GDT: 2020-21 season game 42 LA Kings vs Vegas Golden Knights @7:00pm 4/14/21

[lumbergh]

See my post #395. This summer is a golden opportunity to get players for below market prices due to the flat cap. I didn't even mention the ED but Blake has a great opportunity to pick up at least one forward that he can protect that another team can't. Would cost a pick/prospect. Big deal. This is the EXACT moment when another O'Reilly for basically nothing trade can be made. If not now, when?

ED? Does Blake have some personal problems we don't know about?

 

[Herby]

Herby is on a roll today and is totally right.

@Herby you have earned this

We all need to realize that a hot powerplay early on hid a lot of this teams's problems. We need a top 4 D man badly and we need to never ice McD as a d-man ever again.
We also need an emotional support pony

Thank you! I got people here finishing my basement and it's 45 (after being 80 a couple days ago), so I'm just chilling in my den shooting the **** with you wonderful people.

I was pretty supportive of Blake early on and even excused some of his previous mistakes to the insanely flukey 2018 season that set the franchise back significantly. But to be honest, this year I think he has made a lot of mistakes that are unfortunately going to have a negative effect on the Kings. The two best prospects in the system, that he has used top 5 picks on are playing for the wrong team. They should have had Byfield up in the NHL this year, even if it was a red-shirt year, it would have gotten a lot of the stuff teenagers have to deal with playing in the NHL out of the way in a lost season, now those are going to have to happen next season in what probably wasn't supposed to be a lost season but is shaping up to be. The Turcotte thing has been beaten to death, but I'll just say, take a look at the other 2019 NCAA kids who went back to school and how they have done in the AHL since signing, confidence in the offensive zone matters if you want to be a scorer at higher levels. Blake went against the traditional way most teams develop similar prospects with both Byfield and Turcotte, whether you agree with him doing it or not, that is a factual statement.

The MacD thing is whatever, but how do you give that guy a multi-year extension, it's truly embarrassing not only how bad he is, but that he is playing defense and has a guaranteed contract.

And ofcourse as has been discussed in the previous posts the indecisiveness in either committing to a rebuild or trying to win. How do you have two groups of assets in the franchise, a bunch of old guys and then a bunch of teenagers. Other than Roy, Kempe, Petersen and Iafallo they have no one of significance in their primes signed beyond this season.

Seriously, what are the expectations for the Kings the next 3-4 years if they don't trade for Eichel or someone like that this offseason and continue the rebuild? (as Blake has said)

 

[Lt Dan]

Thank you! I got people here finishing my basement and it's 45 (after being 80 a couple days ago), so I'm just chilling in my den shooting the **** with you wonderful people.

I was pretty supportive of Blake early on and even excused some of his previous mistakes to the insanely flukey 2018 season that set the franchise back significantly. But to be honest, this year I think he has made a lot of mistakes that are unfortunately going to have a negative effect on the Kings. The two best prospects in the system, that he has used top 5 picks on are playing for the wrong team. They should have had Byfield up in the NHL this year, even if it was a red-shirt year, it would have gotten a lot of the stuff teenagers have to deal with playing in the NHL out of the way in a lost season, now those are going to have to happen next season in what probably wasn't supposed to be a lost season but is shaping up to be. The Turcotte thing has been beaten to death, but I'll just say, take a look at the other 2019 NCAA kids who went back to school and how they have done in the AHL since signing, confidence in the offensive zone matters if you want to be a scorer at higher levels. Blake went against the traditional trend most teams use in the handling of similar prospects, whether you agree with him or not, that is a factual statement.

The MacD thing is whatever, but how do you give that guy a multi-year extension, it's truly embarrassing not only how bad he is, but that he is playing defense and has a guaranteed contract.

And ofcourse as has been discussed in the previous posts the indecisiveness in either committing to a rebuild or trying to win. How do you have two groups of assets in the franchise, a bunch of old guys and then a bunch of teenagers. Other than Roy, Kempe, Petersen and Iafallo they have no one of significance in their primes signed beyond this season.

Seriously, what are the expectations for the Kings the next 3-4 years if they don't trade for Eichel or someone like that this offseason and continue the rebuild? (as Blake has said)

I can't disagree with much here.


I expect (at least )two moves this offseason.

1) A top 4 D man. A poor man's Blake would be ideal . Someone that could run the PP and also deliver some bone crushing checks. (I know it's not likely, but one can dream)

2) a top 6 forward, preferably a goal scorer


We also need-
A Lucic/Deadmarsh player and a Mitchell/Regehr type player . We are softer than room temperature butter.



I think even with Seattle, because of the flat cap, there will be opportunities. I think with fans in the stands for the 21-22 season there will be more pressure to make the playoffs.


Are you turning the basement in to a man cave?

I hear that Geraldo Rivera is pretty good with underground vaults

 

[KingsFan7824]

See my post #395. This summer is a golden opportunity to get players for below market prices due to the flat cap. I didn't even mention the ED but Blake has a great opportunity to pick up at least one forward that he can protect that another team can't. Would cost a pick/prospect. Big deal. This is the EXACT moment when another O'Reilly for basically nothing trade can be made. If not now, when?

This is where our split is. I have no idea what Blake can or can't do this summer. You just throw out, he can get at least one forward, as though you know who is available, but never divulge the name of the established O'Reilly type forward. Maybe there's a O'Reilly type deal out there, maybe not. If there isn't one to be had, I'm not going to blame Blake for not making it happen.

Every GM has had their eye on the expansion draft. If anyone is giving you O'Reilly for nothing, it's based on a mistake by someone, not good GMing.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Nobody can expect a Blues/O'Reilly trade. The Blues got him for basically nothing.

And the Blues were in a different situation.

 

[Herby]

If the solution is to throw a bunch of money at UFA's and give them contracts well into their 30's we are totally doomed. Free agency should be used to add final pieces to successfully developed rosters, bad teams who sign FA's don't exactly have a history of success.

 

[tomd]

This is where our split is. I have no idea what Blake can or can't do this summer. You just throw out, he can get at least one forward, as though you know who is available, but never divulge the name of the established O'Reilly type forward. Maybe there's a O'Reilly type deal out there, maybe not. If there isn't one to be had, I'm not going to blame Blake for not making it happen.

Every GM has had their eye on the expansion draft. If anyone is giving you O'Reilly for nothing, it's based on a mistake by someone, not good GMing.

You don’t think there are opportunities galore with a flat cap and the expansion draft? I wish you had been my boss when I was working...you would have expected nothing from me.

 

[Fishhead]

Yep, this offseason is key for Blake. They've drafted pretty well and have a highly rated system, now let's see what those assets get us or do for us.

I'm not too critical this year of where guys are playing because of the pandemic. I actually think it's great that Byfield is in the AHL and not back in Juniors, where he would probably be due to future contracts. It's a rare opportunity for him to be around the team constantly without burning a year, they share the same facility. It's not like he would see what a true NHL season is like anyways, there is very limited travel and things like that. He can learn just fine where he's at. The same with Turcotte. In a regular year, both of those guys could easily be handled differently than they are now, so it's not really a valid comparison to what other teams have done in the past. It's a very unique situation.

My expectation is that we start seeing the youth they want to keep move into the lineup replacing some placeholders, and moving out some of the other youth for players while the market is good. We've seen a bit of what we have in guys in that 2nd tier, like Thomas, Fagemo, and Madden. If Blake doesn't think they can grab a future spot, it's a good time to package them up for something that fits their vision.

Right now, we know what the first line is. We also have the beginnings of a good bottom 6 for the next few years with Moore and JAD. I think we see that Vilardi isn't well suited as a center, but has excellent skills and vision. Kempe is a useful guy that can move around. Outside of that, I feel the forwards group is up in the air. The defense is a more stable situation and won't take much tinkering. I think Blake had a good start with grabbing some useful players and stockpiling, but this is the year when he has to make big strides. The opportunity with cap struggles for many teams is there to take advantage of.

 

[SFKingshomer]

He will have to overpay because teams trading their young RFA to clear cap is a pipe dream. You don't see the type of players we want and need moved very often without a valid reason. A contract dispute, fallen out of favor due to attitude or not what you thought they were as a player, an offer too good to refuse and or a hockey trade. TB won't trade Sergachev but you can certainly try.

 

[Lt Dan]

I didn't even mention the ED

What does erectile dysfunction have to do with this?

 

[Fishhead]

He will have to overpay because teams trading their young RFA to clear cap is a pipe dream. You don't see the type of players we want and need moved very often without a valid reason. A contract dispute, fallen out of favor due to attitude or not what you thought they were as a player, an offer too good to refuse and or a hockey trade. TB won't trade Sergachev but you can certainly try.

This is totally true. But being so prospect rich right now, this team actually has the ability to overpay for things without taking too much of a hit. At least the Kings have the opportunity to do something a little more bold, compare that to a few years ago when no one wanted the shit we had in the pipeline.

 

[KingsFan7824]

You don’t think there are opportunities galore with a flat cap and the expansion draft? I wish you had been my boss when I was working...you would have expected nothing from me.

I'm saying I have no idea if there are or not. The Kings are not the only team that has kept Seattle in the back of their mind. If I were the boss, I'd have more information to go on in making my decision and expectations.

Again, name the opportunities, since you seem to have some sort of insider knowledge. And if you came to me with the Caps Chandler Stephenson as the answer to the Kings veteran point producer problem, I would fire you.

 

[SFKingshomer]

I don't mind the Hamilton idea but be prepared for that deal to be really ugly towards the end of it like most UFA deals.

 

[tomd]

I'm saying I have no idea if there are or not. The Kings are not the only team that has kept Seattle in the back of their mind. If I were the boss, I'd have more information to go on in making my decision and expectations.

Again, name the opportunities, since you seem to have some sort of insider knowledge. And if you came to me with the Caps Chandler Stephenson as the answer to the Kings veteran point producer problem, I would fire you.

Please stop with the chandler Stephenson nonsense. I have no insider knowledge but I can understand cap friendly with the best of them. The kings have the 2nd lowest payroll in the league and can have the ability to protect at least one and probably two forwards in the expansion draft. Those are real assets that can be used to improve the team. BUt you don’t want by the team to improve...that much is clear in your very passive aggressive way

 

[SFKingshomer]

Turcotte, Anderson, and a 1st for Werenski. Kupari for a winger or see what he can do since he hasn't been given much of a shot. The RFA isn't great either. I do like Blake Coleman as a UFA but he's more of a tweener.

 

[Jason Squirties]

I think I'm officially checked out, like the rest of the team. Someone message me when they go on another 7 game winning streak at the end of the season to install a tiny bit of hope. Vilardi probably the most disappointing in not making a step forward and leaves us a lot more vulnerable to looking like shid again next year. Oh well, good luck Blake.

 

[Herby]

Turcotte, Anderson, and a 1st for Werenski. Kupari for a winger or see what he can do since he hasn't been given much of a shot. The RFA isn't great either. I do like Blake Coleman as a UFA but he's more of a tweener.

Werenski is still only 23, might be the best goal-scoring defenseman in the league, is criminally underpaid for next season and is still under team control when his contract expires.

I don't think the Kings get him without including Byfield in any deal. Your offer is very good and fair (especially with the Kings pick getting better with each game), but one of the other teams in the league would top it. Werenski could put a few teams over the top, Columbus would get a kings ransom for him (no pun intended)

I think I'm officially checked out, like the rest of the team. Someone message me when they go on another 7 game winning streak at the end of the season to install a tiny bit of hope. Vilardi probably the most disappointing in not making a step forward and leaves us a lot more vulnerable to looking like shid again next year. Oh well, good luck Blake.

The collapse of Vilardi is definitely the most unfortunate and disappointing part of this season. I keep thinking he has to be injured, but you have to figure the Kings would be very cautious with him if that were the case (given his history) and wouldn't allow him to play through an injury. When people compared him to Getzlaf I think they had 25 year old Getzlaf in mind, not 35 year old Getzlaf.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Werenski is still only 23, might be the best goal-scoring defenseman in the league, is criminally underpaid for next season and is still under team control when his contract expires.

I don't think the Kings get him without including Byfield in any deal. Your offer is very good and fair (especially with the Kings pick getting better with each game), but one of the other teams in the league would top it. Werenski could put a few teams over the top, Columbus would get a kings ransom for him (no pun intended)

I agree but they need to improve their center I e position badly. Maybe they move Laine...

 

[KingsFan7824]

Please stop with the chandler Stephenson nonsense. I have no insider knowledge but I can understand cap friendly with the best of them. The kings have the 2nd lowest payroll in the league and can have the ability to protect at least one and probably two forwards in the expansion draft. Those are real assets that can be used to improve the team. BUt you don’t want by the team to improve...that much is clear in your very passive aggressive way

Yes, Stephenson never shouldn't been brought up to begin with.

You're using my ignorance of who is or is not available around the league as proof that I don't want the Kings to improve over the summer?

I think the Kings need a real 2C, a real scoring winger, and at least one real top 4D this summer. I'll look on capfriendly and decide which ones Blake should get, not knowing if any of them are available, and will hold Blake accountable if he doesn't get who I want them to get, and for what I think he can get them for.

 

[KINGS17]

If the solution is to throw a bunch of money at UFA's and give them contracts well into their 30's we are totally doomed. Free agency should be used to add final pieces to successfully developed rosters, bad teams who sign FA's don't exactly have a history of success.

Agreed. You get to a certain point and you fill in the gaps you have in your third line, or second and third pairings on defense. Scuderi was a great UFA signing back in the day.

 

[KINGS17]

What does erectile dysfunction have to do with this?

Blake says his hands are normal size, and Brandy has no problems.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

This is where our split is. I have no idea what Blake can or can't do this summer. You just throw out, he can get at least one forward, as though you know who is available, but never divulge the name of the established O'Reilly type forward. Maybe there's a O'Reilly type deal out there, maybe not. If there isn't one to be had, I'm not going to blame Blake for not making it happen.

Every GM has had their eye on the expansion draft. If anyone is giving you O'Reilly for nothing, it's based on a mistake by someone, not good GMing.

The other thing is, we’re not a player or two away from being a playoff team. The gap is pretty wide as we saw last night.

The main issue right now is forming an identity, and development. The latter has me more concerned. I think Herby pointed out correctly that Management isn’t going the traditional route of developing Turcotte and Byfield. Throw in Vilardi going through a bad stretch etc.

Draft picks and having the best prospect pool in the NHL is completely meaningless if you cannot develop them.

 

[BigKing]

Thank you! I got people here finishing my basement and it's 45 (after being 80 a couple days ago), so I'm just chilling in my den shooting the **** with you wonderful people.

I was pretty supportive of Blake early on and even excused some of his previous mistakes to the insanely flukey 2018 season that set the franchise back significantly. But to be honest, this year I think he has made a lot of mistakes that are unfortunately going to have a negative effect on the Kings. The two best prospects in the system, that he has used top 5 picks on are playing for the wrong team. They should have had Byfield up in the NHL this year, even if it was a red-shirt year, it would have gotten a lot of the stuff teenagers have to deal with playing in the NHL out of the way in a lost season, now those are going to have to happen next season in what probably wasn't supposed to be a lost season but is shaping up to be. The Turcotte thing has been beaten to death, but I'll just say, take a look at the other 2019 NCAA kids who went back to school and how they have done in the AHL since signing, confidence in the offensive zone matters if you want to be a scorer at higher levels. Blake went against the traditional way most teams develop similar prospects with both Byfield and Turcotte, whether you agree with him doing it or not, that is a factual statement.

The MacD thing is whatever, but how do you give that guy a multi-year extension, it's truly embarrassing not only how bad he is, but that he is playing defense and has a guaranteed contract.

And ofcourse as has been discussed in the previous posts the indecisiveness in either committing to a rebuild or trying to win. How do you have two groups of assets in the franchise, a bunch of old guys and then a bunch of teenagers. Other than Roy, Kempe, Petersen and Iafallo they have no one of significance in their primes signed beyond this season.

Seriously, what are the expectations for the Kings the next 3-4 years if they don't trade for Eichel or someone like that this offseason and continue the rebuild? (as Blake has said)

MacD signing was rewarding a culture/locker room guy with a deal that doesn't hurt anything since one of those two seasons was an expected non-playoff year.

He's definitely been worse this year but I swear to god the coaches are telling him to play their system and pinch. He used to not do this as much because he understood his limitations but now he's out there jumping in way more while also not trying to line up hits.

I've stopped short of accusing Blake & T-Mac of purposefully stacking the cards against the team this year but I feel like I can at least build the tin foil hat and have it ready to put on at this point. Blake gave him a long contract and has given him nothing in real additions to the team while keeping potentially better players down in Ontario. When T-Mac has the option to use better players, they are scratched or he plays certain guys too much.

Actually, I have accused Blake of this but it feels like T-Mac is complicit. Hoven isn't the be-all-end-all of Kings news but he does seem to have some sort of rapport with Blake. Pretty sure Hoven put out there that Blake's plan was to get one more high draft pick. Then Management came out with their "playoff goal" lip service and Hoven all of a sudden became this big pumper about the playoffs. The proof is in the pudding though: Blake did pretty much jack shit to the roster. Actions speak louder than words and Blake's actions indicate that the guy wanted another lottery pick and that is *exactly* how this season is playing out.

I can't blame him either and part of the reason is due to the list of top picks you posted earlier. I'm not shitting on them but none of them have been wunderkinds so far and, honestly, taking Byfield when you know he will take longer screams that you are totally fine on not contending this season. DL mostly missed on his first three 1st round picks (as far as what you'd expect from a 1st rounder: especially Hickey) but he got an all-timer in Doughty that can make up for those misses. Not saying anyone in this draft is Doughty level but you never know with a lot of these kids so, yeah, of course Blake wants another high pick. Squeaking into the playoffs in this stupid COVID season and picking in the Kupari range again makes his job much more difficult.

Anyways, we've been talking for a long time about "when can we start judging him" since there are many that want to give him a pass. I've accepted that but have pinpointed this offseason for when the rubber hits the road. Another season similar to this one without him actively trying to make the NHL product better is going to turn this Board into a pitchfork mob.

 

[Fishhead]

The collapse of Vilardi is definitely the most unfortunate and disappointing part of this season. I keep thinking he has to be injured, but you have to figure the Kings would be very cautious with him if that were the case (given his history) and wouldn't allow him to play through an injury. When people compared him to Getzlaf I think they had 25 year old Getzlaf in mind, not 35 year old Getzlaf.

I think with Vilardi it's a conditioning thing. I mean, the longest season he's played was his first jr year at 62 games. Last year he played 42 overall and is at 40 this year. He had what, a year off during rehab, and then no game situation skating because of COVID. I would expect him not to get back up to playing condition until at least next year, he actually surprised me with how he came out this year. Look at Carter after his injury, it took him many months to get back up to speed once he finished rehab and he's in elite shape. There is definitely some concern there, but I will be more worried if the same thing happens next year. The good news is all the limited skating and rehab time probably healed his back completely.

 

[KingsFan7824]

The other thing is, we’re not a player or two away from being a playoff team. The gap is pretty wide as we saw last night.

The main issue right now is forming an identity, and development. The latter has me more concerned. I think Herby pointed out correctly that Management isn’t going the traditional route of developing Turcotte and Byfield. Throw in Vilardi going through a bad stretch etc.

Draft picks and having the best prospect pool in the NHL is completely meaningless if you cannot develop them.

What's not traditional about the development of Byfield and Turcotte?