2024-2025 Blues Trade Proposals Thread.

[bleedblue1223]

Just to put some numbers to this concept, $6.5M will be 6.8% of the cap in 2025/26, 6.25% in 2026/27 and 5.7% in 2027/28 based on the numbers released by the NHL and PA. Currently, 5.7% of the cap is $5M and 6.25% of the cap is $5.5M. If you think that he can contribute to your team as a legit upgrade this year and next, those last couple years aren't looking as hard to swallow as they were a couple years ago. Also worth noting that his actual salary in the last couple years is $4.3M and $4M.

The Schenn rumors are interesting to me. I don't have a gut reaction about how serious we might be listening or how accurate this report might be. Is this a message to the room (or Schenn specifically)? Is Army testing the waters to see how other GMs are changing their valuation of future cap space? I really can't decide what to make of this report beyond the face value 'of course the Blues are at least listening to offers.'

And I'm probably guilty of over-analysing some of this stuff, but to your 2nd paragraph, while it's often said that Army keeps things quiet and doesn't like stuff getting out, he's also been known to make selective leaks. Could he actually be available, sure. I do think it's possible that this is simply a message to the team. Hell, could just be Dreger connecting his own dots of Berube wanting someone from the Blues.

 

[Brian39]

I get that he paced higher after a poor start but he has fallen off again offensively with 1 point in the last 8 or so. It seems like one of his usual mid season streaks.

He has played better this year than last year. But to me bounced back means returned to normal. That’s why I asked for the definition.

We've focused a lot on Thomas slumping, but this 1-5-1 stretch that has ended any/all playoff hopes has coincided with Schenn's worst stretch of the season. 0 goals, 1 assist, -6, and just 7 total shots in the last 7 games that have put the final nail in this season's coffin. It's a major bummer because he was awesome in the 5 weeks or so leading up to the slump.

 

[LogosBlue]

Personal property tax is a scam. It literally keeps the citizens from owning property 100%.

I don’t ever want to hear that government agencies need more money. Here’s how every agency works. They get an approved budget. They make sure to spend every penny of that budget so the next year they get to claim they need more money.

Schools need taxes? Really? Maybe I’m the only one that remembers before casinos operated in Missouri. Oh if they can only get casinos in the state, it will forever solve the tax issues for schools. Okay lol

If we can only pass the law allowing online betting… the schools will be saved lol

The founders of the country would have went to war over personal property tax… but here we are

Agreed. You are taxed when you make money, when you spend money on goods or property, when you own property (every year), when you receive money you paid into SS. How many times are they going to tax the same dollar!!! This is why we had a tea party in this country!!!

 

[Brian39]

Are we comfortable with having 3 of Texier, Faksa, Sundqvist, Walker or Joseph being regulars at center?

I’m not. I don’t think moving Schenn is a bad idea at all. But we are already searching for a 3C (or should be) I can’t imagine trying to search for a 2C as well.

Next year? Absolutely not. A Schenn trade would necessitate the acquisition of (at bare minimum) a middle 6 center for 2025/26.

The rest of this year? Yeah I'm comfortable with it. My preference this year was for the team to be playing meaningful games as deep into the season as possible, but we are past that time. The last 7 games have ended all reasonable playoff hopes. We're now 8 points back of the 2nd Wild Card spot (with an extra game played).

If you can strengthen the medium-to-long term outlook by trading Schenn, you do it without worrying about how awful the centers will look for the next 27 games.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I'm not saying we get these players, but in theory we could sign Granlund on a short-term deal, maybe sign Bennett as a more similar replacement for Schenn. Dvorsky comes up, and we have Sunny slide into 4th line C role.

 

[Brian39]

Noah Dobson scares the hell out of me.

He is an RFA this summer and I believe that he has 6 accrued seasons, which means that he could take an arbitration award and then walk directly to UFA in the summer of 2026. He had 70 points last season and I see pretty much every reason for him to demand an extension based on that. Because if the offers are anything less, he has a major ability to get himself to UFA in 2026 as the cap explodes.

I just don't see how you give up prime asset for him unless you are ready to make him one of the highest paid D in the league (and perhaps the highest paid D in the league). If he is "only" the 50 point guy that he's been for 3 of the last 4 seasons, his next contract could be a disaster.

 

[Spektre]

We've focused a lot on Thomas slumping, but this 1-5-1 stretch that has ended any/all playoff hopes has coincided with Schenn's worst stretch of the season. 0 goals, 1 assist, -6, and just 7 total shots in the last 7 games that have put the final nail in this season's coffin. It's a major bummer because he was awesome in the 5 weeks or so leading up to the slump.

If the media isn't going to criticize Schenn during last year, there's 0 chance they will this year.

 

[BadgersandBlues]

Dobson is a stud. Only thing that worries me is his contract ask, but the player himself is an absolute stud. Dobson and Broberg would really solidify the back end and lock in our new core's age bracket. I'd be happy with Dobson on an 8x8 or even 8x8.5 - if he wants something that starts with a 9 then it gets dicey.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Noah Dobson scares the hell out of me.

He is an RFA this summer and I believe that he has 6 accrued seasons, which means that he could take an arbitration award and then walk directly to UFA in the summer of 2026. He had 70 points last season and I see pretty much every reason for him to demand an extension based on that. Because if the offers are anything less, he has a major ability to get himself to UFA in 2026 as the cap explodes.

I just don't see how you give up prime asset for him unless you are ready to make him one of the highest paid D in the league (and perhaps the highest paid D in the league). If he is "only" the 50 point guy that he's been for 3 of the last 4 seasons, his next contract could be a disaster.

Yeah, no way would I trade Kyrou, unless there's an agreement on an extension or at least a pretty good idea of what one would look like. And if he looks at the increasing cap like everyone else would/should, he should be increasing his ask, which might be a reason why he's available.

I know there are some concerns related to his defense, but with Parayko, we wouldn't have him handing the heavy defensive minutes, we'd want him being the main offensive pair.

 

[Brian39]

Dobson is a stud. Only thing that worries me is his contract ask, but the player himself is an absolute stud. Dobson and Broberg would really solidify the back end and lock in our new core's age bracket. I'd be happy with Dobson on an 8x8 or even 8x8.5 - if he wants something that starts with a 9 then it gets dicey.

I assume that he'll be demanding something that starts with an 11 or 12. I really don't see any reason for him to lock himself into a contract in the 9s right when the cap explodes and he has the ability to walk himself to UFA quickly. If I were his agent I would opening negotiations by telling teams that my client isn't interested in talking about an extension unless your offer would make him the highest paid D man in the league.

He could potentially be the best RHD to hit the UFA market in at least half a decade and the last couple such guys (Hamilton and Petro) got 11% of the cap. They were 28 years old and 30 years old while Dobson will be 26 years old. 11% of $104M is $11.44M. He's going to get a boatload of money on a 7 year deal if he goes to UFA and he probably gets $7M+ on a 1 year arbitration award.

 

[BrokenFace]

Hah.....I was practically ridiculed here a couple of weeks ago, over my question if we could possibly trade Schenn for anything

The increasing cap announcement has changed how tradable these longer vet contracts are. That being said, who knows how true these rumors are. I would love to get value for Schenn if some team is making a decent offer.

 

[joe galiba]

I assume that he'll be demanding something that starts with a 10, 11, or 12. I really don't see any reason for him to lock himself into a contract in the 9s right when the cap explodes and he has the ability to walk himself to UFA quickly.

Which is probably why he is on the trading block

 

[Mike Liut]

Dobson is a stud. Only thing that worries me is his contract ask, but the player himself is an absolute stud. Dobson and Broberg would really solidify the back end and lock in our new core's age bracket. I'd be happy with Dobson on an 8x8 or even 8x8.5 - if he wants something that starts with a 9 then it gets dicey.

We’ll be able to afford a few of these type of players soon.

 

[A Real Barn Burner]

What are you thinking the large plus is that we add to Schenn that lands us Nemec?

As for the leadership, I am sure we can find a past his prime vet somewhere that can fill the void. Could be this teams version of Dallas Drake. I would just like him to be more functional than Dallas when we brought him in.

Does it have to be a large plus? Schenn without retention I see a large plus being necessary. This isn’t my wheel house but if Schenn was a UFA this year and we retained he would be worth a late round first (equivalent to Minnesota first given for Jireck). If we retained we would be retaining for three years at 3.25 million a year (Actual salary owed would be 4 mil split between the two clubs)

So you sell him as a 2C for this year and a cheap 3C for two years after that? What is that worth? Ask for a second and they agree good now we need a plus to be worth a third and change (to match Minnesota price paid for Jiricek). What winger prospect does New Jersey want that’s value is about a third? idk….if they say Scheen as a cheap 3C for two years is worth a third and you need second round value then I could see us adding something more significant.

Also it depends on what cap dump they send back….if puckpedia is correct then the Devils have just under 2.5 mil in cap space at the deadline so it doesn’t have to be significant. However if it is significant? How does that change the value?

The reason I mentioned Sutter is if they view Nemec as an injury call up for the playoffs they might be interested in him. My understanding is Nemec was called up recently and then benched so they might want better depth for a run.

Like I said it’s a Pipe dream and most fans on this sites would form a lynch mob for any GM who traded a young prospect for an aging vet. However, there is merit for New Jersey to consider it. They need center help this season and Scheen for two more seasons at a low cap hit means you don’t have to be desperate in FA this year to land a center with a rising cap. If New Jersey is happy with their right side and believe they can lock them all up this offseason Nemec would then have no where to go and they are trading him anyways. I am sure they would love for a young center but we as Blues fans know all too well how hard it is to find one of those.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I'd be pretty surprised if Army pulls off a couple major sell trades, but I guess there are going to be plenty of rumors when it comes to the Blues.

 

[SirPaste]

Noah Dobson scares the hell out of me.

He is an RFA this summer and I believe that he has 6 accrued seasons, which means that he could take an arbitration award and then walk directly to UFA in the summer of 2026. He had 70 points last season and I see pretty much every reason for him to demand an extension based on that. Because if the offers are anything less, he has a major ability to get himself to UFA in 2026 as the cap explodes.

I just don't see how you give up prime asset for him unless you are ready to make him one of the highest paid D in the league (and perhaps the highest paid D in the league). If he is "only" the 50 point guy that he's been for 3 of the last 4 seasons, his next contract could be a disaster.

This is kind of where I am at on this. There is zero doubt we could really use Dobson and he would be a huge add, but the cost and the new contract could bury us if we overpay and he is "just" a 50 point guy. Reality is we could really use even a 50 point guy but the contract could be an anchor if we overpay for that.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I'm not sure what his best comps are, but say McAvoy, Werenski, Sergachev, etc. He's probably already reasonably asking for 9.5ish, and with cap going up, wouldn't shock me if he's pushing that number up to 10.5-11.5. Gets more complicated at that point.

I do lean towards I'd rather go down swinging than go down scared to throw a punch, but you absolutely can't trade Kyrou without getting a long-term extension.

 

[BleedBlue14]

I'm not saying we get these players, but in theory we could sign Granlund on a short-term deal, maybe sign Bennett as a more similar replacement for Schenn. Dvorsky comes up, and we have Sunny slide into 4th line C role.

The issue with this line of thinking is it isn't July 1st yet. I was a bit less optimistic before about the potential of signing one due to being incorrect on the centers available for UFA next season.

Given the list of potential UFAs and this is prior to half of them likely never reaching UFA. The following will be UFAs.

Giroux 37
Granlund 32
Bennett 28
Evans 28
Roslovic 28
Tavares 34
Duchene 34
Donato 28
Nelson 33

Those are the guys at or above a .5ppg pace.

Theoretically we only need 1 and then a depth piece like Faksa could probably fill the void in a situation in which Dvorsky is not ready to break camp with the team for some reason.

Why would Giroux, Tavares, or Duchene sign in St. Louis? Money would be the only reason. Are we ready do do an 8m x 4 years for Tavares similar to what Stamkos signed last offseason? Or Duchene for that matter? Cost of a UFA is likely going up a good deal with the recent news of the cap rising exponentially.
I would safely take us out of this bin, it's a really hard sell that we're going to be competitive next season after trading Schenn this season.

2nd bin. Nelson and Granlund. I'm not sure what to estimate their UFA cost to be, but similar to the one before, are we going to pay them top dollar for a 4-5 year contract that they'll likely ask and get?

3rd Bin: Bennett. This would be preferred I'd imagine by most of us. This is going to cost likely north of 7m on a 7 year deal though. He has earned that type of contract. I'd imagine he could have the opportunity to sign in Florida if he were to take a discount, which i wouldn't rule out. I just don't know how they make the money work aside from shipping out Knight but that puts them at a really high risk after this year. That puts him pretty well in line with the Chandler Stephenson contract that he signed last offseason. It's certainly risky, and you're paying on the backend when we're probably going to open a window for production on the front end.

4th Bin: Probably where we'll have to go. Donato, Evans, Roslovic.

Donato is probably going to be able to ask for a bit more due to having a good season this season. I'm not sure he's worth it. He could fill the same void on our team next season though and may not be a bad option if he's a 2-3 year deal.

Evans is a bottom 6 center who's shooting percentage is through the roof this year. His percentage is all over the map throughout his career but it's comfortably double what his average is and over double what his average was prior to this season. He's been hammered in Zone start wise and had fairly good results. If we're looking for a solid 3C this is where I would shop. Unfortunately we're not though and I think he's going to be paid a decent chunk of change over 3-4 years due to his season this season assuming it stays consistent right now and he doesnt' taper off towards the end of the year.

Roslovic: I'm assuming he's playing wing in Carolina. His FO% is good this year but very limited attempts. Looks like last year he was a winger as well but prior to that he was a center. Wasn't very good at faceoffs when he was a center. Certainly not the end all be all. But he's pacing .5ppg which puts him at 41 points for the season. His other totals are around 40-50 prorated for games played, save a couple outliers early in his career on shortened seasons one better some worse. This is probably the cheapest option possible to fill the void. Not a bad option but certainly not something that would make me confident going in to next year that we are having another development year.


Now I understand that trades can occur. But I'm not really too comfortable going into next season saying Dvorsky has to be a 2C or we're absolutely screwed. I'm even less comfortable saying that Sunny is an option at 3C. He shouldn't be anymore. I'm perfectly fine with acquiring a guy to be a 2C short term and allow Dean and Dvorsky to fight out in camp for the 3C spot with alot of upwards mobility. I just don't see anyone that we could acquire being better suited for that role than Schenn, nor costing less than we would get in return for Schenn.

The only true benefit I see in the whole scenario would be allowing the motion of the leadership of the team to shift seamlessly without having to rip a letter off of someone's jersey to try another form of getting life out of the team.

 

[bleedblue1223]

The issue with this line of thinking is it isn't July 1st yet. I was a bit less optimistic before about the potential of signing one due to being incorrect on the centers available for UFA next season.

Yeah, I don't see much point in speculating on what we might do in the summer, and we all know how our center acquisition went this past summer. We at least know that they'll likely try and bring Dvorsky up. Trade or a free agent makes sense as the other, and if we are able to move cap out, we might be in a position to offer an increased salary at a reduced term.

I'm not that worried about replacing Schenn's production.

 

[BadgersandBlues]

I wouldn't trade for Dobson unless we had an 8 year extension already worked out with a number that made sense. I could probably talk myself into something that starts with a 9. Even if he is "only" a 50 point guy, he's still good enough defensively with those 50 points to be a legit #1 on pretty much every team that doesn't have Heiskanen/Makar/Fox/Morrisey et al. He's a top 15 player at his position, possibly in the convo for top 10. I also think this is a great year to go after him, b/c the Islanders' PP has been hot garbage all year, thus suppressing his overall numbers.

He's 6'4", right handed, just turned 25, plays 24 minutes a night, and he's missed 6, 3, 4, and 2 games over the last 4 years. Parayko slots down, Faulk slots down, and we finally have a D that looks reasonable on paper.

This type of guy doesn't come along very often. We should be really sure we want to pass on him before we pass on him.

 

[Brian39]

I'm not sure what his best comps are, but say McAvoy, Werenski, Sergachev, etc. He's probably already reasonably asking for 9.5ish, and with cap going up, wouldn't shock me if he's pushing that number up to 10.5-11.5. Gets more complicated at that point.

I do lean towards I'd rather go down swinging than go down scared to throw a punch, but you absolutely can't trade Kyrou without getting a long-term extension.

Worth noting that those contracts were signed in 2021 and were 11.5% of the cap when the contract begun. 11.5% of next year's cap is $10.98M. So you are dead on with your range when taking those as comps. Neither of them had a 70 point season under their belts when they signed those deals either.

 

[BlueDream]

Just to put some numbers to this concept, $6.5M will be 6.8% of the cap in 2025/26, 6.25% in 2026/27 and 5.7% in 2027/28 based on the numbers released by the NHL and PA. Currently, 5.7% of the cap is $5M and 6.25% of the cap is $5.5M. If you think that he can contribute to your team as a legit upgrade this year and next, those last couple years aren't looking as hard to swallow as they were a couple years ago. Also worth noting that his actual salary in the last couple years is $4.3M and $4M.

The Schenn rumors are interesting to me. I don't have a gut reaction about how serious we might be listening or how accurate this report might be. Is this a message to the room (or Schenn specifically)? Is Army testing the waters to see how other GMs are changing their valuation of future cap space? I really can't decide what to make of this report beyond the face value 'of course the Blues are at least listening to offers.'

I’m in the same boat that I don’t really know how to read the seriousness of the Schenn rumors.

But then I remembered one of Armstrong’s quotes after the Saad termination. He was upset with our inconsistent play and the issues we continue to have, such as slow starts. He mentioned that when looking to fix these things, he starts looking at who has been here the longest and you kind of start chipping away at that list, or something along those lines.

So Schenn, Parayko, Faulk, Thomas and Kyrou are the longest tenured players who have been here for the past 6 years. Binnington of course too, but since he’s a goalie I’m going to separate him from the skaters that I think Armstrong was referring to more.

I wouldn’t be shocked to see Amstrong make a move this Summer to shake up the leadership group and move one of the guys above. I think Thomas and Parayko are safe, but I could see one of the others getting shipped out if Armstrong does want to send a message and change things up.

 

[Stealth JD]

I wouldn't trade for Dobson unless we had an 8 year extension already worked out with a number that made sense. I could probably talk myself into something that starts with a 9. Even if he is "only" a 50 point guy, he's still good enough defensively with those 50 points to be a legit #1 on pretty much every team that doesn't have Heiskanen/Makar/Fox/Morrisey et al. He's a top 15 player at his position, possibly in the convo for top 10. I also think this is a great year to go after him, b/c the Islanders' PP has been hot garbage all year, thus suppressing his overall numbers.

He's 6'4", right handed, just turned 25, plays 24 minutes a night, and he's missed 6, 3, 4, and 2 games over the last 4 years. Parayko slots down, Faulk slots down, and we finally have a D that looks reasonable on paper.

This type of guy doesn't come along very often. We should be really sure we want to pass on him before we pass on him.

I thought Dobson struggles in his own end; which is why the Isles have no interest in signing him to a mega-deal. I don’t watch the Isles much, as I’m not a masochist, but I was under the impression that he was Bouchard-esque.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I thought Dobson struggles in his own end; which is why the Isles have no interest in signing him to a mega-deal. I don’t watch the Isles much, as I’m not a masochist, but I was under the impression that he was Bouchard-esque.

That's what some of the concerns are, but we have Parayko for that role. And it's more common for those guys to get heavier offensive usage, guys like McAvoy and Werenski as examples.

 

[Brian39]

I’m in the same boat that I don’t really know how to read the seriousness of the Schenn rumors.

But then I remembered one of Armstrong’s quotes after the Saad termination. He was upset with our inconsistent play and the issues we continue to have, such as slow starts. He mentioned that when looking to fix these things, he starts looking at who has been here the longest and you kind of start chipping away at that list, or something along those lines.

So Schenn, Parayko, Faulk, Thomas and Kyrou are the longest tenured players who have been here for the past 6 years. Binnington of course too, but since he’s a goalie I’m going to separate him from the skaters that I think Armstrong was referring to more.

I wouldn’t be shocked to see Amstrong make a move this Summer to shake up the leadership group and move one of the guys above. I think Thomas and Parayko are safe, but I could see one of the others getting shipped out if Armstrong does want to send a message and change things up.

I agree with this assessment. Army sounds like he isn't pleased with the leadership group and your captain is certainly a big part of the leadership group.

I really like what I know of Schenn the person. He is very well respected around the league and is by all accounts great with the young guys. He's been a fantastic mentor for Neighbours. I think his leadership in terms of teaching young guys how to be good pros has been excellent.

But I'm not sure that he's been an effective leader for the game-to-game grind of a regular season.

Schenn has always frustrated me with his extended stretches of completely unimpactful play. I respect the way he ups his physicality to try and pull himself out of these slumps, but the flip side of that coin is that I think he too often needs the fight or big hit to get himself into games. This team comes out flat way too often and I can't help but wonder if that is in part a reflection of everyone waiting for something to draw them into the fight.

I do think it is worth remembering that Army was originally talking about not having a captain for 2023/24 before Schenn was named captain in training camp. Berube got fired a few months later and then Bannister got fired a year later. Slow starts and late-game collapses persist. Schenn has been awful in the last 7 games while the season has completely slipped away. I'm not saying that Schenn as the C is the problem, but I could see Army being ready to move on from it.