Pre-Game Talk: 2023 Draft Discussion

[Mcsorley47]

YES!! The pic is still out there!!

View attachment 723783

The one man army!

 

[King'sPawn]

Dvorak would've been1st rounder if not for injury. So many inferior d's picked before him in 1st and 2nd round. Huge body, physical, high-end defensive IQ and great skater. He is going to be ready for the show sooner than many of you think. He has pro experience and is very refined in his own end. His ceiling is high end shut down bottom pair defenceman, if he improves his offense top4 D

I appreciate that - again, he's a Kings prospect so I'm rooting for him regardless. I just had a tepid reaction based on what (admittedly little) I saw.

 

[kings11]

I appreciate that - again, he's a Kings prospect so I'm rooting for him regardless. I just had a tepid reaction based on what (admittedly little) I saw.

Try to get some vids of him before the injury and he’s impressive considering how big he is.. he literally looks like Shaq surrounded by a bunch of Kevin Hart’s

 

[Steve Zissou]

It's the day after and this is still funny

 

[BigKing]

Maybe we’ll rush Ziemmer to the NHL like we did with Clifford. His profile reads similarly, that’s for sure. Cliffy probably could’ve used another development year, but his heart and physicality made him stick and into a champion.

Also, thanks @King’sPawn!

There aren't as many pure crushers out there v. when Clifford came in but Ziemmer still isn't a Clifford type. KC was a legit tough guy while Ziemmer is an offensive talent that plays physical.

KC had 28 total points in his draft year. Ziemmer had 89 and only 43 PIMs.

As much as we want this type of player in the lineup, let's hope they don't rush him.

@bland mentioned Toffoli in comparison. Not as a player but more as a pick. Both had skill and highlights but skating was an issue. Toffoli had two years in Junior and then the majority of the season in Manchester before getting the call-up and then playing in the 2013 playoff run.

Not sure if Ziemmer is AHL eligible in his second year but it would be shocking if he is in the NHL in his D+2 year. Regardless, I'm excited to watch him develop.

Dvorak would've been1st rounder if not for injury. So many inferior d's picked before him in 1st and 2nd round. Huge body, physical, high-end defensive IQ and great skater. He is going to be ready for the show sooner than many of you think. He has pro experience and is very refined in his own end. His ceiling is high end shut down bottom pair defenceman, if he improves his offense top4 D

That's funny because Wheeler said his skating is atrocious, something like "red flag" worthy.

Probably a good thing since this guy was drooling all over the Kings prospects that haven't turned into anything yet.

 

[Chazz Reinhold]

There aren't as many pure crushers out there v. when Clifford came in but Ziemmer still isn't a Clifford type. KC was a legit tough guy while Ziemmer is an offensive talent that plays physical.

KC had 28 total points in his draft year. Ziemmer had 89 and only 43 PIMs.

As much as we want this type of player in the lineup, let's hope they don't rush him.

@bland mentioned Toffoli in comparison. Not as a player but more as a pick. Both had skill and highlights but skating was an issue. Toffoli had two years in Junior and then the majority of the season in Manchester before getting the call-up and then playing in the 2013 playoff run.

Not sure if Ziemmer is AHL eligible in his second year but it would be shocking if he is in the NHL in his D+2 year. Regardless, I'm excited to watch him develop.


That's funny because Wheeler said his skating is atrocious, something like "red flag" worthy.

Probably a good thing since this guy was drooling all over the Kings prospects that haven't turned into anything yet.

I thought that was a funny comment from Wheeler since he tends to defend Brandt Clarke’s skating stride/style. I’ve seen a few outlets say Dvorak’s skating is fine so who knows.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I thought that was a funny comment from Wheeler since he tends to defend Brandt Clarke’s skating stride/style. I’ve seen a few outlets say Dvorak’s skating is fine so who knows.

Looks a little like Moverare's--where he's agile enough to be a great defender around his own net but his top speed is low.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Yannetti also praised Dvorak’s skating.

 

[kings11]

Looks a little like Moverare's--where he's agile enough to be a great defender around his own net but his top speed is low.

He does look slow but that has more to do with his long strides. Hell probably top out as a Gavrikov type skater

 

[Gjwrams]

I like this draft class. likeyou all, don’t know much about the goalie, but they are always a crap shoot anyhow. i did not like last years Draft class at all, and their results sort of confirmed that.

 

[King'sPawn]

Not sure if Ziemmer is AHL eligible in his second year but it would be shocking if he is in the NHL in his D+2 year. Regardless, I'm excited to watch him develop.

I've read different things - one source says that if a player turns 20 by December 31 that season, then they can be assigned to the AHL. But I've also read that players, if they aren't playing in the NHL, must be assigned to their junior team if they are 18 or 19 years old. I always work under the assumption that a player will be in major junior for the next two seasons after being drafted.

Of course, both Ziemmer and Mania can play in the AHL when their major junior seasons end.

 

[KingsHockey24]

Pretty meh draft.

That guy we got in the 3rd round we'll be a beauty though.

 

[Moses Doughty]

@bland mentioned Toffoli in comparison. Not as a player but more as a pick. Both had skill and highlights but skating was an issue. Toffoli had two years in Junior and then the majority of the season in Manchester before getting the call-up and then playing in the 2013 playoff run.

Not sure if it was mentioned earlier but Yannetti made similar comments when speaking to Mayor post-draft. Also mentioned that they think alot of that will resolve itself when he gets into better shape

 

[Surf Nutz]

Was he the starter?

 

[tigermask48]

Was he the starter?

Yes, I got to see him play a handful of times and he's solid. Being a Kings fan in Minnesota finally pays off!
He was pretty far and away the top goalie in the Minnesota High School State Tournament as far as skill goes (Class AA or Class A). He was in Class A which is the smaller schools population wise.
Seemed like one of the leaders of the Warroad team from what I saw of the three games in the tournament.
The finals actually went to double OT and he had 40 in the 6-5 Loss to Mahtomedi, including a first OT PK where he made a couple big saves.

He's a pure butterfly goalie with better than average positioning that needs to work on his rebound control, so he's a good fit for the Kings staff to help in that aspect.

Committed to go to Northern Michigan University if I remember right. No idea how their program is for goaltenders as I only follow their big rival Lake Superior State which is also in the UP of Michigan.

 

[SaltyElkHunter]

My mission is to go to a draft and bang a first rounders mom.

 

[ru4reals]

So every team usually has a development camp after the draft hopefully they're going to have one again soon. Would love to go see the new batch with the likes of Pinelli, Clarke and company.

 

[King'sPawn]

So every team usually has a development camp after the draft hopefully they're going to have one again soon. Would love to go see the new batch with the likes of Pinelli, Clarke and company.

Roster Preview: LA Kings 2023 Development Camp

mayorsmanor.com

Details about dev camp

 

[Sol]

Roster Preview: LA Kings 2023 Development Camp

mayorsmanor.com

Details about dev camp

Yo KP. Can you try to elaborate on.Clarkes skating and physical maturity if you see any? I know his skating and something about his knees or whatever was a point of discussion near his draft. Would love to get an update on whether or not he’s skating much better and if he’s healthy. And if he looks physically more mature. Whatever really stands out to you at camp.


Greatly appreciate your work.

 

[Statto]

Mark Yannetti on the Five Players Selected by LA Kings at 2023 NHL Draft

mayorsmanor.com

Interesting mention from Yannetti - Ziemmer apparently still low in body composition at the combine. The idea of him having a lot of physical development is pretty impressive, although it seems like it's more geared towards how it affects his skating.

They have historically been very good at assessing which players skating they can improve, in particular with strength work. Toffoli, Kaliyev and even Clarke springs to mind (who definitely looks better on his skates).

 

[Statto]

Yo KP. Can you try to elaborate on.Clarkes skating and physical maturity if you see any? I know his skating and something about his knees or whatever was a point of discussion near his draft. Would love to get an update on whether or not he’s skating much better and if he’s healthy. And if he looks physically more mature. Whatever really stands out to you at camp.


Greatly appreciate your work.

Lol, missed this.

My take is that his knees are in a better position. I think he will always have an unusual skating stride but it looks ‘stronger’ in terms of how he plants himself. He certainly gets around the ice well and I don’t see it as a concern. He looks more efficient going backwards also.

Note: Skating is not an area of expertise for me by any means.

 

[Statto]

Maybe we’ll rush Ziemmer to the NHL like we did with Clifford. His profile reads similarly, that’s for sure. Cliffy probably could’ve used another development year, but his heart and physicality made him stick and into a champion.

Also, thanks @King’sPawn!

Hope we don’t rush him. I see the argument especially if he brings something we are missing but based on the composition question (I assume that means disproportionate strength) I think it’d be a recipe for a career of injuries.

They need to get him in good physical shape, which means nicely balanced so the right muscles are doing the right job etc. Lots of young players need to work on their core and explosive power through the glutes and pelvis and given the comments from Yanetti I’d bet he’s in that boat. Given his size now though, he is going to be a unit once he’s ready.

If Dvorak had a broken collarbone, then i can personally attest to that being a problem for him last year. I fractured my collar bone when i was 17 and stupidly thought it was fine 3 weeks later and started to do some activity. Which promptly lead me to a complete/clean break. That was a LOT of pain -- just breathing hurt. It was about 4 months before i was good again -- but it took me like 6-8 more months to mentally feel ok to go full blast.

Collar bones are a bitch. Much more painful than my hip and even ribs… I snapped mine on the last inch just before the shoulder…. About 3 months for me but fortunately escaped surgery.

 

[King'sPawn]

Yo KP. Can you try to elaborate on.Clarkes skating and physical maturity if you see any? I know his skating and something about his knees or whatever was a point of discussion near his draft. Would love to get an update on whether or not he’s skating much better and if he’s healthy. And if he looks physically more mature. Whatever really stands out to you at camp.


Greatly appreciate your work.

I truly wish I could - unfortunately, I live near Seattle now and haven't been able to attend a camp in a long time.

I will probably create a thread though just for general info and of course hope people who can attend will chime in.

I admit I suck in evaluating skating mechanics - I was a slower skater than Robitaille when I played, but I can try to share what I've seen on video with Clarke if that's satisfactory.

Anyway, with Clarke, his skating does look weird, although I'm at that point where I define weird skating like art - I know it when I see it, although I can't define it well, lol. I think it's because there's less flexion at the knees or hips where he's just not bent over as much. Still, despite these mechanics, he's able to keep up with the OHL competition for the most part, that he's able to force attackers to the outside. He's not a speedster, just not impaired by his skating style at the level he was playing at.

Physically, at the OHL level, he held his own. He doesn't bowl guys over, but he doesn't bounce off them either. He's part of the newer age of defenseman who utilize body positioning and stickwork to separate players from the puck.

Frankly, his biggest flaw that I can vocalize is defensive reads, particularly as more layers/elements get added. Up to a 2-on-2 attack, he's comfortable communicating to his partner for coverage. Once it becomes an outnumbered attack or sustained forecheck, he quickly loses track of incoming danger. It's at this point he can get tunnel vision with his marked player. Not Sean Durzi levels, mind you, but not one who will effectively and frequently mitigate dangers to an attack.

This is where his skating can be most exposed, though - when he has a strong skater forechecking, he can force them to the outside, at which point he takes an angle that gives them room to circle behind the net to escape him. It's when the player commits to circling behind the net that Clarke needs a stronger partner to neutralize the carrier on the other side, because he does not have the right combination of skating, strength, and positioning to shut down the attacker.

So, in short, there's obviously room to grow. But at least at the levels he's played at, he's been able to keep up. Ability to read complex or sustained pressure needs to improve. With one-on-one, he can get exposed by more persistent or skilled skaters if they take the bait and continue their path behind the net. By then, he'll be behind them.

Maybe we’ll rush Ziemmer to the NHL like we did with Clifford. His profile reads similarly, that’s for sure. Cliffy probably could’ve used another development year, but his heart and physicality made him stick and into a champion.

Also, thanks @King’sPawn!

No problem, thank you!

I hope they don't rush. As much as I'm a proponent if putting players in their role at an earlier age, I still expect them to be able to perform their role at an acceptable level. Again, I'm not good at evaluating skating technique, but the dude is remarkably and visibly slow. He's not hitting any NHLer unless they have a bout of narcolepsy at this point.

 

[Fat Elvis]

Looking at the last 2 drafts. I think LA could get 2-4 NHL players for the 2 drafts combined.
Maybe kids like Conners, Dvorak and Ziemmer, but that's a big maybe. Don't see any top 6 forwards or top 4 dmen. Hope I'm wrong, and I'm wrong often.
Good thing they drafted Clarke and had the #2 in 2020 or it's going to get pretty thin pretty quick.

 

[JJDrums]

I have zero faith in Yanneti. Zero Nadda