2020 Roster and Fantasy GM Thread II

[President of Hockey]

White was not worth a second round pick. He wasn't worth a second round pick when he was drafted. I think everyone saw that at the draft too. If we could have gotten a second round pick for him, he'd have been gone long ago.

He was worth a second round pick because of the compensatory pick the team holding his rights without signing him received. San Jose selected Chris Tierney with that pick in 2012.

So the Sharks turned Ehrhoff into White, White into Tierney and Tierney into Erik Karlsson

 

[m9]

White was not worth a second round pick. He wasn't worth a second round pick when he was drafted. I think everyone saw that at the draft too. If we could have gotten a second round pick for him, he'd have been gone long ago.

Lukowich wasn't a terrible contract. It wasn't good, but he was 7/8/9 guy at 1.566 which was a bottom pairing cost. Ehrhoff cost 3.1, or 4.666 ish including Lukowich, who we submarined immediately, and Ehrhoff redefined our defenses role in offense. A negative to tack on to be sure, but one year at Lukowich's cap hit was a coup for Gillis in getting Ehrhoff for almost nothing.

We gave up White and Rahimi, neither played a game for us, or for the Sharks, and if I remember correctly, it was plastered all over these boards that precious few of us had much hope in them playing. Nothing we gave up, collectively or individually, was worth a 2nd round pick. We gave up nothing but two roster spots, got a cap dump and top four D. This is the definition of a cap dump from the Sharks.

Booth and Reinprecht and a third round pick for Samuelsson and Sturm was even. Samuelsson didn't have a lot of gas left in the tank (although I was sad to see him go), and Sturm wasn't a quality signing, both of whom were set to expire. Booth, a year of Reinprecht's salary and a pick for that was a great pick up too, at the time. In hindsight, Booth didn't work out, but it was the risk we should have taken.

Both trades are very similar. We receive a player that is an upgrade to our roster, with term and a higher cap hit then their team can afford, we send back players to accommodate the new contracts, and take back a single year of a overpriced contract. We gave up no value, took back salary in the long term, and the other team's motivation of getting cap relief is well documented. I like the Ehrhoff trade better then the Booth trade, as it turned out better, but that's all in hindsight too. Both are very, very similar structurally, we just took more years and more cap hit in the Booth trade, but compensated by sending cap back.

San Jose traded for White knowing he wouldn't be re-signed and they would get a compensatory 2nd round pick.

EDIT - Sorry I see now it was already covered above. Posts weren't loading properly for me.

 

[Cogburn]

San Jose traded for White knowing he wouldn't be re-signed and they would get a compensatory 2nd round pick.

EDIT - Sorry I see now it was already covered above. Posts weren't loading properly for me.

I stand corrected. I still see a lot of similarities in the two trades, and I still don't regret the San Jose trade inspite of Tierney being chosen with that pick, but I will stand down, I didn't take the compensatory pick into consideration.

 

[m9]

I stand corrected. I still see a lot of similarities in the two trades, and I still don't regret the San Jose trade inspite of Tierney being chosen with that pick, but I will stand down, I didn't take the compensatory pick into consideration.

I can see the similarities as well in terms of situation, I just think the value difference (getting a 3rd in one & giving up a 2nd in the other) is important.

 

[bandwagonesque]

I can see the similarities as well in terms of situation, I just think the value difference (getting a 3rd in one & giving up a 2nd in the other) is important.

The value difference that stands out to me is that Ehrhoff was a fantastic offensive defenceman who meshed perfectly with a skilled forward group whereas Booth was mediocre and replaceable. Neither trade was bad or ill-planned but Ehrhoff absolutely tilted the ice on many nights. In retrospect if you have to make one of these trades you make that one, and what picks you give up or get don't even cross your mind. Even without the benefit of hindsight Ehrhoff was far more valuable, a better player making less money. The difference in which picks went in which direction wasn't arbitrary.

 

[Cogburn]

So, uh, an offer for Eriksson came in.

Rielly for Eriksson (post bonus payoff) and a 2nd.

Sold.

Rielly (a RHD)makes 1.5 for the next year. Technically the offer gave us the choice of Anisimov, but we don't really need either so I say take the cheaper option.

We can find a way to dump Sutter and/or Baertschi I'm sure. I was thinking Buffalo might be a target, as they need a stronger C in their bottom six. Say both, one at half, for Johansson, or another expiring contract. Baertschi could be of interest as he is interested in an NHL job next year, and I really don't see a fit on the Canucks (and I will still argue he should have had a better opportunity this year). They can also use Sutter as a winger...they are seriously short on NHL wingers.

We should be able to trade of Stecher's rights, as Tryamkin has said, through his agent, he wants to return to the Canucks.

Tryamkin, Toffoli, Markstrom and Tanev all being brought back becomes a sinch. Gaudette, Virtanen, MacEwen and Motte as RFA will/should be a little less expensive.

We have room to work everyone stress free in if we can dump Eriksson.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

I've definitely beaten this issue to death, but Booth sprained his knee and was out for a few weeks. I can't pin his downfall to that fairly minor injury. I think it was just a cumulative impact of concussions and other injuries over time. And even with health, sometimes players just fall off.

Part of what made Booth an effective player was that he was able to drive the net hard. I think we might have seen the last flashes of that, as I think you're right - once the injuries compounded, he became more timid and didn't drive the net anymore. That was kind of his bread and butter for creating chances on his own. I always thought prime Booth was like a Taylor Hall-lite.

 

[bossram]

So, uh, an offer for Eriksson came in.

Rielly for Eriksson (post bonus payoff) and a 2nd.

Sold.

Rielly (a RHD)makes 1.5 for the next year. Technically the offer gave us the choice of Anisimov, but we don't really need either so I say take the cheaper option.

We can find a way to dump Sutter and/or Baertschi I'm sure. I was thinking Buffalo might be a target, as they need a stronger C in their bottom six. Say both, one at half, for Johansson, or another expiring contract. Baertschi could be of interest as he is interested in an NHL job next year, and I really don't see a fit on the Canucks (and I will still argue he should have had a better opportunity this year). They can also use Sutter as a winger...they are seriously short on NHL wingers.

We should be able to trade of Stecher's rights, as Tryamkin has said, through his agent, he wants to return to the Canucks.

Tryamkin, Toffoli, Markstrom and Tanev all being brought back becomes a sinch. Gaudette, Virtanen, MacEwen and Motte as RFA will/should be a little less expensive.

We have room to work everyone stress free in if we can dump Eriksson.

If it only takes a 2nd round pick to dump Eriksson, we'd have to take that and run.

I suspect it would be much more expensive though. It took a 1st to dump one year of Marleau. Eriksson still has term on his deal. And the cap climate is going to be even harsher for teams going forward.

 

[xtra]

Can you imagine if we lose both the rest of this year (most likely) but also the following year.

we would lose the final year of petersson and Hughes on their rookie deals

 

[Cogburn]

If it only takes a 2nd round pick to dump Eriksson, we'd have to take that and run.

I suspect it would be much more expensive though. It took a 1st to dump one year of Marleau. Eriksson still has term on his deal. And the cap climate is going to be even harsher for teams going forward.

I don't disagree with your thinking we'd have to pay more then that, but we're looking at the cash paid being far below Erikssons cap (to an incredibly, almost impossibly cheap owner), and Eriksson would be expected to play, where Marleau was a dead cap hit.

 

[bossram]

I don't disagree with your thinking we'd have to pay more then that, but we're looking at the cash paid being far below Erikssons cap (to an incredibly, almost impossibly cheap owner), and Eriksson would be expected to play, where Marleau was a dead cap hit.

I get that the actual cash (what matters to Melnyk) is much lower than the cap hit. But the Sens could still quite easily find a near-league minimum salary to fill a bottom-six spot rather than Eriksson. Or play one of the many younger guys they have in Belleville right now (and still be "selling the future").

There's still no incentive for them to take on Loui Eriksson willingly. So it would take a big sweetener.

 

[Cogburn]

I get that the actual cash (what matters to Melnyk) is much lower than the cap hit. But the Sens could still quite easily find a near-league minimum salary to fill a bottom-six spot rather than Eriksson. Or play one of the many younger guys they have in Belleville right now (and still be "selling the future").

There's still no incentive for them to take on Loui Eriksson willingly. So it would take a big sweetener.

I have no argument, it should take more, youre absolutely right. Whether its fear of taking on a longer contract, a plan to buy Eriksson out the next year, or simply someone not realising the nosedive his play has taken (from last year until now), Ottawa fans wereent just ok with this, they countered Eriksson and a first with Eriksson and a second for Reilly or Anisimov.

 

[Peter Griffin]

I have no argument, it should take more, youre absolutely right. Whether its fear of taking on a longer contract, a plan to buy Eriksson out the next year, or simply someone not realising the nosedive his play has taken (from last year until now), Ottawa fans wereent just ok with this, they countered Eriksson and a first with Eriksson and a second for Reilly or Anisimov.

Unfortunately it doesn't matter what fans on a message board would do.

 

[tradervik]

Unfortunately it doesn't matter what fans on a message board would do.

Isn't this is the Fantasy GM thread?

 

[Cogburn]

Unfortunately it doesn't matter what fans on a message board would do.

True, but they know their team, management, and owner better then we do. The fact it isn't a hard no, or even a maybe, and that it was brought up by another fan base also means it's not dead in the water as far as an idea or discussion goes.

 

[vancityluongo]

St. Louis likely has to move Vince Dunn if they want to keep Pietrangelo now that they've signed Scandella.

I'd love to get Dunn on the Canucks. Blues could use a salary controlled roster player. Gaudette + ??

 

[member 290103]

Sportsnet has a list up of every teams best non first round pick in the cap era. Canucks finish one spot below worst (which went to Vegas, so basically Vancouver was the worst), with Mason f***ing Raymond.

Speaks to the complete ineptitude of this team draft wise across several management groups.

Good thing Jim is running Brackett out of town!

 

[member 290103]

Delete.

 

[member 290103]

Grrr delete.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

St. Louis likely has to move Vince Dunn if they want to keep Pietrangelo now that they've signed Scandella.

I'd love to get Dunn on the Canucks. Blues could use a salary controlled roster player. Gaudette + ??

I wouldn't give up Gaudette. St Louis is in a tough spot right now, no idea why they resigned Scandella for that...Anyway, you're right, there is no way they keep both and I am sure Dunn is the one who is gone. I wonder if prospects/picks could get it done, as I wouldn't give up Virtanen or Gaudette for him, and I doubt St Louis would want any of Sutter, Beagle, Baertschi etc.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

I would love to get Gallagher on this team. A poster offered me Gallagher+1st for Boeser, would any of you do that?

 

[elitepete]

So, uh, an offer for Eriksson came in.

Rielly for Eriksson (post bonus payoff) and a 2nd.

Sold.

Rielly (a RHD)makes 1.5 for the next year. Technically the offer gave us the choice of Anisimov, but we don't really need either so I say take the cheaper option.

We can find a way to dump Sutter and/or Baertschi I'm sure. I was thinking Buffalo might be a target, as they need a stronger C in their bottom six. Say both, one at half, for Johansson, or another expiring contract. Baertschi could be of interest as he is interested in an NHL job next year, and I really don't see a fit on the Canucks (and I will still argue he should have had a better opportunity this year). They can also use Sutter as a winger...they are seriously short on NHL wingers.

We should be able to trade of Stecher's rights, as Tryamkin has said, through his agent, he wants to return to the Canucks.

Tryamkin, Toffoli, Markstrom and Tanev all being brought back becomes a sinch. Gaudette, Virtanen, MacEwen and Motte as RFA will/should be a little less expensive.

We have room to work everyone stress free in if we can dump Eriksson.

If Ottawa retains 50% on bobby ryan and trades him to us straight up for Loui Eriksson after his bonus is paid, they save money.

I doubt Ottawa would do that trade since Ryan is a better player, but maybe at 40% retention? 35%?

 

[rypper]

I would love to get Gallagher on this team. A poster offered me Gallagher+1st for Boeser, would any of you do that?

I don't think Montreal touches that.

 

[bandwagonesque]

If Ottawa retains 50% on bobby ryan and trades him to us straight up for Loui Eriksson after his bonus is paid, they save money.

I doubt Ottawa would do that trade since Ryan is a better player, but maybe at 40% retention? 35%?

The two players are pretty much wash in my opinion. Bobby Ryan can't skate anymore, seems to put in little effort and his personal life is in turmoil. He scored 8 points in 24 games last season with 1st unit PP time. Eriksson may well have more value at this point. He at least has a role on an NHL roster. At most, I think the Canucks would have to throw in a 5th.

 

[Diablo2020]

Loui Eriksson, Nikita Tryamkin, Vasili Podkolzin
for
Miles Wood, #10

Brock Boeser, Troy Stecher, Jordie Benn
for
Jonas Brodin, #11

Michael Ferland, Brogan Rafferty, Olli Juolevi, #10, #11
for
Rickard Rakell, Josh Manson



Out - Eriksson, Boeser, Ferland, Podkolzin
Out - Stecher, Benn, Tryamkin, Rafferty, Juolevi

In - Rakell, Wood
In - Manson, Brodin


Canucks 2020/21 - (regular buyout Sutter, Baertschi)

Miller - Pettersson - Rakell
Pearson - Horvat - Toffoli
Wood - Gaudette - Virtanen
Roussel - Beagle - Macewan

ex - Motte, Leivo

Brodin - Manson
Edler - Myers
Hughes - Tanev

ex - Fantenberg

Markstrom, Demko