Speculation: 2024-2025 General Discussion III: We’re back! Kind of.

[DistantThunderRep]

This is actually beneficial for Florida. Gets Ekblad to rest and not get his inevitable injury for the playoffs. If they suspended him before the TDL, would that have given them more space or does suspended players still fully count to the cap?

 

[RussianGuyovich]

imagine getting caught for PEDs in a league that employs ovechkin

 

[Stammertime91]

It should be made by someone that's not an obvious Lightning fan, otherwise everyone can tell it's satire. If anyone has any contacts from the Leafs forum or wherever, we need you.

@Soul Assumption you've been summoned

 

[DrMartinVanNostrand]

Don’t all SC champions from the 6 team era also have asterisks? If not, they should.

(From 2015)

https://grantland.com/the-triangle/passing-judgment-on-your-stanley-cup-title/

It was harsh though because DGB saved his strongest venom for us, for obvious (but factually incorrect) reasons:

Tampa Bay Lightning, 2004: Come on.

Verdict: Literally could not count any less.

This is actually beneficial for Florida. Gets Ekblad to rest and not get his inevitable injury for the playoffs. If they suspended him before the TDL, would that have given them more space or does suspended players still fully count to the cap?

Yeah, I wrote this in the main board thread too. Without having a postseason ineligibility penalty attached, this just gets Ekblad a late season break, albeit with a hit to his salary. He won't even miss one road game in the playoffs due to the timing of this suspension. It's basically meaningless.

 

[Felonious Python]

(From 2015)

https://grantland.com/the-triangle/passing-judgment-on-your-stanley-cup-title/

It was harsh though because DGB saved his strongest venom for us, for obvious (but factually incorrect) reasons:





Yeah, I wrote this in the main board thread too. Without having a postseason ineligibility penalty attached, this just gets Ekblad a late season break, albeit with a hit to his salary. He won't even miss one road game in the playoffs due to the timing of this suspension. It's basically meaningless.

I wouldn't say it's meaningless. Missing the last month of the regular season and needing to step right into game 3 is a disadvantage. He's also in a contract year.

 

[Hoek]

This is actually beneficial for Florida. Gets Ekblad to rest and not get his inevitable injury for the playoffs. If they suspended him before the TDL, would that have given them more space or does suspended players still fully count to the cap?

He doesn't count against the cap now because he's not getting paid, so yeah it would've helped if it was still long enough to keep him out until playoffs.

 

[Felonious Python]

He doesn't count against the cap now because he's not getting paid, so yeah it would've helped if it was still long enough to keep him out until playoffs.

New suspension meta just dropped.

If a team could guarantee a 20-game suspension, it would significantly influence their cap management strategy, especially concerning cap accrual, LTIR usage, and trade deadline planning. Here's how that would factor in, drawing from the sources and our conversation history:

• Immediate and Predictable Cap Relief: A guaranteed 20-game suspension provides immediate and predictable cap relief. The Player Salary and Bonuses that are not paid to such Players shall not count against a Club's Upper Limit or against the Players' Share for the duration of the suspension. This is unlike LTIR, which requires a player to be declared unfit to play for an extended period.
• Cap Accrual: The team could accrue cap space during the suspension. A club with an Averaged Club Salary that is less than the Upper Limit has available Payroll Room.
• Flexibility Compared to LTIR: Unlike LTIR, a suspension doesn't require a player to be deemed unfit to play for an extended period. This provides more flexibility in managing the roster and avoiding potential scrutiny from the league regarding the legitimacy of an injury.
• Trade Deadline Planning:
  • Additional Payroll Room: Prior to the trade deadline, assess the team's Payroll Room. The team may use this room to acquire players.
  • Return from Suspension: Consider the timing of the player's return from suspension relative to the trade deadline. The team must have Payroll Room for such Player's Player Salary and Bonuses in order for such Player to be able to return to Play for the Club.
• Combining with LTIR:
  • Strategic Sequencing: If other players are legitimately injured, the team could strategically combine the cap relief from the suspension with LTIR to maximize available cap space. The team must ensure all LTIR placements are legitimate to avoid potential scrutiny from the Commissioner's Office.
  • LTIR and Cap Accrual: Realize that using LTIR prevents accruing additional cap space. Therefore, LTIR should be used only when exceeding the cap is essential.

In summary, a guaranteed 20-game suspension would be a valuable asset for cap management:

• It provides predictable cap relief, allowing for accrual of cap space and greater flexibility than LTIR.
• Teams could strategically time the suspension and subsequent return of the player to coincide with key dates such as the trade deadline, thereby maximizing their ability to add talent while remaining cap compliant.

There's no cap in the playoffs, so making room for him wouldn't matter.

If a player on LTIR gets suspended, the interaction between these two statuses would affect a team's cap management, according to information in the sources and our conversation history.

Here's a breakdown:

• Cap Relief from Suspension: A suspension provides cap relief because "the Player Salary and Bonuses that are not paid to such Players shall not count against a Club's Upper Limit or against the Players' Share for the duration of the suspension".
• LTIR Usage: A team can exceed the Upper Limit by using LTIR.
• Coordination of LTIR and Suspension: Since LTIR is used when a player is "unfit to play," a suspension would mean the player is also unable to play. This could allow a team to continue utilizing LTIR while also benefiting from the additional cap relief provided by the suspension.

In effect, if a player on LTIR is suspended, the team would likely continue to receive the cap relief from LTIR, and then also receive additional relief from the suspension due to the player not being paid his Player Salary and Bonuses.

It's important to note:

• Legitimate LTIR Placements: The team must ensure all LTIR placements are legitimate to avoid potential scrutiny from the Commissioner's Office.
• Playoff Implications: The team must have Payroll Room for such Player's Player Salary and Bonuses in order for such Player to be able to return to Play for the Club. There is no mention in the provided sources indicating that a team receives additional cap relief in the playoffs.

 

[Lightning1995]

Team may be cooked

 

[JTBF81]

Team may be cooked

It's two really bad games after several weeks of being one of the best performing teams in the league. While they need to snap out of this funk quickly if they want to win the division, they are very far from "cooked".

 

[Stammertime91]

Team isn't cooked, just in the process of being seared.

Wake the f*** up guys.

 

[These Are The Days]

The Lightning go through scoring funks. It's 2 games. We're fine still

 

[ccman68]

Keeping the dogshit 1st line together all year is what will f*** us in the playoffs. Put Hagel there and have Guentzel find some chemistry with someone else before it’s too late. How it’s possible to be only at 51% expected goals with 3 of the best players in the world i do not know.

 

[These Are The Days]

Keeping the dogshit 1st line together all year is what will f*** us in the playoffs. Put Hagel there and have Guentzel find some chemistry with someone else before it’s too late. How it’s possible to be only at 51% expected goals with 3 of the best players in the world i do not know.

View attachment 992071

It keeps happening because the coaching staff only looks at the last column. No one is going care a damn bit if the offense scores once in 7 periods as long as it was 1-0 win the last game and the current game is 0-0 in going into double OT


We made our choice long ago that this is how we choose to die if an unfortunate fate befalls us in the playoffs

 

[Hoek]

It keeps happening because the coaching staff only looks at the last column. No one is going care a damn bit if the offense scores once in 7 periods as long as it was 1-0 win the last game and the current game is 0-0 in going into double OT


We made our choice long ago that this is how we choose to die if an unfortunate fate befalls us in the playoffs

Ok but that first line is also dogshit in that last column too. Hagel makes it better in goals for and against.

 

[JTBF81]

Hagel-Point-Kuch
Guentzel-Cirelli-Bjorkstrand
Paul-Gourde-Chaffee
Girgensons-Glendening-Goncalves

I know Cooper has had Gourde and Bjorkstrand stapled together so far, but it'd be nice to see if a couple different line combos could work.

 

[Rschmitz]

Shoulda added Zetterlund

 

[These Are The Days]

Ok but that first line is also dogshit in that last column too. Hagel makes it better in goals for and against.

Preach. I think the coaching staff is just in love with loading up that line because it's defensively responsible enough to work. And they just figure if you stick those 3 guys together long enough, they'll figure out how to score some goals. If that line gave up enough whoopsies we would never see it again before switching it up because it went 4 games without a goal

 

[JTBF81]

Shoulda added Zetterlund

What a last minute add that would've been. Who knows if JBB even inquired on him, and perhaps S.J.'s gm liked the player and prospect from Ottawa more anyway, but I would've moved the 2nd rd pick this year or next, one of Goncalves or Chaffee, and Tampa's 4th best prospect (comparable to what Ottawa moved), either Duke or Gauthier, for Zetterlund, a 4th, and a lesser prospect. There would've also been the cap next year to consider, as Zetterlund will be up for a solid raise, in addition to them deciding on Gourde amd a gew other spots
He still would've been.great to have this year, though.

 

[Rschmitz]

What a last minute add that would've been. Who knows if JBB even inquired on him, and perhaps S.J.'s gm liked the player and prospect from Ottawa more anyway, but I would've moved the 2nd rd pick this year or next, one of Goncalves or Chaffee, and Tampa's 4th best prospect (comparable to what Ottawa moved), either Duke or Gauthier, for Zetterlund, a 4th, and a lesser prospect. There would've also been the cap next year to consider, as Zetterlund will be up for a solid raise, in addition to them deciding on Gourde amd a gew other spots
He still would've been.great to have this year, though.

and since he's not a rental, we could have traded him in the offseason and got some assets back. He's such a nice fit though

 

[JTBF81]

and since he's not a rental, we could have traded him in the offseason and got some assets back. He's such a nice fit though

Cap space will still be limited this coming summer, depending on what Gourde re-signs at (if he does). After a backup G around a million and 2 or 3 lower cost depth signings (an additional dman depending on if they keep Perbix, and how much Goncalves and Chaffee get), Tampa will probably have maybe 3 million to add an upgrade at F or defense. All of Geekie, Howard, and Duke have to be considered as well for potential F spots, so the exact makeup of the middle/bottom 6 for next year should be interesting.

 

[Zippy316]

Food for thought, how much would the Devils have to retain on the last two years of Palat’s contract for a Tampa reunion to make sense?

My initial thoughts are the Devils could retain about 2 million leaving 2 years of Palat at 4 million AAV. To facilitate a deal, the Devils take back Sheary and Girgensons, no additional assets included.

Devils save 1 million next year on the cap with Sheary and Girgensons on the NHL roster. Could add an additional 2 million if they bury both Sheary and Girgensons in the minors. Tampa frees up roster spots and brings Palat back for third line depth.

I could see the Devils doing up to 50% retention too, given they could bury both Sheary and Girgensons for 2 million in space. Palat’s contract turning into 2 year 3 million AAV is arguably plus value at that point.

 

[Rschmitz]

Food for thought, how much would the Devils have to retain on the last two years of Palat’s contract for a Tampa reunion to make sense?

My initial thoughts are the Devils could retain about 2 million leaving 2 years of Palat at 4 million AAV. To facilitate a deal, the Devils take back Sheary and Girgensons, no additional assets included.

Devils save 1 million next year on the cap with Sheary and Girgensons on the NHL roster. Could add an additional 2 million if they bury both Sheary and Girgensons in the minors. Tampa frees up roster spots and brings Palat back for third line depth.

I could see the Devils doing up to 50% retention too, given they could bury both Sheary and Girgensons for 2 million in space. Palat’s contract turning into 2 year 3 million AAV is arguably plus value at that point.

Beware of Greeks bearing gifts. Have you soured on Palat that much?

I would do Sheary for Palat at 50% for sure, no need to include Girgensons who can be completely buried. I don’t know if Bresbois would do it, he probably wants Geekie/Howard taking those minutes even if this looks like something of interest on face value.

 

[Sky04]

Palat reunion makes no sense after signing Guentzel and having Hagel. Plus he's slow and sucks now.

 

[Felonious Python]

Beware of Greeks bearing gifts. Have you soured on Palat that much?

I would do Sheary for Palat at 50% for sure, no need to include Girgensons who can be completely buried. I don’t know if Bresbois would do it, he probably wants Geekie/Howard taking those minutes even if this looks like something of interest on face value.

NJ fans have been critical of Palat pretty much from the start.

16 goals this season isn't too shabby. Fans may also change their minds in the playoffs.

The cap is going up for everyone. I don't really see moving Palat at 50% being that dire for NJ. I'd probably take the deal, primarily because you're getting a post-prime production Palat without paying a premium price.

We do have Mitchell Chaffee, who kind of has similar statistical impact. (far fewer assists, though)

 

[Stelio Kontos]

Palat reunion makes no sense after signing Guentzel and having Hagel. Plus he's slow and sucks now.

sounds like he’d fit right in on our 4th line