HF Habs: 2024 NHL Draft Thread

[MtlSars]

You whores will do about anything for 2 extra inches...

Iginla has 20 more goals in as many games and 9 goals in 11 playoff games versus 10 in 16 for Beckett, whos also 6-7 months older without the pedigree.

If it comes to that, the choice should be clear.

You keep saying Sennecke is the biggest riser but he was projected a 1st round pick at the seasons beginning (Mckenzie's list?) whereas Iginla wasn't in that conversation.

 

[Jaynki]

Be ready for that to happen. The odds are really good.

Then we'll all pray our 5th overall pick can somehow break the 70 points mark in the OHL and get a Team Canada invite.

Have you ever watched Sennecke?

I will say this as a big Iginla fans. I have Iginla in my soup since october.

But Sennecke might just have a lot more upside.

Iginla has things that Sennecke hasnt. But in terms of pure upside, its Sennecke ainec.

You whores will do about anything for 2 extra inches...

Iginla has 20 more goals in as many games and 9 goals in 11 playoff games versus 10 in 16 for Beckett, whos also 6-7 months older without the pedigree.

If it comes to that, the choice should be clear.

You keep saying Sennecke is the biggest riser but he was projected a 1st round pick at the seasons beginning (Mckenzie's list?) whereas Iginla wasn't in that conversation.

Those two inches are not meaningless. Gives a lot of reaches and go see how Sennecke uses his stick.

Also, it is not just about point production but mainly about upside and Sennecke has a clear edge here. Havent we had our lesson with Slafkovsky in 2022?

 

[WeThreeKings]

You whores will do about anything for 2 extra inches...

Iginla has 20 more goals in as many games and 9 goals in 11 playoff games versus 10 in 16 for Beckett, whos also 6-7 months older without the pedigree.

If it comes to that, the choice should be clear.

You keep saying Sennecke is the biggest riser but he was projected a 1st round pick at the seasons beginning (Mckenzie's list?) whereas Iginla wasn't in that conversation.

Yes, they are both big risers but Sennecke rose the most from mid-season to the end of the season. The argument is that if you see Sennecke as a 'riser' as a negative, then Iginla also qualifies as a riser, it's not a good argument to knock one down and simultaneously lift the other up.

It isn't about the extra 2 inches, it's about the fact that Sennecke was seen as a mid first round pick coming into the year as a 5'11" guy.. now those skills are in a near 6'3" frame and he showed a command and dominance with that frame late in the year and into the playoffs.

If you like the higher floor in Iginla, power to you, but personally, if i'm forced to choose one of Sennecke or Iginla, I'm going upside at 5, because I want a game breaking forward and Sennecke could be that where Iginla hasn't shown quite those qualities but you can be assured you are at least getting a Jake Debrusk level player and some people prefer that cost certainty.

I just don't think the debate of Sennecke vs. Iginla should have someone thinking an opposite opinion is wrong or lunacy.. the same way that I prefer Parekh to Buium, but the opposite opinion isn't lunacy there either.

People have preferences on what they like and value more and that's what we are really looking at here in this draft. This isn't like saying you'd rather take Iginla over Celebrini where there's a clear differential between the prospects at this point in time.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Have you ever watched Sennecke?

I will say this as a big Iginla fans. I have Iginla in my soup since october.

But Sennecke might just have a lot more upside.

Iginla has things that Sennecke hasnt. But in terms of pure upside, its Sennecke ainec.



Those two inches are not meaningless. Gives a lot of reaches and go see how Sennecke uses his stick.

Also, it is not just about point production but mainly about upside and Sennecke has a clear edge here. Havent we had our lesson with Slafkovsky in 2022?

Compare Iginla when he is 18 next year like Sennecke was this past year. You're upside calculation will change.

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

You think he’s going top 10 for sure?

I could see him being available in the 10-15 range.

I do.

Kid looks terrific, and clearly developing.

Also, not haunted by the Ghost of KK.

The new management team has displayed enough hockey acumen to allow me to move on from the previous.

 

[Mrb1p]

Question for you guys.

We know that the 7th , 10th and 11th picks could be in play;

Ottawa
New Jersey
Buffalo.

We know also that a pick in the top 10 is very very expensive:

Let's say that Hughes would want another pick in the top 11 to be able to draft 2 forwards or 1d and 1 forward....;

Would you trade Mike Matheson for one of those 3 picks?

Yes but none of these teams would do it.

 

[WeThreeKings]

In 2 weeks we could be picking Ivan Demidov.

 

[Jaynki]

Compare Iginla when he is 18 next year like Sennecke was this past year. You're upside calculation will change.

They are in the same draft class.

Thats an argument we heard in the KK/Tkachuk debate.

Btw, i would choose Tij above Sennecke if it was only about me, but an honest intellectual debate here where we recognise both pros and cons from both players have Sennecke has an higher upside player.

Tij has better intangibles and is more of a sure shot.

WTK summarised it well a couple of post above.

 

[Kents polished head]

I’m not sure how you can say that Iginla’s output is predictable and say another top prospect is a mystery box…

I'll be as straight forward as I can be right now.

It's not about Iginla being more "predictable" than "the rest".
It's about Sennecke being less "predictable" than "the rest".

You can make an argument for a whole lot of players at 5.

Lindstrom showed he can be downright dominant, plays with pugnacity, and scored as many goals as Sennecke on a full year in... 32 games.

Demidov did what no other prospect before him did in the MHL, no matter how poor people say the calibre is in that league.

Iginla just had a very good 17 years old season, being one of the top goal scorers in the whole CHL, while being one of the youngest players in this draft.

Hell, you can even make an argument for Catton, who had a season for the ages, and for Eiserman, who did what nobody did before him in the USHL.

All of these guys have showed they can actually elevate their game an be dominant in a way or another.

Then, you have Beckett Sennecke, a guy who by all means struggled to hit a point per game in the OHL, and who is being sold here as the second coming of God, but who somehow struggled to product consistently, and is going to get his game to the next level and do something he's never done because "GrOwTh SpUrT". A guy who Scott Wheeler reported that his off-ice reputation was average at best as early as this season.

And that's just taking the empirical data. I won't even get into how freaking disengaged and awkward this guy looks on the ice. Of course people will all put this under the "GrOwTh SpUrT" excuse. But this is the point; You should not justify picking a guy who has that many question marks around him because "GrOwTh SpUrT".

It's a hit-or-miss, and you should not go after hit-or-misses with a 5th overally pick, and pray the guy you drafted is going to do something he's NEVER done before - product consistently/be dominant.

People come up with all kinds of excuses you should not have to make for a 5th overall pick. People will say numbers don't matter and Scheifele didn't have tremendous numbers in his draft season. They'll also disregard how Scheifele is not the norm and how Scheifele is pretty much what every team wants to add to its arsenal - a right-handed C with good size. That alone motivated the reach.

He might just pan out and beat the odds. If so, props to the ones who saw it coming. But if he busts and Iginla becomes what he's pretty much anticipated to become - a fine sniper with a good all-around game and good level of compete - this is a fireable offense. ESPECIALLY considering the shallow depth of our prospects pool up front. ESPECIALLY knowing how much of a perfect duo he'd make with Kirby Dach.

The fact is that if you're drafting Sennecke, you're drafting a guy who hasn't even showed he can do what you draft him for consistently. And who does things that are simply not translatable in the NHL at junior, and who can't even pull it off consistently.

Hell, if that guy is really in the discussions I'd still rather take a chance with one of the Ds.

 

[Jaynki]

Yes but none of these teams would do it.

Agree.

The price for 7,10,11 is Guhle, not Matheson.

If we could get out of the draft with Lindstrom and Iginla, i would certainly entertain it.

Do we have the LD depth to assume a Guhle trade ?

 

[Mrb1p]

I'm not sure why we're talking about "floor" and "lower ceiling" with Iginla vs Sennecke. It just reeks of pre-made opinions.

If there's one thing that's exciting about Tij, it's how high he can reach. I'm not sure where the misconception that he's somehow polished and close to his ceiling came from. (mod)

Reality is, he's played ~70 games in a top 9 role in the past 24 months. He's trying things, he's testing his limits and he's somewhat looking for an offensive identity still.

I'll say this, yes Tij has a high floor, he also probably has the highest runway of all players in the draft. The only truly developed skills he has is puck retrievals and his elite shot. He's weeks away from being a 2025 selection, he's clearly a teenager in all aspects of life and he's just started showing us what he could be. You can draw a parallel to Iggys situation and Slafs situation this year, just in a lower level league.

Miss me with that Sennecke ceiling BS.

Agree.

The price for 7,10,11 is Guhle, not Matheson.

If we could get out of the draft with Lindstrom and Iginla, i would certainly entertain it.

Do we have the LD depth to assume a Guhle trade ?

But then the Habs wouldn't do it. And no we don't. Guhle is here to stay he's our best D and he's probably the only top pair D we'll have for the next decade.

The price is probably Matheson+26th+ prospect. I'd do that pretty fairly but I wake up at night to hate on Matheson.

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

Bob is a part of it. But, I politely disagree when it comes to forwards and defence. Outside of McDrai, the Oilers are a dumpster fire. Bouchard is a nice piece, but inflated with those two as well.

Barkov + Tkachuk play a style that is so conducive to the playoffs and they match up so well again McDrai.

Then the rest of the team absolutely takes over.....

Give me Reinhart, Bennett, Tank, Verheage all day over Nuge, Kane, etc.

Florida flows to, and supports the puck extremely well. Their five-men units seldom waste split seconds, the units are all on the same page.

It’s a real tough, responsible style to play against.

If Bobro is on, I can only imagine how much cussing I would do trying to deal with it for 60 minutes.

Add/Edit: Florida was thrashed by Vegas last year. They learned some things.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Agree.

The price for 7,10,11 is Guhle, not Matheson.

If we could get out of the draft with Lindstrom and Iginla, i would certainly entertain it.

Do we have the LD depth to assume a Guhle trade ?

They're not trading Guhle.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1800558933079138773

 

[Hannibal]

In 2 weeks we could be picking Ivan Demidov.

Boff… that supposed to feel good when you watch those playoffs?

Heck, i would be more confident in Sennecke than Demidov god dammit.

 

[Shutdown]

Boff… that supposed to feel good when you watch those playoffs?

Heck, i would be more confident in Sennecke than Demidov god dammit.

good thing Ken Holland isn't in charge of building the Habs

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Boff… that supposed to feel good when you watch those playoffs?

Heck, i would be more confident in Sennecke than Demidov god dammit.

Demidov is fine if you don't have Nurse playing 20+ minutes a night or Skinner starting lol

 

[Hannibal]

Demidov is fine if you don't have Nurse playing 20+ minutes a night or Skinner starting lol

Im really not confident in Demidov’s play being as much dominant in NA as he is in the MHL. He won’t be able to attack 1vs3 and get through them. Only Mcdavid can do that.

 

[Kents polished head]

Where are you getting your odds from?

My common sense.

And most betting websites now have Sennecke rising and Iginla dropping.

So yeah. I fully expect us to draft Sennecke. All it takes is either Chicago or Anaheim to pick Demidov, or us deciding once again to pass on Demidov because of the Russian factor like we did with Michkov last season.

Im really not confident in Demidov’s play being as much dominant in NA as he is in the MHL. He won’t be able to attack 1vs3 and get through them. Only Mcdavid can do that.

Well, I have bad news for you if you think Sennecke is any better in that aspect.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Im really not confident in Demidov’s play being as much dominant in NA as he is in the MHL. He won’t be able to attack 1vs3 and get through them. Only Mcdavid can do that.

I certainly don't expect him to put up 2 PPG but he's a very smart player and I don't doubt he'll be able to adapt. He certainly won't become less deceptive.

 

[Hannibal]

My common sense.

And most betting websites now have Sennecke rising and Iginla dropping.

So yeah. I fully expect us to draft Sennecke. All it takes is either Chicago or Anaheim to pick Demidov, or us deciding once again to pass on Demidov because of the Russian factor like we did with Michkov last season.



Well, I have bad news for you if you think Sennecke is any better in that aspect.

I think Sennecke’s play is even more easier to project in the Pro than Demidov’s.

And i’m not even that much of a Sennecke’s fans. Much prefer Iginla.

 

[Habs Halifax]

My common sense.

And most betting websites now have Sennecke rising and Iginla dropping.

So yeah. I fully expect us to draft Sennecke. All it takes is either Chicago or Anaheim to pick Demidov, or us deciding once again to pass on Demidov because of the Russian factor like we did with Michkov last season.



Well, I have bad news for you if you think Sennecke is any better in that aspect.

Your common sense is not real odds. It's your opinion.

I am not sure what we do but if we take Sennecke 5th, I'll be very surprised. I'm also waiting for Bob's new ranking. Bet you Bob will have Iggy 6-10 range and Sennecke 8-13 range. We will see

 

[Slew Foots]

Yes, they are both big risers but Sennecke rose the most from mid-season to the end of the season. The argument is that if you see Sennecke as a 'riser' as a negative, then Iginla also qualifies as a riser, it's not a good argument to knock one down and simultaneously lift the other up.

It isn't about the extra 2 inches, it's about the fact that Sennecke was seen as a mid first round pick coming into the year as a 5'11" guy.. now those skills are in a near 6'3" frame and he showed a command and dominance with that frame late in the year and into the playoffs.

If you like the higher floor in Iginla, power to you, but personally, if i'm forced to choose one of Sennecke or Iginla, I'm going upside at 5, because I want a game breaking forward and Sennecke could be that where Iginla hasn't shown quite those qualities but you can be assured you are at least getting a Jake Debrusk level player and some people prefer that cost certainty.

I just don't think the debate of Sennecke vs. Iginla should have someone thinking an opposite opinion is wrong or lunacy.. the same way that I prefer Parekh to Buium, but the opposite opinion isn't lunacy there either.

People have preferences on what they like and value more and that's what we are really looking at here in this draft. This isn't like saying you'd rather take Iginla over Celebrini where there's a clear differential between the prospects at this point in time.

Just a quick note on Sennecke: it seems like he actually came into the year as 6'2" if you look at McKenzie's pre-season 2024 rankings: Bobby Margarita's 2024 NHL Draft preseason rankings

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Your common sense is not real odds. It's your opinion.

I am not sure what we do but if we take Sennecke 5th, I'll be very surprised. I'm also waiting for Bob's new ranking. Bet you Bob will have Iggy 6-10 range and Sennecke 8-13 range. We will see

I don't really see any scenario in which we take Sennecke at 5. From everything we've heard it seems like we'll have one of Demidov or Lindstrom there who are highest on our board, and if they're both gone we'll go D.

 

[Hannibal]

I certainly don't expect him to put up 2 PPG but he's a very smart player and I don't doubt he'll be able to adapt. He certainly won't become less deceptive.

We’ll see i guess, but i’m not that much of a fan.

One thing for sure, he ain’t a slam dunk superstar like many posters here think he is. Far from it.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Boff… that supposed to feel good when you watch those playoffs?

Heck, i would be more confident in Sennecke than Demidov god dammit.

Yes, it still feels good to have a highly skilled player on the team. Oilers won't win but those issues are due to the depth, defense and goaltending. The high end talent on their powerplay got them all the way to the cup finals.

Plus we know this management group values size and puts a premium on it, they aren't gonna move away from that if Demidov is the BPA.

We all want Lindstrom but we're not getting him and we aren't reaching on Iginla, a whole tier worse of a forward when there's a legitimate star talent on the board.

Demidov is competitive and tries all over the ice, this isn't a Michkov style.

Just a quick note on Sennecke: it seems like he actually came into the year as 6'2" if you look at McKenzie's pre-season 2024 rankings: Bobby Margarita's 2024 NHL Draft preseason rankings

Yes but no one had seen him play at that size yet, so his ranking was off of who he was as a prospect the year prior.

I don't really see any scenario in which we take Sennecke at 5. From everything we've heard it seems like we'll have one of Demidov or Lindstrom there who are highest on our board, and if they're both gone we'll go D.

The forward vs. defense calculus is still in effect.. I wouldn't discount it still happening if they don't feel that the defenseman remaining are that much better than Sennecke/Iginla. They're just not going to pick a 2nd line forward over what they perceive to be a 1st pair defenseman, we don't know how they feel explicitly.