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Blue Jays Discussion: 2024-25 Off-season: The free agent watch begins (and sometimes old baseball radio broadcasts)

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Suntouchable13 said:
Sorry to derail the convo, I just wanted to say no way Straw is ahead of Classe or Lukes. Those 2 would have to be injured or complete shit during ST games for Straw to actually start games in CF while Varsho is out.
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I just speak for me, but I don’t see him as a starter for Varsho while he recovers, but a bench guy when Varsho is back. I see Lukes splitting time with Springer in a corner spot. My secret hope is Steward Berroa gets a run to start the year, he’s continued to develop and can really fly. Plus, sentimentally, I’ve followed him since his days in the DSL.
My instinct is the FO will want to get the near ready bats some consistent AB’s to start the year in AAA…..unless they really run away with the spring.
 
phillipmike said:
I get why people are pissed because it isnt us and we lost many players to the Dodgers. But this is what ever organization should strive to be. If this was us we would be laughing and thumbing our nose to the rest of the league.

If anyone doesnt like it then scout, draft, develop, trade, and acquire better players? Dodgers are getting them, then offer more money. Hard to feel sorry for other teams with billionaire owners.

A salary cap isnt the way either. It has ruined hockey and player movement.
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Wholeheartedly agree with all of this.
 
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Last time I felt as deflated as a Toronto sports fan was when GS Warriors added DeMarcus Cousins in the offseason on top of their core of Durant, Curry, Klay, Draymond and Iguodala.

We ended up winning the Chip that year.
 
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TheTotalPackage said:
Wholeheartedly agree with all of this.
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Plus the Dodgers won 2 WS in 35 years coming in 2020 and 2024. They were seen as a laughing stock organization from 1989 to the early 2010s. Then they hired the best management in the game, spent the most money and drafted and developed better than anyone and still won nothing from 2014 to 2019 losing in back to back WS in 2017 to the cheating Astros and 2018 to the cheating Red Sox. They lost out on a Kemp MVP to a cheating Braun too. Then when they finally won in 2020, people said it doesnt count because it was a shortened season, COVID championship.

They changed their circumstances. Other team should aspire to be what the Dodgers are not as the league to put rules in to prevent great management from making great decisions.
 
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tmlfan98 said:
Personally, I doubt the Jays are going to let Straw reach 5 years of service time. Giving a player with a bad contract like that the option to refuse minor league assignments is useless IMO. He's currently at 4 years and 125 days per FanGraphs, and 1 year of service time in MLB is 172 days IIRC.

I think the Jays would use any of Loperfido, Clase, Lukes, and maybe even Springer in CF, over letting Straw inch closer to 5 years of service time while Varsho is out.
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There's a weird situation here, where until Toronto actually puts him on their 40 man, he is sitting in limbo.
 
tmlfan98 said:
The media is reaching too hard to grasp at negatives here. I am extremely anti-Shatkins, but even I can admit that there is no way to reasonably spin getting Anthony Santander at only $14M AAV over a minimum of 3 years into a negative.

If the media wants to continue pushing negatives they should just refuse to let up on the Myles Straw thing. Push the narrative hard of: "However much they spend, Straw's $7.75M AAV could have been spent elsewhere."

This anti-Santander narrative is just weird and a massive reach.
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Yeah, it wasn't unreasonable to think the Jays were going to have to overpay to get the guy they wanted, and most people in the media seemed to be actively advocating for it, as if it would be a tough move to make but they had no choice.

Now they got one of the guys they wanted without overpaying - factoring in deferrals, they actually signed him to a much better contract than he was expected to get - and we're getting these pivots to "They must have been desperate and they might regret this move". It's like Olney had this all in mind in case they spent $150 million on Santander and just didn't bother adjusting.
 
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Discoverer said:
Yeah, it wasn't unreasonable to think the Jays were going to have to overpay to get the guy they wanted, and most people in the media seemed to be actively advocating for it, as if it would be a tough move to make but they had no choice.

Now they got one of the guys they wanted without overpaying - factoring in deferrals, they actually signed him to a much better contract than he was expected to get - and we're getting these pivots to "They must have been desperate and they might regret this move". It's like Olney had this all in mind in case they spent $150 million on Santander and just didn't bother adjusting.
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The Jays have a 14AAV on the books for a guy expected to get 20+. Olney was expecting something like 3 years, 89M and the Jays have him for about half that.
 
Bjindaho said:
The Jays have a 14AAV on the books for a guy expected to get 20+. Olney was expecting something like 3 years, 89M and the Jays have him for about half that.
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Yea that seems like great value tbh. Basically what we were paying 39-year old Justin Turner last season. Even if we're blowing it up/rebuilding, that seems like a contract that you can easily deal.

Just gotta get Alonso now. Bichette-Vlad-Alonso-Santa would be the best top of the order we've had since the Bats/EE/JD days.
 
Bjindaho said:
The Jays have a 14AAV on the books for a guy expected to get 20+. Olney was expecting something like 3 years, 89M and the Jays have him for about half that.
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I’m happy the Jays signed Santander. He checks a lot of the boxes of what we needed. Power, swich hitting and can play in the outfield. And we managed to do it cheaper on a AAV valve than most expected. There is a lot to like there.

But that article is right that we could be looking for a way out of that contract in a year. If we don’t get Vladdy signed we would be looking at a long rebuild. Even if Vladdy does sign they will probably need to find replacements for Bo and Gausman.
Overall it doesn’t matter to me because if they do have to rebuild it’s gonna take 5-7 years if they do it right so I’m not as worried about how those years look but there are legitimate reasons to criticize.
 
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Kurtz said:
Yea that seems like great value tbh. Basically what we were paying 39-year old Justin Turner last season. Even if we're blowing it up/rebuilding, that seems like a contract that you can easily deal.

Just gotta get Alonso now. Bichette-Vlad-Alonso-Santa would be the best top of the order we've had since the Bats/EE/JD days.
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I see the potential downsides to the signing but who cares. If the 3 big names that can walk do it’s going to be a rough 5+ years anyway.
Why does it matter to me if they have an expensive guy they need to eat some of the contract to move.
 
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DuklaNation said:
Since 1993, Dodgers have had only 3 sub .500 seasons. For anyone to claim that franchise had it bad for a long stretch is beyond ludicrous.
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For a team that has spent in the top 5-10 in payroll since then and not have a WS or even a WS appearance until 29 years later since their last, that is horrid based on their market size, history, what they spent and the players they produce.

You dont play baseball for regular season success.
 
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phillipmike said:
For a team that has spent in the top 5-10 in payroll since then and not have a WS or even a WS appearance until 29 years later since their last, that is horrid based on their market size, history, what they spent and the players they produce.

You dont play baseball for regular season success.
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Their payroll only went well above most other teams due to ownership change plus new TV deals around 2013. Before that the difference wasn't that big. People need to have more realistic expectations.
 
DuklaNation said:
Their payroll only went well above most other teams due to ownership change plus new TV deals around 2013. Before that the difference wasn't that big. People need to have more realistic expectations.
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It did but since 2000, they have been top 10 payroll for the last 24 years with the exception of 1 year where they finished 11th.


In their market, payroll, and size, they should have won multiple WS. Especially in that division. They had division winners winning the division with wins in the 80s;

2005: Padres won the division with a 82-80 record (Jays won 80 games)
2006: Padres 88-74 (Jays won 87 games)
2008: Dodgers 84-78 (Jays finished 4th in the division with 86 wins)

From 2013 to 2024, the Dodgers won the division every year except for once in 2021 where the Giants won 107 (Dodgers won 10) and the Dodgers beat them in the first round.

Its incredibly easy to win that division and they should have better results

2nd Place winner in the NL West:
2000: 86 wins
2001: 90 wins
2002: 91 wins
2003: 85 wins
2004: 91 wins
2005: 77 wins
2006: 88 wins
2007: 90 wins
2008: 82 wins
2009: 92 wins
2010: 90 wins
2011: 86 wins
2012: 86 wins
2013: 81 wins
2014: 88 wins
2015: 84 wins
2016: 87 wins
2017: 93 wins
2018: 91 wins
2019: 85 wins
2020: Shortened Season
2021: 106 wins
2022: 89 wins
2023: 84 wins
2024: 93 wins

Average win total to win the NL West is 88 wins.

Since 2001, the lowest win total to win the AL East was 93 wins.

It is incredibly easy to win that division and when on average you only need wins in the mid to high 80s to win a division, the Dodgers should have a lot more WS than 2 in the last 35 years.
 
phillipmike said:
I get why people are pissed because it isnt us and we lost many players to the Dodgers. But this is what every organization should strive to be. If this was us we would be laughing and thumbing our nose to the rest of the league.

If anyone doesnt like it then scout, draft, develop, trade, and acquire better players? Dodgers are getting them, then offer more money or make your team more attractive. Hard to feel sorry for other teams with billionaire owners.

A salary cap isnt the way either. It has ruined hockey and player movement.
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Couldn’t agree more with this.
 
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