OT: 2024 Washington Commanders thread: change we can believe in!

[DWGie26]

That was awesome! Just playing some back yard football in the snow!

 

[g00n]

That was awesome! Just playing some back yard football in the snow!

I honestly don't know why there isn't more lateraling in the game as a regular part of play

 

[Roric]

I honestly don't know why there isn't more lateraling in the game as a regular part of play

Normally when I've seen a team try to lateral it ends in a fumble or loss of yards. Like those goofy end of game kick return type plays

 

[g00n]

Normally when I've seen a team try to lateral it ends in a fumble or loss of yards. Like those goofy end of game kick return type plays

Right, because they don't really practice or work it into the game as much as the other plays.

I bet if some coach came along and really put some smart innovations in, lateral plays could be the new RPO or tush push that other teams have to adjust to.

 

[Neil Racki]

I honestly don't know why there isn't more lateraling in the game as a regular part of play

The back yard down field hook and ladder is coming .. Kelce does a bit off schedule and im surprised Andy Reid doesnt do it intentionally

 

[ynotcaps]

For some reason I'm hearing "Another One Bites The Dust"...

 

[kicksavedave]

For some reason I'm hearing "Another One Bites The Dust"...

Not a 1st rounder, but a Rivera Bust nonetheless.

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

If standings hold we would be a 2v7 on the road in Philly for the playoffs.

 

[RedRocking]

Interesting discussion b/n Rex Ryan and Orlovsky this morning about the T-Lawrence hit. They said that QBs should dive at the defenders legs, if they see contact coming. That sliding is only safe in the open field.

With all our consternation about JD sliding, his awkward “fall forward” thing might be what he’s being coached to do. Lamar has done it for years.

 

[Ridley Simon]

If standings hold we would be a 2v7 on the road in Philly for the playoffs.

Good. That’s what I want. I want to take down the Eagles

Interesting discussion b/n Rex Ryan and Orlovsky this morning about the T-Lawrence hit. They said that QBs should dive at the defenders legs, if they see contact coming. That sliding is only safe in the open field.

With all our consternation about JD sliding, his awkward “fall forward” thing might be what he’s being coached to do. Lamar has done it for years.

I would agree 100%. Sliding in football is “giving one’s self up”, which allows predators to attack. Regardless.

Lunging forward can create injuries to the head and shoulders, if done wrong — but that’s not a usual circumstance.

AND you are taking it at someone. Hit or be hit. As it were

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

Those 49ers trading for Cousins rumors were fun today. Kyle always did love him

 

[Chokingdogs]

Good. That’s what I want. I want to take down the Eagles


I would agree 100%. Sliding in football is “giving one’s self up”, which allows predators to attack. Regardless.

Lunging forward can create injuries to the head and shoulders, if done wrong — but that’s not a usual circumstance.

AND you are taking it at someone. Hit or be hit. As it were

I was under the impression the NFL, as it pertains to QBs scrambling, made it such that when a QB initiates a “slide” they were in effect giving themselves up? Reason being, so they don’t get clobbered. Did I dream that?

 

[Ridley Simon]

I was under the impression the NFL, as it pertains to QBs scrambling, made it such that when a QB initiates a “slide” they were in effect giving themselves up? Reason being, so they don’t get clobbered. Did I dream that?

Yes. That’s true. BUT, they still get whacked a lot. Usually to the upper torso. Head and all.

Rules aren’t stopping things like what happened to Lawrence. So— be aggressive when “giving up”, and dove at someone’s knees. Make them move/or feel it.

 

[Chokingdogs]

Yes. That’s true. BUT, they still get whacked a lot. Usually to the upper torso. Head and all.

Rules aren’t stopping things like what happened to Lawrence. So— be aggressive when “giving up”, and dove at someone’s knees. Make them move/or feel it.

Okay, I was pretty sure the league did that.

What needs to happen, to curb the clobbering that was supposed to be curbed with the rule, is toss any D player who does it. If a QB is going down, feet or head first, just touch them “down”. Do anything else, 15 yards and early shower. That’ll stop that practice real quick, for all but the dumbest of players.

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

To be fair. Mahomes does a fake slide or going out of bounds all the time and it makes it hard to defend.

 

[g00n]

The problem is the slide is not a perfect way to safely broadcast giving yourself up in time to not be hit. Defenders can't always change course fast enough.

A head-first thing doesn't work because it's no different than lunging forward for extra yards. If a QB is off limits lunging forward then he can just get near the line to gain or endzone and lean forward and nobody can touch him.

I've never liked the slide and wouldn't care if it were eliminated. A QB should learn how to take a hit and avoid dangerous situations like every other player is expected to do. FAFO rules apply.

Plus, whatever happened to the crackdown on defenders AND offensive players lowering the helmet to initiate contact? There was an emphasis for a while but now it seems like there are only a handful of fines given out while everyone has gone back to leading with the head.

Combine this with the mandate to get lower than the other guy for leverage during the tackle and you have a formula for disaster when a QB suddenly slides and lowers his head to hip or leg level, where the defender's helmet is now aimed.

Regardless, based on the current rules this hit was extremely vicious and seemed to specifically target TL's head with the forearm. Dude needs a suspension.

 

[Chokingdogs]

To be fair. Mahomes does a fake slide or going out of bounds all the time and it makes it hard to defend.

On the flip side, if a QB fakes giving themselves up, that’s a penalty as well.

 

[RedRocking]

Okay, I was pretty sure the league did that.

What needs to happen, to curb the clobbering that was supposed to be curbed with the rule, is toss any D player who does it. If a QB is going down, feet or head first, just touch them “down”. Do anything else, 15 yards and early shower. That’ll stop that practice real quick, for all but the dumbest of players.

Yea, but most of the time it’s not as vicious/intentional as what Al-Shaair did. It’s just a defender who his lunging and can’t change direction in time. A lot of times you see them fly over top of the QB, and barely miss, or graze an elbow.

It’s already 15 yds if you contact a sliding QB. You don’t even need to touch them, they’re automatically down. Stiffening the penalty to ejection still can’t help guys that have already timed their hit and can’t pull up in time. Maybe it just scares them into not wanting to tackle a running QB at all - but much like Mahomes faking a slide, there’s a point at which the defender can’t win and it’s unfair.

A QB lunging towards the defender’s feet can preempt a hit cause defenders will think twice and pull up because their own legs are exposed.

 

[g00n]

Yea, but most of the time it’s not as vicious/intentional as what Al-Shaair did. It’s just a defender who his lunging and can’t change direction in time. A lot of times you see them fly over top of the QB, and barely miss, or graze an elbow.

It’s already 15 yds if you contact a sliding QB. You don’t even need to touch them, they’re automatically down. Stiffening the penalty to ejection still can’t help guys that have already timed their hit and can’t pull up in time. Maybe it just scares them into not wanting to tackle a running QB at all - but much like Mahomes faking a slide, there’s a point at which the defender can’t win and it’s unfair.

A QB lunging towards the defender’s feet can preempt a hit cause defenders will think twice and pull up because their own legs are exposed.

Football is too chaotic for a QB to be able to pick a defender and lunge at his feet with no threat from anyone else around. He's more likely to lunge for yards than at a defender, or go down in some other way.

 

[RedRocking]

Football is too chaotic for a QB to be able to pick a defender and lunge at his feet with no threat from anyone else around. He's more likely to lunge for yards than at a defender, or go down in some other way.

I mean it in the sense that we see JD/Lamar do every week - the ungraceful tumble forward, fall down thing. That was the point of the discussion I saw this morning. If you get low and down with incoming defenders, their natural instincts of self-preservation take over. They pull up and just tag you down. You’re not attacking them, you’re just trying to preempt and make the decision for them.

There’s no great solution in a fast, chaotic game, and I agree that QBs need to learn how to take a hit. But, I still like the concept of the slide - just a matter of knowing when and how to use it.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Interesting discussion b/n Rex Ryan and Orlovsky this morning about the T-Lawrence hit. They said that QBs should dive at the defenders legs, if they see contact coming. That sliding is only safe in the open field.

With all our consternation about JD sliding, his awkward “fall forward” thing might be what he’s being coached to do. Lamar has done it for years.

I promise he was coached to do it better lol!

Mahomes dives forward pretty safely and frequently. It can be done well.

 

[Cush]

Rams claim Forbes

 

[Jags]

I've never liked the slide and wouldn't care if it were eliminated. A QB should learn how to take a hit and avoid dangerous situations like every other player is expected to do. FAFO rules apply.

Agreed. The problem with these types of rules -- this many seconds, this many steps -- is that the players they're intending to protect take every inch of that slack...

"We're going to protect you by creating a 1-yard barrier around you."

"Great! Now I have an extra yard to play with!"

It takes you right back to the beginning. Running QBs are always going to take it down to the last moment or step because that's who they are. It's on them to protect themselves. Trying to do it for them hurts the game.

 

[ynotcaps]

Rams claim Forbes

Well, damn. We don't get to play them.

 

[HTFN]

Agreed. The problem with these types of rules -- this many seconds, this many steps -- is that the players they're intending to protect take every inch of that slack...

"We're going to protect you by creating a 1-yard barrier around you."

"Great! Now I have an extra yard to play with!"

It takes you right back to the beginning. Running QBs are always going to take it down to the last moment or step because that's who they are. It's on them to protect themselves. Trying to do it for them hurts the game.

Could you devise a writing of the rule that places responsibility on the QB there? Some kind of condition that essentially removes slide protection if, say... done in the direction of an opponent or something? Distance was my first thought but that's insanely hard to do in real time with two guys closing distance at various speeds.

I think the slide should continue to exist for the health of the game unless we're going to fairly drastically change what the league needs to look for in a QB. I also agree that these rules are virtually always weaponized by competitors who want to win, so there needs to be an element of risk at play...

One thing just kind of came to me: what if a QB has to signify that he's sliding by holding the ball over his head? Failure to allow a critical point of contact (knee, hip, elbow, etc.) down within a second or so is a flag and 15 yards (from scrimmage if you want it to hurt), but the QB is not eligible to be hit once the ball is fully above the helmet. It's an unnatural motion, discourages playing too close to contact as it massively risks ball security, and if the ball isn't above your head when you slide you're eligible for the same contact as any other player.

It would have to be codified in a way that distinctly removes the option of throwing, either by only being valid after the line of scrimmage or establishing another "tuck rule/throwing motion" kind of line but if everyone had to hold the ball like a torch we'd get a pretty clear idea of who is running for extra yards. Broadcasts declaration way in time to allow defenders to plan against it without being at a significant disadvantage, doesn't impact reaching for pylons either... could actually work?