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Prospect Info: 2018 NHL Draft / Pick #9 - Vitali Kravtsov (RW) - Part III

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Traktor will play its next game tomorrow against Severstal.

Since the coaching change they got 5 out of 6 total points. Team front office mentioned that these games will be used as an evaluation for the new head coach to determine if Tertyschni will have "interim" removed from his title.

Looking at the standings, Traktor is in 10th place with 18 points after 19 games. However, they are only 3 points (and a game in hand) from the 8th place and only 7 points from the 5th place.
 
Amazing Kreiderman said:
Hmmm, I don't know man. A 22-year old in his 2nd NHL season hitting 43 points at the age of 22... We haven't had that since Petr Prucha and before that Tony Amonte. Even league-wide it's not as unimpressive as you make it out to be.

In the last 10 seasons, a total of only 18 players have reached that benchmark. So it's not as if what Buchnevich is doing is something to criticize. It's only underwhelming if your expectations are too high.

#contextmatters
Click to expand...

FYI: The list of 18 players who reached that benchmark (43+ points at age 22 or younger in the first 2 NHL seasons):

Laine
Matthews
Point
Connor
Aho
Boeser
DeBrincat
McDavid
Monahan
Kucherov
Eberle
Seguin
Grabner
Couture
Skinner
Tavares
Stamkos
Hornqvist
 
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Amazing Kreiderman said:
Hmmm, I don't know man. A 22-year old in his 2nd NHL season hitting 43 points at the age of 22... We haven't had that since Petr Prucha and before that Tony Amonte. Even league-wide it's not as unimpressive as you make it out to be.

In the last 10 seasons, a total of only 18 players have reached that benchmark. So it's not as if what Buchnevich is doing is something to criticize. It's only underwhelming if your expectations are too high.

#contextmatters
Click to expand...

18 players at 22 or 18 players at 22 who also were in their 2nd season?

Edit: Nevermind, that answers my question and that's WAY more impressive, WOW.
 
SnowblindNYR said:
18 players at 22 or 18 players at 22 who also were in their 2nd season?

Edit: Nevermind, that answers my question and that's WAY more impressive, WOW.
Click to expand...

Yeah, 18 players who fit both criteria:

- Under 23 years old
- In their first 2 NHL seasons

But hey, we can always just ignore context and say Buchnevich has been underwhelming :laugh:
 
Amazing Kreiderman said:
Yeah, 18 players who fit both criteria:

- Under 23 years old
- In their first 2 NHL seasons

But hey, we can always just ignore context and say Buchnevich has been underwhelming :laugh:
Click to expand...

Oh I see, I thought you meant 22 year olds in general. Nevermind. I think some of those guys aren't even 22 yet, haha. But yeah, to be fair some guys are younger in their 2nd season. Though, those guys are often top 5 type picks.
 
SnowblindNYR said:
Oh I see, I thought you meant 22 year olds in general. Nevermind. I think some of those guys aren't even 22 yet, haha. But yeah, to be fair some guys are younger in their 2nd season. Though, those guys are often top 5 type picks.
Click to expand...

People always bitch about Russians having to adjust to the smaller ice. But when it takes a Russian kid a year to adjust to the smaller ice and puts up 40+ points as a 22-year old, it's underwhelming. Can't win with these guys :laugh:
 
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Amazing Kreiderman said:
Yeah, 18 players who fit both criteria:

- Under 23 years old
- In their first 2 NHL seasons

But hey, we can always just ignore context and say Buchnevich has been underwhelming :laugh:
Click to expand...

How are you coming up with that list? Maybe I'm missing something in your criteria, but shouldn't RNH, Hall, Hischier all be on that list? Stepan was also under 23 and put up 45 and 51 in his first 2 years. What am I missing here?
 
GAGLine said:
How are you coming up with that list? Maybe I'm missing something in your criteria, but shouldn't RNH, Hall, Hischier all be on that list? Stepan was also under 23 and put up 45 and 51 in his first 2 years. What am I missing here?
Click to expand...

Ditto.

First guy I thought of was Schwartz. I can't see how he doesn't fit the same criteria.
 
GAGLine said:
How are you coming up with that list? Maybe I'm missing something in your criteria, but shouldn't RNH, Hall, Hischier all be on that list? Stepan was also under 23 and put up 45 and 51 in his first 2 years. What am I missing here?
Click to expand...

Ehh. I ran this at work, I'm currently on my way home and can't re-create the query but tried to and got this.

I'll get back to you haha. Looks like their query builder is a bit shaky lately
 

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I don't want to keep going on the Buchnevich thing because this is the Kravtsov thread, but I don't think it's totally unreasonable to be a bit disappointed with Buch based on these kind of lingering attitude/effort questions. Whether they're real or perceived, this is two years in a row where we've seen them. Two coaches who have dealt with them. I mean for a 22-year-old his production was fine/good, I don't question that, but he just looked like he could be...doing more. And then it was like, okay, he had issues with the coach and communication and there was a leadership void and maybe that was all a drag on the kid. But then, this year (I know it's very early), he looks kind of the same, like the effort just isn't all there, or not consistently anyway.

And before someone comes at me with the "lazy Russian" stuff, that's BS and anyone that knows me, knows that's not me or my issue with Buch. And even if I did say that he looks kind of lazy at times, it has nothing to do with his nationality. But that's beside the point--I remember watching him in KHL games and it was so impressive, because his defense was supposedly a question, but that kid would be hustling back and making all these plays, and he'd be muscling guys off the puck, and fighting in the corners. He was tenacious and 110% at all times. And now, I don't see that at all. Plenty of potentially legitimate reasons for it, but it's a little disappointing still.

So, I think being somewhat disappointed with Buchnevich is okay. It doesn't mean you think he's bad. It just means you see things that are less than encouraging, and make you wonder if he'll take the next step like I was/am hoping he does this year.
 
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This is the Kravtsov thread. Yeah, sorry for derailing this further. Let's just go back to discussing the more skilled Russian ;)
 
Amazing Kreiderman said:
FYI: The list of 18 players who reached that benchmark (43+ points at age 22 or younger in the first 2 NHL seasons):

Laine
Matthews
Point
Connor
Aho
Boeser
DeBrincat
McDavid
Monahan
Kucherov
Eberle
Seguin
Grabner
Couture
Skinner
Tavares
Stamkos
Hornqvist
Click to expand...
I’m willing to bet Buchnevich NEVER has a career like any of these guys except for maybe Grabner. Maybe!
 
nyr2k2 said:
I don't want to keep going on the Buchnevich thing because this is the Kravtsov thread, but I don't think it's totally unreasonable to be a bit disappointed with Buch based on these kind of lingering attitude/effort questions. Whether they're real or perceived, this is two years in a row where we've seen them. Two coaches who have dealt with them. I mean for a 22-year-old his production was fine/good, I don't question that, but he just looked like he could be...doing more. And then it was like, okay, he had issues with the coach and communication and there was a leadership void and maybe that was all a drag on the kid. But then, this year (I know it's very early), he looks kind of the same, like the effort just isn't all there, or not consistently anyway.

And before someone comes at me with the "lazy Russian" stuff, that's BS and anyone that knows me, knows that's not me or my issue with Buch. And even if I did say that he looks kind of lazy at times, it has nothing to do with his nationality. But that's beside the point--I remember watching him in KHL games and it was so impressive, because his defense was supposedly a question, but that kid would be hustling back and making all these plays, and he'd be muscling guys off the puck, and fighting in the corners. He was tenacious and 110% at all times. And now, I don't see that at all. Plenty of potentially legitimate reasons for it, but it's a little disappointing still.

So, I think being somewhat disappointed with Buchnevich is okay. It doesn't mean you think he's bad. It just means you see things that are less than encouraging, and make you wonder if he'll take the next step like I was/am hoping he does this year.
Click to expand...

Just as you I've been a vocal fan of Buch and I have been really disappointed with similar concerns related to his effort and engagement during games. I've seen some "symptoms" in the past but was able to rationalize them as not indicators of his future performance: a) Not learning English before coming to NA - he doesn't have aptitude for studying, b) Arrived in less than optimal physical shape - he got here right after injury and he couldn't do anything in the gym, c) invisible in the second half of last year - AV's doghouse and post concussion hesitation...

I'm really hoping that Quinn & Co. will coach it out of him because the talent is there.
 
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Konnick said:
Didn't they have a coaching change? If so this guys system sucks.
Click to expand...

Last year they had a defense first then counterattack system that helped them get into playoffs and then advance there. However the coach left for SKA and they brought Titov who implemented his go-go, offense-first system that resulted in some very lopsided losses.

The new head coach seems to be trying to go back to what worked last year.
 
nyr2k2 said:
I don't want to keep going on the Buchnevich thing because this is the Kravtsov thread, but I don't think it's totally unreasonable to be a bit disappointed with Buch based on these kind of lingering attitude/effort questions. Whether they're real or perceived, this is two years in a row where we've seen them. Two coaches who have dealt with them. I mean for a 22-year-old his production was fine/good, I don't question that, but he just looked like he could be...doing more. And then it was like, okay, he had issues with the coach and communication and there was a leadership void and maybe that was all a drag on the kid. But then, this year (I know it's very early), he looks kind of the same, like the effort just isn't all there, or not consistently anyway.

And before someone comes at me with the "lazy Russian" stuff, that's BS and anyone that knows me, knows that's not me or my issue with Buch. And even if I did say that he looks kind of lazy at times, it has nothing to do with his nationality. But that's beside the point--I remember watching him in KHL games and it was so impressive, because his defense was supposedly a question, but that kid would be hustling back and making all these plays, and he'd be muscling guys off the puck, and fighting in the corners. He was tenacious and 110% at all times. And now, I don't see that at all. Plenty of potentially legitimate reasons for it, but it's a little disappointing still.

So, I think being somewhat disappointed with Buchnevich is okay. It doesn't mean you think he's bad. It just means you see things that are less than encouraging, and make you wonder if he'll take the next step like I was/am hoping he does this year.
Click to expand...
2k2 youve been around a long time and are a very reputable poster so I for one can say i know you are not pitching the “lazy russian” theme.

I didnt read everything you wrote, but Buch does look lazy at times. The effort just isnt enough imo. And im a huge fan of the Butcher. I really think he has some great ability offensively...but that isnt enough when you are trying to break into this league AND be an impact player that can play for 8-12 years. He needs to take the next step and be better otherwise he is just going to be another Burmistrov or Yakupov who never touches the surface of his full potential. He needs to fight more, fight for the goals.
 
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Ah gotcha. This seems to be a downfall of a kid staying over (I think there's pros and cons). Being stuck with a bad coach and a system and team that isn't performing is a negative thing IMO.
 
Vitali was included in the U20 team for the Four Nations tournament in Hodonin in 2 weeks. Now I need to see if I can get tickets. If it's even open to the public. 90 minutes by train! HYPE!!!
 
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