Blue Jays Discussion: 2024-25 Off-season: The free agent watch begins (and sometimes old baseball radio broadcasts)

[ER89]

The biggest problem with that lineup, even if you move him out of the leadoff spot, is Springer. The 2-3-4 are obviously a strength. Wagner has obvious offensive upside and can play a couple different positions. The bottom 4 are elite defenders who project to have roughly average bats. Nothing wrong with that.

Springer would make a nice 4th OF, but they're not going to do that. He has the bat of the bottom four without the defense or versatility. It's frustrating that even if they add someone else, he won't be the one to see his playing time drop off.

What are the odds he produces a 115-120 WRC+ season?

 

[Discoverer]

What are the odds he produces a 115-120 WRC+ season?

Considering he's 35 and coming off a 95 wRC+ (and 104 the year before)... pretty slim.

 

[ER89]

Considering he's 35 and coming off a 95 wRC+ (and 104 the year before)... pretty slim.

Yep. Just a tough contract. Ah well

 

[TopCheeseShotta]

With all the "always a bridesmaid never a bride" drama the Jays have taken on the last 2 seasons - Jeff Blair opined that the Jays are better today than at any time last year. It's not nearly better enough to amke a marked difference mayne, but they are theoretically better on paper with the off-season so far.

That all i got... lol

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Puckstuff]

I'd put Gimenez up top. None of them are ideal, and neither are good options, but Gimenez has a similar OBP to Springer but he can give you 140-150 hits and steal 30 bases. But the big thing is just getting Springer out of that lead off spot so he has less Ab's/per game which could help him stay healthy. I think the lead off hitter gets around an extra 40-50ish ab's per season compared to guys in the bottom of the order.

1. 2B - Gimenez
2. SS - Bichette
3. 1B - Guerrero Jr.
4. RF - Santander
5. C - Kirk
6. DH - Wagner/Martinez
7. LF - Springer
8. CF - Varsho
9. 3B - Clement

 

[Nineteen67]

We are paying Straw $11 million for his glove, no way we are putting Vlad at 3B lol

Buy Vlad won’t be playing in Buffalo.

I'd put Gimenez up top. None of them are ideal, and neither are good options, but Gimenez has a similar OBP to Springer but he can give you 140-150 hits and steal 30 bases. But the big thing is just getting Springer out of that lead off spot so he has less Ab's/per game which could help him stay healthy. I think the lead off hitter gets around an extra 40-50ish ab's per season compared to guys in the bottom of the order.

1. 2B - Gimenez
2. SS - Bichette
3. 1B - Guerrero Jr.
4. RF - Santander
5. C - Kirk
6. DH - Wagner/Martinez
7. LF - Springer
8. CF - Varsho
9. 3B - Clement

500 will be tough unless Bo and Flop are both in the conversation for MVP. Springer shouldn’t be in the everyday lineup.

 

[aingefan]

I'd put Gimenez up top. None of them are ideal, and neither are good options, but Gimenez has a similar OBP to Springer but he can give you 140-150 hits and steal 30 bases. But the big thing is just getting Springer out of that lead off spot so he has less Ab's/per game which could help him stay healthy. I think the lead off hitter gets around an extra 40-50ish ab's per season compared to guys in the bottom of the order.

1. 2B - Gimenez
2. SS - Bichette
3. 1B - Guerrero Jr.
4. RF - Santander
5. C - Kirk
6. DH - Wagner/Martinez
7. LF - Springer
8. CF - Varsho
9. 3B - Clement

I fear it may go this way, having Gimenez at the top….maybe because of the contract or whatever, but I think Wagner has the best eye of the leadoff options (at least during his development). I hope he gets up there in time.
Props for getting OMart in your lineup, too. Guys got legit power, the suspension seems to have really dulled perception about him, but he can hit.

 

[Puckstuff]

Buy Vlad won’t be playing in Buffalo.


500 will be tough unless Bo and Flop are both in the conversation for MVP. Springer shouldn’t be in the everyday lineup.

Bo being Bo is +4 wins
Santander +3 wins
Giménez +3 wins (Biggio/Schneider struggled last year)
Bullpen +5 wins (the bullpen had negative WAR last year and was last in the league, so even improving from 30th to 25th best would add about 5 wins)

That's 15 WAR right there.

We didn’t really lose much. If we get Quintana, that would be a good Kikuchi replacement.

We really need a starter imo, but I think there's a path back to 86-88 wins. It's going to be another competitive division lead by Ny and probably Baltimore. Boston is better as well.

 

[Nineteen67]

Bo being Bo is +4 wins
Santander +3 wins
Giménez +3 wins (Biggio/Schneider struggled last year)
Bullpen +5 wins (the bullpen had negative WAR last year and was last in the league, so even improving from 30th to 25th best would add about 5 wins)

That's 15 WAR right there.

We didn’t really lose much. If we get Quintana, that would be a good Kikuchi replacement.

We really need a starter imo, but I think there's a path back to 86-88 wins. It's going to be another competitive division lead by Ny and probably Baltimore. Boston is better as well.

Bo has to be really good, and healthy, and Flop can’t wait until they’re out of contention before he hits. If that happens then 82 wins isn’t out of the question.

 

[saska sault]

Bo has to be really good, and healthy, and Flop can’t wait until they’re out of contention before he hits. If that happens then 82 wins isn’t out of the question.

Who is Flop?

 

[Discoverer]

Bo has to be really good, and healthy, and Flop can’t wait until they’re out of contention before he hits. If that happens then 82 wins isn’t out of the question.

Vlad started hitting before the end of April when the Jays were .500.

 

[Ale Brew]

Who is Flop?

I was wondering the same thing. Must be Vlad “autocorrected”.

 

[Discoverer]

I was wondering the same thing. Must be Vlad “autocorrected”.

It's not an autocorrect. A couple people here seem to think it's a funny nickname or something.

 

[Ale Brew]

It's not an autocorrect. A couple people here seem to think it's a funny nickname or something.

Classy

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Sorry to derail the convo, I just wanted to say no way Straw is ahead of Classe or Lukes. Those 2 would have to be injured or complete shit during ST games for Straw to actually start games in CF while Varsho is out.

 

[Bjindaho]

 

[Ale Brew]

The Dodgers situation is getting comical now. I guess the cash from the Shohei effect allows them to just sign whoever they want. They arguably now have the best lineup, rotation, and bullpen in MLB.

 

[Bjindaho]

Sorry to derail the convo, I just wanted to say no way Straw is ahead of Classe or Lukes. Those 2 would have to be injured or complete shit during ST games for Straw to actually start games in CF while Varsho is out.

Clase is actually faster than Straw. Straw has been around an average CF the last two seasons (played full-time 2 years ago), so unless he was hurt, there has been a dropoff.

 

[Discoverer]

Straw isn't the worst option as the last man on the roster exclusively as a pinch-runner and defensive replacement who almost never comes to the plate.

CF while Varsho is out should be some combination of Lukes/Loperfido/Clase. I would guess it's Lukes and Loperfido with Clase getting full-time AB in Buffalo.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

The Dodgers are in full-blown video game mode now.

I'd say I'm more jealous and envious than pissed at this point.

 

[tmlfan98]

Straw isn't the worst option as the last man on the roster exclusively as a pinch-runner and defensive replacement who almost never comes to the plate.

CF while Varsho is out should be some combination of Lukes/Loperfido/Clase. I would guess it's Lukes and Loperfido with Clase getting full-time AB in Buffalo.

Personally, I doubt the Jays are going to let Straw reach 5 years of service time. Giving a player with a bad contract like that the option to refuse minor league assignments is useless IMO. He's currently at 4 years and 125 days per FanGraphs, and 1 year of service time in MLB is 172 days IIRC.

I think the Jays would use any of Loperfido, Clase, Lukes, and maybe even Springer in CF, over letting Straw inch closer to 5 years of service time while Varsho is out.

 

[hockeywiz542]

Buster Olney: Santander signing could backfire if Blue Jays aren’t able to extend Vladdy | TSN

Even though the Toronto Blue Jays desperately needed to make a splash after being rebuffed by many of their top targets already, was adding Anthony Santander the right move? That depends, according to ESPN’s Buster Olney.

www.tsn.ca

The Toronto Blue Jays filled a major need Monday when they signed power-hitting outfielder Anthony Santander to a five-year deal.

But even though Toronto desperately needed to make a splash after being rebuffed by many of their top targets already, was adding Santander the right move? That depends, according to ESPN’s Buster Olney.

Olney explained that while Santander fills a major need on the Blue Jays’ current roster, it could end up being a contract they’re looking to get out of in short time, depending on how things go the rest of the off-season.

“The micro level, they get a good player who clearly is an improvement over what they had. He’s a power hitter; he adds balance from the left side and he’s known as a good clubhouse guy,” Olney told TSN 1050 Toronto’s First Up Tuesday morning.

“That’s on the micro side. The macro side, I mean, it’s almost like we forecast this in our previous conversation. Like at some point, are they going to wind up overpaying Santander to a contract that in six or eight months they’ll be looking to get out of.”

A 30-year-old outfielder coming off a 44-homer season in 2024, Santander officially signed with the Jays Monday on a five-year, $92.5 million deal that includes an opt-out clause and a 2030 team option with escalators and deferred money.

According to Olney, it’s a deal that makes a lot more sense if star first baseman Vladimir Guerrero Jr. is signed long-term.

“If they don’t sign Vladimir Guerrero Jr., okay, and they’re forced into a decision at some point in the next six months to trade him, what you’re going to have at the end of the year is potentially the same problem – not really having the core guys locked up – and now you have [Santander] signed to a long-term deal that clearly other teams don’t want to give him. The order of operations needs to go backwards."

 

[phillipmike]

The Dodgers are in full-blown video game mode now.

I'd say I'm more jealous and envious than pissed at this point.

I get why people are pissed because it isnt us and we lost many players to the Dodgers. But this is what every organization should strive to be. If this was us we would be laughing and thumbing our nose to the rest of the league.

If anyone doesnt like it then scout, draft, develop, trade, and acquire better players? Dodgers are getting them, then offer more money or make your team more attractive. Hard to feel sorry for other teams with billionaire owners.

A salary cap isnt the way either. It has ruined hockey and player movement.

 

[tmlfan98]

Buster Olney: Santander signing could backfire if Blue Jays aren’t able to extend Vladdy | TSN

Even though the Toronto Blue Jays desperately needed to make a splash after being rebuffed by many of their top targets already, was adding Anthony Santander the right move? That depends, according to ESPN’s Buster Olney.

www.tsn.ca

The Toronto Blue Jays filled a major need Monday when they signed power-hitting outfielder Anthony Santander to a five-year deal.

But even though Toronto desperately needed to make a splash after being rebuffed by many of their top targets already, was adding Santander the right move? That depends, according to ESPN’s Buster Olney.

Olney explained that while Santander fills a major need on the Blue Jays’ current roster, it could end up being a contract they’re looking to get out of in short time, depending on how things go the rest of the off-season.

“The micro level, they get a good player who clearly is an improvement over what they had. He’s a power hitter; he adds balance from the left side and he’s known as a good clubhouse guy,” Olney told TSN 1050 Toronto’s First Up Tuesday morning.

“That’s on the micro side. The macro side, I mean, it’s almost like we forecast this in our previous conversation. Like at some point, are they going to wind up overpaying Santander to a contract that in six or eight months they’ll be looking to get out of.”

A 30-year-old outfielder coming off a 44-homer season in 2024, Santander officially signed with the Jays Monday on a five-year, $92.5 million deal that includes an opt-out clause and a 2030 team option with escalators and deferred money.

According to Olney, it’s a deal that makes a lot more sense if star first baseman Vladimir Guerrero Jr. is signed long-term.

“If they don’t sign Vladimir Guerrero Jr., okay, and they’re forced into a decision at some point in the next six months to trade him, what you’re going to have at the end of the year is potentially the same problem – not really having the core guys locked up – and now you have [Santander] signed to a long-term deal that clearly other teams don’t want to give him. The order of operations needs to go backwards."

The media is reaching too hard to grasp at negatives here. I am extremely anti-Shatkins, but even I can admit that there is no way to reasonably spin getting Anthony Santander at only $14M AAV over a minimum of 3 years into a negative.

If the media wants to continue pushing negatives they should just refuse to let up on the Myles Straw thing. Push the narrative hard of: "However much they spend, Straw's $7.75M AAV could have been spent elsewhere."

This anti-Santander narrative is just weird and a massive reach.