GDT: 2022-23 season game 9 LA Kings vs Winnipeg Jets @7:30pm 10/27/22

[Rick Knickleback]

I also think it's time to move a D out and bring Tobi back up.

This decision is just sitting there in broad daylight for Blake and TMac.

 

[AbsentMojo]

thats assuming your goalies have an average sv% above .877

Part of that is the Kings are giving up a lot of high danger shots - like the 4 breakaways yesterday... not excusing the goaltending but the save pct may be a little misleading

 

[BigKing]

We are at a point where you hope one of the high-end center selections would be at least a 2C at this point. Blake didn't see that happening and got Danault so they have a 2C but it is still the Kopitar show at 1C and that is a problem. Love the guy but his minutes should be drastically reduced. He's a minute lower right now so that is a start but you've got to start increasing Byfield's minutes.

The argument of "but they are trying to win games" doesn't hold much water when they have a middling record and they are running out of daylight when it comes to the plan of being a contender with 11 and 8 both still on the team.

Speaking of #8...27 minutes a game. 20 right shot defenseman on the team and he is still having to eat that many minutes.

Goalies have a combined .868 SV% and 4.12 GAA. We are firmly in tight sphincter on any shot from anywhere on the ice.

 

[King'sPawn]

Grundstrom has outplayed Arvidsson so far? How in the world do you make that assessment?

By watching them?

Even if you want to go by numbers alone, Grundstrom has one fewer point while averaging 5 fewer minutes a night (16:13 versus 11:27) and not regularly tied to the Danault line. His TOTAL time on the powerplay (2:31) is less than Arvidsson's AVERAGE time on the powerplay (3:04 per game).

How would you argue that Arvidsson has outplayed Grundstrom?

What, .... no hate for Quick?

He gave up 2 - 3 soft goals.

Definitely not one of Quick's better nights, but given the defensive breakdowns, I'm not blaming him.

Most concerning is that we are not losing games because of the kids. The vets are the ones dragging this team down. At their age, Kopitar\Doughty\Quick need different roles , they can't carry this team anymore. That's 27 million in cap space, mind boggling.

Some bootlickers will say "YOU DON'T PAY $10 MILLION FOR REDUCED ROLES"

You do if you have players on entry level contracts you're trying to propel into bigger roles.

Which - say it with me is what the Kings should have done when they considered their rebuild over.

So either the Kings aren't done rebuilding or there's something fundamentally flawed with their rebuild setup... like development.

But maybe a good start would be:
1. Stop delegating ice time relative to cap hit
2. If you have a plan (say, "Kaliyev needs to play in the Top 6"), then don't expend assets and change plans mid-offseason (trading for Fiala so Kaliyev can play in the bottom 6)

 

[kings11]

We are at a point where you hope one of the high-end center selections would be at least a 2C at this point. Blake didn't see that happening and got Danault so they have a 2C but it is still the Kopitar show at 1C and that is a problem. Love the guy but his minutes should be drastically reduced. He's a minute lower right now so that is a start but you've got to start increasing Byfield's minutes.

The argument of "but they are trying to win games" doesn't hold much water when they have a middling record and they are running out of daylight when it comes to the plan of being a contender with 11 and 8 both still on the team.

Speaking of #8...27 minutes a game. 20 right shot defenseman on the team and he is still having to eat that many minutes.

Goalies have a combined .868 SV% and 4.12 GAA. We are firmly in tight sphincter on any shot from anywhere on the ice.

I said something that I thought true at the beginning of the season when we all made predictions for this season and I said TM would be fired.

The Kings worse enemy is TM’s inability to make in game adjustments but that a known quality. His biggest flaw is not realizing that spreading out the minutes to all 4 centers will benefit not only his aging 1C but also his very important future 1C. His over reliance on his vets is killing this team and has done so since last season.

Kopitar needs to be playing no more than 18toi.. those extra 2-3 min should go to QB

Edler is no longer a viable Dman for a team with playoff aspirations and has become the Fiala of the defense even above Durzi

Arvidsson should get Pipp’d as Gabe has done everything needed to supplant him

Cal is what he is at this point… a sunken cost

 

[Fishhead]

By watching them?

Even if you want to go by numbers alone, Grundstrom has one fewer point while averaging 5 fewer minutes a night (16:13 versus 11:27) and not regularly tied to the Danault line. His TOTAL time on the powerplay (2:31) is less than Arvidsson's AVERAGE time on the powerplay (3:04 per game).

How would you argue that Arvidsson has outplayed Grundstrom?

I don't know if the two are directly comparable because of their roles, but it's obvious Grundstrom has been lights out this year. If Lizzo was 3 inches taller that would be the best 4th line in the league, and a lot of that is Grundy. He's making things happen this year and solidifying a spot.

 

[shuchukfan]

Here I sit
Broken hearted...

 

[redcard]

What, .... no hate for Quick?

He gave up 2 - 3 soft goals.

Its not the 36 year old Quick's fault that nobody as taken the starting job from him.

I'd be more than happy with him as a back up or even split guy getting 30-40 games per year yet he's had to play 6 2/3 out of 9 games.

 

[AbsentMojo]

All the ragging on Kopi is misdirected anger at the coach (stating the obvious here).. so when I read this and that about Kopi I think of TM inability to make hard decisions for the benefit of the team. Kopi plays a structured methodical style that is well suited for a 3rd line C. The 3rd line could be reconceived as a defense oriented, possession shutdown line with Iafallo (or Grundstrom while Iafalo is out) and Kaliyev.. If for political reasons you need to call that the 2nd line then so be it. How you arrange the top 6 is basically need to split up Kempe and Fiala.. and Keep Danault and Moore - and fill in the blanks. Then Id spread the minutes much more evenly across the top 9. My guess is with less minutes Kopi would improve his legs being fresher and that line would have long cycles in the O zone, and be solid on D.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Taking the load off isn't even a demotion for Kopitar, it's putting him in the appropriate role. Jeff Carter was a clear #1 level center when he got here, yet they put him with a couple really young players because they meshed. It's just what worked. I think it's coming soon, it has to.

Teams still get too caught up in the 1st 2nd 3rd line, etc. To TM's credit, he's finally squishing the ice time a bit where the gaps aren't so big and the top 3 lines are all getting decent time. Kopitar is obviously showing his age this year, but put him against weaker competition and his level of play will rise.

I also think it's time to move a D out and bring Tobi back up. Not so much because he's head and shoulders above the others, but having 3 LD really helps with getting pucks out of the zone.

Carter was a RW when he got here. Then Sutter kept running Carter on the right side of Richards right up through the first half of the 13-14 season. Even as it was clear that Richards was an empty jersey long before the point of his eventual long term demotion to the 4C. Carter was then put at C, with the eventual formation of the 70's line, begrudgingly. It wasn't a plan.

This decision is just sitting there in broad daylight for Blake and TMac.

Find the team that wants to make a trade. If it's such an easy decision.

 

[bland]

Just boils down to one thing.

This roster isn't constructed to win now, and the coaching isn't done to develop for the future. That gap is why the team has enough talent to win some games but not the mental strength to persevere when needed. Its a poor mix whose absolute ceiling is mediocrity.

 

[bland]

All the ragging on Kopi is misdirected anger at the coach (stating the obvious here).. so when I read this and that about Kopi I think of TM inability to make hard decisions for the benefit of the team. Kopi plays a structured methodical style that is well suited for a 3rd line C. The 3rd line could be reconceived as a defense oriented, possession shutdown line with Iafallo (or Grundstrom while Iafalo is out) and Kaliyev.. If for political reasons you need to call that the 2nd line then so be it. How you arrange the top 6 is basically need to split up Kempe and Fiala.. and Keep Danault and Moore - and fill in the blanks. Then Id spread the minutes much more evenly across the top 9. My guess is with less minutes Kopi would improve his legs being fresher and that line would have long cycles in the O zone, and be solid on D.

That would have been good two years ago. Anze just doesn't have it anymore. No shame in that, nobody in their right mind would think that a team should lean so heavily on a player with that mileage. He would make for an excellent depth center if treated properly, but this organization refuses to look at the Cup core with any kind of clarity, and seems perfectly happy to ride them until their wheels fall off.

 

[FSL KINGS]

Ok, the line combinations are not why this team is losing. Dumb individual plays resulting in high quality chances are. If the King's can cut down on the stupid mistakes, they'll start racking up the wins.

Reducing Kopi's TOI: They have Kopitar & Danault & no one capable of filling the 3C & we're going to replace Kopitar's ice time. I'm all for getting Kopi an easier role. How is Kupari looking? Surely we can run Fiala, Kupari, Kempe as the 1st line.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Ok, the line combinations are not why this team is losing. Dumb individual plays resulting in high quality chances are. If the King's can cut down on the stupid mistakes, they'll start racking up the wins.

Some of those are due to chemistry, though. Remember the Muzzin-Martinez pairing? Elite 95% of the game, then would turn the puck over directly in front of their own net. That's the kind of stuff that's happening now.

Reducing Kopi's TOI: They have Kopitar & Danault & no one capable of filling the 3C & we're going to replace Kopitar's ice time. I'm all for getting Kopi an easier role. How is Kupari looking? Surely we can run Fiala, Kupari, Kempe as the 1st line.

Iafallo-Byfield-Vilardi was absolutely running people over. Even if that wasn't directly because of Byfield, he was VERY effective there and yes, enough so that it should reduce kopitar's minutes by 3-4 instead of giving our leading scorer 14 minutes or less while Kopitar gets run over. It was a good enough line that all 3 of those lines could have been run equal minutes without blinking and now with Grundstrom completing an insanely effective 4th line, Iafallo's absence is unfortunately glaring and hurting that distribution. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Maybe it's hard to stomach, but the evidence is clear as day.

 

[FSL KINGS]

Some of those are due to chemistry, though. Remember the Muzzin-Martinez pairing? Elite 95% of the game, then would turn the puck over directly in front of their own net. That's the kind of stuff that's happening now.




Iafallo-Byfield-Vilardi was absolutely running people over. Even if that wasn't directly because of Byfield, he was VERY effective there and yes, enough so that it should reduce kopitar's minutes by 3-4 instead of giving our leading scorer 14 minutes or less while Kopitar gets run over. It was a good enough line that all 3 of those lines could have been run equal minutes without blinking and now with Grundstrom completing an insanely effective 4th line, Iafallo's absence is unfortunately glaring and hurting that distribution. I don't see why this is so hard to understand. Maybe it's hard to stomach, but the evidence is clear as day.

Sure, there are places where chemistry could improve things. Cute plays at the blue line need to go away. Doughty's drop pass to Ardvidsson at the redline didn't result in anything bad, but that needs to be taken out of the King's game.

Iafallo is injured & Byfield looks exposed without a stable vet on his wing. Moore, Byfield, Kempe might be able to carry him, but will cause problems on the other lines.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

It's amazing what you can only see when you are in the fishbowl, as opposed to getting outside the bowl.....

Everyone and their brother IN this forum, is saying Kopitar is done, he's this he's that etc, yet when you get OUTSIDE the bowl....it's obvious Kopitar is still one of the most well respected players out there, and one of the toughest to play against, and that's coming from PLAYERS WHO PLAY AGAINST HIM..... but yea....

 

[Matt13]

We need a remedial forum with REAL gatekeepers before this kind of nonsense gets posted.

I actually laughed out loud at this.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

 

[Fishhead]

Carter was a RW when he got here. Then Sutter kept running Carter on the right side of Richards right up through the first half of the 13-14 season. Even as it was clear that Richards was an empty jersey long before the point of his eventual long term demotion to the 4C. Carter was then put at C, with the eventual formation of the 70's line, begrudgingly. It wasn't a plan.



Find the team that wants to make a trade. If it's such an easy decision.

Carter was the #1 Center in Philly for quite a while, not sure what he played in CLB as he wasn't there long. The plan seemed to go Kopi-Richards-Carter-Stoll down the middle. Yeah he played some wing but then went to a #2/#3 center role. The point is more you can take a player who traditionally has a certain role and move them around if there's a good fit that balances your team.

As for a trade, I don't think it's so much finding a team but getting the value you want back. I think it will be easier as the season progresses, but I'd take a bit of a loss on someone now to get the roster more cohesive.

Fourth line Fiala has a nice ring to it.

It appears last night was the last bit of rope TM was willing to give. I hope Fiala ends up with Byfield, though. I think they would do well together.

 

[King'sPawn]

Find the team that wants to make a trade. If it's such an easy decision.

And when a defenseman is traded elsewhere, you'll reply with "there's no guarantee the team was interested in one of the Kings' D."

Plenty of people who have put in legwork to discuss a variety of issues and scenarios who have been met with shit from others (not just you) like:
- you're not a scout
- you're not a coach
- you're not a GM
- you're a hater
- you're ignoring the details
- but...
- RAMPANT BASELESS SPECULATION

Plenty of gatekeepers and reductive thinkers who just blindly accept or defend every managerial decision or will expect people proposing solutions to have access to resources Blake has.

And then when people DO, certain others say "you have too much time on your hands. Go outside."

If there was a semblance of belief there would be good faith attempts to consider the ideas we have put forth, then I'd happily go through teams who need a RHD. But I think we both know you'll find reasons why the proposed ideas won't work.

 

[head eyes]

Villardi has earned it. The Fiala decision is a headscratcher.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Don't believe it, I was told by this very forum that this kind of stuff NEVER happens....that the coach is incapable of making it happen.

Villardi has earned it. The Fiala decision is a headscratcher.

Not really, from the start, he's taking some very stupid, very selfish penalties......but beyond that, don't think if it was line 1,2,3,4 but the type of players, Fiala and Lizotte have the potential to do some damage

 

[SaltyElkHunter]

Iafallo deserves every penny that he gets. He is one of the most underrated players on the team. He does everything on the ice well, including his defensive assignments. He was vital to the huge success of that 3rd line, which effectively was the best on the team with Vilardi and Byfield.

Iafollo is a 3rd line winger in a contending team he is a .5-3 million dollar player he is grossly overpaid!

Grundstrom has outplayed Arvidsson so far? How in the world do you make that assessment?

 

[bland]

Villardi has earned it. The Fiala decision is a headscratcher.

Punishment for poor decisions and extended shift lengths.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Fiala can replace Lemieux’s role in committing bad penalties. I thought Grundstrom may have played his way into the pressbox after his horrible clearing attempts that eventually led to Winnipeg’s game-winning goal.