Pre-Game Talk: 2024 Blues Training Camp Thread

[Brian39]

I think the only point I would argue is Kapanen being a genuine NHL regular last year. I was a little surprised when we brought him back. If he doesn't up his game this year he will be 13th or 14th forward or riding the bus in the AHL. There is just too much competition for those bottom six spots this year.

He played 73 games, averaged 14:23 a night, and was on our top PK unit. His 22 points isn't anything special, but that is very much bottom-of-the-lineup-NHL-player production. He wasn't worth his contract, I don't want to see him playing 14+ minutes a night again, and he wouldn't have gotten that many minutes on a better team.

He very well could find himself as the odd man out this year. But he was a legit NHL player last year. I think there is a pretty good chance he'd be claimed on waivers if we try to get him to the AHL. He would improve a lot of 4th lines and PK units.

 

[Xerloris]

Yup. I was trying to say that we have 5 left handed D competing for 3 LD lineup spots and potentially also competing with Kessel for the #3 RD spot. My intention was to say that one of the three lefties fighting for a spot in the lineup could potentially earn a lineup spot by playing on their off side on the 3rd pair. I worded it poorly.

I think that Leddy, Parayko, and Faulk are locked in for top 4 roles. I also think that Broberg is a 99% lock to be an every day player on the left side. We'll see what what type of deployment and minutes total that brings, but you don't sign him to that contract to sit him in the press box more than the occasional 'night off to watch the game from up top' scratches.

That leaves Suter, Joseph, Perunovich, and Kessel all fighting for the last 2 spots in the lineup. Maybe throw Tucker into that battle, although I think that his best case scenario is to impress enough that he gets tabbed as the first AHL call up if/when that is needed. I think Kessel has the clear inside track to be the #3 RD based on his play from last year, but I do think that there is potential for Perunovich to grab that spot in camp. He played on the right side in college, so I could see Bannister liking a Suter-Perunovich or Joseph-Perunovich pairing enough to make Kessel the odd man out if he wants Perunovich running the top PP unit.

I don't see any scenario where Kessel plays his off side. I do see potential scenarios where he finds himself in the press box while two lefties are out there on the 3rd pair.

Probably my fault in the misunderstanding.

 

[Brian39]

Probably my fault in the misunderstanding.

Nah, I re-read my paragraph and it was brutally written lol.

 

[Frenzy31]

He played 73 games, averaged 14:23 a night, and was on our top PK unit. His 22 points isn't anything special, but that is very much bottom-of-the-lineup-NHL-player production. He wasn't worth his contract, I don't want to see him playing 14+ minutes a night again, and he wouldn't have gotten that many minutes on a better team.

He very well could find himself as the odd man out this year. But he was a legit NHL player last year. I think there is a pretty good chance he'd be claimed on waivers if we try to get him to the AHL. He would improve a lot of 4th lines and PK units.

He may be an NHl player, but he has had chances to establish himself as a top 6and he doesn’t have finishing skills. And this isn’t just with the Blues.

I don’t see him as a top PKer, maybe a fill in due to injury’s. And he really doesn’t offer the physical finishing of checks I want from the 4th line.

No loss if he is claimed. But I would bet he goes unclaimed.

 

[Reality Czech]

He played 73 games, averaged 14:23 a night, and was on our top PK unit. His 22 points isn't anything special, but that is very much bottom-of-the-lineup-NHL-player production. He wasn't worth his contract, I don't want to see him playing 14+ minutes a night again, and he wouldn't have gotten that many minutes on a better team.

He very well could find himself as the odd man out this year. But he was a legit NHL player last year. I think there is a pretty good chance he'd be claimed on waivers if we try to get him to the AHL. He would improve a lot of 4th lines and PK units.

Agree. It's become trendy to crap on Kap but he wasn't that bad last year. The issue wasn't his play but the fact that he got in the top 6 way too often. With his skill set he's probably one of the better 4th liners in the league and can have spot duty on the third line, although only when needed as an injury fill in. I like him a lot more at $1 million than what he was making last year. I'd be surprised if he wasn't in our opening night roster.

 

[AyeBah]

Agree. It's become trendy to crap on Kap but he wasn't that bad last year. The issue wasn't his play but the fact that he got in the top 6 way too often. With his skill set he's probably one of the better 4th liners in the league and can have spot duty on the third line, although only when needed as an injury fill in. I like him a lot more at $1 million than what he was making last year. I'd be surprised if he wasn't in our opening night roster.

Yeah having a guy on the 4th line who doesn't hit and is a defensive liability is a good gameplan

 

[Reality Czech]

Yeah having a guy on the 4th line who doesn't hit and is a defensive liability is a good gameplan

He was 7th among forwards with 64 hits and was a staple on our penalty kill but don't worry, 0 for 2 isn't that bad. No one is saying he's a great player but he's surely worth $1 million in a depth role.

 

[Xerloris]

Yeah having a guy on the 4th line who doesn't hit and is a defensive liability is a good gameplan

We're talking about Kapanen not Vrana.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

My issue is Kap is he feels like someone who is lost in no man's land or just being a warm body. He's fine in a bottom 6 role but I'd rather have other players we already have there instead.

 

[MissouriMook]

My issue is Kap is he feels like someone who is lost in no man's land or just being a warm body. He's fine in a bottom 6 role but I'd rather have other players we already have there instead.

This is where I am at with him. He felt overpaid last year for the role he was best suited for, but his contract for this season is fine. Still, there are other players with a long-term future in the organization that I feel would do just as well in the same role for the same (or slightly less) money, and furthering their development at the NHL level might be preferable. I see him as a placeholder that may no longer be necessary now that we've brought in Holloway to push him further down the lineup. I won't be surprised to see him as anywhere from the 10th to the 12th forward (in the lineup) the 13th-14th forward (in the press box) or the 15th forward (in the AHL). I feel like if he's the 15th forward, Army probably does him a solid and seeks a trade to a destination he would prefer (for future considerations) before he exposes him to waivers.

 

[AyeBah]

He was 7th among forwards with 64 hits and was a staple on our penalty kill but don't worry, 0 for 2 isn't that bad. No one is saying he's a great player but he's surely worth $1 million in a depth role.

Nah, glazing a bad player on a non-playoff team last year is crazy. With the added depth we signed/ and have amongst our prospects this guy should not touch the ice. But he was a "staple" on the 20th ranked PK so he must be a stud.

 

[blue zone]

As I doubt that Kapanen is a principal on the penalty kill this year, that really weakens his position on the team.

 

[Memento]

Y'all know my feelings on Kapanen. I'll just say that I hope Walker and Sunny take the depth forward roles from him and leave it at that.

 

[joe galiba]

As much as I love Sunny, he was already turtle slow before this last injury, is he going to be able to keep up anymore?

also, after a certain point, you want him to be able to walk when his career is over

 

[ChicagoBlues]

As much as I love Sunny, he was already turtle slow before this last injury, is he going to be able to keep up anymore?

also, after a certain point, you want him to be able to walk when his career is over

Fuh reeyo

Not counting on Sunny at all. God bless you, buddy! Take care of yourself and retire a Stanley Cup Champion.

 

[BlueDream]

Yeah I’m hoping Kapanen gets waived or traded. I really wonder if we would have bothered bringing him back if we knew we were getting Holloway, Joseph and Faksa. I kind of doubt it, so I wouldn’t be surprised to see Army move him in camp to a team that is looking for a depth forward. If we have lots of guys pushing for a spot, I could see a trade happening where we move out a vet.

To me he still kinda falls into the category of Hayes and Vrana. Like yeah I guess he’s better than those guys but he’s still a big bag of “meh”. He’s in that category of “been there, done that.” We know what he is and it’s not really anything we need. Time to turn the page and get a look at someone else.

I’d much rather give his spot to an unknown like Sylvegard and see what he’s got. At least there MIGHT be some potential there and at the very least, it sounds like he plays with the identity of a 4th liner that could be fun to watch.

 

[STL fan in MN]

Right now, I see Kapanen and Sunny as the 13th and 14th forwards.

I see 4 top-6 players: Thomas, Buchy, Kyrou and I guess Neighbours. Although he still only had 38 pts.

But I see 10 top-9 forwards: the 4 above + Schenn, Saad, Bolduc, Joseph, Holloway and Texier.

So either Bolduc doesn’t make it or someone that’s truly a 3rd line caliber player starts on the 4th line.

Faksa, Torpo, Kap and Sunny are 4th liners. As are Walker and Alexandrov if they figure into the mix.

Sylvegård is the wildcard IMO. We just don’t know what we have in him yet.

I doubt Dvorsky makes it but we’ll see. Same with Dean. Would be nice if a couple of the younger guys made a statement and made things interesting.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Right now, I see Kapanen and Sunny as the 13th and 14th forwards.

I see 4 top-6 players: Thomas, Buchy, Kyrou and I guess Neighbours. Although he still only had 38 pts.

But I see 10 top-9 forwards: the 4 above + Schenn, Saad, Bolduc, Joseph, Holloway and Texier.

So either Bolduc doesn’t make it or someone that’s truly a 3rd line caliber player starts on the 4th line.

Faksa, Torpo, Kap and Sunny are 4th liners. As are Walker and Alexandrov if they figure into the mix.

Sylvegård is the wildcard IMO. We just don’t know what we have in him yet.

I doubt Dvorsky makes it but we’ll see. Same with Dean. Would be nice if a couple of the younger guys made a statement and made things interesting.

I agree with both this and with @BlueDream. As much as we wouldn't truly miss Perunovich, we also wouldn't truly miss Kapanen. The 'however' in this is that, like you posted, Kap is a great 13th forward. I think Sunny is done. He may play a bit this season, just to give it a go, but ultimately retire some time during this season.

Keeping guys like Peru and Kap keeps the young guys hungry. DA needs to make sure Bolduc is hungry, while contributing to his confidence.

BD will get what he wants and that's a thinning of the herd, which I also want. But waiving Kap before someone else effectively "waives" themselves is premature.

I'm leaning toward Dvorsky as the last cut in Camp and starting in the AHL. I think being the last cut would be very exciting for him and a positively strategic move by DA.

 

[blue zone]

I think Sylvegard is the wild card here, and I think that Bolduc could easily start in the minors unless he has just a phenomenal camp.I think if Bolduc makes it, Saad could be traded pretty quickly along with Kapanen. Dvorsky is likely AHL bound to work on being a center against men.
Love Sunny, but the injuries are probably too much.
Schenn may end up our 3rd line center when the smoke clears.

 

[Brian39]

Right now, I see Kapanen and Sunny as the 13th and 14th forwards.

I see 4 top-6 players: Thomas, Buchy, Kyrou and I guess Neighbours. Although he still only had 38 pts.

But I see 10 top-9 forwards: the 4 above + Schenn, Saad, Bolduc, Joseph, Holloway and Texier.

So either Bolduc doesn’t make it or someone that’s truly a 3rd line caliber player starts on the 4th line.

Faksa, Torpo, Kap and Sunny are 4th liners. As are Walker and Alexandrov if they figure into the mix.

Sylvegård is the wildcard IMO. We just don’t know what we have in him yet.

I doubt Dvorsky makes it but we’ll see. Same with Dean. Would be nice if a couple of the younger guys made a statement and made things interesting.

I'd further differentiate the tiers and slide Neighbours down to Saad/Schenn's level. He is capable of playing a support role in the top 6, but he has too many holes for me to call him a top 6 player (especially if we are saying that Schenn and Saad aren't top 6 players). As much as Neighbours is trending in the right direction, he hasn't passed up Schenn and Saad as a player. Hopefully it happens this year, but it hasn't happened yet.

I have Thomas, Buch, Kyrou as clear top line guys. They are legit top line caliber players, but we might be best served splitting them up between 2 lines in the top 6. I think all 3 are capable of being 'the guy' on a top 6 line.

I have Neighbours, Schenn, and Saad as low end top 6 or good middle 6 guys. They can be the 3rd/support guy on a top line that has 2 legit top line caliber players, they can pull their own weight on a 2nd line, and they can be the lead player on a 3rd line.

Then my next tier is Bolduc, Joseph, Holloway, and Texier and I'd describe them as low end middle 6 guys. You don't want them as the 3rd/support guy on a top line unless you have 2 absolute studs with them AND are intentionally distributing talent through all 3 top 9 lines. More realistically, these are 3rd line guys with some upside to genuinely contribute as a support guy on the 2nd line. I could see any of these guys getting plugged onto any line in the top 9.

Faksa and Torpo are the only two guys in my 'bottom 6' tier. I think that they are practically locks to make the lineup. Most likely on the 4th line, but both have the potential to slide into the 3rd line if Bannister wants to roll 4 lines rather than a traditional banger/grinder 4th line.

Kap, Sunny, Walker, Alexandrov are all 4th liner or 'extra' guys.

Dvorsky, Dean, and the rest of the guys are all wildcards to me.

 

[STL fan in MN]

I'd further differentiate the tiers and slide Neighbours down to Saad/Schenn's level. He is capable of playing a support role in the top 6, but he has too many holes for me to call him a top 6 player (especially if we are saying that Schenn and Saad aren't top 6 players. As much as Neighbours is trending in the right direction, he hasn't passed up Schenn and Saad as a player. Hopefully it happens this year, but it hasn't happened yet.

I have Thomas, Buch, Kyrou as clear top line guys. They are legit top line caliber players, but we might be best served splitting them up between 2 lines in the top 6. I think all 3 are capable of being 'the guy' on a top 6 line.

I have Neighbours, Schenn, and Saad as low end top 6 or good middle 6 guys. They can be the 3rd/support guy on a top line that has 2 legit top line caliber players, they can pull their own weight on a 2nd line, and they can be the lead player on a 3rd line.

Then my next tier is Bolduc, Joseph, Holloway, and Texier and I'd describe them as low end middle 6 guys. You don't want them as the 3rd/support guy on a top line unless you have 2 absolute studs with them AND are intentionally distributing talent through all 3 top 9 lines. More realistically, these are 3rd line guys with some upside to genuinely contribute as a support guy on the 2nd line. I could see any of these guys getting plugged onto any line.

Faksa and Torpo are the only two guys in my 'bottom 6' tier. I think that they are practically locks to make the lineup. Most likely on the 4th line, but both have the potential to slide into the 3rd line if Bannister wants to roll 4 lines rather than a traditional banger/grinder 4th line.

Kap, Sunny, Walker, Alexandrov are all 4th liner or 'extra' guys.

Dvorsky, Dean, and the rest of the guys are all wildcards to me.

That’s more than fair regarding Neighbours. We tend to get enamored with his goals but assists count too. And he only had 11 assists last season which was 14th on the team. Fewer than Sunny, Hayes and Kapanen.

And while I expect his shooting % to stay above league average given how he scores his goals, I don’t think it’s likely he maintains 18.6% shooting.

 

[joe galiba]

That’s more than fair regarding Neighbours. We tend to get enamored with his goals but assists count too. And he only had 11 assists last season which was 14th on the team. Fewer than Sunny, Hayes and Kapanen.

And while I expect his shooting % to stay above league average given how he scores his goals, I don’t think it’s likely he maintains 18.6% shooting.

I thought his play, other than going to the net and post whistle scrums, was just meh,
he was just 21 so there is room to improve

 

[Reality Czech]

Nah, glazing a bad player on a non-playoff team last year is crazy. With the added depth we signed/ and have amongst our prospects this guy should not touch the ice. But he was a "staple" on the 20th ranked PK so he must be a stud.

Sorry that a depth player making a million dollars bothers you so much. You don't want good prospects playing on the fourth line, so who would he be blocking exactly? Guess everyone needs a whipping boy.

If someone performs well and steals his job great, but there's little harm to having him around for now.

 

[Brian39]

That’s more than fair regarding Neighbours. We tend to get enamored with his goals but assists count too. And he only had 11 assists last season which was 14th on the team. Fewer than Sunny, Hayes and Kapanen.

And while I expect his shooting % to stay above league average given how he scores his goals, I don’t think it’s likely he maintains 18.6% shooting.

I think he plays a style where he could maintain a career shooting percentage around 15% (which is very rare). However, if that happens it would mean that he continues to pass up a lot of shooting opportunities and/or continues to do little to create offense/opportunities with the puck on his stick outside of the low slot area. I think that his long-term path to being a consistent 25+ goal guy is to round out the rest of his offensive game so that he can increase shot volume and become less predictable with the puck on his stick.

I'd much rather see him hit the 20+ assist mark and improve his own-zone defensive instincts next year than repeat the 25+ goal mark and/or shooting percentage.

 

[BlueDream]

Sorry that a depth player making a million dollars bothers you so much. You don't want good prospects playing on the fourth line, so who would he be blocking exactly? Guess everyone needs a whipping boy.

If someone performs well and steals his job great, but there's little harm to having him around for now.

lol your homerism is top notch on every single topic. You get so aggravated anytime someone criticizes a Blues player.

People can have their own opinions and dislike depth players, it’s not gonna kill you.