2013 NHL-NHLPA CBA

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hatterson

Registered User
Apr 12, 2010
36,024
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North Tonawanda, NY
Can anybody explain this contract to me

http://www.capgeek.com/player/1729

Calvin De Haan

First Year - 1M
Second Year - 2.4M
Third Year - 2.5M

I thought the difference between the lowest paid year and highest paid year has to be 50%, as it stands the difference between the first and third years is 40%

My guess is that capgeek has the specifics of this contract incorrect.

From Section 50.7(b)
For any SPC that is not a Front-Loaded SPC, the difference between the stated Player Salary and Bonuses in the first two League Years of an SPC cannot exceed the amount of the lower of the two League Years.
(emphasis in original)

Given that the contract is not front loaded by the CBA definition (nor any other sane definition) it seems blatantly outside of this clause and thus not valid, hence my assumption that capgeek has something incorrect.

If the first year was raised to 1.15M and the second reduced to 2.3M the AAV would be identical and the contract would then be valid.

Edit: In regards to the 50% you referenced, that's only for front loaded deals. Having a contract go 1M, 2M, 3M, 4M, 5M, 6M, 7M would be legal however 7M, 6M, 5M, 4M, 3M, 2M, 1M would not.

Front loaded SPCs (first half has higher value than second half) two things must hold:
- Years immediately adjacent cannot vary more than 35% from the value of the first year of the deal; and
- No year may be less than 50% of the highest year

Non front loaded deals have different rules:
- The first two years must not be different by more than the amount of the smaller year (ie, the larger of the first two years can be at most double the smaller)
For years beyond the first 2:
- Any increase from one year to another must not exceed the smaller of the first two years
- Any decrease from one year to another must not exceed 50% of the smaller of the first two years.

That means if the first year of the deal is $1 million the maximum year to year increase in the deal can be $1 million and the maximum year to year decrease can be $500k

There are no requirements on non-front loaded deals that each year be within a certain percent of the maximum.
 
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mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,524
13,020
South Mountain
Can anybody explain this contract to me

http://www.capgeek.com/player/1729

Calvin De Haan

First Year - 1M
Second Year - 2.4M
Third Year - 2.5M

I thought the difference between the lowest paid year and highest paid year has to be 50%, as it stands the difference between the first and third years is 40%

Capgeek has updated the contract to $1m, $2m, $2.9m.

Seems the Islanders originally filed the contract with the invalid values but the NHL must have rejected the original deal and the Isles refiled the contract with compliant values.
 

SchultzSquared*

Guest
I noticed some thing in an interview with Nail Yakupov...

- What cars do you like?

– For now I drive the Ford pickup the team gave me. I like that car. I like huge cars, “tanksâ€. I don’t have a car in Nizhnekamsk, I spend a lot of time in North America, therefore getting a car there makes little sense. The city is little, you can get everywhere by foot.

http://thehockeywriters.com/nail-yakupov-interview-with-edmonton-oilers-forward/

Is this maybe cap circumvention??? I did not know teams could do that
 

LadyStanley

Registered User
Sep 22, 2004
109,399
22,085
Sin City
I noticed some thing in an interview with Nail Yakupov...



http://thehockeywriters.com/nail-yakupov-interview-with-edmonton-oilers-forward/

Is this maybe cap circumvention??? I did not know teams could do that

First, how good is his English?

Second, was there a car/vehicle specified as part of his signing bonus?

Third, does he have an endorsement deal with the brand/local dealers?

Fourth, is it a lease deducted from his paycheck?

Fifth, is it a teammate who owns the car and is letting him use it?

And those are just some possibilities that would be acceptable?
 

IME

Registered User
Feb 21, 2008
654
2
The Cloud
First, how good is his English?

Second, was there a car/vehicle specified as part of his signing bonus?

Third, does he have an endorsement deal with the brand/local dealers?

Fourth, is it a lease deducted from his paycheck?

Fifth, is it a teammate who owns the car and is letting him use it?

And those are just some possibilities that would be acceptable?

Yeah, the most plausible explanation is that they take the lease payments out of his paycheck.
 

LadyStanley

Registered User
Sep 22, 2004
109,399
22,085
Sin City
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/tkachevs-contract-with-oilers-ruled-inelgible/

Ah, the small fine print. Russian winger hoped that by playing last season in CHL, and not being drafted, he'd be able to parlay that into a NHL contract with Edmonton.

But he played a handful of games in the KHL, some very specific exemptions come into play, so his ELC contract with Edmonton has been invalidated.


Edit: http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-making-sense-of-the-tkachev-mess/
Friedman with a few thoughts (and some historic references)
 
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Hawkscap

Registered User
Jan 22, 2007
2,614
29
Quick Question, If a team has been assessed a cap penalty, is the penalty calculated pro rata in the daily count or tacked on at the end of the year?


Hawks have $60k penalty from last year's overage. CBA reads

Bonuses that may be earned by Players pursuant to Section 50.2(b)(i)(C)
above, then the Club's Upper Limit for the next League Year shall be
reduced by an amount equal to such excess.
 
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hatterson

Registered User
Apr 12, 2010
36,024
13,644
North Tonawanda, NY
Quick Question, If a team has been assessed a cap penalty, is the penalty calculated pro rata in the daily count or tacked on at the end of the year?


Hawks have $60k penalty from last year's overage. CBA reads

Bonuses that may be earned by Players pursuant to Section 50.2(b)(i)(C)
above, then the Club's Upper Limit for the next League Year shall be
reduced by an amount equal to such excess.

I don't have the specific section in front of me, but cap compliance is calculated based on daily totals. The idea being that you should never be in a situation where keeping your team exactly as it is now suddenly results in either an overage or underage at the end of the year.

A 60k penalty will mean the hawks have roughly $333 less per day to work with in terms of cap space.
 

mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,524
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South Mountain
It's definitely not tacked on at the end of the year.

Easiest way to think of it: most teams have an upper limit of $69m this season, however the Hawks have an upper limit of $68,940,000 due to the carry over.
 

LadyStanley

Registered User
Sep 22, 2004
109,399
22,085
Sin City
Sharks also have a bonus overage applied to this season's cap hit.

Cap hits are calculated on a per day basis. (Although with the Sharks having three players on the IR for opening day -- one definitely on the LTIR -- it may be they are "over" on day one. :sarcasm: )
 

Hawkscap

Registered User
Jan 22, 2007
2,614
29
So here is the deal in Chicago, Q claims the Hawks are going to carry 23, if you add it up it will be them over by $47k.

If you look at Cap Geek moved down Mishinter and add TVR


This is why I brought up if the penalty is applied at the end of the year or not.

If it was tacked on at the end of the year, they would be cap compliant on a daily basis but would have to get under the $68.94 number for the end of year.

I scoured the CBA but couldn't find anything specific to when the penalty is applied.
 

Burakovsky95*

Guest
Sorry if this is the wrong place for this but can the Capitals place Burakovsky in the AHL this season and still have his ELC slide another year?
 

mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
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South Mountain
Sorry if this is the wrong place for this but can the Capitals place Burakovsky in the AHL this season and still have his ELC slide another year?

Yes they can. Although Burakovsky played in the OHL last season, he was originally drafted from a European team. Making him eligible to play in the AHL.

Burakovsky was signed at age 18, and has his ELC slide last season. He will slide again this season so long as he plays in less then 10 NHL games.
 

mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,524
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South Mountain
So here is the deal in Chicago, Q claims the Hawks are going to carry 23, if you add it up it will be them over by $47k.

If you look at Cap Geek moved down Mishinter and add TVR


This is why I brought up if the penalty is applied at the end of the year or not.

If it was tacked on at the end of the year, they would be cap compliant on a daily basis but would have to get under the $68.94 number for the end of year.

I scoured the CBA but couldn't find anything specific to when the penalty is applied.

Teams can never be over the cap at any time and "fix" it before the end of the season.

Looks like Chicago would be over by $16.8k with Teravainen on a 23 player roster. Assuming all the Capgeek figures are accurate Chicago would have to do something like leave Teravainen in the AHL for the first week of the season then recall him. Unless they have a player that would be LTIR eligible?

FORWARDS
Patrick Sharp ($5.900m) / Jonathan Toews ($6.300m) / Patrick Kane ($6.300m)
Bryan Bickell ($4.000m) / Brad Richards ($2.000m) / Marian Hossa ($5.275m)
Jeremy Morin ($0.800m) / Andrew Shaw ($2.000m) / Kris Versteeg ($2.200m)
Brandon Saad ($0.764m) / Marcus Kruger ($1.325m) / Ben Smith ($1.500m)
Daniel Carcillo ($0.550m) /
Teuvo Teravainen ($0.894m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Brent Seabrook ($5.800m) / Duncan Keith ($5.538m)
Niklas Hjalmarsson ($4.100m) / Johnny Oduya ($3.375m)
Michal Rozsival ($2.200m) / David Rundblad ($0.785m)
Kyle Cumiskey ($0.600m) /
GOALTENDERS
Corey Crawford ($6.000m)
Antti Raanta ($0.750m)
BUYOUTS
Steve Montador ($0.000m)
Rostislav Olesz ($0.000m)
BONUS OVERAGE
$60,000
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $69,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $69,016,795; BONUSES: $630,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): -$16,795
 

Hawkscap

Registered User
Jan 22, 2007
2,614
29
TT is already in Rockford

This is what Q is saying his roster is going to be

Patrick Sharp ($5.900m) / Jonathan Toews ($6.300m) / Patrick Kane ($6.300m)
Bryan Bickell ($4.000m) / Brad Richards ($2.000m) / Marian Hossa ($5.275m)
Jeremy Morin ($0.800m) / Andrew Shaw ($2.000m) / Kris Versteeg ($2.200m)
Brandon Saad ($0.764m) / Marcus Kruger ($1.325m) / Ben Smith ($1.500m)
Daniel Carcillo ($0.550m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Brent Seabrook ($5.800m) / Duncan Keith ($5.538m)
Niklas Hjalmarsson ($4.100m) / Johnny Oduya ($3.375m)
Michal Rozsival ($2.200m) / David Rundblad ($0.785m)
Kyle Cumiskey ($0.600m) / Trevor Van Riemsdyk ($0.925m)
GOALTENDERS
Corey Crawford ($6.000m)
Antti Raanta ($0.750m)
BUYOUTS
Steve Montador ($0.000m)
Rostislav Olesz ($0.000m)
BONUS OVERAGE
$60,000
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $69,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $69,047,628; BONUSES: $130,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): -$47,628

Assuming Quinville is right and keeps 8 d men and Carcillo, they are going to be over the cap , unless there is something we don't know about the rules. I was speculating it could be the bonus penalty calculation.
 

LadyStanley

Registered User
Sep 22, 2004
109,399
22,085
Sin City
Yes they can. Although Burakovsky played in the OHL last season, he was originally drafted from a European team. Making him eligible to play in the AHL.

Burakovsky was signed at age 18, and has his ELC slide last season. He will slide again this season so long as he plays in less then 10 NHL games.

He can play in AHL, but it would nominally be on his NHL contract -- so no slide.
 

mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,524
13,020
South Mountain
He can play in AHL, but it would nominally be on his NHL contract -- so no slide.

Doesn't matter. The rule is if the player doesn't play at least 10 NHL games. It works the same whether the player is returned to the CHL, plays in the AHL, or anywhere else.
 

mouser

Business of Hockey
Jul 13, 2006
29,524
13,020
South Mountain
What is the actual penalty a team receives for going over the cap? Just a penalty towards next season's cap?

Teams are not allowed to go over the cap unless it's due to performance bonuses or using the LTIR exception. If a team goes over the cap due to performance bonuses then that overage is applied to the next season's cap.

If for some reason a team refused to be cap compliant the league has all sorts of options including forfeiting games, fines and draft pick forfeiture. We really don't know what the league would do because it has never happened.
 

DrinkFightFlyers

THE TORTURE NEVER STOPS
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Sep 24, 2009
23,666
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NJ
CBA Question:

If a player is traded and the old team retains salary, how does a buyout work? Would the new team have to buyout the whole contract and take the same cap penalty as if they were shouldering the whole cap hit? Would they just buy out their portion and take a pro-rated cap penalty? Would the old team be impacted in any way?
 

kdb209

Registered User
Jan 26, 2005
14,870
6
CBA Question:

If a player is traded and the old team retains salary, how does a buyout work? Would the new team have to buyout the whole contract and take the same cap penalty as if they were shouldering the whole cap hit? Would they just buy out their portion and take a pro-rated cap penalty? Would the old team be impacted in any way?

Both the buyout payments and cap hits would be split based on the %-age of salary retained in the original trade.

CBA Article 50.5(e)(iii)(E) said:
(E) In the event that a Retained Salary SPC is "bought out" or
terminated, the resulting obligations (both Averaged Amount and
Salary and Bonus) shall be divided as between the Clubs party to
the Retained Salary Transaction(s) for that SPC on the same
percentage basis as originally agreed upon in the Retained Salary
Transaction.
 

Siludin

Registered User
Dec 9, 2010
7,505
5,452
Are expansion fees considered hockey-related revenue per the CBA?

Just wondering.

Lots of talk of expansion after the recent CBA agreement and USA TV-deal. Looks like the owners are looking for new revenue-growth sources.

I am sure this has been discussed, but what are factors being considered in "hockey-related revenue" with regards to player pay/salary cap? Do expansion fees count towards player salary-growth for the following season?
 

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