2023-2024 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread

[stl76]

Sure those could all be possibilities, but the reality is that the Blues will do none of them. Best and only case scenario is that a playoff team suitable for Krug emerges, they have the cap, and we offload him for few assets. I don't see a world where Krug plays significantly less, where he gets waived, where he gets bought out; the only realistic scenario to move him is to trade him to a playoff contender in need.

The Blues kind of already did the bolded last season...

 

[Brian39]

Sure those could all be possibilities, but the reality is that the Blues will do none of them. Best and only case scenario is that a playoff team suitable for Krug emerges, they have the cap, and we offload him for few assets. I don't see a world where Krug plays significantly less, where he gets waived, where he gets bought out; the only realistic scenario to move him is to trade him to a playoff contender in need.

I fully expect his 5 on 5 minutes to reflect the results he is getting on the ice. He has lost 2 minutes a night of ice time in each of the last 2 seasons. He went from 22:35 a night in 2020/21 to 20:34 a night in 2021/22 to 18:35 a night in 2022/23. Why wouldn't that trajectory continue if the team keeps getting caved in when he is on the ice? If Perunovich gets and seizes an opportunity and plays better than Krug, why wouldn't the coaching staff decrease Krug's minutes?

I'm not saying it is a lock that Krug is going to wind up 7th on the depth chart. I wouldn't say that is the most likely outcome this season. But I wouldn't say it is outside the realm of possibility.

I also think it is completely reasonable to believe that Army will use every ounce of leverage he has to try and move Krug if he still believes that is in the team's best interest. Army has a very clear line in the sand between NTCs and NMCs. I don't see any reason to believe that he wouldn't use the one extra piece of leverage the team gets from a contract having a NTC vs a NMC.

Finally, we aren't just talking about this season. The knowledge that these things could happen at any time between now and 2027 if he's still here should be part of his decision-making process whenever he is next asked about waiving his NTC.

 

[stlbluz]

"Are You Ready for the Blues?"

Perfect pre-season summary song.

 

[ezcreepin]

The Blues kind of already did the bolded last season...

20-21 season everyone was hurt besides he and Faulk. Krug played 20 minutes on the pk that year and I doubt he will ever sniff close to that amount anytime soon. Last year he got hurt mid game and played like 7 minutes in one game and the other he got 26 penalty minutes and played 5 the entire game. If you accounted for that, you'd get around 19 minutes per game for Krug last year which isn't necessarily massive, but it's not as drastic as losing 2 min+ of ice time in a year. It's obvious that they see Krug is a liability, but until we see him playing like 16 minutes a night, I'm pumping the brakes. That's still top 4 minutes on this team. If after this year, he drops another 1:30 or 2:00, then I'll change my tune.

I fully expect his 5 on 5 minutes to reflect the results he is getting on the ice. He has lost 2 minutes a night of ice time in each of the last 2 seasons. He went from 22:35 a night in 2020/21 to 20:34 a night in 2021/22 to 18:35 a night in 2022/23. Why wouldn't that trajectory continue if the team keeps getting caved in when he is on the ice? If Perunovich gets and seizes an opportunity and plays better than Krug, why wouldn't the coaching staff decrease Krug's minutes?

I'm not saying it is a lock that Krug is going to wind up 7th on the depth chart. I wouldn't say that is the most likely outcome this season. But I wouldn't say it is outside the realm of possibility.

I also think it is completely reasonable to believe that Army will use every ounce of leverage he has to try and move Krug if he still believes that is in the team's best interest. Army has a very clear line in the sand between NTCs and NMCs. I don't see any reason to believe that he wouldn't use the one extra piece of leverage the team gets from a contract having a NTC vs a NMC.

Finally, we aren't just talking about this season. The knowledge that these things could happen at any time between now and 2027 if he's still here should be part of his decision-making process whenever he is next asked about waiving his NTC.

20-21 Krug and Faulk were the only healthy defenseman so it doesn't surprise me he had 22 minutes. 22-23, as a mention above, he had two games where he played less than 8 minutes which accounts for roughly 30 seconds over the course of the season, so in reality he should've played 19 minutes as opposed to 18:30. As I also mention above, 18 min on this team is still top 4, so I don't foresee his ice time changing drastically this year unless he is actually awful. Even strength is a different question and I'd have to see how he's deployed to really make an accurate reading on what's happening.

All this to say that of the mentioned strategies people have outlined, Armstrong is likely to do only one of them, and that's to trade him. And that rests on the available suitors willing to take Krug who have the cap space to do so. I guess Krug could be made uncomfortable, but in all of the interviews I've seen with Armstrong, he's very candid on how he handles situations with players when he's actively trading them, and I just don't see a scenario where Krug is made uncomfortable. Now, there are always surprise things that happen midseason and a team could really want Krug and he waives his no-move, but that's like the only thing that would get him off the team. Blues don't have the defenseman to push him aside at this point is the way I see it. But we can revisit this at the end of the season I guess?

 

[Mike Liut]

Buchnevich-Thomas-Kyrou
Saad-Schenn-Kapanen
Vrana-Hayes-Blais
Toropchenko-Sundqvist-Neighbours

Leddy-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Scandella-Tucker

Binnington
Hofer

Tonight’s lineup looks like what we’ll see next Thursday barring injuries.

 

[kimzey59]

Buchnevich-Thomas-Kyrou
Saad-Schenn-Kapanen
Vrana-Hayes-Blais
Toropchenko-Sundqvist-Neighbours

Leddy-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Scandella-Tucker

Binnington
Hofer

Tonight’s lineup looks like what we’ll see next Thursday barring injuries.

But don't worry, there's no video tonight.

The Blues have to figure something out for streaming pre-season games.
It's absolutely ridiculous that in today's world there are games not being shown online someplace.

Side note; Toro may not be going tonight. Apparently he just left the ice at practice.

 

[Mike Liut]

Leddy-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Scandella-Tucker

Poor Binnington

 

[Thallis]

But don't worry, there's no video tonight.

The Blues have to figure something out for streaming pre-season games.
It's absolutely ridiculous that in today's world there are games not being shown online someplace.

Side note; Toro may not be going tonight. Apparently he just left the ice at practice.

It's wild because they're literally taping the game already! Just show the jumbotron feed!

 

[kimzey59]

Looks like Alexandrov is getting the nod for Toro tonight.

Projected Lineup: Oct. 5 at Dallas | St. Louis Blues

With the training camp roster now reduced to 34 players, the St. Louis Blues will travel to face the Dallas Stars in a preseason contest carrying a lineup that looks a lot like what it could for Opening Night. The Blues will be back in Dallas for the start of

www.nhl.com

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Looks like Alexandrov is getting the nod for Toro tonight.

Projected Lineup: Oct. 5 at Dallas | St. Louis Blues

With the training camp roster now reduced to 34 players, the St. Louis Blues will travel to face the Dallas Stars in a preseason contest carrying a lineup that looks a lot like what it could for Opening Night. The Blues will be back in Dallas for the start of

www.nhl.com

tonight might be biggest game of Alexandrov’s life. If he wants to be nhl player this is his chance.

 

[Majorityof1]

tonight might be biggest game of Alexandrov’s life. If he wants to be nhl player this is his chance.

That might be overstating it. It's not like he'll never play in an NHL game if he doesn't play well tonight. He could do nothing offensively, have multiple major mistakes leading to goals against and he would still have a really, really strong chance to play in the NHL at some point this year when injuries hit

 

[Mike Liut]

tonight might be biggest game of Alexandrov’s life. If he wants to be nhl player this is his chance.

I like Alexandrov’s game. He might only ever be a bottom 6 player, but he is physical and has skill.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

That might be overstating it. It's not like he'll never play in an NHL game if he doesn't play well tonight. He could do nothing offensively, have multiple major mistakes leading to goals against and he would still have a really, really strong chance to play in the NHL at some point this year when injuries hit

not saying that he will never have another chance, but if he shows well tonight he likely makes club and all that entails. if he doesn't, he likely gets waived and spends bulk of year in ahl. one path keeps moving him forward, the other says club is willing to risk losing him. so is he going to show that he is part of our plans going forward or future journeyman?

I like Alexandrov’s game. He might only ever be a bottom 6 player, but he is physical and has skill.

i don't see that he shows much physicality. he has some skill, more than guy like torpo, but if he isn't harder on pucks, doesn't win faceoffs, can't show that he can handle center, then i don't see that he has enough skill or physicality to be all that valuable as bottom 6 winger.

 

[Brian39]

20-21 season everyone was hurt besides he and Faulk. Krug played 20 minutes on the pk that year and I doubt he will ever sniff close to that amount anytime soon. Last year he got hurt mid game and played like 7 minutes in one game and the other he got 26 penalty minutes and played 5 the entire game. If you accounted for that, you'd get around 19 minutes per game for Krug last year which isn't necessarily massive, but it's not as drastic as losing 2 min+ of ice time in a year. It's obvious that they see Krug is a liability, but until we see him playing like 16 minutes a night, I'm pumping the brakes. That's still top 4 minutes on this team. If after this year, he drops another 1:30 or 2:00, then I'll change my tune.


20-21 Krug and Faulk were the only healthy defenseman so it doesn't surprise me he had 22 minutes. 22-23, as a mention above, he had two games where he played less than 8 minutes which accounts for roughly 30 seconds over the course of the season, so in reality he should've played 19 minutes as opposed to 18:30. As I also mention above, 18 min on this team is still top 4, so I don't foresee his ice time changing drastically this year unless he is actually awful. Even strength is a different question and I'd have to see how he's deployed to really make an accurate reading on what's happening.

All this to say that of the mentioned strategies people have outlined, Armstrong is likely to do only one of them, and that's to trade him. And that rests on the available suitors willing to take Krug who have the cap space to do so. I guess Krug could be made uncomfortable, but in all of the interviews I've seen with Armstrong, he's very candid on how he handles situations with players when he's actively trading them, and I just don't see a scenario where Krug is made uncomfortable. Now, there are always surprise things that happen midseason and a team could really want Krug and he waives his no-move, but that's like the only thing that would get him off the team. Blues don't have the defenseman to push him aside at this point is the way I see it. But we can revisit this at the end of the season I guess?

In 2021/22 Krug had 14 games where he logged 22+ minutes. He had 4 such games last year.

In 2021/22 Krug had 30 games where he logged 21+ minutes. He had 9 such games last year.

In 2021/22 Krug only had 12 games where he failed to reach the 19 minute mark. He had 28 such games last year.

In 2021/22 Krug only had 1 game where he played between 14 and 17 minutes. He had 14 such games last year.

It was way more than those two games. His role was noticeably reduced.

And I very much disagree that injuries led to his big spike in ice time in 2020/21. He was averaging 22:13 a night in the first 10 games of the season. Faulk and Parayko played in all 10 of those games while Dunn and Scandella each played 9 of 10. His icetime went up whern Parayko was out, but he was playing 22+ a night before injuries. At the end of the day, Faulk played 56 of 56 games, Dunn played 43 of 56, Scandy played 49 of 56 and Parayko played 32 of 56. That's not enough injuries to say he would have been at 20 minutes, but then got an extra 2+ minutes a night.

 

[BlueDream]

not saying that he will never have another chance, but if he shows well tonight he likely makes club and all that entails. if he doesn't, he likely gets waived and spends bulk of year in ahl. one path keeps moving him forward, the other says club is willing to risk losing him. so is he going to show that he is part of our plans going forward or future journeyman?


i don't see that he shows much physicality. he has some skill, more than guy like torpo, but if he isn't harder on pucks, doesn't win faceoffs, can't show that he can handle center, then i don't see that he has enough skill or physicality to be all that valuable as bottom 6 winger.

Yeah I think Alexandrov needed to add some muscle and get stronger this offseason and from what I’ve seen, it doesn’t really look like that happened.

I am starting to question where he fits too. It’s a shame Ratcliffe got injured, I want to see some more of him as a bottom 6 guy.

 

[STL fan in MN]

Yeah I think Alexandrov needed to add some muscle and get stronger this offseason and from what I’ve seen, it doesn’t really look like that happened.

I am starting to question where he fits too. It’s a shame Ratcliffe got injured, I want to see some more of him as a bottom 6 guy.

I agree on Alexandrov. He hasn’t taken a step like I’d hoped from what I’ve seen. Agree tonight is a big night for him.

It’s interesting they haven’t released Ratcliffe from his PTO yet. I don’t think there’s any obligation to keep him around just because he’s injured. So that tells me his injury is minor and they’re hoping to get another look at him before they have to make a final decision.

That also tells me none of the bubble guys has absolutely grabbed a spot if they’re keeping Ratcliffe around when they don’t need to.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

I agree on Alexandrov. He hasn’t taken a step like I’d hoped from what I’ve seen. Agree tonight is a big night for him.

It’s interesting they haven’t released Ratcliffe from his PTO yet. I don’t think there’s any obligation to keep him around just because he’s injured. So that tells me his injury is minor and they’re hoping to get another look at him before they have to make a final decision.

That also tells me none of the bubble guys has absolutely grabbed a spot if they’re keeping Ratcliffe around when they don’t need to.

agreed, but is there any reason why they need to release him from his pto? like can they keep him on it until he is healthy and then decide? or what would force there hand to make decision?

 

[ezcreepin]

In 2021/22 Krug had 14 games where he logged 22+ minutes. He had 4 such games last year.

In 2021/22 Krug had 30 games where he logged 21+ minutes. He had 9 such games last year.

In 2021/22 Krug only had 12 games where he failed to reach the 19 minute mark. He had 28 such games last year.

In 2021/22 Krug only had 1 game where he played between 14 and 17 minutes. He had 14 such games last year.

It was way more than those two games. His role was noticeably reduced.

And I very much disagree that injuries led to his big spike in ice time in 2020/21. He was averaging 22:13 a night in the first 10 games of the season. Faulk and Parayko played in all 10 of those games while Dunn and Scandella each played 9 of 10. His icetime went up whern Parayko was out, but he was playing 22+ a night before injuries. At the end of the day, Faulk played 56 of 56 games, Dunn played 43 of 56, Scandy played 49 of 56 and Parayko played 32 of 56. That's not enough injuries to say he would have been at 20 minutes, but then got an extra 2+ minutes a night.

I'm not going to argue his role wasn't reduced, My point was that he effectively missed two games during the season last year and it took 30 seconds off of his total ice time for the entire year. It's not necessarily a major argument that I'll die on, but it bumps his ice time to 19 minutes instead of 18:30.

Obviously his role was reduced, though my argument is that I don't see him getting less than 18 minutes a night because my belief is the Blues still consider him a top 4 defenseman despite his defense. Those are the arguments people are making here to get rid of him; reduce his ice time significantly (like borderline 15-16 minutes), waiving him, etc. The Blues have never done something like that and I don't suspect it will happen here. (Edit: they haven't done that since I've been watching.)

We'd probably have to look into the logs harder to say whether or not injuries affected his ice time in 20-21. Maybe Berube thought more highly of him and played him way more than he should've been, or maybe it was injuries that propelled him into the top 2 spot, I don't know. There's probably a lot of factors that contributed to that. Anyway, my point is that I believe the Blues view him differently than we do and he'll likely play 18:30-19 min again this year, but we'll just have to revisit the convo at the end of the year.

 

[STL fan in MN]

agreed, but is there any reason why they need to release him from his pto? like can they keep him on it until he is healthy and then decide? or what would force there hand to make decision?

Fair point. Main reason for the Blues to end the PTO (besides the obvious of them determining they don’t want to sign him) would be daily cost - per diem, hotel, the time resources of the trainers/medical staff, etc. Only incentive for Ratcliffe to end it is if he has a better opportunity elsewhere…which he almost certainly doesn’t. So yeah, logic would suggest it’s a short-term injury and both sides still have interest in pursuing it.

 

[BlueDream]

I agree on Alexandrov. He hasn’t taken a step like I’d hoped from what I’ve seen. Agree tonight is a big night for him.

It’s interesting they haven’t released Ratcliffe from his PTO yet. I don’t think there’s any obligation to keep him around just because he’s injured. So that tells me his injury is minor and they’re hoping to get another look at him before they have to make a final decision.

That also tells me none of the bubble guys has absolutely grabbed a spot if they’re keeping Ratcliffe around when they don’t need to.

True. We might as well at least give him a two-way contract. Even if he doesn’t stick in the NHL, that’s another piece for Springfield, who should have a competitive team again.

 

[Xerloris]

Aren't we only paying Hayes like 3 mill? So far that seems like it's gonna be a great deal for us.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Aren't we only paying Hayes like 3 mill? So far that seems like it's gonna be a great deal for us.

3.571. He's going to be a fine addition as a 3rd line Center who can move up when needed or be moved to the wing when a player like Dvorsky makes the jump to being a Full time Center in the NHL.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Looks like this may be the final lineup.

Buch-Thomas-Kyrou
Saad-Schenn-Kapenen
Vrana-Hayes-Blais
Toropchenko-Sunny-Neighbours
Alexandrov

Leddy-Parayko
Krug-Faulk
Scandella-Tucker
Perunovich-Bortuzzo

Binnington
Hofer

 

[BlueDream]

Hopefully the team is at least more watchable than last season, but I have doubts about that. Just not much to get excited about with that lineup.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Hopefully the team is at least more watchable than last season, but I have doubts about that. Just not much to get excited about with that lineup.

Yeah, unless there's some decent system changes or some younger players elevate their game even more, then it's probably another frustrating and mediocre season.