Halakitlikethat
Registered User
Absolutely disgusting and embarrassing that subban didn't make the team I have no idea how they can justify that decision
World Cup: 2016 World Cup — Team Canada (Part II)
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LeafalCrusader
Registered User
Any ideas on line combo's? I enjoy playing around with them. With all the centres hard to guess who plays the wing. I'd imagine Toews Crosby and Thornton would be centres. Not sure who the 4th would be.
Came up with this for starters. I'm sure someone will come up with a better one though.
Benn Crosby Seguin
Giroux Tavares Stamkos
Marchand Toews Bergeron
Duchene Thornton Carter
Getzlaf
Keith Weber
Vlasic Burns
Muzzin Doughty
Pietrangelo
Price
Holtby
Crawford
Came up with this for starters. I'm sure someone will come up with a better one though.
Benn Crosby Seguin
Giroux Tavares Stamkos
Marchand Toews Bergeron
Duchene Thornton Carter
Getzlaf
Keith Weber
Vlasic Burns
Muzzin Doughty
Pietrangelo
Price
Holtby
Crawford
High five Tom
Registered User
- Nov 11, 2012
- 664
- 278
Exactly. TC made the right call here with their picks.
Doughty
Weber
Piet
Burns
Also Letang. All RD that go before Subban.
Makar Goes Fast
grocery stick
Team Canada does not care about having the 23 best players. They are building a team to win and while doing so their is a lot to consider other then raw skill.
The way i see it when it came to defense they decided to take 1 offensive defenseman. they had to choose form Burns, Subban, and Letang. Subban had the worst year of those 3 so it came down to Letang and Burns. Burns is the better chose because he can play forward if you need him to due to injuries.
We did the same with the forwards where we left better players off to have role players instead.
End of the day building a team matters and due to Canada's depth we get to do it.
We got the best 7th D, 13th F, and #3 G. we can afford to be pick and build a team. Advantage us.
Avs44
Registered User
- May 16, 2011
- 21,997
- 10,873
I really don't understand the argument for Hall over Duchene this tournament.
- This past season Duchene had a 0.78 PPG average, Hall had a 0.79 PPG average
- Duchene scored 30 goals
- Duchene was 2nd on Team Canada in the WC with 10 points, Hall had 9
- Duchene has participated in 5 World Championships, which meant that if it was 50/50, Duchene was likely getting the nod over anyone else
- Duchene can play centre and wing, and he was third league wide in face offer percentage at 57.9%
- Hall actually really impressed me with the effort he put in at both ends of the rink in the WC, but Duchene when he wants to be is actually a pretty good defensive player, and he was this past WC.
- Duchene is more versatile, e.g. the team was using him on the PK this past WC
If Hall wanted to beat Duchene out then he basically had to impress significantly more offensively than Duchene, because Duchene really holds all of the other cards - but as much as you complain about Duchene being selfish, the results this past year and in the WC certainly didn't indicate that that supposed selfishness was a problem. If anyone should have been on the team ahead of Duchene, it should have been ROR, because he at least beats Duchene in every non-offensive category.
Insulin
Registered User
Tavares-Crosby-Stamkos
Benn-Giroux-Seguin
Duchene-Toews-Carter
Marchand-Thornton/Getzlaf/Bergeron
Even though Giroux used to play RW I don't see how you can't use him as a center. He's one of the best faceoff men in the world and is very good defensively. He has also previously shown great chemistry with Seguin. Put Giroux between Seguin and Benn.
Subban had a solid defensive year this season. He was a significant plus player 5 on 5 on a minus team with league worst goaltending. He's one of the league's best two-way play drivers at even strength and is a better penalty killer than the guys he's competiting for a spot with.
If your going on Subban being bad defensively, you really have not a single idea of what you are talking about.
If I grant you the premise that Burns had a monster year and thus deserves one of the spots, what on earth did Pietroangelo do to deserve a place on the team beyond have his GM be in charge of selecting the team? At this point in time there is no role that AP could play that Subban doesn't do better.
That is a good Canadian snub team, decent players on all positions (maybe the goalies fall of bit).
Here is a Swedish snub team just for fun. The forwards water down the lines, but at least a good first line. The D is at pair with the Canadian snub or what do you think?
Rakell-Berglund-Nyqvist
Zibanejad-Backlund-Johansson
Larsson-Wennberg-Pääjärvi
Jarnkrok-Rask-Lindholm
Lindholm-Larsson
Klingberg-Edler
Brodin-Klefbom
Läck
Enroth
Gustavsson
Limekiller
Registered User
Disagree. I think Thornton will be one of the centers. He has had too good a year, and is too good at the position to try and play him at wing. One of those guys (probably Tavares) will move to wing.
Do you have a single stat to back this up? Or this just your opinion? Because from the games I saw of subban he was at times a train wreck that had no idea when to just take the easy route instead of trying for the fancy play. This is not something Team Canada needs.
And no, plus minus is not a real stat that matters.
6 players who were on 2015 Team Canada for WHC (world Hockey Championships) are on this roster for World Cup. Crosby, Giroux, Duchene, Seguin, Burns, Muzzin.
O'Reilly, Hall who were also on that team are considered among the biggest snubs.
MacKinnon, Couturier, Ekblad are on NA team.
Shows how ****ing deep and great 2015 Team Canada was! They have dominated in a fashion that we haven't seen for a long time on WHC. It was blast to watch that team.
I wish that O'Reilly or Hall could be on this team instead of Thornton. I mean, Thornton is awesome player and he had hell of a year, no doubt, but he's an older player. He will have extremely short off-season to prepare for this tournament, I dunno and he's yet another center. Hall is natural LW, one of the best, and O'Reilly is always very comfortable on wing.
O'Reilly or Hall would deserve it more, they had done so much for Hockey Canada in the past. They led Team Canada in back-to-back years for Gold Medals on WHC. I really feel bad for them.
And they are tremendous players.
Awfully tough decisions for Hockey Canada.
O'Reilly, Hall who were also on that team are considered among the biggest snubs.
MacKinnon, Couturier, Ekblad are on NA team.
Shows how ****ing deep and great 2015 Team Canada was! They have dominated in a fashion that we haven't seen for a long time on WHC. It was blast to watch that team.
I wish that O'Reilly or Hall could be on this team instead of Thornton. I mean, Thornton is awesome player and he had hell of a year, no doubt, but he's an older player. He will have extremely short off-season to prepare for this tournament, I dunno and he's yet another center. Hall is natural LW, one of the best, and O'Reilly is always very comfortable on wing.
O'Reilly or Hall would deserve it more, they had done so much for Hockey Canada in the past. They led Team Canada in back-to-back years for Gold Medals on WHC. I really feel bad for them.
And they are tremendous players. Awfully tough decisions for Hockey Canada.
1Gold Standard
Registered User
- Jun 13, 2012
- 7,986
- 317
6 players who were on 2015 Team Canada for WHC (world Hockey Championships) are on this roster for World Cup. Crosby, Giroux, Duchene, Seguin, Burns, Muzzin.
O'Reilly, Hall who were also on that team are considered among the biggest snubs.
MacKinnon, Couturier, Ekblad are on NA team.
Shows how ****ing deep and great 2015 Team Canada was! They have dominated in a fashion that we haven't seen for a long time on WHC. It was blast to watch that team.
I wish that O'Reilly or Hall could be on this team instead of Thornton. I mean, Thornton is awesome player and he had hell of a year, no doubt, but he's an older player. He will have extremely short off-season to prepare for this tournament, I dunno and he's yet another center. Hall is natural LW, one of the best, and O'Reilly is always very comfortable on wing.
O'Reilly or Hall would deserve it more, they had done so much for Hockey Canada in the past. They led Team Canada in back-to-back years for Gold Medals on WHC. I really feel bad for them.
Awfully tough decisions for Hockey Canada.
If this were a tournament that actually mattered or I cared about the outcome, and actually planned on watching, I'd perhaps have an opinion. But it's not and I don't.
Good to see Giroux get named to the team. Ultimately I think he opts out for more recovery time from surgery and a replacement is named.
Happy to see a few names left off the team who could have helped their cause with WHC appearances last year or this...and we all know who they are...
And also, I don't think they included Thornton. It was Thornton's beard that made the team. This is a marketing tournament, not a hockey tournament, and the NHL marketing department has BIG BIG plans for that beard.
Now back to regularly scheduled programming. I won't waste a second of the final days of September watching this contrived nonsense. I will ridicule and complain about it up to the drop of the puck of the first pre-tournament game...after that I'll completely ignore the event and find some other worthwhile distraction for my September evenings.
To start, the last 4 seasons combined, Subban has significantly outplayed is team on the penalty kill averaging 5.66 goals per hour against compared to his team's 6.2 and averaged 46.6 shots against per hour to his team's 49.7
Montreal has been the 7th penalty killing team in the league during this time frame, so its not like he's outcompeting scrub competition.
In comparison to the entire league, Subban has the 7th best shots against rate and 12th best goals against rate amoung defenseman who played at least 400 minutes of penalty kill over this time frame.
Neither Burns, Pietroangelo, Weber, nor Doughty have a penalty kill stat line remotely as good as Subban's. Pietroangelo has pretty good overall results, but they are in the context of the league's best penalty killing team and Barret Jackman is the star performer of that group not AP.
At even strength, Subban has run a goal percentage of 54.4% which is 4.76% better than his team over this stretch of years. He is likewise a 4.18% better than his team at corsi%. His corsi for is best and against is the 2nd best on his team for these 4 seasons. Subban runs in at the 12 best relative goal percentage in the league better than any of his Team Canada comparison players and 13th best in relative fenwick percentage amoung players with 3000 minutes (roughly top four defenseman) during this time frame.
In short, Subban's statistical tendancy is to massively outperform his team at puck possession at even strength, which results in a commesurate out-performance in terms of results.
Compare this to both Pietroangelo and Weber, who haven't outperformed their team much in recent years, and Subban looks like very much the superior even strength player as well.
I am glad that Brodie or Giordano were not selected. They had their chance to go to WHC this year and show that they are worth the nomination, and they refused, there was not any indications that either of them was injured. They basically showed that they don't want to be on this team. Good for Hockey Canada to not pick any of them.
For example, Muzzin accepted the invitation in 2015 and was very good, Marchand this year.
Subban was reportedly injured and didn't play in the last games of the season so I will give him a pass regarding this. Subban/Letang are the only real snubs on defense. I wish at least 1 of them was there, to create even more entertaining roster.
For example, Muzzin accepted the invitation in 2015 and was very good, Marchand this year.
Subban was reportedly injured and didn't play in the last games of the season so I will give him a pass regarding this. Subban/Letang are the only real snubs on defense. I wish at least 1 of them was there, to create even more entertaining roster.
1Gold Standard
Registered User
- Jun 13, 2012
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P.K. is one of my favorite players. He's a great player and even better person. I admire his commitment to social causes and the work he does in the community. Just my opinion, but I think he milked the injury excuse this year to attend to other matters that were more important to him. Which is fine. He made his decision and Hockey Canada made theirs. We all have to live by the decisions we make. I applaud even louder HC's decision to keep Giordano and Brodie off the team. but hey, I still have no intention of watching this contrived gimmicky tournament masquerading as an international best on best.
easy, STL's GM is Team Canada's GM.
I knew Pie was getting picked when Armstrong randomly mentioned his name after he was asked about whether or not Subban was being considered for the last RHD spot (this was an interview right after the first selections).
look at Subban's advanced stats and compare him to the other dmen on TC, look at his advanced stats and compare him to the other players on our roster.. hes also has the highest PPG amongst active dmen in the playoffs, oh well i guess Armstrong knows best!
I guess the silver lining is USA's terrible roster (or Sweden picking Kronwall over Lindholm/Kruger over Backlund), goes to show you how clueless professional GMs can be.
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Pandaman11
Registered User
- Dec 3, 2009
- 2,835
- 1,334
I've been preaching for months that Muzzin should make this team, not only because of his chemistry with Doughty, but also in his own right. Besides Keith, I don't see any significantly better LHDs. But I'm ready to read some "Muzzin-over-Giordano-is-so-ridiculous-booooo"-comments 
(95% probably coming from people who don't watch Kings games regularly 
)
I'm also not sure why Pietrangelo made it over Letang. As a 7th D, I'd want an offensive weapon, one who can spark your team or can be used on the PP if you're e.g. behind and in a need for offense.
But I think in Canada's case this is all nitpicking, they have the strongest roster anyway. There will always be tough decisions.
Thornton is imo also deserving, although Couture would've been the more versatile player.
(95% probably coming from people who don't watch Kings games regularly )I'm also not sure why Pietrangelo made it over Letang. As a 7th D, I'd want an offensive weapon, one who can spark your team or can be used on the PP if you're e.g. behind and in a need for offense.
But I think in Canada's case this is all nitpicking, they have the strongest roster anyway. There will always be tough decisions.
Thornton is imo also deserving, although Couture would've been the more versatile player.
Pandaman11
Registered User
- Dec 3, 2009
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I count only two (!) pure wingers on the entire roster. Who between Crosby, Toews, Getzlaf, Thornton & Bergeron do you think will play wing? I can only see either Crosby at LW, or Bergeron on Crosby's wing like in Sochi (but Bergeron probably taking the faceoffs).
I could imagine the lineup being something like this:
Marchand - Crosby - Bergeron
Tavares - Toews - Stamkos
Benn - Getzlaf - Seguin
Duchene - Thornton - Carter
Giroux
Keith - Weber
Muzzin - Doughty
Vlasic - Burns
Pietrangelo
Price
Holtby
Crawford
I could imagine the lineup being something like this:
Marchand - Crosby - Bergeron
Tavares - Toews - Stamkos
Benn - Getzlaf - Seguin
Duchene - Thornton - Carter
Giroux
Keith - Weber
Muzzin - Doughty
Vlasic - Burns
Pietrangelo
Price
Holtby
Crawford
I also am a PK fan but agree 100% that he milked his injury to go off a do the playboy thing. Happy to see him sit. Also very happy to see the two Calgary d get the snub as a result of their snub to HC.
I do feel Hall and ROR should be on this team as a result of their brilliant play in back to back WHC.
Thornton is long in the tooth and beard and Giroux is just too beaten up to be on this squad. Perhaps he and Thornton really will take a step back because of the long season and injuries and open up the spots for the above mentioned players. Hall and ROR should be here.
It really will do serious damage to any further top level WHC participation if they do not make their way on. Actually the damage is done. No three in a row next year.
Macman
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- May 15, 2004
- 3,483
- 516
As talented as he is, he did lead the NHL in turnovers by a fair margin. That wouldn't sit well with Babcock.
HabsQC
Registered User
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