World Cup: 2016 World Cup — Team Europe

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Corax

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May 1, 2007
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Actually is probably a waste of time to arguing with you but...Marc Streit is SWISS! and he has all the rights to complain about this format. For the younger Swiss players, like Josi - Niederreiter-Hiller , they will join the team if they receive an inventation. If not, they will crack under Bettmann's pressure. These guys are not really "character heads" anyways, so solidarity means not to much to them.

Streit is another case. As Captain of the Swiss National Team he has some solidarity to his National Team Teammates. I would not be surprised if he will refuse to join Team "Europe". He has, comparing to the younger guys, nothing to loose.

Ok, Swiss makes more sense, but having teams that come to lose all games... this is different format. No IIHF where if lucky and the group is ok, you have some teams to beat and if lucky you need to win 2 times against good team. QF and SF. Here there is no team to beat fro Swiss or Slovakia. Oooh, sorry, it can happen :) So I will follow this tournament to wait for that day. Or?
 

xxxx

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Sep 20, 2012
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Before you laugh, read about the recent Šatan vs. Chára feud. I've just mentioned it above. The two weren't on speaking terms for something like 2 years. You, obviously, have never heard about it. :shakehead

it's fine, I believe you, but that doesn't mean they won't play for this team.


Yeah, officially, perhaps. There may be a spate of sudden "injuries" just before the event. There are ways of avoiding this travesty if it can't be done freely and openly.
Well, I can't wait for it.
 
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Jakk123

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May 6, 2014
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If that were so, and political correctness :shakehead would turn out to be the main criterion for selecting the roster, that would give the perfect excuse to Šatan to resign his GM post well ahead of the event, which would be the ideal scenario to me.

Slovaks should just stay away completely from this travesty, in any shape or form. This is not how you treat the nation of hockey World Champions, and it's not like that was 100 years ago – some players from that 2002 gold team are still active players today, like Nagy, who could certainly be valuable even on a Slovakia team composed predominantly of current NHL-ers.

I don't think the current format is ideal, but no way is Slovak hockey in a position to feel touched by the fact that it is excluded. 2002 is history. Our hockey is a total mess now, a couple of solid NHL players won't change that.
 

Faterson

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I don't think the current format is ideal, but no way is Slovak hockey in a position to feel touched by the fact that it is excluded. 2002 is history. Our hockey is a total mess now, a couple of solid NHL players won't change that.

No, you're just happy to be and stay mediocre, that's all. :help: I remember that this is exactly what people were saying about Slovak hockey in the late 1990s, just before Slovakia started winning all those medals, including gold in 2002. People like you kept saying: "We're a weak team, we can't possibly ever compete with Czechs, we should be happy just to play in the top Worlds category, blah, blah, blah, the golden times of Czechoslovakia are over forever and can never be brought back, blah, blah, blah." The typical defeatist Slovak mentality. :shakehead

It took someone with a winning mentality, like Peter Šťastný (winning only because he spent decades of his life living and playing in Canada – if he had stayed in Slovakia, he would have ended up being just such a defeatist like virtually all Slovaks), to say it clearly: "Slovakia can and should compete for medals, and it can even win gold." And a few years later, that's exactly what happened.

Again, it's inexcusable to exclude 2002 World Champions from a so-called World Cup of hockey, without even giving them a chance to qualify for the event. They should at least have given both Slovakia and Switzerland, as well as other hockey nations, the opportunity and motivation to join the tourney. That would have been the decent thing to do. They could have used the upcoming World Championships tourney in Russia as a World Cup qualifier, saying that whichever two teams outside of the top 6 nations come up at #7 and #8 in that event, will get the invitation to play at the World Cup. Don't give me those idiotic excuses about "no time for qualifying". :rant: There is all the time in the world, and no extra qualifiers are needed, because the World Championships in Russia can serve as a perfectly legitimate qualifying tourney – after all, the Worlds tourneys have always also served as Olympic qualifiers, with no one complaining about it! So don't give us that bull**** about "no time for qualifiers". :rant:

So, like someone else in this thread, I'll be rooting for a Slovakia vs. Switzerland final at the upcoming World Championships in Russia, and then I'll be rooting for a united and firm boycott of the Mickey Mouse Cup by all Slovak & Swiss players in September. :nod:
 
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xxxx

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Sep 20, 2012
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So, like someone else in this thread, I'll be rooting for a Slovakia vs. Switzerland final at the upcoming World Championships in Russia, and then I'll be rooting for a united and firm boycott of the Mickey Mouse Cup by all Slovak & Swiss players in September. :nod:

I don't want to disappoint you, but...

Switzerland at the World Championships, since 2007:

2007 - made the QF, lost 1-5 to Canada
2008 - made the QF, lost 0-6 to Russia
2009 - didn't make the QF
2010 - made the QF, lost 0-1 to Germany
2011 - didn't make the QF
2012 - didn't make the QF
2013 - finished 2nd
2014 - didn't make the QF
2015 - made the QF, lost 1-3 to the US

Slovakia at the World Championships, since 2007:

2007 - made the QF, lost 4-7 to Sweden
2008 - didn't make the QF
2009 - didn't make the QF
2010 - didn't make the QF
2011 - didn't make the QF
2012 - finished 2nd
2013 - made the QF, lost to Finland 3-4
2014 - didn't make the QF
2015 - didn't make the QF
 
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Corax

Registered User
May 1, 2007
287
7
No, you're just happy to be and stay mediocre, that's all. :help: I remember that this is exactly what people were saying about Slovak hockey in the late 1990s, just before Slovakia started winning all those medals, including gold in 2002. People like you kept saying: "We're a weak team, we can't possibly ever compete with Czechs, we should be happy just to play in the top Worlds category, blah, blah, blah, the golden times of Czechoslovakia are over forever and can never be brought back, blah, blah, blah." The typical defeatist Slovak mentality. :shakehead

It took someone with a winning mentality, like Peter Šťastný (winning only because he spent decades of his life living and playing in Canada – if he had stayed in Slovakia, he would have ended up being just such a defeatist like virtually all Slovaks), to say it clearly: "Slovakia can and should compete for medals, and it can even win gold." And a few years later, that's exactly what happened.

Again, it's inexcusable to exclude 2002 World Champions from a so-called World Cup of hockey, without even giving them a chance to qualify for the event. They should at least have given both Slovakia and Switzerland, as well as other hockey nations, the opportunity and motivation to join the tourney. That would have been the decent thing to do. They could have used the upcoming World Championships tourney in Russia as a World Cup qualifier, saying that whichever two teams outside of the top 6 nations come up at #7 and #8 in that event, will get the invitation to play at the World Cup. Don't give me those idiotic excuses about "no time for qualifying". :rant: There is all the time in the world, and no extra qualifiers are needed, because the World Championships in Russia can serve as a perfectly legitimate qualifying tourney – after all, the Worlds tourneys have always also served as Olympic qualifiers, with no one complaining about it! So don't give us that bull**** about "no time for qualifiers". :rant:

So, like someone else in this thread, I'll be rooting for a Slovakia vs. Switzerland final at the upcoming World Championships in Russia, and then I'll be rooting for a united and firm boycott of the Mickey Mouse Cup by all Slovak & Swiss players in September. :nod:
Would you dare to tell me the year of your birth? You are are writing a Hollywood-like history. In 90's we were hockey power house and we won gold as all NHL stars came in for Worlds. We were far the best team there. We crapped previous Olympics as NHL players were not allowed to play qualifiers, and without them we were exactly what we are thin.

Peter Stastny? Wtf? Everyone knew we were among the best at that time. We sent our B-team to Worlds in C category and came out winning all games as well as in B.

Over all score was 103:18 for both tournaments.

At that time we were offensive force, Handzus was not slow and played with Bartecko in Blues, Stumpel was also young. We were decent at center. And forgot Hlinka, the real 3rd line center, grinder.

Bondra, Palffy, Satan, Nagy, Orszagh? Look at Russian roster from that finals, few names that were somehow known.

I think you should wake up from your dream? Heart is fine, but someone has to hit the net as well.
 

jeru

Registered User
Sep 18, 2015
11
0
Zurich
I don't want to disappoint you, but...

i don't want to disappoint either, but why not taking the results inclusive the NHL Players involved?

Like the Olympic Games?

2006:
SWI - FIN 0:5
SWI - CZE 3:2
SWI - CAN 2:0
SWI - GER 2:2
SWI - ITA 3:3
SWI - SWE 2:6

Final Rank 6th (btw, CAN was 7th)

2010:
SWI - USA 1:3
SWI - CAN 2:3 SO (remember that Game?)
SWI - NOR 5:4 OT
SWI - BEL 3:2
SWI - USA 0:2

Final Rank 8th

2014:
SWI - LAT 1:0
SWI -SWE 0:1
SWI - CZE 1:0
SWI - LAT 1:3

Final Rank 9th
 
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jeru

Registered User
Sep 18, 2015
11
0
Zurich
Slovakia

same for Slovakia

2006
SLV - RUS 5:3
SLV - LAT 6:3
SLV - USA 2:1
SLV - KAZ 2;1
SLV - SWE 3:0
SLV - CZE 1:3

2010
SLV - CZE 1:3
SLV - RUS 2:1 SO
SLV - LAT 6:0
SLV - NOR4:3
SLV - SWE 4:3
SLV - CAN 2:3
SLV - FIN 2:5

2014
SLV - USA 1:7
SLV - SLO 1:3
SLV - RUS 0:1
SLV - USA 1:5
 

xxxx

Registered User
Sep 20, 2012
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bringing Slovakian results from 2006 or 2010 is laughable, let alone 2002. Why? Because the teams back then were really strong. Even 2010 was still good. With players like Satan, Handzus, Stumpel, Zednik, Demitra, Palffy (even though not as good, but still on the team), prime Visnovsky, Chara, Halak, Gaborik, Hossa...totally different story today.
 

Jakk123

Registered User
May 6, 2014
1,279
111
Bratislava
No, you're just happy to be and stay mediocre, that's all. :help: I remember that this is exactly what people were saying about Slovak hockey in the late 1990s, just before Slovakia started winning all those medals, including gold in 2002. People like you kept saying: "We're a weak team, we can't possibly ever compete with Czechs, we should be happy just to play in the top Worlds category, blah, blah, blah, the golden times of Czechoslovakia are over forever and can never be brought back, blah, blah, blah." The typical defeatist Slovak mentality. :shakehead

It took someone with a winning mentality, like Peter Šťastný (winning only because he spent decades of his life living and playing in Canada – if he had stayed in Slovakia, he would have ended up being just such a defeatist like virtually all Slovaks), to say it clearly: "Slovakia can and should compete for medals, and it can even win gold." And a few years later, that's exactly what happened.

Again, it's inexcusable to exclude 2002 World Champions from a so-called World Cup of hockey, without even giving them a chance to qualify for the event. They should at least have given both Slovakia and Switzerland, as well as other hockey nations, the opportunity and motivation to join the tourney. That would have been the decent thing to do. They could have used the upcoming World Championships tourney in Russia as a World Cup qualifier, saying that whichever two teams outside of the top 6 nations come up at #7 and #8 in that event, will get the invitation to play at the World Cup. Don't give me those idiotic excuses about "no time for qualifying". :rant: There is all the time in the world, and no extra qualifiers are needed, because the World Championships in Russia can serve as a perfectly legitimate qualifying tourney – after all, the Worlds tourneys have always also served as Olympic qualifiers, with no one complaining about it! So don't give us that bull**** about "no time for qualifiers". :rant:

So, like someone else in this thread, I'll be rooting for a Slovakia vs. Switzerland final at the upcoming World Championships in Russia, and then I'll be rooting for a united and firm boycott of the Mickey Mouse Cup by all Slovak & Swiss players in September. :nod:

You are really getting ridiculous, and STOP telling me that I like to be mediocre. Are you blind or what? Our 16, 17, 18, 20 teams are constantly getting destroyed by every single top 6 nation. Our league is just a joke. Watching our senior team play is a pain. The only NHL star calibre player we have is Hossa, and he is getting old. You could count our solid player in Europe using one hand. It really pisses me off, when I follow every single match of our national teams, mostly seeing us getting destroyed, and someone like you labels me as a "medicore wannabe". I don't want us to be mediocre but unfortunately we ARE.

And also, did you just seriously compare our current situation to the situation after the dissolution of Czechoslovakia? You just can't be serious with that one, no way.
It's not 2002, wake up and stop telling me that I want to be mediocre, I f**king hate this kind of people.

I am not saying we shouln't be there if it is supposed to be a top8 tourney, but what the hell does the fact that we won the 2002 WC (not even a best on best tourney) have to do with it?

Bottom line, if you seriously think that we can compete for medals at a best on best tourney with our current players, you are just wrong.


To True Hockey Fan above me: Exactly, someone should explain this to Faterson. I am tired of it.
 

Elvs

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Jul 3, 2006
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bringing Slovakian results from 2006 or 2010 is laughable, let alone 2002. Why? Because the teams back then were really strong. Even 2010 was still good. With players like Satan, Handzus, Stumpel, Zednik, Demitra, Palffy (even though not as good, but still on the team), prime Visnovsky, Chara, Halak, Gaborik, Hossa...totally different story today.

Zednik, Palffy, Satan and Stumpel were barely NHL calibre players in 2010. Anyway, no one is saying Slovakia is still as good as they were 10-15 years ago, or even five years ago. I just think it's wrong to exclude a nation because they got worse on paper. On ice performance it what should matter, and Slovakia have two medals from the WC and WHJC in the last three years, showing that they are still a relevant hockey country.

Yes the world championship isn't on par with the world cup yada yada... But people, mostly north americans, act as if a team full of NHL stars would skate circles around a team that consists of 50% NHL players and 50% european league players.
 
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jeru

Registered User
Sep 18, 2015
11
0
Zurich
bringing Slovakian results from 2006 or 2010 is laughable, let alone 2002. Why?

bcs you brought the results up from 2007 - that's all. Sincerly, we could go back to whatever year. Maybe it's easier if you tell me, what exactly your problem is to bring the 7th & 8th ranked teams into this tournament instead of two gimmick teams?

my goal was to show you that these 2 countries are able to compete with the top 6 nations.
 

FiLe

Mr. Know-It-Nothing
Oct 9, 2009
7,030
1,418
2006:

SWI - SWE 6:2
I think you need to swap the numbers here.

But people, mostly north americans, act as if a team full of NHL stars would skate circles around a team that consists of 50% NHL players and 50% european league players.
We even have a recent example. Didn't USA do exactly that in the Sochi bronze game...
 

Elvs

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Jul 3, 2006
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I think you need to swap the numbers here.

We even have a recent example. Didn't USA do exactly that in the Sochi bronze game...

One game. Good sample size you have there. Not the bronze game though, lol.
 

FiLe

Mr. Know-It-Nothing
Oct 9, 2009
7,030
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One game. Good sample size you have there. Not the bronze game though, lol.
For the record, I was being snarky there. As it indeed was the 50-50 NHL/Euro split Finland that skated circles around the full-NHL US of A.

Of course, you could extend the sample size to the entire tournament, but I bet the NA apologists would now tell us it doesn't count - because Finland beating the odds is nothing new.
 

Doshell Propivo

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Dec 5, 2005
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I hear they will have advertising on jerseys at this tournament. I think I found the sponsor of the Euro All star team.

41234L.jpg
 

xxxx

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Sep 20, 2012
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bcs you brought the results up from 2007 - that's all. Sincerly, we could go back to whatever year.

The reason I brought that up is to show that missing the playoffs for Switzerland and Slovakia is not just about last few tournaments.

Maybe it's easier if you tell me, what exactly your problem is to bring the 7th & 8th ranked teams into this tournament instead of two gimmick teams?

my goal was to show you that these 2 countries are able to compete with the top 6 nations.

I don't have a problem with it. Maybe I didn't make the best statement above, and didn't express my opinion the right way. I've always said that I would like to have them at this tournament (or any two nations winning the qualification or whatever). But, at the same time, this new format looks to be fun to me and an interesting thing.
 

Elvs

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Jul 3, 2006
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For the record, I was being snarky there. As it indeed was the 50-50 NHL/Euro split Finland that skated circles around the full-NHL US of A.

Of course, you could extend the sample size to the entire tournament, but I bet the NA apologists would now tell us it doesn't count - because Finland beating the odds is nothing new.

Oops sorry, I thought you were talking about USA's 7-1 victory over Slovakia in Sochi. :)
 

torero

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Oct 5, 2007
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To tell you the truth, i was hurt by these Anglo-saxon setting the rules and not respecting my nation as a real nation.

So lets move up the sleeves, spit in the hands, and all "small ****y european nations" get together and kick some ass on the rink.

Let's show them who we are.
 

Corax

Registered User
May 1, 2007
287
7
To tell you the truth, i was hurt by these Anglo-saxon setting the rules and not respecting my nation as a real nation.

So lets move up the sleeves, spit in the hands, and all "small ****y european nations" get together and kick some ass on the rink.

Let's show them who we are.
Wouldn't it be great to kick some Canadian ass. I wish they would win it. That would make my day. :nod:

And the more I read how they get trashed, the more I want to see them win :)
 

Canuckistani

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Mar 15, 2014
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Toronto
The whole rationale for this mickey mouse frankenstein of a team (and the U23s) is that it will produce more equal competition and do away with the blowouts that Slovakia and Switzerland are allegedly so prone to. But are they really so much more likely to be blown out?

In the past 10 years there have been 13 major events at the senior level (10 WHC, 2 Olympics).

If we define a blowout as a loss by four goals or more, then the top eight nations have suffered the following number of blowouts over the last decade:

Switzerland 10, USA 7, Finland 6, Slovakia 5, Russia 4, Sweden 4, Czech Rep 4, Canada 1

So Switzerland (only recently establishing itself in the top 8) suffers the most, while the US and Finland are more likely to be get crushed than the Slovaks are.

Hell, even if we reduce the sample size to only the past three years (to look only at the most recent and relevant performances) you end up with:

Switzerland 3, USA 3, Russia 2, Slovakia 1, Finland 1, Canada/Czech/Sweden 0

So if we're worried about blowout games then why not ban USA and Russia instead of Switzerland and Slovakia?
 

jcbio11

Registered User
Aug 17, 2008
2,846
538
Bratislava
I don't think the current format is ideal, but no way is Slovak hockey in a position to feel touched by the fact that it is excluded. 2002 is history. Our hockey is a total mess now, a couple of solid NHL players won't change that.

Chara, Hossa, Gaborik, Tatar, Halak, Dano, Sekera etc. How is that a couple?
 

Corax

Registered User
May 1, 2007
287
7
Chara, Hossa, Gaborik, Tatar, Halak, Dano, Sekera etc. How is that a couple?

what about the holes on 3rd and 4th line? We ask other team not to send their top lines to match them? :)

Who is the 1st line center? And Second? Dano is listed as C but plays as RW.
So no centers, and wings so so....you could have Jurco on 3rd and Panik...but centers are the brain...we have Surovy that could play 3rd and Handzus maybe 4th and PK.


This will be fun...could be a great team
 

GordonGraham

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Sep 12, 2009
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Tentative plan by the way is for Team Europe and North America Youngstars to hold World Cup camp in Quebec City and Montreal next Sept
 
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