Richi
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Completely agreed! Hollenstein had some issues at the beginning of the season, being on a new team and all. Now he lives up to the expectations and is one of the 5 (!) PPG players in the swiss league.
Olympics: 2014 — Switzerland Roster (Released, post #1)
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Completely agreed! Hollenstein had some issues at the beginning of the season, being on a new team and all. Now he lives up to the expectations and is one of the 5 (!) PPG players in the swiss league.
Not sure what would make you think that. I expected Hollenstein to improve from last season, which sounds normal for a 24 years old with his talent level. He's pretty much where I thought he would be.
My point is, strong league play is not the only, or even the main factor in picking players. A guy like Daniel Steiner may score at an impressive pace in the NLA, but it's obvious he's not fast or tough enough for international hockey. On the other hand, if Vermin or Bykov were having a strong season, they should get considerations, although not ahead of players who are proven at this level and have established chemistry. This is especially true for the Olympics.
Would like to reignite the discussion by trying to outline what the lineup should look like at the moment - the most notable omission would be Sven Baertschi as I believe that he just hasn't done enough to be part of the squad. Moreover, I don't really think that Sbisa and Weber are much more than 7th or 8th defensemen, respectively, on the big ice surface.
Moser - Plüss - Niederreiter
Hollenstein -
i - Brunner
Suri - Ambühl - Wick
B. Plüss - Monnet - Sprunger
(Walker, Romy, Bürgler)
Josi - Seger
Streit - Diaz
Blindenbacher - Furrer
(Weber, Sbisa)
Hiller
Berra
Gerber
Moser - Plüss - Niederreiter
Hollenstein -
i - BrunnerSuri - Ambühl - Wick
B. Plüss - Monnet - Sprunger
(Walker, Romy, Bürgler)
Josi - Seger
Streit - Diaz
Blindenbacher - Furrer
(Weber, Sbisa)
Hiller
Berra
Gerber
Richi
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Monnet??? Even I have to say that there is absolutely no chance he makes it on the Olympic roster and he´s my favourite player! He wasn´t important for the team at the world cup, he doesn´t play better than last season and there are a lot more guys available for the Olympics.
And you do know what a fourth line is for, right? B.Plüss - Monnet - Sprunger just seems to me like a biased line from a Fribourg Gotteron fan...
And just some interesting detail: Baertschi has as many points as Brunner this season. Maybe Brunner hasn´t done enough either?
Baertschi is a winger near NHL-Level. We just don´t have too many of these!
Sbisa and Weber know the big surface, they have both played half a season on it last year. This is not a valid argument!
torero
Registered User
As the season goes on... it seems to me that there are no big positive surprises, only negative let downs. The coming national games will hopefully clear things up a bit.
I don't see a spot for Scherwey on an Olympic National Team roster; has he even played a meaningful NT game yet?
Few thoughts: Walker - Trachsler - Bieber is the defensive line to go for Switzerland IMO; Moser and Niederreiter should be together on a big offensive line; Brunner will play better on big ice, Bärtschi needs to show how he can be useful to this team; maybe keep some of the ZSC guys together?;
Anyone watch a lot of Nashville games this season? Josi's play seems so unspectacular, he only scored his first goal of the season last weekend; is he able to lead the team now that Weber is gone? You hear neither good nor bad about him.
i often watch their games, and he has been able to shut down great lines !!
among which : Ovechkin and Sid !
In my view he has been very good ! and is likely to be one of the best swiss players in the coming tournament !
If you look at the stats ... then Brunner shouldn't look too bad, yet he's been invisible for many games now.
=> stats don't say everything ! and Josi has been great !
if he is used in a european manner, he'll be even greater !
An overstatement to be sure.
Bartschi has not and does not stink. He has been a step behind for sure especially in the defensive zone, but also has been quite effective in creating offense and setting up plays that quite frankly his 3rd line rate teammates arent quite used to seeing.
fulltime NHLer, no.. but a brimming one at his age, I think still speaks quite well
Would like to reignite the discussion by trying to outline what the lineup should look like at the moment - the most notable omission would be Sven Baertschi as I believe that he just hasn't done enough to be part of the squad. Moreover, I don't really think that Sbisa and Weber are much more than 7th or 8th defensemen, respectively, on the big ice surface.
Moser - Plüss - Niederreiter
Hollenstein -
Suri - Ambühl - Wick
B. Plüss - Monnet - Sprunger
(Walker, Romy, Bürgler)
Josi - Seger
Streit - Diaz
Blindenbacher - Furrer
(Weber, Sbisa)
Hiller
Berra
Gerber
I don't see Simpson giving up on Gardner, which is having a good season. And I don't see B.Plüss above Pestoni, in all sincerity, but I wouldn't take either. Ambühl is not the same, but has experience so I honestly don't know. And what about P.Bärtschi? He always does great in play-off, could be useful in this kind of tournament as scoring addition.
Do anybody think that the loss of Fischer as assistant would have any kind of impact? He is doing well in Lugano, I wonder how much of his intensity and drive was responsible for the silver medal in stockholm. I guess it was marginal, but we will see.
I can see it happen. Niederreiter, Moser, Wick, Brunner and Hollenstein are pretty much locks, then you have Walker, Ambühl or Bieber who play a different role, and Suri who is hard to pass. That's a lot of competition for a player who is not familiar with the playing system and has no existing chemistry.
Most will agree on Weber. He's way below the other NHL defensemen and I would even say below some NLA ones (at least Seger and Vauclair, and even though I'm not crazy about having Blindenbacher, Furrer or Du Bois at the Olympics, I'd take them before Weber). And with Josi, Diaz, Streit and Seger, he's not exactly needed to provide offense from the blueline.
Regarding Sbisa, I agree he's more of a small ice player, but as there is no reason to break the Josi-Diaz and Seger-Vauclair pairs we saw last spring, and there's the fact he complets Streit pretty well, I think he belongs in the top 6.
Moser - Plüss - Niederreiter
Hollenstein -
Suri - Ambühl - Wick
B. Plüss - Monnet - Sprunger
(Walker, Romy, Bürgler)
Your first and third line make sense, although I think that Plüss,
i and Romy are set to be the top 3 centers and Ambühl will play on the wing, but I can see major flaws in the other two:Although the idea of Brunner playing with
i is intriguing, they both have trouble handling physical play are not the best defensive players either. As we don't have that many forwards who are weak defensively, I think we can afford not to have two on the same line.Regarding the 4th line, first we can say that none of the players you name are 4th line players, and a strong case can also be made against them in an offensive role. When Benny Plüss made the WC team in 2012, many expected him to be unable to translate his good NLA play to the next level, and they were proven right. I've argued many times against Sprunger in the national team (pure offensive player who doesn't produce much in international hockey) and don't feel the need to do it again, although I'll repeat my arguments if anyone requests it. Monnet has the biggest chance of the three, but others are simply better than him in an offensive role. He was scratched during the world championship last year, so I have a hard time seeing him make the team with Wick, Romy and Brunner available (this point if also true for Bürgler).
Richi
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Please no! And he´s having a terrible season!
As much as I would love to see Vouclair at the Olympics, the chances of him being there are not that good. The concussion he suffered has nearly ended his career, the two games since his recovery haven´t proven that he's ready for the challenge
Although the idea of Brunner playing with
i is actually not as bad defensively as many people might think. He's +13 right now for example.And I just don't see how you came to the conclusion that he's having problems with physical play. The swiss league doesn't keep track of checks made or anything. But seeing him going up against the other teams top line every game and the fact that he's 52 PIM are strong indicators that he doesn't mind throwing his body (and stick) around.
And just some interesting detail: Baertschi has as many points as Brunner this season. Maybe Brunner hasn´t done enough either?
Baertschi is a winger near NHL-Level. We just don´t have too many of these!
There are huge differences between Brunner and S. Bärtschi. We all know Brunner is better on the big ice, and the line he formed with Romy and Moser in 2012 was deadly (he was great with Ambühl in 2010 as well). Bärtschi on the other hand has never played a professional game on the big ice, and has no national team experience.
And to expand on the arguments I made in my last post about not having two poor defensive players on the same line, that would mean Brunner,
i and Bärtschi are on different lines, which limits possible combinations (although this is just my opinion and we can't possibly know if Simpson will be keen on taking that risk).Gardner is an interesting case. His skillset is unique and can definitely be used at the Olympics, and although he has big weaknesses in his game, he's smart enough to work around them. The more I think about it, the more I would like to see him in Sochi, but it's difficult to find a spot where he would fit. Maybe have him as the 13th forward and use him in specific situations?
Regarding Ambühl, he may not be having a good season, but it's hard to ignore how useful he has been for the national team, both in an offensive and defensive role, as a center and as a winger. That makes him the perfect player to have in case someone is injured during the tournament.
About P. Bärtschi, he has dfinitely played himself into consideration. He would complement
i very well (they played a lot together with ZSC) and could play a role similar to Bodenmann in Stockholm. He also played some tournaments with Romy if I'm not mistaken. On the other hand, just like S. Bärtschi he has a lot of player to pass to be picked.Hard to say as we can't judge how big was Fischer's impact in last year's WC. He's a smart guy who knows what he wants, and I wouldn't be surprised if he had a hand in picking the right players for Stockholm (the moves Lugano made since the season started seems to show that he's very good at this).
No need to judge him on the two games he played last week. He will have the opportunity to show next weekend if he's on his way to full recovery, and he has six more weeks of league play to get back in shape before the Olympics. If Simpson feels he will have recovered in February, Vauclair will be on the team.
And I just don't see how you came to the conclusion that he's having problems with physical play. The swiss league doesn't keep track of checks made or anything. But seeing him going up against the other teams top line every game and the fact that he's 52 PIM are strong indicators that he doesn't mind throwing his body (and stick) around.
Plus/minus doesn't prove much, every player on a good team is bound to have a high one.
You don't need to count hits to see he's at his best when he has open ice to use his skating skills and not when fighting for the puck along the board. And 30 of his penalty minutes came when he lost his cool in the game in Lugano after getting penalized for his stickwork for the third time of the game. Not exactly "throwing the body".
As long as
i can use his skating skills to avoid one on one battles, he'll be fine, but if faced with players who can outmuscle him but he can't outskate, it would be good to have linemates who are up to the challenge.
SCBdude
SC Bern 1931
Gardner hasn't had a great season so far but having a huge guy like him on the powerplay would be great. He's really good at screening the goalie and putting home rebounds.
Richi
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I guess you deliberately chose to ignore the sarcasm smiley?
That said, I think Sven would do great on the big ice. He's a gritty winger with good speed, qualities that are rather advantegeous on the big ice. I say that he should get his chance, as Niederreiter has gotten his last year. And we all remember how great that turned out!
I truly hope so. If he'll be able to play like during the las World Cup, then we would be set defensively.
Plus/minus doesn't prove much, every player on a good team is bound to have a high one.
You don't need to count hits to see he's at his best when he has open ice to use his skating skills and not when fighting for the puck along the board. And 30 of his penalty minutes came when he lost his cool in the game in Lugano after getting penalized for his stickwork for the third time of the game. Not exactly "throwing the body".
As long as
We all know that +/- isn't a very reliable stat, but still it shows something about the defensive play of someone. Or wheter someone has scored mostly on the PP.
Still, mostly it shows wheter your team sucks or not
Hard to make a point in
is favor not being able to use good statistics, but having watched him play this whole season I still have to say that he can not only use his speed, but also his body. If you don't believe me, watch some of the games of the Lions. He does go to the dirty area pretty often and there he doesn't just get pushed around.Of course Gardner is not having the season of his life, but his 2-meter-long stickplay was incredible in box-play in stockholm and he did win a lot of faceoff, moreover he is a guy that always raise his level when its required (playoff, WC). But he is not getting any younger, so I don't honestly know. It is up to Simpson.
Monnet??? Even I have to say that there is absolutely no chance he makes it on the Olympic roster and he´s my favourite player! He wasn´t important for the team at the world cup, he doesn´t play better than last season and there are a lot more guys available for the Olympics.
And you do know what a fourth line is for, right? B.Plüss - Monnet - Sprunger just seems to me like a biased line from a Fribourg Gotteron fan...
And just some interesting detail: Baertschi has as many points as Brunner this season. Maybe Brunner hasn´t done enough either?
Baertschi is a winger near NHL-Level. We just don´t have too many of these!
Sbisa and Weber know the big surface, they have both played half a season on it last year. This is not a valid argument!
It seems to me as if we have different concepts of what a fourth line should provide in order to help the team win. I would like to see a line that 1) has chemistry 2) can contribute secondary offense and 3) plays puck posession hockey. Any fourth line in hockey is useless if it is unable to keep the puck away from a usually more talented opponent, i.e. gain puck possession - that is exactly where Monnet comes into the equation. Swiss national teams have a long track record of subpar performances when it comes to faceoffs, and a natural centerman like Monnet who performs well at key draws is a very valuable asset to have. I would envision him to play a role similar to guys like Manny Malhotra or Jay McClement, transformed to the bigger ice surface. Someone you can put out there late in a game and who gives you a chance to win that key draw - exactly how for instance Randy Carlyle uses the aforementioned McClement.
Concerning the Bärtschi and Brunner comparison: I think that stv11 has already mentioned the decisive arguments. I also am a valiant supporter of looking at a player's whole résumée and not just his current form when selecting a team - Brunner has gotten it done on an international level, Bärtschi hasn't. It's as simple as that.
They did indeed, and I think it was apparent that Sbisa wasn't really feeling it out there with Lugano. However, I think that it could be a good idea to actually play him situatively, maybe shorthanded or against certain specific opposition. Weber could earn a spot on the powerplay but he is a long shot to play in Sochi in my opinion - apart from his one-timer, there is nothing he is really excellent or standing out at.
Thinking about shootout scenarios as well at the moment, having read that the US hockey team considers to use Galchenyuk as a 13th forward with a focus on shootout situations. Thinking that Brunner would be a lock, but apart from him I cant really make up my mind on that right now. Any ideas?
Richi
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I agree on the concept.
Anyhow, Monnet isn´t a good defensive player, he´s a scorer. I don´t know about his faceoff percentage but it would have to be extremely high in order for him to be used on the fourth line and the PK. Even for Gotteron he only rarely plays on the PK.
He was scratched the whole tournament last year and since he hasn´t progressed, but rather regressed, he won´t make the team this year.
IMO Trachsler is the best choice for this position since he´s pretty good at faceoffs and doesn´t shy away from the competition.
B. Plüss might be a candidate for the fourth line, he´s able to play a physical game and as long as I´ve known him, he´s always been able to adapt to his linemates.
Sprunger on the other hand is just a terrible choice for the fourth line. He hasn´t played a physical game since his concussion issues. He might be a candidate for the third line.
If S. Bärtschi: Next time I´m being sarcastic I´ll put next to it a gif with a dancing polar bear holding up a sign where the word sarcasm is written in blinking red letters...
If P. Bärtschi: Completely agreed. But I wouldn´t mind if he´d get a chance at some of the preparation games.
Weber has improved over the last few games (AHL and NHL). This said, I never mentioned that he should be on the team. He would have to prove himself during preparation games.
Sbisa has the advantage that he knows the opponents. I´m guessing it will be a tight race between him and Bezina.
Niederreiter and S. Bärtschi aren´t too bad skill wise:
According to http://www.sehv.ch/SIH/aktuell/de/sportinformationen_news.php?news=20131221_brz002_4 Brunner will be at least four weeks out... 
According to http://www.sehv.ch/SIH/aktuell/de/sportinformationen_news.php?news=20131221_brz002_4 Brunner will be at least four weeks out...
4 weeks means he could play again at the end of january. The mens tournament in Sochi starts on February 12. He should be able to play in Sochi, with a bit of luck he even has played a few games again when he arrives there.
swisdan
Registered User
Here is my choice for Sochi, very hard indeed but I have to choice at this point:
Hollenstein -i - Brunner
Niederreiter - Plüss - Moser
Wick - Romy - Suri
Ambuhl - Traschler- Walker
Reserve: Sprunger, Bieber, Bodenmann
Josi - Diaz
Streit - Seger
Furrer - Vauclair
Reserve: Bezina, Blindenbacher
Goalie: 1. Hiller, 2. Berra, 3. Gerber
Some thoughts:
Possible switch between Romy andi. Sbiba would be in jeopardy, we have to see if he'll step up when he'll come back, very poor play this season but he's a real asset physically. For me, it's too early to pick guy like S. Baertschi or Andrieghetto. Weber has no place in this team. I'm pretty sure Bezina'll be in the squad choiced by Simpson ( we can contest it but it isn't for nothing if he is the coach and we are only behind ours screens). Brunner must be a lock even if he'll have a lack of competition.
Hollenstein -
i - BrunnerNiederreiter - Plüss - Moser
Wick - Romy - Suri
Ambuhl - Traschler- Walker
Reserve: Sprunger, Bieber, Bodenmann
Josi - Diaz
Streit - Seger
Furrer - Vauclair
Reserve: Bezina, Blindenbacher
Goalie: 1. Hiller, 2. Berra, 3. Gerber
Some thoughts:
Possible switch between Romy and
i. Sbiba would be in jeopardy, we have to see if he'll step up when he'll come back, very poor play this season but he's a real asset physically. For me, it's too early to pick guy like S. Baertschi or Andrieghetto. Weber has no place in this team. I'm pretty sure Bezina'll be in the squad choiced by Simpson ( we can contest it but it isn't for nothing if he is the coach and we are only behind ours screens). Brunner must be a lock even if he'll have a lack of competition.
Last edited:
Some observations based on the Arosa challenge:
Not much to say on individual players, although I think Gardner has made a good case for himself and the Ambühl-Bieber pair had some strong efforts on the PK.
Regarding the line up, Simpson kept thei-Hollenstein, Ambühl-Suri and Tachsler-Walker combo from the last WC. It's also interesting to note that he put a physical player with i and Hollenstein, which makes me think that whoever it was who said that Niederreiter would end up on that line may be right. And given the strong defensive play we could expect from a Bieber-Ambühl-Suri line, I wonder if Duga may have been right when he suggested a few pages back that Trachsler may end up out of the team.
If we remember that Romy and Wick played on the same line at the Deutschland cup, maybe this is the line up Simpson has in mind:
Brunner - Romy - Wick
Niederreiter -i - Hollenstein
Moser - Plüss - Gardner
Bieber - Ambühl - Suri
Not much to say on individual players, although I think Gardner has made a good case for himself and the Ambühl-Bieber pair had some strong efforts on the PK.
Regarding the line up, Simpson kept the
i-Hollenstein, Ambühl-Suri and Tachsler-Walker combo from the last WC. It's also interesting to note that he put a physical player with i and Hollenstein, which makes me think that whoever it was who said that Niederreiter would end up on that line may be right. And given the strong defensive play we could expect from a Bieber-Ambühl-Suri line, I wonder if Duga may have been right when he suggested a few pages back that Trachsler may end up out of the team.If we remember that Romy and Wick played on the same line at the Deutschland cup, maybe this is the line up Simpson has in mind:
Brunner - Romy - Wick
Niederreiter -
i - HollensteinMoser - Plüss - Gardner
Bieber - Ambühl - Suri
My choice:
Hollenstein -i - Wick
Sprunger - Plüss - Niederreiter
Brunner - Romy - Moser
Ambuhl - Trachsler- Suri
Reserve: Bieber, Gardner or Walker
Josi - Diaz
Vauclair - Seger
Streit - Blindenbacher
Reserve: Bezina, Sbisa, Weber
Goalie: 1. Hiller, 2. Berra, 3. doesn't matter
Hollenstein -
i - WickSprunger - Plüss - Niederreiter
Brunner - Romy - Moser
Ambuhl - Trachsler- Suri
Reserve: Bieber, Gardner or Walker
Josi - Diaz
Vauclair - Seger
Streit - Blindenbacher
Reserve: Bezina, Sbisa, Weber
Goalie: 1. Hiller, 2. Berra, 3. doesn't matter
Pominville Knows
Registered User
If Luca Sbisa is scheduled to be back in late january, what are the odds that he does not get picked? I see that many of you dont have him on your roster, and am just wondering if that is really realistic.
swisdan
Registered User
The way he played before his injury, it is realistic in my opinion. And he had this injury in a bad time. And finally, the last time he played for Switzerland, he was not so good.
I'm eager to see what Simpson will decide.
On the other hand, a big advantage for Sbisa is that he fits well with Streit. And who could replace him? Furrer, Ramholt or Grossmann aren't exactly locks themselves.
