t submit their votes before the deadline and 9 didn’t make the right number of selections for their all-star teams.

I really don’t think we’re dealing with the type of people who consider empty net points in their voting.

 

[crowfish]

The empty net crying is truly reaching new levels of embarrassing in this thread

Embarrassing is Avs fans saying a guy on pace for 22 empty net points is the Hart favourite

You can call it crying, I call it a dose of reality.

Top 5 points per game (vs goalies )

1) McDavid 1.54
2) Draisaitl 1.46
3) Kucherov 1.45
4) MacKinnon 1.35
5) Kaprizov 1.29

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Embarrassing is Avs fans saying a guy on pace for 22 empty net points is the Hart favourite

You can call it crying, I call it a dose of reality.

Top 5 points per game (vs goalies )

1) McDavid 1.54
2) Draisaitl 1.46
3) Kucherov 1.45
4) MacKinnon 1.35
5) Kaprizov 1.29

More crying!


But I get it. I wouldn't trust McDavid or Draisaitl to hold a lead late in the game either.

 

[Finster8]

Would Winnipeg have the same record without Hellebuyck. Leading almost all categories. On a 1 scoring line team with a good supporting cast. But has stood on his head all year has to be top 5.

 

[NotAVacuumSalesman]

Drai’s winning it this year.

And the Ted Lindsay too.

 

[Video Nasty]

By definition of most valuable player, it shouldn’t be Draisaitl because if he wasn’t in the lineup, they have McDavid who would carry the team. You take MacKinnon out of the Avs lineup, even with Mikko and Makar, Avs wouldn’t be in the playoff spot right now, with all the injuries they had and still having and with the bad goaltending earlier in the season, MacK has been carrying the Avs. Mikko is not driving his own line or anything, his production is mainly based on what MacK is doing.

You take Kaprizov out of Minnesota lineup, who’s gonna carry them? They probably don’t make the playoffs either. Q. Hughes also is very valuable to Vancouver. Again, take Drai out of Oilers lineup, they’ll still be fine and make the playoffs because McDavid will carry them that’s why I don’t think Draisaitl should be a front runner or even top 3 in Hart voting

Nonsense post.

Rantanen has done just fine whenever MacKinnon has missed time. Kaprizov has sat out the past five games and Minnesota is 4-1.

Draisaitl is a top 5 player in the league and has been so for seven seasons now. Saying you can just delete him from any squad and not expecting there to be a negative impact is foolish.

 

[Regal]

I’m just keeping it simple and going by where would this teams be without this players.

Avs without MacKinnon wouldn’t be in the playoffs right now, neither would the Wild without Kaprizov, or Vancouver without Hughes

But I can confidently say that the Oilers would be without Draisaitl. McDavid would carry the Oilers to the playoffs

But you’re basing it on your own perception of what might have happened with the other players, not what has happened . Playing as they currently have, they’d be significantly lower in the standings without Drai

 

[the_fan]

But you’re basing it on your own perception of what might have happened with the other players, not what has happened . Playing as they currently have, they’d be significantly lower in the standings without Drai

Oilers would be worse without Drai no doubt, but still make the playoffs because of McDavid

 

[the_fan]

Nonsense post.

Rantanen has done just fine whenever MacKinnon has missed time. Kaprizov has sat out the past five games and Minnesota is 4-1.

Draisaitl is a top 5 player in the league and has been so for seven seasons now. Saying you can just delete him from any squad and not expecting there to be a negative impact is foolish.

I never said if Oilers didn’t have Draisaitl it wouldn’t have negative impact, it sure would, but they’d still be a playoff team because McDavid would carry them. As far as Rantanen, he has done a good job driving play and carrying the Avs couple of years ago when MacKinnon was missing time because of injuries.

This year Avs tried to put Mikko on 2nd line to help Mittelstadt and drive that line, but he hasn’t done it yet. He’s producing points at a high rate playing with MacKinnon. As far as Kaprizov, even if the Wild done well without him for few games, not sure if they would survive if they didn’t have Kaprizov for a whole season. They’re probably not a playoff team without Kirill.

Same with the Avs. Without MacKinnon they wouldn’t be in the playoffs unless Rantanen would actually drive play and carry the load. Vancouver is barely hanging on to a playoff spot right now since Hughes got injured. My top 3 for Hart would probably be MacKinnon, Kaprizov and Hughes. Then probably Drai and Hellebuyck 4 and 5 followed by Marner and Kucherov

 

[Puckstop40]

MacKinnon is a generational empty net scorer.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Mackinnon could win the Art Ross but it's reminding me a bit of Gretzky's 1993-94 season where he lead the league in points with 130, but finished with zero (0) Hart votes. He doesn't really look like himself this year and it's weird to give the Hart to a guy who's not on top of his game and yes, kind of coasting off those empty net points (in terms of the scoring race). That's not meant to be an insult to Mackinnon, he's having a monster year, it just doesn't scream Hart Trophy to me.

Those 93-94 Kings were a lot worse than this years Avalanche team too if you remove Gretzky and Mackinnon from those teams. I'm sure Nate will get more than zero Hart votes but Art Ross =/= Hart Trophy.

You cant have your cake n eat it too. Either he is having such a "monster year" that he deserves to be in mvp talks. Or he is not having a "monster year"

 

[daver]

MacKinnon is a generational empty net scorer.

That was the name of a great punk band in the early 80s.

 

[Tralfamadore]

The league should just create a new trophy for most empty net points scored. Name it the MacKinnon trophy.

 

[bobholly39]

I never had an issue with empty net points. They pretty much guarantee a win.

As for hart favorites, I'm not really sure who would win right now. But I expect some of the leaders to distance themselves by year end.

The 4 most obvious contenders are McDacvid, Kucherov, MacKinnon & Draisaitl by virtue of being the 4 best players who also happen to be contenders at the halfway point. But it'll depend a lot on how the 2nd half plays out.

Drai and McDavid have each other, and McDavid has voter fatigue, hurts the votes.
MacK now has voter fatigue (won last year), and also has Ranta (phenomenal season) and Makar, which hurts the votes.
Kucherov - voters don't like him as much for some reason.

It's still wide open. There are other contenders too, but I expect one of, or a few of these 4, to distance the pack in 2nd half.

 

[qc14]

Would love for this to finally be the year it goes to a non-forward so I would have Q Hughes and Hellebuyck 1 and 2. For the third spot I'd probably take Kaprizov right now, he's doing it with quite literally no help.

Re: empty net points
I certainly don't begrudge MacKinnon for them or think it would be better if he didn't score them. That being said, when so many forwards are having really, really good years it does become a fair thing for me to help separate guys out and the fact that only 40% of his points are at 5v5 does hold some weight. Also hilarious seeing Avs fans talk about Draisaitl being carried by McDavid and yet in the same breath turn around and talk about how Makar is the best defenseman in the world ...

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

I never had an issue with empty net points. They pretty much guarantee a win.

As for hart favorites, I'm not really sure who would win right now. But I expect some of the leaders to distance themselves by year end.

The 4 most obvious contenders are McDacvid, Kucherov, MacKinnon & Draisaitl by virtue of being the 4 best players who also happen to be contenders at the halfway point. But it'll depend a lot on how the 2nd half plays out.

Drai and McDavid have each other, and McDavid has voter fatigue, hurts the votes.
MacK now has voter fatigue (won last year), and also has Ranta (phenomenal season) and Makar, which hurts the votes.
Kucherov - voters don't like him as much for some reason.

It's still wide open. There are other contenders too, but I expect one of, or a few of these 4, to distance the pack in 2nd half.

Why mcdavid over marner? Mcdavid doesnt n shouldnt sniff the hart right now

 

[bobholly39]

Why mcdavid over marner? Mcdavid doesnt n shouldnt sniff the hart right now

Did you read the second sentence of my post? Not really sure who wins now, but I expect those 4 players I listed (some of them, if not all 4) to distance the pack in the 2nd half, and so I expect one to win.

McDavid over Marner because I expect him to have a very strong 2nd half.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Did you read the second sentence of my post? Not really sure who wins now, but I expect those 4 players I listed (some of them, if not all 4) to distance the pack in the 2nd half, and so I expect one to win.

McDavid over Marner because I expect him to have a very strong 2nd half.

It will be hard for mcdavid to pass drai. As they both get a lot of points together.

 

[2023FriendshipTour]

Should be Hellebuyck at this stage. There is too many forwards having similar years, while he's blowing ever other goalie away and putting up some godly numbers.

 

[bobholly39]

It will be hard for mcdavid to pass drai. As they both get a lot of points together.

Still 43 games to go though. Lots of hockey to play. McDavid is only 5 points back of Drai, and 11 points back of MacKinnon (1 game in hand).

I'd have both Drai and MacKinnon ahead of McDavid in the hart race if awards were handed out today. But with over half the year left, I think it's going to come down to the 2nd half.

 

[daver]

Draisaitl's goalscoring lead is a bit inflated so far. Expect others to finish closer to him by year's end.