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Blue Jays GDT: 2021 v12 | Next: Thu, Sept 30| vs NYY | 7:00pm ET/4:00pm PT | Kluber vs Ray

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This gonna suck so bad. Despite having a loaded batting lineup and starter rotation this team gonna miss out on playoff action thanks largely to wildly and very long inconsistencies from either our starters, hitters, or BP pitchers. Its always one of the three in any given game.

And I called it all these months back that this would be their fall.
 
Nineteen67 said:
It started on the Sunday against the Twins after the 5 run 1st.
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for me it was the terrible game before that. TB stole our card then the last game of the series game stole our swagger. that was the 1st series we lost in like 13 series or something and it just seemed we crashed back to earth that game. the 5 run twins 1st was just proving it.
 
Legend123 said:
This gonna suck so bad. Despite having a loaded batting lineup and starter rotation this team gonna miss out on playoff action thanks largely to wildly and very long inconsistencies from either our starters, hitters, or BP pitchers. Its always one of the three in any given game.

And I called it all these months back that this would be their fall.
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The defensive and base running mistakes as well as the unprofessional approach at the plate is big reason they’re not locked in spot.
To me, that’s on the manager.
 
Pretty pathetic way to go out. Team showed zero heart down the stretch. Got embarrassed game in a game out by shit teams and top teams. Really disappointing
 
Nineteen67 said:
The defensive and base running mistakes as well as the unprofessional approach at the plate is big reason they’re not locked in spot.
To me, that’s on the manager.
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Not sure what you mean by unprofessional plate approach. The Jays are way ahead of the curve on attacking the first pitch which will become the norm in baseball over the next few years.
 
theaub said:
Not sure what you mean by unprofessional plate approach. The Jays are way ahead of the curve on attacking the first pitch which will become the norm in baseball over the next few years.
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Overall their offence is not the problem. However, they have a lot of ,what appear to be, selfish ABs where they don’t move runners along.

The Yanks tied the game last night when the batter just tried to make contact , dinked it into LF and the Jays throwing miscue was worse than Yankees base running blunder. The next pitch was a sac fly that scored the winning run.
If that’s your approach to hitting every single day and you have theses talented hitters, you’ll be better off in the long run.
 
Nineteen67 said:
Overall their offence is not the problem. However, they have a lot of ,what appear to be, selfish ABs where they don’t move runners along.

The Yanks tied the game last night when the batter just tried to make contact , dinked it into LF and the Jays throwing miscue was worse than Yankees base running blunder. The next pitch was a sac fly that scored the winning run.
If that’s your approach to hitting every single day and you have theses talented hitters, you’ll be better off in the long run.
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The Jays are 2nd in contact% behind the Astros. The Yanks are bottom 5. I can’t imagine the Yanks having a day to day approach of dinking balls to LF and moving the runners over considering they have less sac flies than the Jays. Jays pitched them tough and they managed to hit pitches way outside of the zone. Almost like Gardner stole their data card or something.
 
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Nineteen67 said:
Overall their offence is not the problem. However, they have a lot of ,what appear to be, selfish ABs where they don’t move runners along.

The Yanks tied the game last night when the batter just tried to make contact , dinked it into LF and the Jays throwing miscue was worse than Yankees base running blunder. The next pitch was a sac fly that scored the winning run.
If that’s your approach to hitting every single day and you have theses talented hitters, you’ll be better off in the long run.
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In a way, I see your point...Tampa's patient approach at the plate where they just grind out at-bats and wear out the starting pitcher does seem more productive than our free-swinging approach, for example.

But I wouldn't use single-game sample sizes to draw any conclusions. Stanton put away the game by swinging at a pitch at his ankles yesterday. That's terrible discipline, and yet...
 
Nineteen67 said:
Overall their offence is not the problem. However, they have a lot of ,what appear to be, selfish ABs where they don’t move runners along.

The Gurriel at-bat last night was exhibit A of this problem, although it was with two out. Swung at a pitch at least a foot down and out of the zone for strike one. Swung at just as bad of a pitch for strike two. Held off for ball one only because the pitch was so ridiculously out of the zone. Swung at strike three well inside. If he just shows some patience, he might have worked them for a walk and moved the train along.

I thought the AB was typical of the team this season. When it's working it's working, when it's not you're basically hopeless. I'd like to see a more varied approach next season.
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shaner89 said:
Pretty pathetic way to go out. Team showed zero heart down the stretch. Got embarrassed game in a game out by shit teams and top teams. Really disappointing
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what do you mean? they swept the yankees. took 2 of 3 from tampa. swept oakland. destroyed baltimore. split minnesota. outside of this last series against tampa they have won or tied their last 8 series. seems pretty good.
 
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Kurtz said:
In a way, I see your point...Tampa's patient approach at the plate where they just grind out at-bats and wear out the starting pitcher does seem more productive than our free-swinging approach, for example.
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This article from fangraphs (The Giants Capitalize on the First Pitch) talks a lot about why swinging at the first pitch is more and more beneficial in today's game. To point, this graph, which shows the dramatic decline in wOBA when falling behind in the count.

upload_2021-9-29_12-58-19.png


With the significantly higher quality of middle relivers over the last 10 years, working the starting pitcher is not the same as it used to be. Attacking hittable first pitches also reduces the chance that you end up facing what are now increasingly effective strikeout pitches (unsurprisingly the Jays have the second fewest strikeouts in the league).
 
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Kurtz said:
In a way, I see your point...Tampa's patient approach at the plate where they just grind out at-bats and wear out the starting pitcher does seem more productive than our free-swinging approach, for example.

But I wouldn't use single-game sample sizes to draw any conclusions. Stanton put away the game by swinging at a pitch at his ankles yesterday. That's terrible discipline, and yet...
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It’s a single game today but it’s reared it’s head a few times this season. Oftentimes they go up hacking after a leadoff double and then in the later innings they decide they’ll bunt to move a runner over, which is fine. Over 162 could they have won 3-5 more games with a different approach? IMO, yes.

Their record in extra innings wasn’t great either. Not every loss is on the on offensive strategy but a few time it was.
 
I seriously hope I'm wrong, but I can see Cole being absolutely dynamite tonight and making it very difficult for the Jays' hitters.

I hope that ends up being a good jinx in me saying that.
 
Nineteen67 said:
It’s a single game today but it’s reared it’s head a few times this season. Oftentimes they go up hacking after a leadoff double and then in the later innings they decide they’ll bunt to move a runner over, which is fine. Over 162 could they have won 3-5 more games with a different approach? IMO, yes.

Their record in extra innings wasn’t great either. Not every loss is on the on offensive strategy but a few time it was.
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Yeah they were very bad at converting the free baserunner this year. Something like 20% below the league average IIRC

TheTotalPackage said:
I seriously hope I'm wrong, but I can see Cole being absolutely dynamite tonight and making it very difficult for the Jays' hitters.

I hope that ends up being a good jinx in me saying that.
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Agree with this but just need our guy to also be good.
 
theaub said:
Yeah they were very bad at converting the free baserunner this year. Something like 20% below the league average IIRC



Agree with this but just need our guy to also be good.
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And Seattle is near the top….
 
shortfuze said:
what do you mean? they swept the yankees. took 2 of 3 from tampa. swept oakland. destroyed baltimore. split minnesota. outside of this last series against tampa they have won or tied their last 8 series. seems pretty good.
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Lost 4 out of the last 6. Pathetic. Crunch time and they failed. Period
 
shaner89 said:
Lost 4 out of the last 6. Pathetic. Crunch time and they failed. Period
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whats pathetic is having such hostility towards such a young team that has played great the last 2/3rds of the season. especially in the deepest division in all of baseball. take a breath man. they have played great.
 
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