OT: 2024 Weather Thread

[ThePhoenixx]

BC slashed their forestry budget by one third since the 1980's.

Thank you, B.C.

 

[bellagiobob]

BC slashed their forestry budget by one third since the 1980's.

Thank you, B.C.

Yup, another summer out here where we are basically an ashtray. It used to be around every five years or so that we’d have a bad wild fire/smoky summer. Now it’s every summer, with fires in every direction. It was basically snowing ashes today on the boat, finally just gave up and came inside. Next few days are gonna be fun with temps in the 40’s and all the smoke.

 

[Paralyzer]

Everyone in Edmonton is dead.

 

[Stoneman89]

BC slashed their forestry budget by one third since the 1980's.

Thank you, B.C.

Some dude in the city that was in the sun for about 3 hours too long.

 

[Stoneman89]

Yup, another summer out here where we are basically an ashtray. It used to be around every five years or so that we’d have a bad wild fire/smoky summer. Now it’s every summer, with fires in every direction. It was basically snowing ashes today on the boat, finally just gave up and came inside. Next few days are gonna be fun with temps in the 40’s and all the smoke.

Feel for you guys, that really sucks. Out at Trestle this weekend, but I heard it's way worse in the city. Not sure if our smoke is from B.C. or from up north. Either way, it looks like the summer is destined finish off with the sun being covered up by smoke the rest of the way.

 

[Barrsy]

BC slashed their forestry budget by one third since the 1980's.

Thank you, B.C.

The forestry budget is irrelevant for this discussion. Id be curious in the last 10-15 or so years the BC yearly budget for fighting forest fires.
I know our idiot government(s) have cut the fire fighting budget(s) from time to time.

 

[rboomercat90]

Not even a breath of wind out there either. That smoke isn’t going away any time soon.

 

[Senor Catface]

The forestry budget is irrelevant for this discussion. Id be curious in the last 10-15 or so years the BC yearly budget for fighting forest fires.
I know our idiot government(s) have cut the fire fighting budget(s) from time to time.

2018 $64 million
2019 $101 million
2020 $136 million
2021 $136 million
2022 $199 million
2023 $204 million
2024 $233 million

It gets a bit nebulous with the different categories of funding, but those seem to be the numbers for direct wildfire fighting.

 

[Barrsy]

2018 $64 million
2019 $101 million
2020 $136 million
2021 $136 million
2022 $199 million
2023 $204 million
2024 $233 million

It gets a bit nebulous with the different categories of funding, but those seem to be the numbers for direct wildfire fighting.

Thats no good. Despite the budget really increasing just more and more smoke. Doesn't bode well for the future.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

The forestry budget is irrelevant for this discussion. Id be curious in the last 10-15 or so years the BC yearly budget for fighting forest fires.
I know our idiot government(s) have cut the fire fighting budget(s) from time to time.

Irrelevant?

Fire prevention is not irrelevant. This thought pattern is why we are in this situation and fire fighting budgets are ballooning. Fire fighting is the reactionary side of the equation.

Forestry budgets include hiring and keeping experienced forest rangers, up-to-date equipment, education, etc. which enable them to police and enforce parks and public land (where the majority of fires and human-caused fires start), monitor and then manage forests (controlled burns, etc.), have systems in place to catch fires (or potential fires) early, money for public education, fire-investigations, etc. Less money means less of all of that.

Fires were a real problem in B.C. back in the early to mid 1900's so B.C. followed this Smokey the Bear (created in 1944) guys advice and worked on prevention. Then the eighties rolled around and there were no more really bad fires so they started to cut the budget. I mean, obviously it just wasn't needed anymore, right? It's irrelevant.

Couple that with some dry warmer weather, beetles, etc. and we find ourselves where we are today. In a very reactionary state.

 

[Barrsy]

Irrelevant?

Fire prevention is not irrelevant. This thought pattern is why we are in this situation and fire fighting budgets are ballooning. Fire fighting is the reactionary side of the equation.

Forestry budgets include hiring and keeping experienced forest rangers, up-to-date equipment, education, etc. which enable them to police and enforce parks and public land (where the majority of fires and human-caused fires start), monitor and then manage forests (controlled burns, etc.), have systems in place to catch fires (or potential fires) early, money for public education, fire-investigations, etc. Less money means less of all of that.

Fires were a real problem in B.C. back in the early to mid 1900's so B.C. followed this Smokey the Bear (created in 1944) guys advice and worked on prevention. Then the eighties rolled around and there were no more really bad fires so they started to cut the budget. I mean, obviously it just wasn't needed anymore, right? It's irrelevant.

Couple that with some dry warmer weather, beetles, etc. and we find ourselves where we are today. In a very reactionary state.

Yes, irrelevent. By far the biggest part of the equation , by far, is the fire fighting capabilities as well as the actual conditions on the ground. Its not close. The fire fighting budgets have gone up significantly, & we all know (or at least most of us) is the conditions on the ground have gotten exponentially worse.
So yeah, irrelevant. Or close enough.

 

[Drivesaitl]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the continual erosion of the Northern Boreal forest biome. Edmonton used to be in that Boreal forest and you'd hardly know. Boreal forests are supreme environmental managers providing canopy, protection from sun and elements, winds, erosion, heat etc while being great at carbon capture. When I went to school the great environmental tragedy taught was the deforestation of the globe from Amazon to Canada. Now for some reasons, maybe economic influences these don't get talked about. Instead now we have a sole focus on carbon emissions instead of a recognition of the myriad factors involved in atmospheric increase in CO2.

This article is interesting reading. The main tragedy is we're raping the Boreal forest and have been for centuries. This too of course erodes this boreal forest biomes integrity to resist the burns we are currently seeing and perhaps would not be seeing in a more healthy and intact Northern Boreal Forest biome.

Canada’s Boreal Forest: Why It’s So Important

Protecting the boreal is not only about saving trees and wildlife, says NRDC’s Jennifer Skene. It’s also about the people who’ve been living on the land for millennia and the urgent fight against climate change....

www.nrdc.org

 

[Ritchie Valens]

Yup, another summer out here where we are basically an ashtray. It used to be around every five years or so that we’d have a bad wild fire/smoky summer. Now it’s every summer, with fires in every direction. It was basically snowing ashes today on the boat, finally just gave up and came inside. Next few days are gonna be fun with temps in the 40’s and all the smoke.

Canada is starting to become an indoor country 9 out of 12 months of the year. It’s either too cold or too hot or too hot and smoky to be outside for too long.

 

[K1984]

Canada is starting to become an indoor country 9 out of 12 months of the year. It’s either too cold or too hot or too hot and smoky to be outside for too long.

The smoke is making central AC almost a requirement. In the past you could deal with the few weeks of heat by opening windows and working fans, but with the smoke opening windows isn't an option and it turns your house into a sweat box.

I finally bit the bullet and got central AC for this year so thankfully I can comfortably sit inside, but I went over to my parents who don't have it and I felt like I was going to melt. They're older so they don't seem to mind it somehow, but I got out of dodge faster than anticipated. It was simply gross.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Yes, irrelevent. By far the biggest part of the equation , by far, is the fire fighting capabilities as well as the actual conditions on the ground. Its not close. The fire fighting budgets have gone up significantly, & we all know (or at least most of us) is the conditions on the ground have gotten exponentially worse.
So yeah, irrelevant. Or close enough.

lol

Ok, then.

 

[Ritchie Valens]

The smoke is making central AC almost a requirement. In the past you could deal with the few weeks of heat by opening windows and working fans, but with the smoke opening windows isn't an option and it turns your house into a sweat box.

I finally bit the bullet and got central AC for this year so thankfully I can comfortably sit inside, but I went over to my parents who don't have it and I felt like I was going to melt. They're older so they don't seem to mind it somehow, but I got out of dodge faster than anticipated. It was simply gross.

I’ve lived in Medicine Hat for the last 10 years. We’re usually in desert heat by mid-June and I remember when we were looking at houses, 95% of them had central A/C. I asked a buddy why all the houses had it and he said “You’ll find out, but don’t buy one without it or have the money to put it in.”

Yeah, it gets stupid hot here in the SE corner. That also explains the rattle snakes.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I’ve lived in Medicine Hat for the last 10 years. We’re usually in desert heat by mid-June and I remember when we were looking at houses, 95% of them had central A/C. I asked a buddy why all the houses had it and he said “You’ll find out, but don’t buy one without it or have the money to put it in.”

Yeah, it gets stupid hot here in the SE corner. That also explains the rattle snakes.

Could never live in the Hat or Kamloops or Radium. Seem to be heat sinks always in the summer. AC not an option for me. Basically puts my arthritis to unbearable, the feeling of jackhammers on my knees and seems to inflame sciatica as well. Whenever I'm in AC I pay for it later. For us its shade, basements, and getting as much water intake as possible. I do feel I'm acclimating to this current weather.

That said we build a sun room that has super ventilation and we're sleeping in there. The wind was blowing last night and is today and its much more bearable with a slight to moderate breeze. I was chilly last night in the detached sunroom in backyard. Sleeping on an air mattress at age 63, it gets old...

 

[Drivesaitl]

The smoke is making central AC almost a requirement. In the past you could deal with the few weeks of heat by opening windows and working fans, but with the smoke opening windows isn't an option and it turns your house into a sweat box.

I finally bit the bullet and got central AC for this year so thankfully I can comfortably sit inside, but I went over to my parents who don't have it and I felt like I was going to melt. They're older so they don't seem to mind it somehow, but I got out of dodge faster than anticipated. It was simply gross.

Just a note though that the Smoke gradient numbers are so unreliable and so poorly documented. I find that basically any smoke accumulation here now they put a 10 and the concentrations are nothing like seen in recent years. We've had days where you couldn't even spot the sun. its been nothing at all like that. My wife with breathing problems isn't even experiencing trouble with the smoke, more the humidity.

The AQHI maps of where the smoke is, complete fiction as well. Any locations showing lower smoke ratings tis basically because their sensors are not working or they are not updating. We went for a roadtrip to Leduc, Calmar, Drayton Valley where smoke was supposed to be a 3 on the scale. It was same as Edmonton all over.

One thing is the smaller towns really cooled down quicker than Edmonton. Kind of the big city heat island effect. We left Leduc 7pm, was cooling down considerably and we come home and its still blistering hot in Edmonton.

 

[OfCorsiDid]

Just a note though that the Smoke gradient numbers are so unreliable and so poorly documented. I find that basically any smoke accumulation here now they put a 10 and the concentrations are nothing like seen in recent years. We've had days where you couldn't even spot the sun. its been nothing at all like that. My wife with breathing problems isn't even experiencing trouble with the smoke, more the humidity.

The AQHI maps of where the smoke is, complete fiction as well. Any locations showing lower smoke ratings tis basically because their sensors are not working or they are not updating. We went for a roadtrip to Leduc, Calmar, Drayton Valley where smoke was supposed to be a 3 on the scale. It was same as Edmonton all over.

One thing is the smaller towns really cooled down quicker than Edmonton. Kind of the big city heat island effect. We left Leduc 7pm, was cooling down considerably and we come home and its still blistering hot in Edmonton.

I mean they don't just see smoke and say oh that's a 10 lol. It's based on current observations and predictive modelling.

That being said the AQHI does leave a lot to be desired when it comes to information. I prefer to use either the US AQI website (Link) or AQICn (Link). The benefit of AQI is that it breaks up air quality into a scale of 0-300 so it's a bit more informative of just HOW bad the air is. Basically anything above 150 is considered "high risk" by the AQHI.

Also smoke can be really deceptive. Lots of smoke both near the ground and up in the atmosphere creates the apocalyptic conditions we're use to seeing with heavy smoke days but even when the sun is shining, smoke may still exist at ground level and that's what causes the sensors to read high.

If you're looking for maps for smoke prediction I'd either go with the smoke plume feature on the US AQI website or visit the ECCC Smoke maps here. The 72 hour maps at ground level are pretty accurate and are updated twice a day.

 

[Stoneman89]

Thats no good. Despite the budget really increasing just more and more smoke. Doesn't bode well for the future.

I think it's "catch-up" time for our forests lifetimes and regeneration these days. All those years "protecting them", when they should have listened to some of the native elders and do some preventative pro-active burns, and not be so bloody paranoid about disturbing some dead brush so a couple squirrels could run around on it.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I mean they don't just see smoke and say oh that's a 10 lol. It's based on current observations and predictive modelling.

That being said the AQHI does leave a lot to be desired when it comes to information. I prefer to use either the US AQI website (Link) or AQICn (Link). The benefit of AQI is that it breaks up air quality into a scale of 0-300 so it's a bit more informative of just HOW bad the air is. Basically anything above 150 is considered "high risk" by the AQHI.

Also smoke can be really deceptive. Lots of smoke both near the ground and up in the atmosphere creates the apocalyptic conditions we're use to seeing with heavy smoke days but even when the sun is shining, smoke may still exist at ground level and that's what causes the sensors to read high.

If you're looking for maps for smoke prediction I'd either go with the smoke plume feature on the US AQI website or visit the ECCC Smoke maps here. The 72 hour maps at ground level are pretty accurate and are updated twice a day.

Thanks the Alberta data is shit as is the gradient used. Its not a proper scale as 10 gets passed routinely. They've gone spinal tap in just often saying +10 now when that doesn't capture the scale of smoke concentrations more commonly seen now. Its crazy they use a scale of 10 to measure smoke particle concentrations that can get in the hundreds.

This Alberta smoke map is basically garbage.

AQHI - Map

airquality.alberta.ca

Thanks again. I hadn't known of these much better sources.

 

[bellagiobob]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1815603293604958462

https://x.com/i/web/status/1815616363685093798

https://x.com/i/web/status/1815609268646924392

Terrible news. Hopefully everyone gets out safely.

 

[nexttothemoon]

Air quality is 449 here right now... basically can chew the smoke outside.

f*** this.. my exit plan is to head somewhere else where it's A) cheaper to live... B) less shit weather (where it's not shit in winter AND shit in summer)... and C) with a lot less societal/political shit to wade through (and that's only going to get worse).

 

[harpoon]

Air quality is 449 here right now... basically can chew the smoke outside.

f*** this.. my exit plan is to head somewhere else where it's A) cheaper to live... B) less shit weather (where it's not shit in winter AND shit in summer)... and C) with a lot less societal/political shit to wade through (and that's only going to get worse).

The weather thing I can understand, but there’s ‘shit to wade through’ wherever you live. It’s planet wide.

 

[Heavy Dee]

Air quality is 449 here right now... basically can chew the smoke outside.

f*** this.. my exit plan is to head somewhere else where it's A) cheaper to live... B) less shit weather (where it's not shit in winter AND shit in summer)... and C) with a lot less societal/political shit to wade through (and that's only going to get worse)

Let me know where that is.