WJC: 2016 — USA Roster Talk

[1Gold Standard]

Walman is American? He's played in Canada his whole life and is born in Canada.

but is a dual citizen... and he came to grips (rather smartly) with the fact that if he wants to play internationally, then making Team Canada is a pipedream. He made the wise choice. He's even a longshot to make Team USA imo.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Walman is American? He's played in Canada his whole life and is born in Canada.

No outrage when Brown and Chychrun suit up for Canada though-right?

 

[YMCMBYOLO]

No outrage when Brown and Chychrun suit up for Canada though-right?

All three are dual citizens, so not sure what you're trying to get at. I'd actually say Chychrun and Brown feel more Canadian since that's their heritage. Hell, they're playing in Canada now and their parents are Canadian NHL players (or at least Chychrun's dad is).

Where was his outrage in his post because I sure don't see it? I could understand Walman being American and I can understand him being Canadian, too. It would be a lot more easier to make Team USA than Team Canada so I wouldn't be surprised if he suits up for the Yanks.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

All three are dual citizens, so not sure what you're trying to get at. I'd actually say Chychrun and Brown feel more Canadian since that's their heritage. Hell, they're playing in Canada now and their parents are Canadian NHL players (or at least Chychrun's dad is).

Where was his outrage in his post because I sure don't see it? I could understand Walman being American and I can understand him being Canadian, too. It would be a lot more easier to make Team USA than Team Canada so I wouldn't be surprised if he suits up for the Yanks.

There is always a ton of belly-aching when a dual-citizen suits up for a country-especially when the player has spent a significant portion of their life in one country and decide to play for the other. The U.S. has been criticized of "poaching" these types of players in the past. However, when a a player like Logan Brown who was born in the U.S. and has lived and played most of his life here decided to play for Canada it's not a big deal. I see a double-standard. the point is, patriotism is rarely the deciding factor, it's as you say-opportunity more often than not that drives these decisions. Let's just call it what it is and move on.

 

[Mehar]

but is a dual citizen... and he came to grips (rather smartly) with the fact that if he wants to play internationally, then making Team Canada is a pipedream. He made the wise choice. He's even a longshot to make Team USA imo.

I agree. However- i was reading Bob Mckenzie's twitter, and he said that Canada is expected to name Walman to the Team Canada invite list as well today. In that case- Walman has a decision to make. If he has a deep desire to play internationally, then he should opt to play for the US, because it would be easier to make that team.

 

[William H Bonney]

All three are dual citizens, so not sure what you're trying to get at. I'd actually say Chychrun and Brown feel more Canadian since that's their heritage. Hell, they're playing in Canada now and their parents are Canadian NHL players (or at least Chychrun's dad is).

Where was his outrage in his post because I sure don't see it? I could understand Walman being American and I can understand him being Canadian, too. It would be a lot more easier to make Team USA than Team Canada so I wouldn't be surprised if he suits up for the Yanks.

He's getting at that Ferrero Rocher, whose sole purpose of posting in USAH related threads is to rile everyone up, is applying a double standard. He's all up in arms about Walman being invited to USAH's camp despite having "played in Canada his whole life and [being] born in Canada", yet he has no issue with Chychrun or Brown playing for Team Canada despite playing in USA their whole lives and being born in the USA.

No one is claiming that USAH hasn't been on the better end of duals for most of its history or that Chychrun or Brown aren't justified for wanting to play for Team Canada. Just the hypocrisy that comes out when it goes the other way.

 

[JackSlater]

There is always a ton of belly-aching when a dual-citizen suits up for a country-especially when the player has spent a significant portion of their life in one country and decide to play for the other. The U.S. has been criticized of "poaching" these types of players in the past. However, when a a player like Logan Brown who was born in the U.S. and has lived and played most of his life here decided to play for Canada it's not a big deal. I see a double-standard. the point is, patriotism is rarely the deciding factor, it's as you say-opportunity more often than not that drives these decisions. Let's just call it what it is and move on.

This is 100% correct, it is a double standard. It's all well and good to complain about USA taking players, but when Canada does it it's a lot more quiet. Chychrun/Day/Brown are shaping up to be the first real cases of Canada taking a player that the USA primarily developed, and I expect to see the public keep their mouths shut a lot more than they have when it goes the other way.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

This is 100% correct, it is a double standard. It's all well and good to complain about USA taking players, but when Canada does it it's a lot more quiet. Chychrun/Day/Brown are shaping up to be the first real cases of Canada taking a player that the USA primarily developed, and I expect to see the public keep their mouths shut a lot more than they have when it goes the other way.

Coincidentally none of those players are on Canada's invite list. Are any of them eligible?

 

[Get North]

No outrage when Brown and Chychrun suit up for Canada though-right?

He's getting at that Ferrero Rocher, whose sole purpose of posting in USAH related threads is to rile everyone up, is applying a double standard. He's all up in arms about Walman being invited to USAH's camp despite having "played in Canada his whole life and [being] born in Canada", yet he has no issue with Chychrun or Brown playing for Team Canada despite playing in USA their whole lives and being born in the USA.

No one is claiming that USAH hasn't been on the better end of duals for most of its history or that Chychrun or Brown aren't justified for wanting to play for Team Canada. Just the hypocrisy that comes out when it goes the other way.

I'm not trying to create any outrage. Obviously I have for some reason. I asked a question, on all the sites I've looked on I've seen Walman as only a Canadian but since he was invited to the USA Junior Camp I was wondering if it was a mistake or if he is a dual-citizen.

This has nothing to do with Chychurn and Brown so I have no idea what you're trying to get at. I was asking a question, that's how simple it is and you are making it much more complicated. I have no problem where he plays, if he wants to play in USA, stay there and don't come back.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

I'm not trying to create any outrage. Obviously I have for some reason. I asked a question, on all the sites I've looked on I've seen Walman as only a Canadian but since he was invited to the USA Junior Camp I was wondering if it was a mistake or if he is a dual-citizen.

This has nothing to do with Chychurn and Brown so I have no idea what you're trying to get at. I was asking a question, that's how simple it is and you are making it much more complicated. I have no problem where he plays, if he wants to play in USA, stay there and don't come back.

I knew your intentions were pure, FR. Never apologize for taking the high road, buddy. God knows, I never do.

 

[cagney]

I have no problem where he plays, if he wants to play in USA, stay there and don't come back.

That's an interesting way to put it.

To be honest, I have no idea how Walman would be eligible to play for the US as it doesn't seem like he could have fulfilled the IIHF requirements to do so. I think I've given up on trying to keep track of what the IIHF's rules are to be honest.

If he ends up on the team I hope he's worth the spot and that he takes pride in the jersey.

 

[JackSlater]

Coincidentally none of those players are on Canada's invite list. Are any of them eligible?

I believe they are eligible. I think you just need citizenship and to have played in the country for two years, and at least Chychrun and Day meet that criteria. I don't think Day is good enough to warrant a spot yet, but Chychrun is (plus he's a legitimate threat to play for USA while Day isn't). I think this is a case of Hockey Canada wanting him to play in an under 18 tournament (like the Hlinka) rather than have him at the camp. They have a weird 'graduation' system sometimes and Chychrun has not moved beyond the U18 level yet.

Most Canadians seemingly disagree with me, but I don't want Canada to pick any of those three regardless of their ability or IIHF eligibility.

 

[Get North]

I knew your intentions were pure, FR. Never apologize for taking the high road, buddy. God knows, I never do.

Must come from watching Cherry every Saturday.

That's an interesting way to put it.

To be honest, I have no idea how Walman would be eligible to play for the US as it doesn't seem like he could have fulfilled the IIHF requirements to do so. I think I've given up on trying to keep track of what the IIHF's rules are to be honest.

If he ends up on the team I hope he's worth the spot and that he takes pride in the jersey.

I agree. I would hate to see players play for a country just for playing in international tournaments.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I believe they are eligible. I think you just need citizenship and to have played in the country for two years, and at least Chychrun and Day meet that criteria. I don't think Day is good enough to warrant a spot yet, but Chychrun is (plus he's a legitimate threat to play for USA while Day isn't). I think this is a case of Hockey Canada wanting him to play in an under 18 tournament (like the Hlinka) rather than have him at the camp. They have a weird 'graduation' system sometimes and Chychrun has not moved beyond the U18 level yet.

Most Canadians seemingly disagree with me, but I don't want Canada to pick any of those three regardless of their ability or IIHF eligibility.

I forgot about the u18 camp.

 

[Mehar]

That's an interesting way to put it.

To be honest, I have no idea how Walman would be eligible to play for the US as it doesn't seem like he could have fulfilled the IIHF requirements to do so. I think I've given up on trying to keep track of what the IIHF's rules are to be honest.

If he ends up on the team I hope he's worth the spot and that he takes pride in the jersey.

I see Walman was invited by both Canada and the US. Reminds me of Jamie Oleksiak from 4 years ago when he was invited by both Canada and US. Walman has played for Canada in the past (World Junior A Challenge), but as a dual citizen he has the right to play for either country- even if he primarily spent his entire life in Canada.

 

[1Gold Standard]

That's an interesting way to put it.

To be honest, I have no idea how Walman would be eligible to play for the US as it doesn't seem like he could have fulfilled the IIHF requirements to do so. I think I've given up on trying to keep track of what the IIHF's rules are to be honest.

If he ends up on the team I hope he's worth the spot and that he takes pride in the jersey.

It's quite easy actually, the IIHF will make an exemption to the rule so long as it is not Canada applying.

 

[1Gold Standard]

I believe they are eligible. I think you just need citizenship and to have played in the country for two years, and at least Chychrun and Day meet that criteria. I don't think Day is good enough to warrant a spot yet, but Chychrun is (plus he's a legitimate threat to play for USA while Day isn't). I think this is a case of Hockey Canada wanting him to play in an under 18 tournament (like the Hlinka) rather than have him at the camp. They have a weird 'graduation' system sometimes and Chychrun has not moved beyond the U18 level yet.

Most Canadians seemingly disagree with me, but I don't want Canada to pick any of those three regardless of their ability or IIHF eligibility.

Jack, I get your opinion on "where players were developed" but if Day has a desire to play internationally, then his only option is playing for Team Canada. He is not an American citizen. Day, nor his family has ever wanted American citizenship; so, unless that has changed in the last year, according to you, his only options are either to not play internationally at all, not ever ever ever amen, or apply for American citizenship. Seriously, that's what you think he should do?
I really don't care what dual citizens decide. It's their personal choice. your opinion on Day is just wrong.



having said that, my opinion on the player: I have serious doubts that Day makes the junior team in 2018 as a 19 year old, forget as an underage player, but if he does, his international career most likely will end there. I'll be surprised beyond surprised...more surprised than Sid showing up the WHC...if Day ever plays a single minute for the senior team at an A-list A- team event. He's just not that great of a prospect imo... but, he only has Canadian citizenship, therefore he has privilege of playing for or attempting to play for Team Canada. I wish him well and good luck.

And TBH, I'm thankful that Chychrun and Brown made their decision, as this draft class of Canadian born and developed 1998 born players is the worst I've seen since the early 90s. I'm curious to see how well this group does at Hlinka this summer. And really, if truth be told, other than the Mcfew at the top of the heap, 1997 born players is no great draft class for us either.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

...as this draft class of Canadian born and developed 1998 born players is the worst I've seen since the early 90s. I'm curious to see how well this group does at Hlinka this summer. And really, if truth be told, other than the Mcfew at the top of the heap, 1997 born players is no great draft class for us either.

To your credit, you made this call years ago and it looks like you were right - 2 weak Canadian drafts, sadly, in a row.

 

[1Gold Standard]

To your credit, you made this call years ago and it looks like you were right - 2 weak Canadian drafts, sadly, in a row.

Hockey Canada is probably too busy trying to address the issues with our goaltending...of course we wouldn't want to be firing on all cylinders in the developmental game, that would just be too unfair to our competition...I have no opinions on the 1999 players as of yet.

anyway, enough of that noise, this is the U.S. roster thread after all....

 

[JackSlater]

Jack, I get your opinion on "where players were developed" but if Day has a desire to play internationally, then his only option is playing for Team Canada. He is not an American citizen. Day, nor his family has ever wanted American citizenship; so, unless that has changed in the last year, according to you, his only options are either to not play internationally at all, not ever ever ever amen, or apply for American citizenship. Seriously, that's what you think he should do?
I really don't care what dual citizens decide. It's their personal choice. your opinion on Day is just wrong.

Since this thread is about the American WJC team I'm not going to post about this issue in this thread after this. I really could not care less about Day's personal situation. His case is very unique and in my opinion represents little more than bad luck. My suggestion would be for him to get American citizenship and play for the country that he has spent the vast majority of his life in and that developed him. The unfortunate thing for him is that the IIHF has tied citizenship to national teams. I also don't deny that he has the right under the IIHF's rules to try out for Canada. I would hope that Hockey Canada would refuse to select any player developed in another country, but I am fully aware that no federation acts in this way.

And TBH, I'm thankful that Chychrun and Brown made their decision, as this draft class of Canadian born and developed 1998 born players is the worst I've seen since the early 90s. I'm curious to see how well this group does at Hlinka this summer. And really, if truth be told, other than the Mcfew at the top of the heap, 1997 born players is no great draft class for us either.

Yeah Canada's next draft will look better superficially due to the theft of a few American players, but it really is pathetic. This is the USA WJC thread though so I won't get into it anymore.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

By the way, I don't begrudge any player playing for who he wants as long as it's within the rules. That said, there's no need to call it the "high road" if a player chooses one country over another. That's pathetic.

 

[1Gold Standard]

Since this thread is about the American WJC team I'm not going to post about this issue in this thread after this. I really could not care less about Day's personal situation. His case is very unique and in my opinion represents little more than bad luck. My suggestion would be for him to get American citizenship and play for the country that he has spent the vast majority of his life in and that developed him. The unfortunate thing for him is that the IIHF has tied citizenship to national teams. I also don't deny that he has the right under the IIHF's rules to try out for Canada. I would hope that Hockey Canada would refuse to select any player developed in another country, but I am fully aware that no federation acts in this way.



Yeah Canada's next draft will look better superficially due to the theft of a few American players, but it really is pathetic. This is the USA WJC thread though so I won't get into it anymore.

Wouldn't it have been great if we had realized our NHL hockey dreams instead of stuck here in this forum talking about those who have actually done it or are about to...

 

[canuck2010]

Yeah Canada's next draft will look better superficially due to the theft of a few American players, but it really is pathetic. This is the USA WJC thread though so I won't get into it anymore.[/QUOTE]

I have no problem with any sons of non Canadian players that have played their NHL careers in Canada playing for whatever country their father calls home.

I also have no problem with any sons of Canadian players who have played in the NHL for USA based teams to call the United States home if they so choose. There are certainly enough of those.

 

[AmericanDream]

Who in the heck is Scott Eansor? 19 year old 5'8" forward who scored 37 points in 72 WHL games this past season? What on earth?

Hopefully the next Tyler Johnson!!

 

[AmericanDream]

Looking at these invites Logan Brown would have no chance at this team right now...I mean this group is loaded...Keller and Max Jones aren't even invited and both are ahead of Brown...same for Bellows..so I can't really cry about this as he has no chance at this squad really..

As for Chychrun he would have a better shot depending on if Hanifin sticks in the NHL but even then we already have a 17 year old Krys likely making this blue line so not sure he would as well...