Laval Rocket: 2024-25 Laval Rocket Thread

[red devil]

 

[schwang26]

Great. Beck up for a couple weeks too. Start the drop in standings in 3, 2, 1….

 

[HabsAddict]

Isn't the "no powerplay" thing a known plan that everyone in the org is aware of? I could have sworn that I have seen it reported on multiple times this year.

No. It was a comment by Vincent to concentrate on his defense in a regular shift but nothing about taking him out of the powerplay.

He is the Rockets top offensive defenseman and when he's playing error free Vincent does start him on the 1st PP unit. So the PP is used as a dog biscuit, which I vehemently disagree with. That is so 50s and ancient school. Over my career I had thousands of employees. I lost many inches of hairline training people but I never used reward/punishment as daily motivation. People are not Pavlovian dogs.

In overtime, Vincent has no choice but to put him on the first unit...or likely lose the game.

 

[montreal]

No. It was a comment by Vincent to concentrate on his defense in a regular shift but nothing about taking him out of the powerplay.

He is the Rockets top offensive defenseman and when he's playing error free Vincent does start him on the 1st PP unit. So the PP is used as a dog biscuit, which I vehemently disagree with. That is so 50s and ancient school. Over my career I had thousands of employees. I lost many inches of hairline training people but I never used reward/punishment as daily motivation. People are not Pavlovian dogs.

In overtime, Vincent has no choice but to put him on the first unit...or likely lose the game.

i've had trouble understanding the logic behind what they are doing with Mailloux, how one day he's on PP1, next he's not then he's back then he's off it again, then back again.

But I still don't get how Engstrom got benched yet in an OT game where Mailloux was the lone man back and he just gives up on the play and they lose, yet nothing happens to him. Doesn't make sense to me considering Engstrom is a rookie and adjusting to the smaller ice and Mailloux knows better.

 

[HabsAddict]

i've had trouble understanding the logic behind what they are doing with Mailloux, how one day he's on PP1, next he's not then he's back then he's off it again, then back again.

But I still don't get how Engstrom got benched yet in an OT game where Mailloux was the lone man back and he just gives up on the play and they lose, yet nothing happens to him. Doesn't make sense to me considering Engstrom is a rookie and adjusting to the smaller ice and Mailloux knows better.

It's clear that Vincent uses the power play and playing time as a dog biscuit. If Mailman behaves, he get's power play time, it he is a bad doggie, no PP time for him.

The previous game I watched, Mailman pulled a stupid and Vincent would not put him on for a 4 minute powerplay including 5 on 3. Rocket didn't score.

When I first started out in my management career, I had a boss who asked every day, in a very serious tone, what I did that day to keep my job. I was young but self assured and uber arrogant so he couldn't break me down, but previous to me, 3 much older managers had come and gone in 3 years.

THAT kind of management style, the one that we can clearly see in how Vincent hands out PP and playing time, is very corrosive and can easily break down a 21 year old . Particularly one that had one year of pro experience and probably the first time in his life where he gets mentally beaten down.

How is Mailman handling it? I know on the third goal his body language showed defeat. Obviously I can't tell his mental state, but I doubt he likes it. Which Vincent may pick up on and make it worse. That's what 50s style Stalin adjacent management tells him to do.

All we can do is observe and surmise of what is happening behind the scenes...and none of it appears to be good. Given the results, maybe worse then we think.

I also saw a Saturday team that looked closer to junior then AHL. Passes were off, team play was adhock, defenseman were beaten consistently, board battles lost....not a team halfway through the season.

 

[Egresch]

It's clear that Vincent uses the power play and playing time as a dog biscuit. If Mailman behaves, he get's power play time, it he is a bad doggie, no PP time for him.

The previous game I watched, Mailman pulled a stupid and Vincent would not put him on for a 4 minute powerplay including 5 on 3. Rocket didn't score.

When I first started out in my management career, I had a boss who asked every day, in a very serious tone, what I did that day to keep my job. I was young but self assured and uber arrogant so he couldn't break me down, but previous to me, 3 much older managers had come and gone in 3 years.

THAT kind of management style, the one that we can clearly see in how Vincent hands out PP and playing time, is very corrosive and can easily break down a 21 year old . Particularly one that had one year of pro experience and probably the first time in his life where he gets mentally beaten down.

How is Mailman handling it? I know on the third goal his body language showed defeat. Obviously I can't tell his mental state, but I doubt he likes it. Which Vincent may pick up on and make it worse. That's what 50s style Stalin adjacent management tells him to do.

All we can do is observe and surmise of what is happening behind the scenes...and none of it appears to be good. Given the results, maybe worse then we think.

I also saw a Saturday team that looked closer to junior then AHL. Passes were off, team play was adhock, defenseman were beaten consistently, board battles lost....not a team halfway through the season.

I guess this is intentional approach from Habs management and Rocket coaching staff. 1st team is already in the mix even if we are still super young and we have a ton of prospects. Very shortly, we can be a contender and you need kids with strong mental resiliance. They did the same experiment with Xhekaj and Barron. Xhekaj responded well, Barron did not and was moved. We cannot afford to have bipolar D on a contending team. As Mailloux would not be PP1 QB he would not be able to compensate his mistakes there, so we need him to stabilize his game and we need it quickly (this season).
Where do they see him in 2 years? Realistically, he could be 3RD, but then you need to be able to rely on him and that is not the case.
Similar with Roy, I do not see a place for him as he lack speed and grit for 3rd line player. His production is OK in AHL, but most of it comes from PP and he will not have that in NHL.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I guess this is intentional approach from Habs management and Rocket coaching staff. 1st team is already in the mix even if we are still super young and we have a ton of prospects. Very shortly, we can be a contender and you need kids with strong mental resiliance. They did the same experiment with Xhekaj and Barron. Xhekaj responded well, Barron did not and was moved. We cannot afford to have bipolar D on a contending team. As Mailloux would not be PP1 QB he would not be able to compensate his mistakes there, so we need him to stabilize his game and we need it quickly (this season).
Where do they see him in 2 years? Realistically, he could be 3RD, but then you need to be able to rely on him and that is not the case.
Similar with Roy, I do not see a place for him as he lack speed and grit for 3rd line player. His production is OK in AHL, but most of it comes from PP and he will not have that in NHL.

Turns out that there was some logic to Heineman being a higher draft pick than Roy.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Turns out that there was some logic to Heineman being a higher draft pick than Roy.

One can skate and the other can’t. No mystery there. None whatsoever.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

I guess this is intentional approach from Habs management and Rocket coaching staff. 1st team is already in the mix even if we are still super young and we have a ton of prospects. Very shortly, we can be a contender and you need kids with strong mental resiliance. They did the same experiment with Xhekaj and Barron. Xhekaj responded well, Barron did not and was moved. We cannot afford to have bipolar D on a contending team. As Mailloux would not be PP1 QB he would not be able to compensate his mistakes there, so we need him to stabilize his game and we need it quickly (this season).
Where do they see him in 2 years? Realistically, he could be 3RD, but then you need to be able to rely on him and that is not the case.
Similar with Roy, I do not see a place for him as he lack speed and grit for 3rd line player. His production is OK in AHL, but most of it comes from PP and he will not have that in NHL.

I think any effort to read a carrot and stick approach to the team's handling of Mailloux is, frankly, off the mark. Mailloux's 'problems' are not from the waist up, but the waist down. He can't skate well enough to be the main puck transporter from the back end. Regrettably, I don't think that will ever change for this young player. And I think (hope) Hughes and company now realize it. Trudeau's injury was very improvident, because, coupled with the loss of Jacobs, Mailloux's continued high use on Laval's back end is now needed. Had Trudeau not gone down, I think it would have been a great opportunity to move Mailloux up to take Roy's position, and see what this kid can do as a forward.

I think Mailloux has little or no chance to be anything more than a fringe defenceman at the NHL level. Carrot or stick.

 

[HabsAddict]

Carrot and stick on a 21 year old is sooo 2025.

Next up, beatings, lashes and cattle prods. Given our modern tech, surely a schock collar will work wonders...

BTW...X was pulled and worked on directly in that period with Adam Nichols. NOBODY tried to a stick and carrot approach on X. Went through endless videos specifically to be more active with his stick and positioning.

Arber Xhekaj is studying defenseman to improve his game

Arber Xhekaj has shown glimpses of the skill and talent that could form the makings of a top four defender. But his willingness to keep learning even through vi

awinninghabit.com

Work WITH players to change and improve, not try to beat them into it.

I doubt any one of you wants to be treated like a dog and doggie treats...

 

[ahmedou]

Pascal Vincent on Filip Mesar:

“You get injured early in the season, and I’ve seen it before … It takes time and I expected it. He wants to be coached, he wants to do the right things. He’s listening and paying attention. I expected him to struggle a little bit, but it’s normal. And he’s a young player.''

“What he was doing really well (before the injury) was moving his feet when he got the puck. He needs to get back to that. He gets the puck and slows down. First thing you know he gets pressure coming to him. When he moves his feet he’s really dynamic. It’s going to come. No worries.”

 

[montreal]

Pascal Vincent on Filip Mesar:

“You get injured early in the season, and I’ve seen it before … It takes time and I expected it. He wants to be coached, he wants to do the right things. He’s listening and paying attention. I expected him to struggle a little bit, but it’s normal. And he’s a young player.''

“What he was doing really well (before the injury) was moving his feet when he got the puck. He needs to get back to that. He gets the puck and slows down. First thing you know he gets pressure coming to him. When he moves his feet he’s really dynamic. It’s going to come. No worries.”

I've been hard on Mesar especially in his D+1 but have said since that you can see he's making some improvements. Will they be enough, only time will tell but with prospects it's ALWAYS about progress over time or a lack of.

I agree with Vincent though, when he's moving his feet, using his speed as it's one of his best assets but when he's not, you don't get much out of him. Players that only work hard when they feel like it are a red flag but sometimes that comes with maturity and struggling.

When you post quotes, can you post the link to where you get them so we know it's not from behind a paywall for copyright reasons. Thanks

 

[HabsAddict]

I've been hard on Mesar especially in his D+1 but have said since that you can see he's making some improvements. Will they be enough, only time will tell but with prospects it's ALWAYS about progress over time or a lack of.

I agree with Vincent though, when he's moving his feet, using his speed as it's one of his best assets but when he's not, you don't get much out of him. Players that only work hard when they feel like it are a red flag but sometimes that comes with maturity and struggling.

When you post quotes, can you post the link to where you get them so we know it's not from behind a paywall for copyright reasons. Thanks

Nobody ever said coaching was easy. Particularly working with not-fully-matured kids who have been told all their life how great they are.

Part of why the Habs use to have years of greatness was bringing the rookies into a mature, must win locker room. When Pierre Bouchard comes in as a rookie, the locker room has players like Jean Beliveau, Henri Bouchard, John Furgeson...players who wear the CH like their life depends on it. Today, Reinbacher comes in and meets who? There is not even a Price or a Weber to greet him. Who exactly is going to promote and if need be, enforce a team and winning ethos.

In an uber mature and gravitas environment, playing how one feels like is very noticeable...and not acceptable.

Coaching now has a much more important goal to set the goals and ethos of the players. That is why I slowly turned from blaming just the players to looking at how the coaches are handling the players.

 

[Tyson]

A tough Hershey team plays in Laval tomorrow against an all of a sudden decimated team.