2023-24 #2: Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Jrs., Int'l, etc.

[Curufinwe]

Drysdale, York and Zamula in Philadelphia. Attard and Andrae with the Phantoms. That's to go along with the healthy veterans.


Somehow think the Flyers will be fine on D for years.

There's only one player there who has been good in the NHL. Attard is 25 and has played 29 NHL games. Andrae is 22 and has played 4 games. Drysdale is so injury prone he has only has played 123 out of the last 246 games.

He's not exactly a shark poker player.

I really wanted to like Briere as GM but then he does stuff like lavish praise on that loser Lappy, and admits publicly that they are going to pick a center based on need right before the NHL draft when they then duly reach to take a center.

 

[BernieParent]

The only thing that makes sense to me is that Buium's agent said, "Don't bother."

 

[thedjpd]

The only thing that makes sense to me is that Buium's agent said, "Don't bother."

Yup, I believe this is it. But they can't say that.

 

[Fight4yourRight]

Briere just doesn't strike me as wise GM so far, Looks like a lost puppy when he speaks. Don't see him oozing confidence.

No good answer to provide as they messed up badly.

Sometimes even the moron GMs can get by, by just railroading other people. Rare as it is and increasingly rarer, but they exist. But Briere is neither intimidating nor is he very bright. The worst of both worlds.

 

[BernieParent]

Yup, I believe this is it. But they can't say that.

The problem is that this is worse than being too dumb to pick the player with the biggest upside.

 

[CerpinTaxt]

Probably nothing more than size and he’s a lefty. Maybe Cutter and McGroarty scared teams away from college guys? Idk.

The only thing that makes sense to me is that Buium's agent said, "Don't bother."

I'd still take him and then trade him for other assets. I know the Flyers are not good at this but you don't draft for need you draft for talent. And who knows maybe Michkov is good enough to pull this team out of mediocrity and Buium decides he wants to be the next piece. Oh well will never know cause management drafted for "need" instead.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Traded back for a 3rd rounder in 2025, the greatest bounty of talent ever, so at least we have that to look forward to.

Hate to break it to you but they already traded the pick to trade up for Spencer Gill.

 

[Appleyard]

I mean, obviously.

A GM making a mistake in isolation is fair; they aren't infallible. But it's surprising that everybody's claiming he was most likely the best D-Man available among the 6, but was the last one taken.

I just think there's something more to the story is all.

His size and Kurt Overhardt are a big part of the reason I believe...

 

[thedjpd]

His size and Kurt Overhardt are a big part of the reason I believe...

I’m aware - but do you believe that Kurt Ovarhardt is avoided by other teams as well?

 

[VaCaps Fan]

My hometown of Richmond had the flyers AHL team in the 1970s..

 

[Appleyard]

I’m aware - but do you believe that Kurt Ovarhardt is avoided by other teams as well?

He is getting a reputation from what I understand...

he already had one from what I know before the Gauthier situation.

 

[Larry44]

Hate to break it to you but they already traded the pick to trade up for Spencer Gill.

I know, it was a joke. Forgot to use Sarcastica font.

 

[deadhead]

Think there were two reasons teams were wary of Buium, age (December b-day) and Denver scoring - at 6'0 185 (which means he'll probably end up 200+ lbs) I don't think size was a big consideration.

Luchanko is a gamble, he has all the qualities the "new" Flyers want, high IQ, great speed, defensively responsible, at 5'11 187 at the Combine he'll probably end up 6'0 200+.

They're gambling on an August birthday, he was 5 months older than Catton in his D-1 season:
63g 23-32 55 -36 (5'11 174 at the combine)
Luchanko last season 68g 20-54 74 -13 on a bad Guelph team

Now will he make a similar jump? Don't know.
If he does, Flyers look brilliant, get a bigger, stronger, faster version of Catton.
If he doesn't, they've got a nice bottom six center in the Poehling mold.

 

[renberg]

Think there were two reasons teams were wary of Buium, age (December b-day) and Denver scoring - at 6'0 185 (which means he'll probably end up 200+ lbs) I don't think size was a big consideration.

Luchanko is a gamble, he has all the qualities the "new" Flyers want, high IQ, great speed, defensively responsible, at 5'11 187 at the Combine he'll probably end up 6'0 200+.

They're gambling on an August birthday, he was 5 months older than Catton in his D-1 season:
63g 23-32 55 -36 (5'11 174 at the combine)
Luchanko last season 68g 20-54 74 -13 on a bad Guelph team

Now will he make a similar jump? Don't know.
If he does, Flyers look brilliant, get a bigger, stronger, faster version of Catton.
If he doesn't, they've got a nice bottom six center in the Poehling mold.

Welcome back. Your input was missed.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Think there were two reasons teams were wary of Buium, age (December b-day) and Denver scoring - at 6'0 185 (which means he'll probably end up 200+ lbs) I don't think size was a big consideration.

Luchanko is a gamble, he has all the qualities the "new" Flyers want, high IQ, great speed, defensively responsible, at 5'11 187 at the Combine he'll probably end up 6'0 200+.

They're gambling on an August birthday, he was 5 months older than Catton in his D-1 season:
63g 23-32 55 -36 (5'11 174 at the combine)
Luchanko last season 68g 20-54 74 -13 on a bad Guelph team

Now will he make a similar jump? Don't know.
If he does, Flyers look brilliant, get a bigger, stronger, faster version of Catton.
If he doesn't, they've got a nice bottom six center in the Poehling mold.

The "new" Flyers. Do they want elite level talent? Can never have enough RP's

 

[Magua]

I'll die on the hill that the Flyers should've stayed away from Michkov and his December birthday. Someone like Dvorsky (June) would've been preferable. Anything can happen in those 7 months. This is why Brannstrom was a better prospect than Makar, and Chytil a better prospect than Pettersson.

Remember, the Flyers were horny over Reinbacher and his October birthday as a top 5 prospect, while possessing the most vanilla low upside of skill-sets. They're telling us what they do and don't care about. They don't really care about high upside developmental arcs. They watched Bonk (January birthday) and Cowan (an OHL rookie) and decided on Bonk. Perreault has a May birthday and physical development runway; Musty is a July birthday.

They want certain skill-sets and draft for imagined need at certain positions -- the rest is coincidence. To this day, no one has said anything concrete about why Luchanko has magical upside because he was born in August. He's probably one of the more physically peaked players in his class, with skill question marks. Pretend Buium was a 2023 draftee and this was his D+1; his season loses none of its luster. Giroux was a January birthday, not a summer birthday. But he was 160lbs and a Q rookie scoring at explosive levels. It's beyond facile to simply say, "August."

 

[deadhead]

It's been shown, all else held equal, that late birthdays outperformed early birthdays.
Now all things are rarely equal, it's not just age, physical maturity, experience, etc.

I don't remember the Flyers being horny over Reinbacher, from all reports, Briere was focused on Michkov and was prepared to trade up if needed.

Hard to claim Cowan is a better choice than Bonk, since Barkey's performance is pretty similar to Cowan on the same team.

Perreault fell b/c the league didn't think his production would translate to the same extent as Benson.

They do want certain skill sets, speed, IQ and work ethic seem to be at the top of their list.
Any team that drafts York, Brink, Andrae is not fixated on size, but they do want balance.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

It's been shown, all else held equal, that late birthdays outperformed early birthdays.
Now all things are rarely equal, it's not just age, physical maturity, experience, etc.

I don't remember the Flyers being horny over Reinbacher, from all reports, Briere was focused on Michkov and was prepared to trade up if needed.

Hard to claim Cowan is a better choice than Bonk, since Barkey's performance is pretty similar to Cowan on the same team.

Perreault fell b/c the league didn't think his production would translate to the same extent as Benson.

They do want certain skill sets, speed, IQ and work ethic seem to be at the top of their list.
Any team that drafts York, Brink, Andrae is not fixated on size, but they do want balance.

So odd how talent is left off that.

 

[deadhead]

So odd how talent is left off that.

"Talent."

Talent is just a generic term for a set of skills, speed, agility, hands, vision, etc.

Now if you mean scoring ability, say so.
But that's not synonymous with talent (substantial overlap but not the same).

I think IQ is the most important element of "talent," and work ethic the key to maximizing your talent.

But there are few players who excel at every important attribute, so in most cases you're trading off between skills.

 

[FLYguy3911]

I've seen some crazy defenses of the pick but comparing his draft year scoring to a draft peer's D-1 scoring has to take it.

And you know it's a reach when the ES breakdown is left out.

 

[deadhead]

I've seen some crazy defenses of the pick but comparing his draft year scoring to a draft peer's D-1 scoring has to take it.

And you know it's a reach when the ES breakdown is left out.

Luchanko's performance was better than Catton at 5 months older.
Now Catton made a huge jump last season, we'll see if Luchanko does this season.
I presume the Flyer scouts watched him all season and could see if he showed steady improvement.

It's a gamble, we'll have a good idea if it works out by spring.

But D-0, D+1 is as arbitrary as birthdays, you're talking 18-19 year olds, most players make a huge jump from 17 to 19 (a few elite players emerge by 16-17, but those are rare as hen's teeth).

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Luchanko's performance was better than Catton at 5 months older.
Now Catton made a huge jump last season, we'll see if Luchanko does this season.
I presume the Flyer scouts watched him all season and could see if he showed steady improvement.

It's a gamble, we'll have a good idea if it works out by spring.

But D-0, D+1 is as arbitrary as birthdays, you're talking 18-19 year olds, most players make a huge jump from 17 to 19 (a few elite players emerge by 16-17, but those are rare as hen's teeth).

That is the scary part. Scouting isn't their forte. Or maybe it is development. Or both. Or incompetence.

 

[volnoir]

Luchanko's performance was better than Catton at 5 months older.
Now Catton made a huge jump last season, we'll see if Luchanko does this season.
I presume the Flyer scouts watched him all season and could see if he showed steady improvement.

It's a gamble, we'll have a good idea if it works out by spring.

But D-0, D+1 is as arbitrary as birthdays, you're talking 18-19 year olds, most players make a huge jump from 17 to 19 (a few elite players emerge by 16-17, but those are rare as hen's teeth).

I don't think many people have as much problem with the gamble on Luchanko as much as they have a problem with what was left on the table.

 

[deadhead]

I don't think many people have as much problem with the gamble on Luchanko as much as they have a problem with what was left on the table.

Yeah, but we've seen "sure things" flop, we're Flyer fans.

I no longer get excited by drafts, the media consensus is almost always wrong.
By next spring you'll have a much better idea, and usually confirmed by D+2.
Though there are always the late bloomers like Tippett. But those are outliers.

My theory is simple, trust your scouts, stick to your board, if your scouts are wrong, get new scouts.

 

[Appleyard]

I mean, all of that can be very easily flipped. Even if comparing 2022-23 Catton to 2023-24 Luchanko.

Catton was playing on an even worse team... (2.86 G/GP vs 3.30)

drove play far better... (55% corsi vs 50.3%)

and put up the same EV production per game... (0.55 P/GP, which when equate to team scoring, well, yeh, Catton's looks even better)

while having much better puck-skills, passing, IQ and shot.

when he was 7 months younger than Luchanko, who almost went top ten!

Wow. What a prospect that Catton is. Wonder what leap he might take next year!