GDT: 2024-25 season game 30 LA Kings vs New York Rangers @10:00am 12/14/24

[kingsholygrail]

Faber is the new Cernak.

 

[Herby]

Oh, I get it now ... GMs are supposed to have a crystal ball and use it appropriately prior to a trade.

So again, even yourself who is self-proclaimed expert of all that is hockey....YOU GOT IT WRONG TOO, YES?

Me, I still don't have a problem with it, Kings needed a top-6 winger, they got one...Blake addressed an issue. Still love Fiala.

Didn't @All The Kings Men in a recent podcast he doesn't remember Faber at all in last game? Yah, me either.

No, never said that, GM's win and lose some trades, you can't win them all. But the Faber trade was very clearly a huge loss (Blake's worst as GM of the Kings). Anybody who is not a complete and total homer can see this.

When did I ever self proclaim myself "The expert of all that is hockey", sorry some of us like to have intelligent hockey discussions with other fans on this forum, and some would rather act like a pathetic troll on a hockey forum. That is the existence you have made for yourself in this community.

Oh, and one fan didn't remember Faber in one game, OMG stop the presses, kick him off the best vs best team he just made when he is (to quote your pathetic line) "barely old enough to buy a beer" and stop payment on his contract extension for next season, he clearly sucks.

Faber is the new Cernak.

I don't think this is a fair statement, Faber is better in just about all facets of the game. Faber was calder runner up last year, just made a loaded Team USA in a best vs best at 22 and signed an extension that fits a star defenseman. Cernak is a 2nd pairing defender.

To put it in historical Kings bad-trade perspective, Faber was like giving away Larry Murphy, Cernak was like giving away Garry Galley.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

No, never said that, GM's win and lose some trades, you can't win them all. But the Faber trade was very clearly a huge loss (Blake's worst as GM of the Kings). Anybody who is not a complete and total homer can see this.

Respectfully disagree - the PLD debacle is Blake's worst (it's not even close) and may go down as being in top 5 of worst trades in Kings history.

Community.....lol.

 

[Kingfan1967]

Respectfully disagree - the PLD debacle is Blake's worst (it's not even close) and may go down as being in top 5 of worst trades in Kings history.

Community.....lol.

This so much , with the Fiala trade we can see the logic even if in hindsight it was a "bad" trade , PLD was so much worst at first glance , and the poor results elevated it to one of the worst in LA's history, the 8th overall for Graeme is the all time fubar though .

 

[Buddy The Elf]

Yeah, I have to agree. Not that it matters but at least Fiala is still contributing to the team and has since he came to the Kings. The Kings essentially gave away two useful players (one with quite a bit of upside) for a 3rd liner making $8M a year.

 

[yankeeking]

I wouldn't think either axl or herby were born yet when that trade for Ron g went down

and the value might be close for the fiala trade and the PLD trades BUT THE LEVEL OF STUPIDITY of the PLD trade makes it one of the worst, everyone but Blake knew that one was historically bad especially losing Gabe V,

 

[BaileyFan]

Man how sad is it that there is a legitimate case to be made that gifting away one of the best young RHD in the game AND a 1st in exchange for a liability might actually not be the worst trade in a calendar year, let alone the last decade, for the somehow still currently gainfully employed GM of our hockey team?

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

IMO, Turcotte's performance on Saturday should grant him at least a 4-5 game extended look on the top line with Kopitar and Kempe.

Going to be very frustrated if Hiller throws Turcotte back on the 4th line and Moore right back up to the first line when Moore's back. Idc if it means Moore spends a couple games on the 4th line.

Turcotte has the speed, skill, and hockey IQ to keep up with 9 and 11. He brings a lot of energy to that line and was particularly great last game in transition - helping to push the pace up the ice when the Kings got possession.

It's also very low risk/high reward. If Turcotte can find a way to stick on that line, that would be absolutely massive for the Kings. It would also be massive for Turcotte - who would likely see a boost in offensive production due to the elevated minutes with highly skilled linemates. So far this year, Turcotte has helped improve every line he's been placed on - Let's see if he can have the same effect continually on our top line.

Turcotte could end up being a speedier, more skilled version of Iafallo with 11 and 9.

 

[Herby]

IMO, Turcotte's performance on Saturday should grant him at least a 4-5 game extended look on the top line with Kopitar and Kempe.

Going to be very frustrated if Hiller throws Turcotte back on the 4th line and Moore right back up to the first line when Moore's back. Idc if it means Moore spends a couple games on the 4th line.

Turcotte has the speed, skill, and hockey IQ to keep up with 9 and 11. He brings a lot of energy to that line and was particularly great last game in transition - helping to push the pace up the ice when the Kings got possession.

It's also very low risk/high reward. If Turcotte can find a way to stick on that line, that would be absolutely massive for the Kings. It would also be massive for Turcotte - who would likely see a boost in offensive production due to the elevated minutes with highly skilled linemates. So far this year, Turcotte has helped improve every line he's been placed on - Let's see if he can have the same effect continually on our top line.

Turcotte could end up being a speedier, more skilled version of Iafallo with 11 and 9.

He'd be a lot more useful in that role if Kopitar and Kempe were higher tier offensive players (that is not his fault obv), say if the Kings had the Avs roster, he'd be a nice badger type player to compliment the superstars. The problem is, Kopitar has slowed down the second half the last couple of years and then you suddenly have a limited offensive player in Turcotte on the 1st line in addition to that. The more offense that Moore (or potentially QB) provides does become a big difference to the overall success of line 1, also Moore can play a pretty similar energy game to Turcotte, not quite the motor and tenacity as Turcotte, but less a difference than the difference in offense.

With all that being said, I really think a goal-scoring wing upgrade for Kopi and Kempe is going to be addressed at the deadline if the Kings remain in this spot. I know many people aren't going to like that, especially since the return is probably going to involve the 2025 first, but you guys really think Blake with no cemented fututre with the team is going to keep a 1st round pick. Unless he is specifically restricted from trading it, how can they justify keeping it?

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

He'd be a lot more useful in that role if Kopitar and Kempe were higher tier offensive players (that is not his fault obv), say if the Kings had the Avs roster, he'd be a nice badger type player to compliment the superstars. The problem is, Kopitar has slowed down the second half the last couple of years and then you suddenly have a limited offensive player in Turcotte on the 1st line in addition to that. The more offense that Moore (or potentially QB) provides does become a big difference to the overall success of line 1, also Moore can play a pretty similar energy game to Turcotte, not quite the motor and tenacity as Turcotte, but less a difference than the difference in offense.

With all that being said, I really think a goal-scoring wing upgrade for Kopi and Kempe is going to be addressed at the deadline if the Kings remain in this spot. I know many people aren't going to like that, especially since the return is probably going to involve the 2025 first, but you guys really think Blake with no cemented fututre with the team is going to keep a 1st round pick. Unless he is specifically restricted from trading it, how can they justify keeping it?

yeah at this point there would be no point in keeping it, he's all-in invested with little to no help on the way after trading away damn near everything worthwhile between ages 20-24. I've already accepted that we're not going to hve this year or next years' 1st/2nd round picks and though they'll be nice ELCs I could see Greentree and/or Ziemmer gone too (i know the org is high on them).

We are pot committed to 'window open' whether it is or not for the next few years before the next rebuild.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

He'd be a lot more useful in that role if Kopitar and Kempe were higher tier offensive players (that is not his fault obv), say if the Kings had the Avs roster, he'd be a nice badger type player to compliment the superstars. The problem is, Kopitar has slowed down the second half the last couple of years and then you suddenly have a limited offensive player in Turcotte on the 1st line in addition to that. The more offense that Moore (or potentially QB) provides does become a big difference to the overall success of line 1, also Moore can play a pretty similar energy game to Turcotte, not quite the motor and tenacity as Turcotte, but less a difference than the difference in offense.

With all that being said, I really think a goal-scoring wing upgrade for Kopi and Kempe is going to be addressed at the deadline if the Kings remain in this spot. I know many people aren't going to like that, especially since the return is probably going to involve the 2025 first, but you guys really think Blake with no cemented fututre with the team is going to keep a 1st round pick. Unless he is specifically restricted from trading it, how can they justify keeping it?

They can’t…the future is now.

 

[KopitarGOAT420]

Turcotte might have more offensive upside then we realize...

To me, Turcotte is the perfect complimentary player to really any line because of how hard he works and how he's constantly involved in the play.

I feel like Turcotte is the kind of player where - the more offense you surround him with - the more offensively productive he's going to be. Sure, you could say that about any player - But I think this is especially true for Alex Turcotte.

This is a player who does all the dirty work and makes his linemates' lives much easier. We saw in the World Juniors (years ago, but still) how he drove that line with Zegras and Kaliyev and produced at roughly a point/game pace as a result. He was rewarded with points because his play allowed the game to open up offensively for Zegras and Kaliyev. The same could 100% be the case when you put him with Kopitar and Kempe. All of the sudden their lives become easier because they have a linemate who's a puck hound with a great motor and those two can focus more on generating offense - Which Turcotte will inevitably benefit from.

And he's honestly a pretty skilled player in his own right. His shot isn't heavy but he's proven he can pick corners. His playmaking/passing is very solid. He's a great skater and is good in transition. It's really not that crazy to think he could produce at a pretty solid level offensively if he was given an extended look in the top 6.

 

[Schrute farms]

... because you don't want to admit your beloved GM made one of the worst trades in the NHL in the last decade, so your opinion on the player is way more ridiculous than even his biggest detractors.

It's a dead end and wasted conversation. Just like for years he claimed how great TMac was right up until he was fired. Now Hiller is the new best thing to happen to the Kings hockey franchise. ("The King is dead, long live the new King!")

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

It's a dead end and wasted conversation. Just like for years he claimed how great TMac was right up until he was fired. Now Hiller is the new best thing to happen to the Kings hockey franchise. ("The King is dead, long live the new King!")

Actually, wrong. I still don't put the 'blame' on Todd...thought he did a fine job and was/is a good coach.

Maybe Hiller is even better, good for us....but you guys will still find a way to shit on him because that's what you are good at. Yay.

 

[Statto]

Oh, I get it now ... GMs are supposed to have a crystal ball and use it appropriately prior to a trade.

So again, even yourself who is self-proclaimed expert of all that is hockey....YOU GOT IT WRONG TOO, YES?

Me, I still don't have a problem with it, Kings needed a top-6 winger, they got one...Blake addressed an issue. Still love Fiala.

Didn't @All The Kings Men in a recent podcast say he didn't remember Faber at all in last game? Yah, me either.

Bigger picture is that Herby soured on the deal incredibly quickly. He saw very early the following season IIRC that it was a misstep.

No Blake shouldn’t have a crystal ball but he should be far more informed than us.

I felt at the time of the trade (or just after) that it was value but without the pick. I had Faber as a #3 D on a good side but did not think he was a top pairing guy.

I personally think Blake has been a bit lose with the picks. Both in the Faber and PLD trades. Neither of his two biggest deals has aged well even if you/we/I/anyone liked them at the time.

 

[chris kontos]

He'd be a lot more useful in that role if Kopitar and Kempe were higher tier offensive players (that is not his fault obv), say if the Kings had the Avs roster, he'd be a nice badger type player to compliment the superstars. The problem is, Kopitar has slowed down the second half the last couple of years and then you suddenly have a limited offensive player in Turcotte on the 1st line in addition to that. The more offense that Moore (or potentially QB) provides does become a big difference to the overall success of line 1, also Moore can play a pretty similar energy game to Turcotte, not quite the motor and tenacity as Turcotte, but less a difference than the difference in offense.

With all that being said, I really think a goal-scoring wing upgrade for Kopi and Kempe is going to be addressed at the deadline if the Kings remain in this spot. I know many people aren't going to like that, especially since the return is probably going to involve the 2025 first, but you guys really think Blake with no cemented fututre with the team is going to keep a 1st round pick. Unless he is specifically restricted from trading it, how can they justify keeping it?

Kaliyev will be the goal scoring wing

 

[Schrute farms]

Actually, wrong. I still don't put the 'blame' on Todd...thought he did a fine job and was/is a good coach.

Maybe Hiller is even better, good for us....but you guys will still find a way to shit on him because that's what you are good at. Yay.

I didn't say that YOU did not like TMac at the end. Just that your boy Blake did not -- because the dude got canned mid-season by Blake.

I also have not said one single bad word about Hiller and his coaching. Time will tell. So i'm not sure this "you guys" is coming from. I honestly don't know enough about his coaching yet. Last year taking over mid-way is a tough position to be in and evaluate a guy. This year it's been too early to claim greatness (nor "shit on him" as you seem to think everyone is doing).

 

[bland]

Bigger picture is that Herby soured on the deal incredibly quickly. He saw very early the following season IIRC that it was a misstep.

No Blake shouldn’t have a crystal ball but he should be far more informed than us.

I felt at the time of the trade (or just after) that it was value but without the pick. I had Faber as a #3 D on a good side but did not think he was a top pairing guy.

I personally think Blake has been a bit lose with the picks. Both in the Faber and PLD trades. Neither of his two biggest deals has aged well even if you/we/I/anyone liked them at the time.

It didn't take a crystal ball to see all the holes in Fiala's game. He had a well-known book out on him, and surprise, surprise, it held true.

That deal suffered from the same exact hubris that brought in Dubois. And I don't think it's the "we can change him" kind, but more of the "well OUR analytics say..." garbage.

 

[FSL KINGS]

It didn't take a crystal ball to see all the holes in Fiala's game. He had a well-known book out on him, and surprise, surprise, it held true.

That deal suffered from the same exact hubris that brought in Dubois. And I don't think it's the "we can change him" kind, but more of the "well OUR analytics say..." garbage.

It doesn't take a crystal ball to see Faber plays small. After watching Doughty for almost 2 decades, just sick of that game.

PL got rid of Todd so it wasn't a complete loss.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

It didn't take a crystal ball to see all the holes in Fiala's game. He had a well-known book out on him, and surprise, surprise, it held true.

You mean the book that had him at 0.9 PPG in last 3 seasons? On par with what Kopitar and Kempe output? ARE WE REALLY IMPLYING THAT'S A BAD THING?? Holy f***....

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Turcotte might have more offensive upside then we realize...

To me, Turcotte is the perfect complimentary player to really any line because of how hard he works and how he's constantly involved in the play.

I feel like Turcotte is the kind of player where - the more offense you surround him with - the more offensively productive he's going to be. Sure, you could say that about any player - But I think this is especially true for Alex Turcotte.

This is a player who does all the dirty work and makes his linemates' lives much easier. We saw in the World Juniors (years ago, but still) how he drove that line with Zegras and Kaliyev and produced at roughly a point/game pace as a result. He was rewarded with points because his play allowed the game to open up offensively for Zegras and Kaliyev. The same could 100% be the case when you put him with Kopitar and Kempe. All of the sudden their lives become easier because they have a linemate who's a puck hound with a great motor and those two can focus more on generating offense - Which Turcotte will inevitably benefit from.

And he's honestly a pretty skilled player in his own right. His shot isn't heavy but he's proven he can pick corners. His playmaking/passing is very solid. He's a great skater and is good in transition. It's really not that crazy to think he could produce at a pretty solid level offensively if he was given an extended look in the top 6.

I mean a guy that is that plug and play is super valuable, look at how happy everyone is with Foegele for example. YOu need to fill out your roster with guys like that and Turcotte is an amplifier. You put him with Lee and Jeannot and they won't score much but they'll drive play; you put him with an elite trigger man and you'll see some numbers because he's a terrific playmaker since he can create the turnover and quick strike a pass with his great vision.

I got absolutely nuked for holding that WJC opinon but I think it holds true now even more than ever.

I just think he's lacking elite offensive tools. His shot is a muffin. But he has an elite hockey brain and sense and I don't think he'll ever be a PPG guy but my predraft prediction was a Toews/Richards type and right now that's not seeming so far flung.