2017 Offseason Thread 5.0 Summer Doldrums

[Brodeur]

I have NHL '95 running on my Windows 10 PC by using dosbox, and Toni Whilen's NHLINFO editor works as well.

Hrm, I haven't tried dosbox on my new Windows 10 computer yet. I might have to look that up (you may have opened up Pandora's Box for me).

Downloaded '95 and successfully started it up. That opening music still makes me smile. Grabbed the editor but didn't have the time (aka didn't want to tempt myself to stay up to 2am maniacally updating rosters) to try it yet. But my memory did get jogged and I think I tried it back in the day and didn't like the interface. I have a different editor which still works on a super old laptop that takes like 20 minutes to boot up.

 

[KingsFan7824]

That's my bad then I totally misinterpreted your post, I actually feel really bad now sorry KF gonna go pull my head out of my ass now

Though It is amazing that parts of our fanbase are coming up with these insane conspiracies over a ****ing number. I don't remember anyone batting an eye when Dean gave Gilbert 14 last year but now Luc/Blake give it to Cammy and people are having meltdowns over it

I can't wait until we can move on from this whole "but muh character" nonsense

No worries.

http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2017/08/24/daunting-drew-doughty-decision-looms-for-kings/

The Doughty questions haven't truly started yet, and I'm already tired of it. Sign him, trade him, whatever, just don't let him walk as a free agent. I saw the Cups, if he wants to go home, then go. Trade him now if that's the case. It was exhausting watching Tampa fans go through it with Stamkos, so I don't need the will he/won't he drama. Please Doughty, pick a side quickly.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I think you misunderstand. I'm not saying the Kings can't trade core players.

I'm saying that of all moves to be made, trading away the youngest of the core players does not make it a rebuild or give the core a shot in the arm.

If the Kings want to trade Doughty, Kopitar, Quick, etc. That's one thing. I may not completely agree with it. But if they want to go that route, okay. But Doughty is the youngest of the core players that the Kings have built around. Trading him away ages the core, it doesn't make a rebuild.

Just don't call it a rebuild is all I'm saying.

I think it depends on how you define rebuilding. Usually it's a start over foundationally type thing. Trading Doughty and trying to still win might fall into a retooling effort.

If they end up trading Doughty, then it's time to blow it all up as much as you can. They're stuck with Kopitar, Brown, Gaborik, and probably Quick. Everyone else can go if Doughty's gone, up to an including Toffoli and Pearson. At that point, you're building for a post-Kopitar world, and TT and TP will be in their early 30's then, if they would even still be here.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Trading Doughty would be an end to an era. It's a very similar situation to what played out with Rob Blake, except this time we won't have a Tim Leiweke or Kevin Gilmore mismanaging the team and flexing their muscles to insult a mainstay.

After trading Blake, the Kings would wait another seven years before they'd get an opportunity to draft a #1 dman like him. They couldn't acquire a player of that caliber via trade or free agency, they had to land the #2 overall pick in one of the deepest drafts in NHL history.

If they wind up trading Doughty, it will signal the end of one era and lead to a new chapter. I'm all for doing what's best for the organization, and that would be winning more Cups. They won't be achieving that goal for quite some time if they move Doughty.

 

[deeshamrock]

Trading Doughty would be an end to an era. It's a very similar situation to what played out with Rob Blake, except this time we won't have a Tim Leiweke or Kevin Gilmore mismanaging the team and flexing their muscles to insult a mainstay.

After trading Blake, the Kings would wait another seven years before they'd get an opportunity to draft a #1 dman like him. They couldn't acquire a player of that caliber via trade or free agency, they had to land the #2 overall pick in one of the deepest drafts in NHL history.

If they wind up trading Doughty, it will signal the end of one era and lead to a new chapter. I'm all for doing what's best for the organization, and that would be winning more Cups. They won't be achieving that goal for quite some time if they move Doughty.

WOuld't that depend on what the return for him was? Teams have won the cup plenty of times and they didn't have DD. I love him, and respect just how high his talent is, and will continue to be (sans Concussions or other injury) but signing him, doesn't mean the Kings will achieve a Cup either. As great as he is, it still takes a team to win.
If he signs in LA, in order to compete with the other rising teams in the division and conference, they'd have to make some significance trades and get their core younger.

 

[Reaper45]

You trade everyone older than Doughty before moving him, including Kopitar. I still believe you buyout Gaborik and move Martinez/Muzzin and Carter for young cost controlled pieces or piece and a pick and use that flexibility to resign Doughty. Not a full rebuild, but reload on the fly.

 

[Little Psycho]

You trade everyone older than Doughty before moving him, including Kopitar. I still believe you buyout Gaborik and move Martinez/Muzzin and Carter for young cost controlled pieces or piece and a pick and use that flexibility to resign Doughty. Not a full rebuild, but reload on the fly.

Yup, this is the way it should be done. Not resigning Doughty will be one of the biggest mistakes for this franchise, you can't let him go.

 

[johnjm22]

The Kings don't get to choose whether or not Doughty re-signs. It's Drew's choice.

If he wants to stay here then great re-sign him.

If he plans on leaving trade him ASAP.

The real problem is Doughty may not know what he wants to do. That puts us in a real limbo.

 

[USE Fi]

Last star player that left as a free agent to new team?

 

[USE Fi]

Hearing it's 50/50 between #NJDevils and #Lakings for @DU_Hockey free agent Will Butcher

https://twitter.com/andystrickland/status/901156169653391361

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Hearing it's 50/50 between #NJDevils and #Lakings for @DU_Hockey free agent Will Butcher

https://twitter.com/andystrickland/status/901156169653391361

That would be a huge get. On the undersized side, but he's a great skater who can distribute the puck quickly.

 

[KingsFan7824]

You trade everyone older than Doughty before moving him, including Kopitar.

Assuming you can trade Kopitar, that would be the way to go. How many teams can add $10m in cap space, and give you what you want in return though? Not that losing a #1C is going to be any easier to replace than a #1D.

Hearing it's 50/50 between #NJDevils and #Lakings for @DU_Hockey free agent Will Butcher

https://twitter.com/andystrickland/status/901156169653391361

Everything old is new again. It's the rubber match. They got Kovalchuk, the Kings got the Cup. Who will pop the Butcher?

 

[deeshamrock]

That would be a huge get. On the undersized side, but he's a great skater who can distribute the puck quickly.

It would be a great add. Devils and Kings weren't in any of the stuff I read in the last couple weeks. The Sabres seemed to be a frontrunner. However, he did visit the Devils today, per NJ.com.

Mike Chambers
✔
@MikeChambers

UFA D Will Butcher is traveling to New Jersey today to meet w #Devils & #LAKings among top choices, I learned at @DU_Hockey pro camp this AM
1:54 PM - Aug 25, 2017

and he was in LA, according to the Mayor


he Mayor John Hoven‏ @mayorNHL 2h2 hours ago

Re: Kings pursuit of college free agent Will Butcher - dman visited LA, met w/mgmt. No further mtgs scheduled b4 decision, likely this wkend



Of the list of 10 teams, he pared it down to a few finalists. Yesterday (below) his agent mentioned 2, the Knights and Sabres, with 2 more(finalists) teams to visit this week before going home Sat. He'll make his decision on Sunday.


https://www.nhl.com/news/hobey-baker-winner-will-butcher-to-pick-nhl-team-sunday/c-290755970

From his agent:

"He wants to play for team that really understands and believes in him as a player and what he can bring to an organization, so it's weeding out the ones who just kind of want good players since every team needs good players," Bartlett said. "The second part is which team has the opportunity and resources to give him the best chance to be a longtime professional player. We haven't been demanding he make the team right out of [training] camp or have a roster spot. It's about the process over the next couple of years."

What say you DB?

Dennis Bernstein‏ @DennisTFP

Dennis Bernstein Retweeted Chad DeDominicis

IMO Butcher isn't top 4D in LA, think would be challenged to make roster. That said, given new offensive scheme adding mobile D only helps

 

[kingsholygrail]

He's not going to be a King. No room for him.

 

[deeshamrock]

He's not going to be a King. No room for him.

Well, the Kings front office must think so or they wouldn't have reached out to him and interviewed him. And now the Kings are on the small list of finalists.

 

[KINGS17]

I think you misunderstand. I'm not saying the Kings can't trade core players.

I'm saying that of all moves to be made, trading away the youngest of the core players does not make it a rebuild or give the core a shot in the arm.

If the Kings want to trade Doughty, Kopitar, Quick, etc. That's one thing. I may not completely agree with it. But if they want to go that route, okay. But Doughty is the youngest of the core players that the Kings have built around. Trading him away ages the core, it doesn't make a rebuild.

Just don't call it a rebuild is all I'm saying.

I think the Kings have already missed out on trading Kopitar or Quick for anything of real value. If they can't contend with this roster, trading Doughty would help kick start a better roster down the line.

To me, trading Doughty would signal a rebuild as I suspect the Kings would use the new CBA (likely after a lockout) to take care of some of the other roster issues.

Who knows, maybe they can still rebuild around Doughty if a new CBA helps their cap situation. They need to work with Doughty to figure this out, and the sooner the better.

 

[Sol]

He's not going to be a King. No room for him.

Lol how does that even make sense since the Kings have been in contact

 

[bob77]

The Kings don't get to choose whether or not Doughty re-signs. It's Drew's choice.

If he wants to stay here then great re-sign him.

If he plans on leaving trade him ASAP.

The real problem is Doughty may not know what he wants to do. That puts us in a real limbo.

I agree with your point. I think the money involved will be about the same offered from a few different places. Drew will pick a place. You can't help but think it will relate to winning another cup, so the current Kings will have to impress him for him to stay.

 

[The Tikkanen]

He's not going to be a King. No room for him.

They have 6 mil in cap space, how do they not have room for him? If the Kings could get Butcher this dreary offseason would get a lot better quickly.

 

[King'sPawn]

I think the Kings have already missed out on trading Kopitar or Quick for anything of real value. If they can't contend with this roster, trading Doughty would help kick start a better roster down the line.

To me, trading Doughty would signal a rebuild as I suspect the Kings would use the new CBA (likely after a lockout) to take care of some of the other roster issues.

Who knows, maybe they can still rebuild around Doughty if a new CBA helps their cap situation. They need to work with Doughty to figure this out, and the sooner the better.

Fair points.

I guess I just think overall, the Kings can still contend with the current core. I don't want to derail the discussion, since you and I clearly disagree with this.

And while the Kings would definitely get younger by trading Doughty, It's tenuous on whether or not the piece(s) they get back are pieces they can build around, which is why I don't think getting young players while depending on Quick, Carter, Kopitar can be called a rebuild.

As stated above, though, maybe I'm arguing semantics. I just get annoyed that people conflate getting younger with rebuilding.

 

[johnjm22]

If Doughty played for the Leafs he would be living under a microscope. You have to wonder if he actually likes that idea.

Also, I may be biased, but living in Hermosa Beach in L.A. is way better than living in any place in Toronto.

A lot of times these decisions actually come down to what the wife wants.

 

[bob77]

The Butcher thing is like the Mike Reilly thing all over again. You really can't guarantee the kid anything but a shot. Part of his thinking should be if he'd have a chance to showcase his skills, so this includes Ontario for now also.

 

[bob77]

If Doughty played for the Leafs he would be living under a microscope. You have to wonder if he actually likes that idea.

Also, I may be biased, but living in Hermosa Beach in L.A. is way better than living in any place in Toronto.

A lot of times these decisions actually come down to what the wife wants.

Some see a microscope. Others see the bright lights of NHL stardom in a crazed hockey town. If Drew win a cup in Toronto he would be immortal.

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

I didn't even know we were in on Butcher

 

[Sol]

You would be lucky if someone would take Quick without the Kings getting the shaft.