Blue Jays GDT: 2024 v1 |Sun, Apr 7| @NYY | 1:30pm ET/10:30am PT | Francis vs Gil

[Tw1ster]

Friendly reminder that no-hitters come from less-than-intimidating pitchers all the time before everyone either a) anoints Blanco as a big deal or b) makes a bigger deal out of him doing it instead of, say, Verlander.

That's not to say it's not bad that the Jays got no-hit. It is bad. Very bad. But it's not worse that they got hit by some unknown #5 pitcher vs anyone else. Phil Humber had a no-hitter in his career and I think he was out of baseball within 5 years because he was a tire fire.

And now we get to watch a Sharks game

 

[mikeyz]

Ken Reid is quickly becoming my least liked desk jockey on Sportsnet. It's like he decided "I'm going to become Don Cherry only with less potentially offensive content and more aggressive, confrontational cranky old man energy." and then went out and did it.

Was he wrong though?

 

[The Nemesis]

Was he wrong though?

Yes. Because there are no "velocity nerds". The people that love velo above all else are generally people that aren't big on stats and newer ideas. Nerds now love spin rate, break and movement readings, and metric-ified "stuff" values that I bet Blanco rated well on. Of course he'd carp about that too even though his argument here was "who cares how hard he threw, look at the filthy pitches he was working with." which is exactly what those numbers would be saying.

He usually is wrong in a lot of these "cranky old man screeching at things that are ruining the game" sort of things because he doesn't actually understand what he's angry at, so he just makes up a lazy straw opponent and punches it instead. He's not angry about real, sensible things. He's angry that he doesn't understand how the language of sports has evolved and now he's not the cool kid who "gets it" and can gatekeep.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Was he wrong though?

I missed it. Cole's Notes version if possible, please and thank you.

 

[The Nemesis]

And now we get to watch a Sharks game

it's a nice come-down because I am literally incapable of being frustrated by the Sharks anymore.

 

[The Nemesis]

I missed it. Cole's Notes version if possible, please and thank you.

In the bit off the top of the show when talking about the no-hitter he talked about how Blanco did it with a changeup and without a blazing fastball. Then he let loos a really, really snide "Take that, velocity nerds!" and looked all proud of himself afterwards.

It doesn't sound like much, but I take it in the broader context of him spending an inordinate amount of time taking potshots at "nerds" and "stat geeks" and losers who didn't play the game in all sorts of sports when his job is literally just to narrate the highlight pack and tell us the score. Plus he does all this in spite of looking and coming across like he was probably the dorky kid nobody liked in school that's exactly the stereotype he's attempting to bust on now.

 

[Cleetus]

I love to watch the jays in 30 before bedtime, think I will skip it and get the extra 30 mins of sleep tonight lol

 

[Nineteen67]

I love to watch the jays in 30 before bedtime, think I will skip it and get the extra 30 mins of sleep tonight lol

I tuned in for a minute and caught the 3rd HR and then promptly turned it off…..until I saw it was a no hitter in the 9th.

 

[canucksfan]

You think the bullpen and the back end starting depth is fine for a team hoping to be in playoffs?

I do agree it's more so the hitting depth but for a playoff team to a lesser extent we're hoping kikuchi pitches like last year not the year before, but then we're hoping manoah can return to form and Bowden Francis is a starter assuming no injuries to the top 3 guys. A lot of hope.

I think so. After Francis, there's Manoah, White, Rodriguez, and maybe Tiedemann. No team is going to have elite starting depth or else those guys would be starting.

Relievers are fine. There are some guys in the minors that can fill in.

The biggest problem with this team is the bats. Even after the Turner signing, I wanted another good bat but they didn't add anyone.

Looking at the lineup

Springer - Fine
Vlad - Fine
Bo - Fine
Need someone here IMO
Turner - fine as a #5 Personally, I wasn't a big fan of the signing.
Kirk/Jansen - Fine although Kirk has had an awfully slow start. Jansen will provide a boost once he's back.
Varsho - Needs to get going. He can't have a year like last year.
IKF/Clement - Might work if Clement takes a step forward.
Biggio - Fine.

The biggest problem with the off-season is they didn't sign a high-impact bat. If Turner was in his prime that would be okay but he's more of a 5/6 type bat in the lineup. I also didn't under the KK signing. Awesome player but Varsho fills his role.

Baseball is weird, someone like Barger could come up and mash the ball. Varsho could finally get his bat back. It was risky going into the season with the lineup they have.

However, its five games into the season and they had to play in Trop and one game in Houston after they got embarrassed by the Yankees. Not the easiest start by any means.

 

[CabanaBoy5]

I’m not overreacting yet, but virtually everyone including Atkins knew this team needed at least two good hitters. Atkins delivered an aging Turner and the tepid bat of IKF. Hoping on improvements by the likes of Varsho and Kirk among others was a risky move. Atkins may end up regretting this strategy.

 

[Orca Smash]

I think so. After Francis, there's Manoah, White, Rodriguez, and maybe Tiedemann. No team is going to have elite starting depth or else those guys would be starting.

Relievers are fine. There are some guys in the minors that can fill in.

The biggest problem with this team is the bats. Even after the Turner signing, I wanted another good bat but they didn't add anyone.

Looking at the lineup

Springer - Fine
Vlad - Fine
Bo - Fine
Need someone here IMO
Turner - fine as a #5 Personally, I wasn't a big fan of the signing.
Kirk/Jansen - Fine although Kirk has had an awfully slow start. Jansen will provide a boost once he's back.
Varsho - Needs to get going. He can't have a year like last year.
IKF/Clement - Might work if Clement takes a step forward.
Biggio - Fine.

The biggest problem with the off-season is they didn't sign a high-impact bat. If Turner was in his prime that would be okay but he's more of a 5/6 type bat in the lineup. I also didn't under the KK signing. Awesome player but Varsho fills his role.

Baseball is weird, someone like Barger could come up and mash the ball. Varsho could finally get his bat back. It was risky going into the season with the lineup they have.

However, its five games into the season and they had to play in Trop and one game in Houston after they got embarrassed by the Yankees. Not the easiest start by any means.

I think the bolded is a big concern for me and part of my hope comment where we just hope those guys can fill in, the jays dont seemingly have relievers like the rays they can just call up and fill in and pitch well and be fine, it is typically erratic, or at least over the last number of years I have felt that has been a big issue when key guys go down there is not often guys in the minors who can come up and get the job done. The starting depth I get no team will have elite starters 1 to 5 but francis, white, manoah are riskier then just not being elite guys, those guys are just flat out questionable starters in the big leagues altogether rather then just being an average number 5 starter. But I do hope manoah can return to form. Thats my concern anyway can any of those guys even be a number 5 and big league starters, but I agree with the rest of your post. Time will tell and hopefully the rotation can stay healthy.

 

[canucksfan]

I think the bolded is a big concern for me and part of my hope comment where we just hope those guys can fill in, the jays dont seemingly have relievers like the rays they can just call up and fill in and pitch well and be fine, it is typically erratic, or at least over the last number of years I have felt that has been a big issue when key guys go down there is not often guys in the minors who can come up and get the job done. The starting depth I get no team will have elite starters 1 to 5 but francis, white, manoah are riskier then just not being elite guys, those guys are just flat out questionable starters in the big leagues altogether rather then just being an average number 5 starter. But I do hope manoah can return to form. Thats my concern anyway can any of those guys even be a number 5 and big league starters, but I agree with the rest of your post. Time will tell and hopefully the rotation can stay healthy.

We have to remember Romano and Swanson are currently injured. That’s a big blow to the bullpen. Pearson, Cooke, Danner and a few other guys are good depth for relievers.

Now, I don’t follow other teams closely but I doubt many teams have better pitching depth, especially starting rotation, than the Jays. I’m willing to bet they have better depth than what the Rangers had last year.

 

[Orca Smash]

We have to remember Romano and Swanson are currently injured. That’s a big blow to the bullpen. Pearson, Cooke, Danner and a few other guys are good depth for relievers.

Now, I don’t follow other teams closely but I doubt many teams have better pitching depth, especially starting rotation, than the Jays. I’m willing to bet they have better depth than what the Rangers had last year.

The jays top end looks good, but the concern for me is white, manoah and francis banking on one of them to be in the rotation. No team has a great number 5 but typically you have guys they class as a veteran starter or a young pitcher chomping at the bit to be called up in the system. I wouldnt say those 3 fit that bill. I believe Orioles have irvin as a fifth starter, not spectacular but a starter who can give you innings and has for years in the mlb. We will see how this plays out, but Im just concerned there might not be options for that fifth spot if Manoah does not regain his form. I don't have a ton of faith in Francis or white locking down that starter role.

I think Texas had heaney or jon gray as a 5th last year. They invested quite a bit in starting depth.

 

[mikeyz]

We have to remember Romano and Swanson are currently injured. That’s a big blow to the bullpen. Pearson, Cooke, Danner and a few other guys are good depth for relievers.

Now, I don’t follow other teams closely but I doubt many teams have better pitching depth, especially starting rotation, than the Jays. I’m willing to bet they have better depth than what the Rangers had last year.

They’ve either gotten their ass kicked or kicked ass in the 5 games played so far. The BP is irrelevant in the results so far.

 

[shaner8989]

Teo Hernandez has more Hr then our whole team
Guriel and Moreno are better then any hitter we have

Management has failed so f***ing bad at every move made

Varsho is a joke. Don’t care if he can run
IKF is another joke. Don’t care is he’s decent with a glove
Turner is 40

Offense wins World Series.
Can’t hit can’t win

 

[Suntouchable13]

They need to move Varsho to 8th or something. I don’t know whose idea it was to hit him in the middle of the order. Not pinning everything on him, I am just not sure why he is hitting so high up.

 

[Nineteen67]

Teo Hernandez has more Hr then our whole team
Guriel and Moreno are better then any hitter we have

Management has failed so f***ing bad at every move made

Varsho is a joke. Don’t care if he can run
IKF is another joke. Don’t care is he’s decent with a glove
Turner is 40

Offense wins World Series.
Can’t hit can’t win

Teo and Gurriel don’t make much of a difference on this team if Bo and Flop don’t hit.

They’re built to contend for a playoff spot and hope they catch a wave in the event they do.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

I’m not overreacting yet, but virtually everyone including Atkins knew this team needed at least two good hitters. Atkins delivered an aging Turner and the tepid bat of IKF. Hoping on improvements by the likes of Varsho and Kirk among others was a risky move. Atkins may end up regretting this strategy.

If last night showed us anything, IKF wasn't brought here for his bat. He's the secret weapon they signed for the 'pen.

 

[LaP]

I’m not overreacting yet, but virtually everyone including Atkins knew this team needed at least two good hitters. Atkins delivered an aging Turner and the tepid bat of IKF. Hoping on improvements by the likes of Varsho and Kirk among others was a risky move. Atkins may end up regretting this strategy.

I don't get why people feel the need to say it's still early or i'm not overreacting etc ... Let's be honest it's pretty much the same lineup as last year.

- You have Biggio instead of Merrifield and even if Merrifield had a rough end of the season he still runned 67 batters in and stole 26 bases. Merrfield OPS was weak but it was in line with Biggio. I don't see Biggio doing better than that.
- You have Turner instead of Belt. I think Turner might do better or at least play more but he's 39 and will probably need a couple of days off too.
- Then you have IKF, Schneider or Clement instead of Chapman. As bad as Chapman was last year i don't see IKF doing better. Clement or Schneider could but how much will they play is a big question mark?

This team was not expected to score many runs this year and an improvement to the offense mostly relied on hope. Is it early? Yes. But so far the offense comes as advertised there's no surprise there they finsihed 14th last year in run scored and they currently sit at 15h in run scored.

I still firmly believe they have to give kids a chance. I don't mind IKF signing but he should be a bench player. Varsho should hit lower in the lineup.

 

[mikeyz]

Teo Hernandez has more Hr then our whole team
Guriel and Moreno are better then any hitter we have

Management has failed so f***ing bad at every move made

Varsho is a joke. Don’t care if he can run
IKF is another joke. Don’t care is he’s decent with a glove
Turner is 40

Offense wins World Series.
Can’t hit can’t win

Are you honestly surprised by this?

Anybody with even the most fringe knowledge of baseball and who isn’t a Blue Jays fanboy saw this coming.

The only thing that surprised me was it took them this long into the season to get no hit. And the fact that it happened on April fools day makes it even more poetic. Lol.

I don't get why people feel the need to say it's still early or i'm not overreacting etc ... Let's be honest it's pretty much the same lineup as last year.

- You have Biggio instead of Merrifield and even if Merrifield had a rough end of the season he still runned 67 batters in and stole 26 bases. Merrfield OPS was weak but it was in line with Biggio. I don't see Biggio doing better than that.
- You have Turner instead of Belt. I think Turner might do better or at least play more but he's 39 and will probably need a couple of days off too.
- Then you have IKF, Schneider or Clement instead of Chapman. As bad as Chapman was last year i don't see IKF doing better. Clement or Schneider could but how much will they play is a big question mark?

This team was not expected to score many runs this year and an improvement to the offense mostly relied on hope. Is it early? Yes. But so far the offense comes as advertised there's no surprise there they finsihed 14th last year in run scored and they currently sit at 15h in run scored.

I still firmly believe they have to give kids a chance. I don't mind IKF signing but he should be a bench player. Varsho should hit lower in the lineup.

They’re actually worse then last year if you can believe it.

 

[mikeyz]

They need to move Varsho to 8th or something. I don’t know whose idea it was to hit him in the middle of the order. Not pinning everything on him, I am just not sure why he is hitting so high up.

The sad thing is he’s actually their "best" option for hitting 5th. That's how pathetic their middle to bottom of the order is.

The alternatives are Kirk, Biggio, IKF and KK. And as dog shit as Varsho is, he's "A better" hitter then all 4 of those guys.

 

[Suntouchable13]

I don't get why people feel the need to say it's still early or i'm not overreacting etc ... Let's be honest it's pretty much the same lineup as last year.

- You have Biggio instead of Merrifield and even if Merrifield had a rough end of the season he still runned 67 batters in and stole 26 bases. Merrfield OPS was weak but it was in line with Biggio. I don't see Biggio doing better than that.
- You have Turner instead of Belt. I think Turner might do better or at least play more but he's 39 and will probably need a couple of days off too.
- Then you have IKF, Schneider or Clement instead of Chapman. As bad as Chapman was last year i don't see IKF doing better. Clement or Schneider could but how much will they play is a big question mark?

This team was not expected to score many runs this year and an improvement to the offense mostly relied on hope. Is it early? Yes. But so far the offense comes as advertised there's no surprise there they finsihed 14th last year in run scored and they currently sit at 15h in run scored.

I still firmly believe they have to give kids a chance. I don't mind IKF signing but he should be a bench player. Varsho should hit lower in the lineup.

What is head scratching to me is why couldn’t, or wouldn’t they, ante up for Soto? I get it, sometimes you get outbid but they did not do anything. Why did they become so risk averse all of a sudden? Oh we’re just gonna run it back with the guys we have. But we chased, Ohtani, guys. See, we’re trying. Atkins time is up, yet Shapiro keeps him around. Especially after the way last season ended.

 

[CabanaBoy5]

I don't get why people feel the need to say it's still early or i'm not overreacting etc ... Let's be honest it's pretty much the same lineup as last year.

- You have Biggio instead of Merrifield and even if Merrifield had a rough end of the season he still runned 67 batters in and stole 26 bases. Merrfield OPS was weak but it was in line with Biggio. I don't see Biggio doing better than that.
- You have Turner instead of Belt. I think Turner might do better or at least play more but he's 39 and will probably need a couple of days off too.
- Then you have IKF, Schneider or Clement instead of Chapman. As bad as Chapman was last year i don't see IKF doing better. Clement or Schneider could but how much will they play is a big question mark?

This team was not expected to score many runs this year and an improvement to the offense mostly relied on hope. Is it early? Yes. But so far the offense comes as advertised there's no surprise there they finsihed 14th last year in run scored and they currently sit at 15h in run scored.

I still firmly believe they have to give kids a chance. I don't mind IKF signing but he should be a bench player. Varsho should hit lower in the lineup.

We shouldn't overreact after 5 games because they have a plan and we have to give them a chance to see if it plays out. They've put their faith in the players they have and the possibility they might improve on last season. Can Varsho hit like he did 2 years, can Vladdy hit like he did 3 years ago, can Kirk hit like he did 2 years ago, etc. I don't agree with the strategy but we have to give it more than 5 games before we conclude it isn't happening.

 

[DuklaNation]

Teo Hernandez has more Hr then our whole team
Guriel and Moreno are better then any hitter we have

Management has failed so f***ing bad at every move made

Varsho is a joke. Don’t care if he can run
IKF is another joke. Don’t care is he’s decent with a glove
Turner is 40

Offense wins World Series.
Can’t hit can’t win

There is no #5 hitter. Agree that team budget should prioritize offense. Looking at how team was built pre Manoah collapse, having 5 quality starters plus good defense might be a solid regular season team but isn't that great come playoff time.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Looking back at the Bo/Vladdy era so far, it is kind of disappointing that with all the high expectations heaped onto this group, they yet to have a postseason win under their belt. Pretty crazy how in a matter of a couple seasons the thought went from this team being a legitimate, consistent World Series contender in the foreseeable future, to one that will be battling it out for a Wild Card spot.