World Cup: 2016 World Cup — Team Europe

[Hemsky001]

I hope Kopitar boycotts. I would feel 0 pride if this team won anything.

Have no idea what you're complaining about. Slovenia wouldn't be there anyway.. so?

 

[kabidjan18]

I think the general misconception on this board or at least it seems like it is that the All-star teams are here to stay. While the idea is ridiculous and will probably tank sales and interest in large markets like Germany, France, Slovakia, Switzerland, and so forth, it's obviously not a permanent idea as expressed by the Bettman, but a response to the lack of time to hold a qualification tournament.
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=750156
This makes perfect sense. The Olympic qualification tournament is in 2016, 18 months in advance of the Olympics. There are not 18 months left to this World Cup of Hockey, and even if there were the pain of planning logistics for a new tournament would make it difficult if possible. Some have said well why not just give it to Slovakia and Switzerland on the basis of IIHF rankings. I fail to see why a tournament that has little to do with the IIHF would use the IIHF's rankings, which unlike FIFA's well-calculated and algorithmic rankings, often seem like random numbers drawn out of a hat. Teams like Latvia, which beat Switzerland in the Olympics and won the series in terms of points have just as much a claim that they deserve a chance to be in the tournament as much as Switzerland or Slovakia. Thus, in an attempt not to upset some countries, the NHL has upset pretty much all countries outside of Canada. This tournament will not be extremely relevant in 2016 because of the controversy that surrounds it but hopefully by 2020 there is a solid format for qualifying preferably more that 8 teams (the FIFA World Cup has 32 teams, 8 groups) and people can enjoy a large international tournament every 2 years.

 

[FiLe]

I think the general misconception on this board or at least it seems like it is that the All-star teams are here to stay. While the idea is ridiculous and will probably tank sales and interest in large markets like Germany, France, Slovakia, Switzerland, and so forth, it's obviously not a permanent idea as expressed by the Bettman, but a response to the lack of time to hold a qualification tournament.

As it's been pointed out before, that's still no excuse to simply inviting two more national teams this time around. It's an invitational tournament after all so they don't really have to consider who "deserves" to be there. Just invite the ones you think can put together the best squads.

You're absolutely correct when you claim that the NHL does not have to adhere to IIHF's rankings. Although I disagree about the randomness of the metric behind them - they're rather clear and logical. The only issue might be that they put plenty of weight on the WHCs, which is not considered a very prestigious tournament in North America. But that's actually the North Americans' problem, not the IIHF's.

Also, there's no official agreement in place about this format being a one-time thing. You have to be rather blue-eyed to let the reassurances of the very people who came up with this brainfart in the first place to placate you. Only way to be certain is for this to blow up in their faces. If it generates enough money despite all the discord, you could bet money that they will at the very least consider a repeat.

 

[Faterson]

"Lack of time for qualifying tourney" is the stupidest excuse ever. You refuse to accept IIHF rankings, but base your absurd assertion about "lack of time" on the Olympic tournament, an IIHF event? Looks like you follow IIHF rules when it suits you, and ignore IIHF rules, also when it suits you. Completely randomized thinking. Of course there is plenty of time to hold even a series of qualifying tourneys. It's just that they don't want those non-top 6 teams to participate, period. So they give us this bullcrap about "lack of time", as if that could deceive anyone. This year's and/or the following World Championships could have excellently served as World Cup qualifying tourneys, among many other opportunities.

 

[llwyd]

I always smile when my eye catches the title of this thread - it reads like "World Cup: Team Performing Dwarfs" or "World Cup: Team Left Handed Ontarians". This will be a fun all star tournament - will they have individual skills competitions? Maybe you could award points for those, or have, say, relay competitions between teams instead of shoot-outs etc. Why the hell not...

 

[Arrhizal]

Have no idea what you're complaining about. Slovenia wouldn't be there anyway.. so?

So why is he in every damn fantasy lineup since the start of the thread?

 

[QnebO]

Have no idea what you're complaining about. Slovenia wouldn't be there anyway.. so?

I guess he cares about justice. Taking two fantasy teams over 7th and 8th best national teams isn't justice.

 

[ForumNamePending]

It's the NHL(PA)'s tournament and they can run it how they want, but ya... IMHO the two most common reasons given for/by the NHL(PA) for going in the direction they did don't hold up well to scrutiny.

1) No time for a qualifying tournament - Since when did the NHL's 'World' Cup (or the CC before that) have qualifying? How come the lack of qualifying in previous tournaments didn't result in Team Young Gunz and Team Miscellaneous?

2) Want to avoid blowout games - The NHL has already sort of undermined their own argument by saying this format might only be a one time thing but lets look at the whole blowout thing anyway... If we set the threshold for a blowout as a game with a differential of 4 goals then over the past decade/last three 'best vs best' tournaments Switzerland, with 2 (none since '06), has as many blowout loses as Russia, and Slovakia, with 1 lopsided lose, has as many as the Czech Rep, Finland, Sweden and the US. Even when you add in the 'minnows' beyond Slovakia and Switzerland you are considerable more likely to see a relatively close game than you are a blowout during that same time period.

I think it is obvious the reason why the NHL(PA) did what they did. There are only 6 nations that can scrape together 25 players under NHL contract so anything beyond that and other leagues/feds would have to become involved so some level of cooperation between the NHL and other parties would have to take place. I guess they could have just limited to those 6 countries but the two 'all-star' teams allow them to shoehorn in (market) 50 additional NHLers who otherwise wouldn't be there. In the past this didn't seem to be a problem as Germany had barely any NHLers and most of the other European countries had at least a few non-NHLers on the roster, but the NHL(PA) has clearly had a change in heart.

Finally, given how (not) well the tournament has been managed up to this point I think I will take a 'believe it when I see it' approach in regards to teams in the future being given the opportunity to qualify. Even if a qualifying tournament is established in the future, based on reports regarding eligibility, things really don't sound all that much better.

 

[Uncle Rotter]

The qualifying tournament for the Olympics is September 1-4 for all teams not automatically qualified. This means that players like Anze Kopitar, Mats Zuccarello, Thomas Vanek, Frans Nielsen, and Zemgus Girgensons among others will likely be attending to national duties. Participating in two tournaments right before the start of the regular season would be both an injury hazard and pose the issue of fatigue and would likely outweight a couple thousand dollars to represent "rest of Europe."

This is the point people should be paying attention to. So basically, the only countries able to contribute NHL players to this team would be Switzerland and Slovakia. How ironic.

 

[Nakawick]

I just hope that Finland aint claiming the gold in this tournament. It will be so fudging anticlamatic.

Finland will win bronze

I don't like the set up either. Just have a real world cup of 12 teams or the top 8 teams in the world rankings.

 

[Faterson]

By the way, the World Championships beginning this Friday in Czech Republic do serve (along with other recent top events) as the Olympic qualifying tourney for 2018 in Korea. In the same way, of course, the World Championships (this year's, next year's, whatever...) could have served as World Cup qualifiers, if that wasn't just a crappy excuse that has nothing to do with real reasons.

Based on the IIHF ranking following this year's World Championships, the top 8 teams will be automatically qualified for the 2018 Olympics. Currently, Switzerland is ranked #7, Slovakia is #8, and Latvia is #9, but this may well change over the next few weeks. If Slovakia or Switzerland have a disastrous tourney now, they might fall out of the top 8, which would require them, as well, to play in that additional Olympic qualifying tourney in 2016.

 

[Theokritos]

That's actually something that could end up happening if the NHL players decide to play in the Olympics (which is likely considering the amount of money the IIHF is willing to pour in to ensure this). The qualifying tournament for the Olympics is September 1-4 for all teams not automatically qualified. This means that players like Anze Kopitar, Mats Zuccarello, Thomas Vanek, Frans Nielsen, and Zemgus Girgensons among others will likely be attending to national duties. Participating in two tournaments right before the start of the regular season would be both an injury hazard and pose the issue of fatigue and would likely outweight a couple thousand dollars to represent "rest of Europe."

That either means the NHL is determined not to take part in the Olympics or the competence level that went into planning of the "World Cup" is even more laughable than we've already learned.

 

[cutchemist42]

Yeah I really dont buy the NHL or the NHLPA's excuses concerning the two gimmick teams. I mean, whne you have Bettman saying they want competitive games, I actually think a motivated Swiss/Slovak team puts on a better show than randon Young Gunz for sure.

If you believe its truly a one-off, I really dont see why a declaration of "next two WHCs determine the last 2 teams" would not have worked. That way, the countries at least understand the crieteria fairly ahead of time.

 

[Riddum]

This is the NHL World Cup isn't it? I think it would become too complicated if they started using players from different leagues around the world.

So the guys mad about their Countries not being represented really shouldn't be mad.

 

[FiLe]

This is the NHL World Cup isn't it? I think it would become too complicated if they started using players from different leagues around the world.

There's been nothing bloody complicated about it in 2004, 1996, or earlier years when the tournament still was called Canada Cup. And there's actually nothing complicated about it this time around either, since the "proper" national teams participating are allowed to use players from other leagues. Matter of fact, countries like Russia, Finland and Czech Republic could fully build their squads using euro players only if they so desired. Of course they won't, but the option is there all right.

So nope, sorry, not an excuse. The countries who are supposed to have representation in this mickey mouse squad have every right to be mad.

 

[Canuckistani]

Yeah I really dont buy the NHL or the NHLPA's excuses concerning the two gimmick teams. I mean, whne you have Bettman saying they want competitive games, I actually think a motivated Swiss/Slovak team puts on a better show than randon Young Gunz for sure.

If you believe its truly a one-off, I really dont see why a declaration of "next two WHCs determine the last 2 teams" would not have worked. That way, the countries at least understand the crieteria fairly ahead of time.

The NHL simply wanted to get as many of their league's stars into the event no matter how they did it.

All the nonsense about "competitive games" and "no time for qualifying" are just lies, and poor ones at that.

There was no qualifying in 1996 or 2004, and if star players made for competative games then the NHL All-star game would provide the greatest hockey of the year.

 

[Risingwind]

But why not just ice two or three Team Canadas then? Or have a competition between the provinces of Canada? Or maybe Quebec could have its own team?

That was my first reaction as well. Then I thought of another way to make it even more insulting to every player and viewer, they could just adopt the NHL structure and make it a four team tournament: Team Central, Team Pacific, Team Atlantic, Team Metropolitan. Instant NHL All-Star teams that include only the best of the best and will be the pinnacle of ice hockey in both history and the future.

 

[admire]

The thing I understand the least about this, is how short sighted it is from the NHL point of view. I get that it's a short term money maker but it will still be pretty limited in the overall picture..and this does absolutely nothing to make the nhl brand grow in the rest of the world. The NFL and the NBA to a lesser extend have done great in expanding their product and brand while the nhl seems to almost go out of their way to piss off International fans...and that without even gaining that much from the north american fan base in return...Its not like the Americans and Canadians are freaking out with utter excitement at this "world cup".

The attitude and arrogance in terms of Olympic participation does not help either.


enjoyed this article on the subject
http://dkonpittsburghsports.com/2015/01/24/column-nhl-better-not-bow-olympics/

First: I feel insulted as a Slovak hockey fan.
Second: The Slovak ice-hockey association should officialy prostest this tournament or something like that.
Third and mostly: I do believe, nonono, I do know, that the most of eligible slovak players - probably all of them - will boycott this tournament. Suddenly they start to be injured, families, whatever.

Book it.

I feel exactly the same..

What´s the feeling about it in Danemark?

Fans are mad, but not surprised. Frans Nielsen has said that he would play but would absolutely prefer denmark to participate. There is No way in hell that he would play now since he would play Olympic qualifier instead.

So wait... These players would rather be on their own countries team and battle for 6-7th place than be on a team together that could contend for 1/2/3?

I know if it was basketball and Canada had to play USA I'd rather join w/ another country and actually have a shot at winning.

Yes. A semi final with denmark would mean a hundred times more than winning gold with team Europe minus the best EU countries.

This is how I want the World Cup of Hockey to look like:

Scandinavia (Sweden-Norway-Denmark-Finland, 14 swedes and seven finns)

Czech & Slovakia & Slovenia

USSR (inluding Turkmenistan, Turkey, Ukraine, Krim, Sotji, Latvia, Mongolia, Putingrad, KGB, GRU, Afghanistan, Chessnia, Sir Bad Jan, Stonia, Vlad Vostok, Lithium, Russian White, Zbek, Kzakh, Kirgis, Tajik, Georgia, Moldau, The Army and Camp Sibiria.

US of A including Hawaii, Alaska, Great Britain, I$I$ slash da3$h and Iraq.

Western Canada (including Anonymous, best WHL junior player and best female player)

Eastern Canada (including France, best OHL or QMJHL junior player and the best kostymnisse not being a goalie, sorry, Roy!)

oh my god...


oh..There a problem with both eastern and western canada. The two best players in the whl and qmjhl this season are danes

Sadly, Finland is not in Scandinavia. But Iceland is!! You could replace Sami Vatanen with Emil Alengard!



Why stop there? Add Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Netherlands and Belgium to this mix and you can have Team Holy Roman Empire. The uniforms would be sick.

Correct...Finland demanded mandatory saunas every where and that's where we drew the line.

 

[Stuzchuk]

WOW! this is real???thought it was a thread made here by some user... but apparently, this joke is apparently real. VERY bad move from the Organizing Committee!!

 

[MessierII]

So who does rest of Europe qualify as? As long as these 7 countries all have teams I'm ok with it.

Canada
Russia
USA
Sweden
Finland
Czech Republic
Slovakia

 

[swissexpert]

Canada (without players 23- yo)
Russia
USA (without players 23- yo)
Sweden
Finland
Czech Ritblic
Slovakia (nope, but supposed to send players to the "mixed countries" team)

So only 4 of those countries can choose their best-of-best rosters.

 

[mattihp]

So only 4 of those countries can choose their best-of-best rosters.

Sweden
Canada
USA

Who is number 4? Czech Republic?

Russia and Finland have way too many good players in the KHL. KHL won't be releasing players to this tournament.

 

[swissexpert]

Sweden
Canada
USA

Who is number 4? Czech Republic?

Russia and Finland have way too many good players in the KHL. KHL won't be releasing players to this tournament.

No, NA countries can't ice under-23 players, so no MacKinnon, McDavid, Eichel etc.

If KHL won't release players, Sweden and Czech Rep are actually the only countries to have an "Olympic" kind of rosters with their best players.

 

[FiLe]

Russia and Finland have way too many good players in the KHL. KHL won't be releasing players to this tournament.

Not leaguewide, they'll have to be negotiated on case-to-case basis.

But yeah, if the KHL clubs wish to hang onto some of their key guys, that'll mean three Euro teams (Russia, Finland, Czech Rep) will be quite neutered. So, with those YoungStarz being off limits to USA and Canada, that would only one participant - Sweden - would be rolling out with their best possible roster. So... a best-on-best tournament my backside.

Of course, Russia is so dependent on KHLers that it's hard to see them not getting whoever they want - if they decide to take this seriously. In that case the clubs will be strong-armed to release whoever the federations request. But if they and other euro countries take it for what it really is, a plasticy NHL cash-grab gimmick, they could just settle to complete those rosters with whoever happens to be standing next to the zamboni at the time with nothing better to do. Currently I'd say both outcomes are equally possible.

 

[Syckle78]

One of the funniest parts is the two big time names joining the league next year are relegated to a team no one will give a flying **** about. The NHL could of made a lot of money and had massive free marketing of McDavid vs. Eichel if they were on their respective countries teams. I could see a lot of the people in here upset by their countries not being represented ending up cheering for the hodgepodge team because if they win it's a middle finger to those that decided they weren't worthy. But team young guns? Lol who will care about that at all?