2018 NHL Entry Draft Thread (Less then 24 Hours Edition)

[Habs Halifax]

To be fair, McCarron was picked 25th. It’s okay to roll the dice once in a while, especially late.

It's a fair comment... especially in that draft year. However, We fell into a "size" trap and neglected skill and skating. Theodore or Hartman would of been better picks. They had size but also had better skill and skating vs McCarron. We took a big huge leap of faith thinking McCarron would develop his skating and he always had limited skill.

But yes, in that draft year, it was not deep. We had 3- 2nd round picks and ended up getting DLR, Fucale, and Lehkonen. DLR and Lehkonen might be the best to come from that round.

 

[Habs Halifax]

That has to do with drafting philosophy, not about picking the best guy, as McCarron is better than them. Late first round is pretty close to what McCarron was slotted to go. You are just over thinking here.

No, McCarron was projected to go in the 2nd round. DLR however was ranked in the 1st round but he slipped (at least he has skating and size). And yes, I am talking about philosophy and strategy. I don't care about finding BPA according to some rankings you can Google. It's about risks vs rewards. With McCarron, we fell into the size trap. Just like we did with Tinordi.

If you target size, the player better have either skill or skating. DLR has size and skating but McCarron had size, limited skill, and his skating needed a lot of improvement. Bad 1st round pick IMO.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Fair comment for sure. I have not studied the 40+ rankings in depth but I do like Rodrigue a lot. And I think Ducharme will have influence as well. I think Ridrigue could either replace Price or be used in a trade if he turns into a Hart type prospect. I'd be hesitant with the 61/62 pick but would have no problem with the 66th pick. We are already stock piled with grade B prospects so another goalie with Primeau to potential replace price in 6+ years is a move I would consider.

Pretty safe bet Rodrigue plays for team Canada at the world U20's right?

I just couldn't care less about the goaltending position. Rodrigue could replace Price in 6 years. So could Primeau, or McNiven, or Lindgren, or lots of other dudes, which is kind of the point. You can find .915 goaltending for a song these days. Looking back on it, Timmins and co were absolutely right with the Primeau pick, and that's how the goaltending position should be looked after. Separate list, once we're out of our top 100 skaters, the picks go to the goalie scouts.

 

[jaffy27]

Plenty of good goalies to be had for free (Lindgren, McNiven) or with a late pick (Primeau). Wouldn't waste any picks on a goalie this year, no matter how good.

Our views on this are laser exact and precise, plus we have good depth there. If Rodrigue is still there in the 6th round then sure, aquire a 6th round pick and get him....but otherwise, Swing for the fences on LHD or C

 

[Habs Halifax]

I just couldn't care less about the goaltending position. Rodrigue could replace Price in 6 years. So could Primeau, or McNiven, or Lindgren, or lots of other dudes, which is kind of the point. You can find .915 goaltending for a song these days. Looking back on it, Timmins and co were absolutely right with the Primeau pick, and that's how the goaltending position should be looked after. Separate list, once we're out of our top 100 skaters, the picks go to the goalie scouts.

Ask the Flyers how long it took them to find a goalie like Hart. Lets see who the Sabres get. Habs have been spoiled with goalies but that's because we are not afraid to draft them in any draft year. Heck, we drafted Price 5th overall and Theodore was coming off a MVP season a year or two before.

There are a lot of good goalies out there but not many game changers. Many teams have been looking for a goalie for a while. Were not getting grade A prospects with the 61/62 and 66th pick. We are getting another grade B prospect but we potentially pass on a grade A prospect in Net? Sorry, I'm willing to take Rodrigue if he is still around with the 61/62 and 66th picks.

 

[Frank JT]

Sometimes it’s not all on Timmins either. I’m sure he didn’t single-handedly pick guys like Crisp, Pezzeta and Staum. He gets advice from other scouts too.

Timmins already said that Bergevin asked him and his team to focus on physical players at the 2013 draft. McCarron, DLR before Lehkonen; Crisp before Andrighetto. Timmins can make mistakes, but I think Bergevin could be the bigger problem for us.

 

[boss10]

According to Arpon Basu's interview with Brady Tkachuk for the Athletic, he interviewed with 14 teams. Ottawa and Arizona (picking 4th and 5th) requested he visit them shortly after the Combine. No Montreal visit mentioned, so that's a good sign.

For now, it's still early. I am sure the Habs will end up interviewing him and all the other top prospects at the combine or days before the draft. And if Ottawa and Phoenix are that interested in him then pit them against each other and see who offers more for the third pick.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Ask the Flyers how long it took them to find a goalie like Hart. Lets see who the Sabres get. Habs have been spoiled with goalies but that's because we are not afraid to draft them in any draft year. Heck, we drafted Price 5th overall and Theodore was coming off a MVP season a year before.

And look at how far that got us.

The flyers actually had a vezina caliber goaltender. Then they traded him for a song. Perhaps we should ask Columbus how much it took to acquire a vezina caliber goaltender? Or do we always have to ask the one team in the NHL who can't help but f*** that position up ad nauseam?

 

[Habs Halifax]

And look at how far that got us.

The flyers actually had a vezina caliber goaltender. Then they traded him for a song. Perhaps we should ask Columbus how much it took to acquire a vezina caliber goaltender? Or do we always have to ask the one team in the NHL who can't help but **** that position up ad nauseam?

Understood but we also had Dubnyk and let him go too. You are hoping we get lucky like the Blue Jackets and Wild. It happens but we didn't get lucky with getting the center we needed over the last 6 years so planing on luck is for losers more often than not. Blues traded for Schenn and look how he took off this past year? If the Habs and the rest of the league only knew the future they would of all taken that deal.

You think the Flyers let Hart go this time around when they have a good core of young players around him? I don't think so

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

No, McCarron was projected to go in the 2nd round. DLR however was ranked in the 1st round but he slipped (at least he has skating and size). And yes, I am talking about philosophy and strategy. I don't care about finding BPA according to some rankings you can Google. It's about risks vs rewards. With McCarron, we fell into the size trap. Just like we did with Tinordi.

If you target size, the player better have either skill or skating. DLR has size and skating but McCarron had size, limited skill, and his skating needed a lot of improvement. Bad 1st round pick IMO.

Bad pick, better than the three you named though, because he's a plain better hockey player, if that makes sense. Nobody was surprised McCarron was drafted in the first round, it's not even a reach.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Bad pick, better than the three you named though, because he's a plain better hockey player, if that makes sense. Nobody was surprised McCarron was drafted in the first round, it's not even a reach.

We disagree. Drafting McCarron with the 25th pick was a bit of a stretch. He was projected to go early to mid 2nd round from what I remember. And are you saying McCarron is better than DLR?

 

[Runner77]

To be fair, McCarron was picked 25th. It’s okay to roll the dice once in a while, especially late.

I've heard an interesting take putting the McCarron pick in a far different perspective.

One pundit argued how the league had moved on from McCarron type players when he was picked and how the Habs did not sufficiently pay attention to where the league was going.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I wouldn't use a high pick on a goalie in this draft because there isn't a Carter Hart level prospect out there.

Skarek isn't very good at all. Rodrigue is good but he's gonna be a steady Eddy and not a game stealer.

Better off waiting later on and grabbing Dostal, Myrenberg, Lindbom, Annunen, etc.

 

[Draft]

BPA according to who's ranking? Let me ask you this question... who scores more goals in the NHL in future years? Zadina or Kotkaniemi? We are not getting a potential #1C if we don't draft one and Kotkaniemi will go top 10. BPA from 3-10 don't exist. It's who you are high on personally.

The other think you have to consider it a risking stock value towards the end. Kotkaniemi is a rising stock value and he is 8 or 9 months younger than Zadina.

From what I've seen of the players, both Zadina and Wahlstrom have better opportunities to make an offensive impact at the NHL level. Personally, based on his skill level, skating fundamentals, and defensive awareness at the junior and professional level, I don't see Kotkaniemi becoming a top-30 center in the league. On the other hand, Zadina and Wahlstrom both have the ability, given their respective offensive toolboxes, strong foundational skills, and production to this point, to be top players at their positions.

There is BPA. Kotkaniemi wouldn't be in the top-10 if he weren't a center IMO.

 

[Runner77]

I defer to most here for my prospect analysis pre-draft.

Smart man.

 

[montreal]

I've heard an interesting take putting the McCarron pick in a far different perspective.

One pundit argued how the league had moved on from McCarron type players when he was picked and how the Habs did not sufficiently pay attention to where the league was going.

wouldn't be the first time they did not sufficiently pay attention to where the league was going. Tinordi is a perfect example, I said when he was in Hamilton, he would have been a great pick if it was done 5/10 years earlier but who knew that 6'6 hulking blueliners would be out of favor?

 

[NotProkofievian]

Understood but we also had Dubnyk and let him go too. You are hoping we get lucky like the Blue Jackets and Wild. It happens but we didn't get lucky with getting the center we needed over the last 6 years so planing on luck is for losers more often than not. Blues traded for Schenn and look how he took off this past year? If the Habs and the rest of the league only knew the future they would of all taken that deal.

You think the Flyers let Hart go this time around when they have a good core of young players around him? I don't think so

It's not really luck, though. The value of a young tender who's ready to take on a starting role is a first round pick, and almost everyone has a competent starter. Every singe replacement that I suggested for Price last year did well, and none of them were moved for more than a 3rd round pick.

If we do end up like the flyers, then sure, that changes things. But in the meantime, back of the bus, goalies, especially now that some of our top prospects actually are goalies.

 

[Runner77]

Personally, based on his skill level, skating fundamentals, and defensive awareness at the junior and professional level, I don't see Kotkaniemi becoming a top-30 center in the league. On the other hand, Zadina and Wahlstrom both have the ability, given their respective offensive toolboxes, strong foundational skills, and production to this point, to be top players at their positions.

There is BPA. Kotkaniemi wouldn't be in the top-10 if he weren't a center IMO.

Exactly and so much this.

If the Habs really want a no. 1C through the draft, then sell, sell, sell and stack up on as many first rounders as they can get their hands on next year. Point final. Kotkaniemi is just a compromise any way you slice it -- and we don't need that. He was a winger, could become a winger, is not a fluid skater. I don't know about his defensive awareness but if that is an issue, you can bet it'll scare the Habs off in a hurry.

Get the BPA.

 

[Habs Halifax]

From what I've seen of the players, both Zadina and Wahlstrom have better opportunities to make an offensive impact at the NHL level. Personally, based on his skill level, skating fundamentals, and defensive awareness at the junior and professional level, I don't see Kotkaniemi becoming a top-30 center in the league. On the other hand, Zadina and Wahlstrom both have the ability, given their respective offensive toolboxes, strong foundational skills, and production to this point, to be top players at their positions.

There is BPA. Kotkaniemi wouldn't be in the top-10 if he weren't a center IMO.

Disagree. I watched a lot of video on Kotkaniemi and he picks corners just like Zadina does. And I know Zadina very well!

 

[Runner77]

Our views on this are laser exact and precise, plus we have good depth there. If Rodrigue is still there in the 6th round then sure, aquire a 6th round pick and get him....but otherwise, Swing for the fences on LHD or C

Swing for the fences by also making allowances with at couple of boom or bust types -- players with an enormous ceiling but that carry a high risk.

Now that we have a Bouchard heading our development, there is a decent chance we'll hit a homerun with one of them.

 

[NotProkofievian]

From what I've seen of the players, both Zadina and Wahlstrom have better opportunities to make an offensive impact at the NHL level. Personally, based on his skill level, skating fundamentals, and defensive awareness at the junior and professional level, I don't see Kotkaniemi becoming a top-30 center in the league. On the other hand, Zadina and Wahlstrom both have the ability, given their respective offensive toolboxes, strong foundational skills, and production to this point, to be top players at their positions.

There is BPA. Kotkaniemi wouldn't be in the top-10 if he weren't a center IMO.

Which is, you know, why there's just sooooo many other centers in the top 10 this year. I can't turn around without seeing a ranking with Kupari or Lundeström in the top 10.

 

[The Great Weal]

Hard to really get excited about that to be honest.

If its :

Kotkaniemi: Bonafide #1 center
Poehling: Good #2 center
Danault: Very good #3 center

Then thats very good and i'd be excited for that.

But if it ends up being:

Kotkaniemi: good 2nd line center
Poehling: good 3rd line center
Danault: good 3rd line center

Then its seriously 'meh', and not very exciting at all tbh.

Both scenarios are honestly just as likely right now. Both Kotkaniemi and Poehling's potentials could go either way at this point.

The thing is, if we suck next year, there will be an abundance of high end centers. So if we take Kotkaniemi next year, we will also have a realistic shot at a guy like Dach. Dach-Kotkaniemi-Poehling/Danault-DLR would look nice.

 

[Runner77]

Suck it up and pile first round draft picks next year. There is no other way to land these potential no. 1Cs. Six years of Bergevin should have taught ownership a thing or two.

 

[Draft]

Which is, you know, why there's just sooooo many other centers in the top 10 this year. I can't turn around without seeing a ranking with Kupari or Lundeström in the top 10.

But you've got Hayton and Veleno ranked just outside the top-10. Objectively rank Kotkaniemi against last year's draft and I don't have him in the top-10 of the first round or top-5 available centers.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Disagree. I watched a lot of video on Kotkaniemi and he picks corners just like Zadina does. And I know Zadina very well!

Jesperi Kotkaniemi esitteli tulista laukaustaan – superlupauksen kauden viides osuma näki päivänvalon

This is my favourite goal that he scored this year, and he scored some beauties. He does two things particularly well in this clip. First, he purposefully takes the scenic route into the zone in order to become the trailer, instead of bum-rushing into the zone, head-down like, say, Gallagher would. Second, he lets the shot go from his outside foot. The puck is released from his feet, a la Auston Matthews. The goalie's no longer square to the shot, so he gets beat high glove. It's a small clip, but there are some little things done very well.