2019 Draft Discussion

[Raccoon Jesus]

Fine, here you go.

Every top 6 forward, top 4 d-man or starting goalie drafted by each NHL team over this decade. I will be conservative for the most part

Anaheim - Fowler, Rakell, Gibson, Karlsson, Lindholm, Theodore, Montour
Arizona - Keller, Chychrun, Domi, Strome
Boston - Seguin, Hamilton, Pastrnak, DeBrusk, McAvoy, (Debate: Donato)
Buffalo - Ristolainen, Eichel, Dahlin, Reinart (Debate: Compher)
Calgary- Ferland, Gaudreau, Monahan, Tkachuk
Carolina - Skinner, Faulk, Anderssen, Slavvin, Lindholm, Aho, Hanifin, Svechnikov
Chicago - Hayes, Saad, Shaw, Terovainen, Schmaltz, DeBrincat
Colorado- Landeskog, MacKinnon, Butcher, Rantanen
Columbus - Johansen, Jenner, Anderson, Werenski, Dubois
Dallas- Klingberg, Heiskinen
Detroit- Mrezak, AA, Mantha, Larkin
Edmonton - Hall, RNH, Klefbom, Gustafsson, Nurse, Draisitl, McDavid
Florida - Huberdeau, Trochek, Barkov, Ekblad (Debate: Hyman, Bjugstad, Donskoi)
Los Angeles - Toffoli, Miller (Debate: Pearson)
Minnesota- Granlund, Zucker, Dumba, Tuch
Montreal - Gallagher, Galchenyuk, Sergachev
Nashville - Jones, Arvidsson, Girard, Fiala
NJ- Larsson, Severson, Hirschier (Debate: Bratt)
NYI- Nino, Nelson, Pulock, Barzal,
NYR- Miller, Skej, Buchnevich,
Ottawa- Stone, Zibanijad, Ceci, Tkachuk (Debate: White)
Philly - Couturier, Ghostisbere, Konechy, Provorov
Pittsburgh - Maata, Murray, Guentzel, Kapanen
SJ - Coyle, Hertl, LaBanc, Meier (Debate: Tierney)
St. Louis - Tarasenko, Schwartz, Parayko, Dunn (Thomas will be but want to be conservative in this list)
Tampa - Gudas, Kucherov, Palat, Vasilevsky, Drouin, Point (Debate: DeAngelo)
Toronto - Reilly, Nylander, Marner, Matthews
Vancouver - Horvat, Boeser, Peterssen
Washington- Kuznetsov, Forsberg, Vrana
Winnipeg - Schiefele, Trouba, Morrissey, Hellebucyk, Ehlers, Connor, Laine

Look, I have been happy with Blake's picks since he took over, and I think if Vilardi is able to regain his health the Kings could easily have a comparable run of picks in 17-18-19 that could be a poor man's version of what Toronto did in 14-15-16 (Nylander, Marner, Matthews) but I just have no idea how you can in any way defend the Kings drafting for the last decade. Looking at the above list it's either the Kings, Devils, Dallas or the Rangers. And since Dallas has what looks like 2 star defenseman in that time it's really probably either the Kings, Devils or Rangers for the worst drafting team in the NHL the last decade.

Like I said above if you're going to give credit for players moving to other teams then you also have to include Cernak, and considering some of the guys you have on that list (your Michigan bias is showing with JT Compher) then you HAVE to include Brayden Schenn, Pearson, Forbort (if you have Ceci you can't ignore Forbort), and suddenly surprise, we're right in there with everyone else, especially given most of those picks are high first rounders that we didn't have.

And yet again, it's not about defending the Kings drafting, it's about contextualizing it. You yourself are admitting you're pretty happy with the Blake picks and while they have yet to pan out it's pretty clear how much better one can do with high picks (though it's not a guarantee, look how many firsts TBL have swung and missed on before crushing it in 2-3).

But ultimately just thank you for helping show that the Kings aren't the worst at it, which was all I claimed up there.

 

[crassbonanza]

Fine, here you go.

Every top 6 forward, top 4 d-man or starting goalie drafted by each NHL team over this decade. I will be conservative for the most part

Anaheim - Fowler, Rakell, Gibson, Karlsson, Lindholm, Theodore, Montour
Arizona - Keller, Chychrun, Domi, Strome
Boston - Seguin, Hamilton, Pastrnak, DeBrusk, McAvoy, (Debate: Donato)
Buffalo - Ristolainen, Eichel, Dahlin, Reinart (Debate: Compher)
Calgary- Ferland, Gaudreau, Monahan, Tkachuk
Carolina - Skinner, Faulk, Anderssen, Slavvin, Lindholm, Aho, Hanifin, Svechnikov
Chicago - Hayes, Saad, Shaw, Terovainen, Schmaltz, DeBrincat
Colorado- Landeskog, MacKinnon, Butcher, Rantanen
Columbus - Johansen, Jenner, Anderson, Werenski, Dubois
Dallas- Klingberg, Heiskinen
Detroit- Mrezak, AA, Mantha, Larkin
Edmonton - Hall, RNH, Klefbom, Gustafsson, Nurse, Draisitl, McDavid
Florida - Huberdeau, Trochek, Barkov, Ekblad (Debate: Hyman, Bjugstad, Donskoi)
Los Angeles - Toffoli, Miller (Debate: Pearson)
Minnesota- Granlund, Zucker, Dumba, Tuch
Montreal - Gallagher, Galchenyuk, Sergachev
Nashville - Jones, Arvidsson, Girard, Fiala
NJ- Larsson, Severson, Hirschier (Debate: Bratt)
NYI- Nino, Nelson, Pulock, Barzal,
NYR- Miller, Skej, Buchnevich,
Ottawa- Stone, Zibanijad, Ceci, Tkachuk (Debate: White)
Philly - Couturier, Ghostisbere, Konechy, Provorov
Pittsburgh - Maata, Murray, Guentzel, Kapanen
SJ - Coyle, Hertl, LaBanc, Meier (Debate: Tierney)
St. Louis - Tarasenko, Schwartz, Parayko, Dunn (Thomas will be but want to be conservative in this list)
Tampa - Gudas, Kucherov, Palat, Vasilevsky, Drouin, Point (Debate: DeAngelo)
Toronto - Reilly, Nylander, Marner, Matthews
Vancouver - Horvat, Boeser, Peterssen
Washington- Kuznetsov, Forsberg, Vrana
Winnipeg - Schiefele, Trouba, Morrissey, Hellebucyk, Ehlers, Connor, Laine

Look, I have been happy with Blake's picks since he took over, and I think if Vilardi is able to regain his health the Kings could easily have a comparable run of picks in 17-18-19 that could be a poor man's version of what Toronto did in 14-15-16 (Nylander, Marner, Matthews) but I just have no idea how you can in any way defend the Kings drafting for the last decade. Looking at the above list it's either the Kings, Devils, Dallas or the Rangers. And since Dallas has what looks like 2 star defenseman in that time it's really probably either the Kings, Devils or Rangers for the worst drafting team in the NHL the last decade.

I don't know how much of that is on drafting and how much of that is on the lack of high value draft picks. This decade the Kings have had 5 1st round draft picks, they are Forbort, Pearson, Kempe, Vilardi and Kupari. Those pick locations were 15th, 30th, 29th, 11th and 20th, which are not high value draft picks, I would argue that no team has had worse picks over this decade. The fact that they were able to get NHL players out of some the super late 1st round picks, which is actually not guaranteed.

 

[Herby]

Like I said above if you're going to give credit for players moving to other teams then you also have to include Cernak, and considering some of the guys you have on that list (your Michigan bias is showing with JT Compher) then you HAVE to include Pearson, Forbort (if you have Ceci you can't ignore Forbort), and suddenly surprise, we're right in there with everyone else, especially given most of those picks are high first rounders that we didn't have.

And yet again, it's not about defending the Kings drafting, it's about contextualizing it. You yourself are admitting you're pretty happy with the Blake picks and while they have yet to pan out it's pretty clear how much better one can do with high picks (though it's not a guarantee, look how many firsts TBL have swung and missed on before crushing it in 2-3).

But ultimately just thank you for helping show that the Kings aren't the worst at it, which was all I claimed up there.

I have to include Forbort? Um no. And if Ceci is comparable to Forbort then take him off the list, didn't say list was perfect. But there is no way Derek Forbort is a top 4 d-man, just stop, one person on this board thinks that and you don't want to join that club.

Cernak is close, but I was reluctant to put rookies on there unless I was sure (as noted with Thomas).

Compher has 16 goals in 60 games this season, which is a 22 goal/ 44 pt pace over a full season (comparable to TT) and that is as a 23 year old with room to grow. It's ridiculous to say a 20 goal-scorer is a 3rd liner. He's not a world beater and he'd be a lower end 2nd line player (like TT) but if he's a 3rd liner he's one of the best in the league.

Pearson it's just tough because of how much he has fallen off, and it's why he was in the debate category with someone like Bjugstad. Both provided 2nd line scoring for atleast one season but then just fell off. Considering Pearson scored 25 goals once and had a good playoff in 2014 it's fair to argue he could be considered a 2nd line pick. But considering he has had 1 season avg over .5 ppg and scored more than 15 goals only once and is now 26 you could also take the other side, that's why he is a debate.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I don't know how much of that is on drafting and how much of that is on the lack of high value draft picks. This decade the Kings have had 5 1st round draft picks, they are Forbort, Pearson, Kempe, Vilardi and Kupari. Those pick locations were 15th, 30th, 29th, 11th and 20th, which are not high value draft picks, I would argue that no team has had worse picks over this decade. The fact that they were able to get NHL players out of some the super late 1st round picks, which is actually not guaranteed.

That's exactly what the "problem" is, though I think it's a fair criticism that we haven't gotten many scoring forwards out of later rounds. Then again, that wasn't our organizational mantra, and we've drafted one of the highest amounts of just raw NHLers in that time. And now the winds are changing.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I have to include Forbort? Um no. And if Ceci is comparable to Forbort then take him off the list, didn't say list was perfect. But there is no way Derek Forbort is a top 4 d-man, just stop, one person on this board thinks that and you don't want to join that club.

Cernak is close, but I was reluctant to put rookies on there unless I was sure (as noted with Thomas).

Compher has 16 goals in 60 games this season, which is a 22 goal/ 44 pt pace over a full season (comparable to TT) and that is as a 23 year old with room to grow. It's ridiculous to say a 20 goal-scorer is a 3rd liner. He's not a world beater and he'd be a lower end 2nd line player (like TT) but if he's a 3rd liner he's one of the best in the league.

Pearson it's just tough because of how much he has fallen off, and it's why he was in the debate category with someone like Bjugstad. Both provided 2nd line scoring for atleast one season but then just fell off. Considering Pearson scored 25 goals once and had a good playoff in 2014 it's fair to argue he could be considered a 2nd line pick. But considering he has had 1 season avg over .5 ppg and scored more than 15 goals only once and is now 26 you could also take the other side, that's why he is a debate.

Well, if we're talking about paces and things that haven't happened, better add Adrian Kempe who had really close to 40 points, Austin Wagner who could be on pace for 20 goals 40 points with more usage, Grundstrom who is on a 30 goal pace, and Iafallo who will fall just short of 40, all on a team that can't score, right?

Again, grass is always greener. You're seeing the potential in guys on other teams while going out of your way to see the negative in our using recency bias. i appreciate you putting together the list and I don't think it would be fair to you to chastise you for it not being flawless/perfect but I'm telling you these guys have easy comps and the vast majority of your list consists of high firsts that we have been missing.

Edit: besides, if you ACTUALLY go back a decade of drafts, you'd have to include Doughty and Voynov as well--but I understand you're more pointing out the mid-2010s than anything, so I'll leave that off but knowing that you're talking about the Cup years, that's why I struggle with the point that it's so hard for some people to understand why our drafting wasn't great in those years.

 

[Herby]

Well, if we're talking about paces and things that haven't happened, better add Adrian Kempe who had really close to 40 points, Austin Wagner who could be on pace for 20 goals 40 points with more usage, Grundstrom who is on a 30 goal pace, and Iafallo who will fall just short of 40, all on a team that can't score, right?

Again, grass is always greener. You're seeing the potential in guys on other teams while going out of your way to see the negative in our using recency bias. i appreciate you putting together the list and I don't think it would be fair to you to chastise you for it not being flawless/perfect but I'm telling you these guys have easy comps and the vast majority of your list consists of high firsts that we have been missing.

Well I like Kempe actually. And I think he has upside to be a very good offensive 3rd line player who could step up into a bigger role if needed, but you just can't put him on the list as of now, until he proves it. He could easily end up as one of those guys that the whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts. I don't know why he doesn't score more.

Like Wagner too, but come on, he is going to be a great 4th liner on this team one day, he is a championship caliber bottom six player with his speed. But a scorer? No, not close. He does not have the offensive skills of Compher, Wagner was not even a big scorer in junior.

Grundstrom has played 8 NHL games, ridiculous to talk about paces at that amount of games. He is on pace for 35G and 0A, yeah lets let the sample size fix a little. Didn't really want to include rookies in this, if he is 20/25 next season we can definitely include him in the future 2nd liner talk.

 

[King'sPawn]

It would be a fun exercise to do points/draft position over the past decade.

Something like (Career Points)/(# years since drafted)/(218-{draft position}).

This way, if a player has been in the league for a long time, he won't have an unfair number of points compared to a player who is a rookie and realistically can't reach that production. However, dividing by 218-draft position provides a better number for players picked later, so you're getting better value for your picks (I picked 218 because there's 217 picks in the drafts with Vegas, and you can't divide by 0).

So Mark Stone would be 319/9/30, which is 1.18
Tyler Toffoli is 253/9/171, which is 0.16. Same draft year.
Auston Matthews is 201/3/217 = 0.31 (this isn't to say he's a bad player, but saying your team drafted well because you drafted an exceptional player 1st overall is different than drafting an exceptional player 50th overall)
Connor McDavid is 364/4/217 = .42
Ondrej Kase is 73/5/13 = 1.12

If anyone's ambitious enough, that might give you something fun to do.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

For funsies, here's what other recent Cup winners were drafting in the yeras they won the Cup, let's see how many impact players they came up with:

2009 Pens--Despres, Philip Samuelsson, Hanowski, Nick Petersen, Alex Velischek, Andy Bathgate, Viktor Ekbom. Maybe Despres if he had stayed healthy.
2010 Hawks--Kevin Hayes, Rensfeldt, Holl, Kent Simpson, Stephen Johns, Joakim Nordstrom, Flick, Hoefflin, Mattson, Carruth -- I'll give Hayes credit, couple more NHLers at least in Nordstrom, Johns
2011 Bruins--Hamilton, Khoklachev, Camara, Ferlin, O'Gara, Volden
2012 Kings--Pearson, Porkins, Miller, Hyka, LaDue, Ebert
2013 Hawks--Hartman, Dahlstrom, Hayden, Norrell, Motte, Luke Johnson, Louis, Press--nothin, couple of bottom sixers
2014 Kings--Kempe (arguable), McKeown, Lintuniemi, Amadio, Johnson, Dillon, Marchment, Mistele, Watson, Middleton
2015 Hawks--Knott, Shea, Gilbert, Bondra, Radke, Tuulola, Dahlstrom--anyone heard of any of these guys?
2016 Pens--Filip Gustavsson, Bjorkvist, Hall, Jones, Almari, Masonious--ditto
2017 Pens--Zach Lauzon, Phillips, Drozg, Olund, Palojarvi, Reilly
2018 Caps--Little early here but I'll give them credit for Alex Alexeyev

Turns out when you're dumping 1st rounders or picking late it's really effing difficult to draft impact players. It's really strange that all these teams were somehow competitive eh?

 

[Herby]

Edit: besides, if you ACTUALLY go back a decade of drafts, you'd have to include Doughty and Voynov as well--but I understand you're more pointing out the mid-2010s than anything, so I'll leave that off but knowing that you're talking about the Cup years, that's why I struggle with the point that it's so hard for some people to understand why our drafting wasn't great in those years.

Yesterday I made a post about the players the Kings passed up on in drafts (guys literally taken 1-2 picks after the Kings) and you told me that wasn't fair to do.

And now today you are making the argument that since the Kings picked late so didn't have a chance at great players, which is just flat out wrong. The Kings had chances to draft great players under DL/Futa and they made the wrong picks for the better part of a decade. I'm not asking to hit every year, that would be foolish. But there is simply no excuse for missing time after time after time after time. It's almost impossible. They literally could have put the top 3 ranked kids left on CSS names into a hat every year and pulled out and they would have done better. Again not asking for hits for every year, but over a 9 year period the best you can do is Tyler Toffoli? Come on man, that is embarrassing.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Well I like Kempe actually. And I think he has upside to be a very good offensive 3rd line player who could step up into a bigger role if needed, but you just can't put him on the list as of now, until he proves it. He could easily end up as one of those guys that the whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts. I don't know why he doesn't score more.

Like Wagner too, but come on, he is going to be a great 4th liner on this team one day, he is a championship caliber bottom six player with his speed. But a scorer? No, not close. He does not have the offensive skills of Compher, Wagner was not even a big scorer in junior.

Grundstrom has played 8 NHL games, ridiculous to talk about paces at that amount of games. He is on pace for 35G and 0A, yeah lets let the sample size fix a little. Didn't really want to include rookies in this, if he is 20/25 next season we can definitely include him in the future 2nd liner talk.

I agree with you, I was illustrating the fallacy of pace. But i also think it's a little shortsighted to use production--particularly on past versions of the Kings to say a guy that's scored 37 points is not a top sixer but a guy who projects for 43 is.

 

[Herby]

For funsies, here's what other recent Cup winners were drafting in the yeras they won the Cup, let's see how many impact players they came up with:

2009 Pens--Despres, Philip Samuelsson, Hanowski, Nick Petersen, Alex Velischek, Andy Bathgate, Viktor Ekbom. Maybe Despres if he had stayed healthy.
2010 Hawks--Kevin Hayes, Rensfeldt, Holl, Kent Simpson, Stephen Johns, Joakim Nordstrom, Flick, Hoefflin, Mattson, Carruth -- I'll give Hayes credit, couple more NHLers at least in Nordstrom, Johns
2011 Bruins--Hamilton, Khoklachev, Camara, Ferlin, O'Gara, Volden
2012 Kings--Pearson, Porkins, Miller, Hyka, LaDue, Ebert
2013 Hawks--Hartman, Dahlstrom, Hayden, Norrell, Motte, Luke Johnson, Louis, Press--nothin, couple of bottom sixers
2014 Kings--Kempe (arguable), McKeown, Lintuniemi, Amadio, Johnson, Dillon, Marchment, Mistele, Watson, Middleton
2015 Hawks--Knott, Shea, Gilbert, Bondra, Radke, Tuulola, Dahlstrom--anyone heard of any of these guys?
2016 Pens--Filip Gustavsson, Bjorkvist, Hall, Jones, Almari, Masonious--ditto
2017 Pens--Zach Lauzon, Phillips, Drozg, Olund, Palojarvi, Reilly
2018 Caps--Little early here but I'll give them credit for Alex Alexeyev

Turns out when you're dumping 1st rounders or picking late it's really effing difficult to draft impact players. It's really strange that all these teams were somehow competitive eh?

The Hawks were in the same win-now mode as the Kings (even longer since they went to WCF in 2009) but were able to find players like Hayes (24), Saad (43), Shaw (139) , DeBrincat (39), Teravainen (18), Schmaltz (20). But idk I guess it's impossible to find top 6 forwards unless your picking top 10.

But it doesn't matter, there was no way the Kings were taking a player like DeBrincat whether it was at #39 or #139 and that line of thinking is the biggest reason the roster today is so lacking in skilled players. But atleast it appears that page has been turned under Blake. So happier times ahead.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Yesterday I made a post about the players the Kings passed up on in drafts (guys literally taken 1-2 picks after the Kings) and you told me that wasn't fair to do.

And now today you are making the argument that since the Kings picked late so didn't have a chance at great players, which is just flat out wrong. The Kings had chances to draft great players under DL/Futa and they made the wrong picks for the better part of a decade. I'm not asking to hit every year, that would be foolish. But there is simply no excuse for missing time after time after time after time. It's almost impossible. They literally could have put the top 3 ranked kids left on CSS names into a hat every year and pulled out and they would have done better. Again not asking for hits for every year, but over a 9 year period the best you can do is Tyler Toffoli? Come on man, that is embarrassing.

Fair, yet i think you're understating just how many picks were missing.

2013 the only 'high' picks they had were 2nd, 2 4ths.
2014 is kind of a mild disaster in retrospect if amadio does'nt do more, they had a 1st, 2 2nds, 3, 4
2015 2, 3, 4
2016 2, 4

And those are the truly painful ones, I agree. But you have to admit that's not a lot of swings.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

The draft is a total crapshoot. I don’t know how many times we all need to go over this. Sheer luck determines successful drafts more often than anything else. Every piece of data we have available since the beginning of the draft supports this.

From 2011 to 2017, the Kings experienced a statistically unusual dip in successful picks. Some of that can be attributed to a narrow drafting philosophy. Some of that is errors in development. Some of that is just bad luck.

The point is to keep your picks. The more you draft, the better your odds become at selecting successful NHL players.

Over a long enough sample size, every team’s drafting history evens out. As much as we kick Lombardi for the Forbort pick, you can turn around and point at all the teams who passed on Kopitar.

Again, to be clear, this is not a Lombardi apologist post. He deserves criticism for prioritizing picks like Forbort and Teubert. But you’re not arguing in good faith unless you point out the overwhelming statistical evidence in support of pure random chance in the NHL draft.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

With 10 picks in the upcoming draft, this will be the most amount of selections the Kings have had since the 2014 draft, which also produced 10 selections.

Of those 10 selections, only one of them is an NHL regular, Adrian Kempe (selected 29th overall), and only two additional players have appeared in NHL games with Roland McKeown appearing in 10 games with Carolina, and Michael Amadio having played 74 games with the Kings.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

With 10 picks in the upcoming draft, this will be the most amount of selections the Kings have had since the 2014 draft, which also produced 10 selections.

Of those 10 selections, only one of them is an NHL regular, Adrian Kempe (selected 29th overall), and only two additional players have appeared in NHL games with Roland McKeown appearing in 10 games with Carolina, and Michael Amadio having played 74 games with the Kings.

That's all true. But I have more confidence now, based on the last 2 drafts. Even 2015 saw Cernak, Wagner and Roy (7th) 2016 Clague at 51 and only had 4 picks. Good pick.
2017 Vilardi (say what you will, but he did play most of the season and was dominant. Story is not over. he's 19 yrs old) JAD, Villata, Mikey Anderson, Phillips, Hults. All 3
of those D have been beyond expectations and Anderson best D drafted since Doughty and Voynov 10 yrs ago. 2018 Kupari, Thomas, Shafigullin, Dudas, Sodergran. (too early to know on all of them, especially last 3)

2014 was NOT good, as you stated. Last 4 drafts rounds 1 and 2, pretty good. No Ist in 15 and 16 and Cernak and Clague rd 2 looks good. Too bad Cernak was traded.
He would be looking good on the Kings D right now. A level above Walker, Roy, Forbort. Oh well.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Like Wagner too, but come on, he is going to be a great 4th liner on this team one day, he is a championship caliber bottom six player with his speed. But a scorer? No, not close. He does not have the offensive skills of Compher, Wagner was not even a big scorer in junior.

Honestly i also thought Wagner would be a great 4th liner for us. Right now I am not so sure anymore.

This is his first NHL season. He might not have great hands or a super shot but this guy is gonna have multiple 20 goals seasons despite all that. Wagner is gonna put the puck in the net anyhow.

Thomas Holmstrom and many others were not super skilled either.

I think you sell him short here.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Alex Turcotte. Who I would pick at #3.

he's 5'11" and 190. Solidly built, great on his skates



His PPG on the USHL games is higher than Hughes. Turcotte has 34 pts in 16 games. Filthy. And with the US Team games, 53 pts in 30 games. A combined total of 87 pts in 46 games. Close to 2 ppg.
USNTDP Juniors at eliteprospects.com
U.S. National U18 Team at eliteprospects.com

Sam Conentino - SportsNetFeb. 13th: "Strong showing at the U18 Five Nations event has him on pace to be a top 10 pick. Exhibits a solid two-way game."

Cam Robinson - Dobber ProspectsFeb. 6th: "Great offensive instincts, quick acceleration and already the most complete two-way player in the crop. A constant battler. Injuries stole the first portion of his season, but he’s back healthy and dominating. A coach’s dream."

Ryan Kennedy - The Hockey NewsFeb. 1st: "The University of Wisconsin commit missed a bunch of games due to injury early, but since his return Turcotte has been lightning. An excellent skater with NHL pedigree (his dad is Alfie Turcotte) and a ton of skill."

Steve Kournianos - Sporting NewsJan. 31st: "Dominant play in Jack Hughes's absence solidified his standing as the draft's best two-way center. He should be near the top on every team's draft board."

Bob McKenzie - TSNJan. 24 th: "Centre Alex Turcotte, the son of former NHLer Alfie Turcotte, is No. 11 and a legit threat to break into the Top 10 despite playing only 13 games this season because of injury."

Hannah Stuart - theScoreJan. 9th: "He's a relentless player with strong offensive instincts who makes good decisions at both ends of the ice. "

Will - Scouching.caJan. 7th: "Great skill with his stick one-on-one and a very agile and shifty skater who could have massive upside if you can snag him after a few picks roll by."

 

[AzKing]

I think that you could argue 3 players that will be in the 3-5 conversation and all 3 look very good:

Turcotte
Cozens
Byram

I wouldn't be disappointed in any of them. You have a Top 2 upside Dman and 2 guys who have top line talent. I think that Zegras could push his way into the conversation as well. A lot of people are really digging into him and calling him a lighter version of Hughes. Supposedly though, he has the same problem that Hughes has in that they both can get knocked off the puck rather easily.

Turcotte's biggest problem is sample size because he has missed so many games. I think Cozens will get the nod at #3 because of his size, agility, skating and he has a good, accurate shot. He just fits the bill as a top C or W.

If the Kings don't get one of the top 2 picks but come away with Cozens or Turcotte, they will be more than just fine.

 

[YP44]

I think that you could argue 3 players that will be in the 3-5 conversation and all 3 look very good:

Turcotte
Cozens
Byram

I wouldn't be disappointed in any of them. You have a Top 2 upside Dman and 2 guys who have top line talent. I think that Zegras could push his way into the conversation as well. A lot of people are really digging into him and calling him a lighter version of Hughes. Supposedly though, he has the same problem that Hughes has in that they both can get knocked off the puck rather easily.

Turcotte's biggest problem is sample size because he has missed so many games. I think Cozens will get the nod at #3 because of his size, agility, skating and he has a good, accurate shot. He just fits the bill as a top C or W.

If the Kings don't get one of the top 2 picks but come away with Cozens or Turcotte, they will be more than just fine.

I take Dach and Zegras before Byram.

 

[AnThGrt]

^ You can argue a lot more then 3 guys in that range. I'd not be one bit shocked if you saw any of Podkolzin, Dach, Turcotte, Cozens, Byram, Krebs, and Zegras go anywhere from #3-5.

Turcotte/Byram if not #1/2 are still my biggest targets. After that I'd love Podkolzin barring combine conversations or Dach personally yet wouldn't be upset with any of the guys listed above. Not huge on Zegras personally though.

Still have my list/tiers in preference order within:

Hughes/Kakko

Turcotte/Byram/Podkolzin (barring a safe bet he is coming over)

Dach/Cozens

Krebs/Zegras

 

[AzKing]

I take Dach and Zegras before Byram.

Dach is sliding down the boards rapidly. I have seen him fall out of the Top 10 in some mock drafts.

 

[AzKing]

^ You can argue a lot more then 3 guys in that range. I'd not be one bit shocked if you saw any of Podkolzin, Dach, Turcotte, Cozens, Byram, Krebs, and Zegras go anywhere from #3-5.

Turcotte/Byram if not #1/2 are still my biggest targets. After that I'd love Podkolzin barring combine conversations or Dach personally yet wouldn't be upset with any of the guys listed above. Not huge on Zegras personally though.

I'm not sure that anyone is going to risk a top 5 on a guy who is not even 50/50 on coming over from Russia. I like Podkolzin but he may fall. The Kings will probably pass because they can't afford to have a guy refuse to come over. If I were a gambling man, I would put my money on Cozens or Turcotte being the pick if they are there when the Kings draft.

 

[johnjm22]

Like Wagner too, but come on, he is going to be a great 4th liner on this team one day, he is a championship caliber bottom six player with his speed. But a scorer? No, not close. He does not have the offensive skills of Compher, Wagner was not even a big scorer in junior.

This is a terrible attitude to take.

It's the same mentality that Lombardi and Murray took towards Simmonds, and why they under utilized him and botched his value.

Wagner could absolutely develop into a top 6 scoring winger. At some point you have to give him a chance and try him out in a scoring role.

 

[funky]

Would love to see Wagner paired with Kempe and Grundstrom for a few games in the third. That line would piss off a lot of teams with speed, for checking and elite speed

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Lets just hope we have pick 1 or 2.

Too many options for 3, so more room for error.